Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems.

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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather repair
than
replace.

TIA
Gerry



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

toomanytoys wrote in message
...
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He

has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather

repair
than
replace.

TIA
Gerry




I don't have 5051 data or items but the AY1-5050 is PCH technology ,
whatever that is.
with for 14 pin DIL ground pin 1 ,Vdd pin 8 and Vgg pin 14
The rest would be tracing which goes to which octave and inferring

I have a couple of salvaged 1978 , 5050 in front of me with pinning, no
knowledge if working order.
With a DVM diode test and -ve to ground pin
one measures .71 to Vgg and .66 to Vdd pin
other is .8 and .74V

for isolated dividers with no internal linking and a few readings referred
to pin 1 as -ve
to pin labelled input .88 and its o/p .78 and some others
..95 i/p and .86 o/p
,97 and .85V o/p
those with internal linking are nearer the o/p readings, up and down

+ probe to pin 1 ground then no forward drop reading to any other pin
, max 2V IIRC on Fluke 77

Please report back any findings on the 5051 pinning , voltages etc, for the
archives.

Early Maplin in UK catalogues had pinning etc for a number of AY1- organ use
series


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

toomanytoys wrote in message
...
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He

has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather

repair
than
replace.

TIA
Gerry




I assume you have some voltage on the power rails and at least 1 pin has
some oscillation signal on it.


If you can determine which the DC rail pins are I can check 4 other pinouts
that are probably GI AY1- ???? frequency divider ICs but no cross-reference
back to the IC numbers, but they all have different DC rail pins than the
5050 one.

Whether isolated , 2 or 3 interlinked then all related pins to one divider
chain are on one side of the IC, none cross over to the other side.


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

On Dec 12, 11:15 am, "toomanytoys" wrote:
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather repair
than
replace.

TIA
Gerry


Don't know if this helps or not but apparently this was made by
General Semiconductor, later acquired by Vishay (www.vishay.com)
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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

In article ,
toomanytoys wrote:
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather repair
than
replace.


Fresh off the scanner, all two pages of it. (about 50k bytes).

ftp://ftp.eskimo.com/u/m/mzenier/AY-1-5050.pdf

Includes AY-1-5050 AY-1-5051 AY-1-6721/5 AY-1-6721/6


Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

Mark Zenier wrote in message
...
In article ,
toomanytoys wrote:
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He

has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather

repair
than
replace.


Fresh off the scanner, all two pages of it. (about 50k bytes).

ftp://ftp.eskimo.com/u/m/mzenier/AY-1-5050.pdf

Includes AY-1-5050 AY-1-5051 AY-1-6721/5 AY-1-6721/6


Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)


Thats tidied up the mystery of the graphics only sheet I have from GI as
only the 5050 was labelled as such.

The next problem is how to buffer the outputs of a 4024, or something, to
drive 30V chippery? a 4104 is not high enough , 7x discrete SM ?

So to the OP - what are the next devices in the chain being driven by each
octave from the ay1-5051 ?

--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/


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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

The sort of task I would relish doing, now realised its only 3 octaves
This is how I'd tackle it assuming enough spare space

Wire a chopped down to 10 pin turned pin socket to the pcb and glue in
place.
Another chopped down socket , to plug into the first, wired to a piece of
matrix board.
Try an "upside down" ,positive ground (is that possible?) 4024 between Vdd
and ground and voltage divided input signal to one of the 4024 inputs and
and try just one output , level shifted with transistor and a couple of Rs ,
from Vgg, to drive any high level tone generators or whatever comes after.

--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

In article , N Cook wrote:
Mark Zenier wrote in message
...
In article ,
toomanytoys wrote:
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He

has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather

repair
than
replace.


Fresh off the scanner, all two pages of it. (about 50k bytes).

ftp://ftp.eskimo.com/u/m/mzenier/AY-1-5050.pdf

Includes AY-1-5050 AY-1-5051 AY-1-6721/5 AY-1-6721/6


Thats tidied up the mystery of the graphics only sheet I have from GI as
only the 5050 was labelled as such.

The next problem is how to buffer the outputs of a 4024, or something, to
drive 30V chippery? a 4104 is not high enough , 7x discrete SM ?

So to the OP - what are the next devices in the chain being driven by each
octave from the ay1-5051 ?

^
Note: You guys might have better luck adding in the extra "-" in the
part number for your searches.

Did you see the fine print about the two power supplies. The outputs
are fed seperatly from VDD, which only goes to -13 volts. And that
VDD can be modulated for various effects. Using the numbers in the
"Drive capablity" section of the characteristics, it looks like the
output is a Fet pulldown with a 6k ohm load.

Here's how I would do a workalike.

Power supply. You have to use the -27 volt VGG since VDD can be
modulated. So a 12 volt or thereabouts zener, and a series resistor
should be ok to get a -12 volt supply. Which will feed some CD4000
family chips, running upside down. Their positive power supply being
the PMOS ground. Typical drain for the old chip is 3 milliamps, that
should be plenty for a handful of CMOS logic running at audio frequencies.

For each input, an input resistor, diode clamps to the CMOS power positive
(gnd) and negative supply, and a schmitt trigger buffer or inverter.
CD40106? Then use either D latches (4013) or JK ff's (4027) for the
dividers. Easier to get the short divider chains than the CD4024 if
you don't know how the external circuit is wired. If which edge is the
trigger matters, you may needed to chain one of the spare 40106 inverters
to get the right polarity to feed the flip flop.

For each output, a small p channel MOSFET, source to (PMOS) ground,
with a 6.2k ohm drain resistor to VDD. (Or maybe a jellybean PNP with a
base resistor. Depends on the sound that results, perhaps). You might
need a capacitor or RC filter across the output to slow down the edges.

Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)


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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

Many thanks for the information. I shall be looking at the organ again on
Monday and will report back. I much appreciate the effort you guys have put
in.

Gerry
Wareham Dorset UK.

"toomanytoys" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He
has had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather
repair than
replace.

TIA
Gerry





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Posts: 1,220
Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

toomanytoys wrote in message
...
Many thanks for the information. I shall be looking at the organ again on
Monday and will report back. I much appreciate the effort you guys have

put
in.

Gerry
Wareham Dorset UK.

"toomanytoys" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He
has had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather
repair than
replace.

TIA
Gerry






Is it only 3 octaves or would there be 2 of the 5051? for more octaves?

Could you note the model number and any chip datecodes , or dates on
capacitors etc


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/





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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

Mark Zenier wrote in message
...
In article , N Cook

wrote:
Mark Zenier wrote in message
...
In article ,
toomanytoys wrote:
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed

Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by

General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend.

He
has
had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather

repair
than
replace.

Fresh off the scanner, all two pages of it. (about 50k bytes).

ftp://ftp.eskimo.com/u/m/mzenier/AY-1-5050.pdf

Includes AY-1-5050 AY-1-5051 AY-1-6721/5 AY-1-6721/6


Thats tidied up the mystery of the graphics only sheet I have from GI as
only the 5050 was labelled as such.

The next problem is how to buffer the outputs of a 4024, or something, to
drive 30V chippery? a 4104 is not high enough , 7x discrete SM ?

So to the OP - what are the next devices in the chain being driven by

each
octave from the ay1-5051 ?

^
Note: You guys might have better luck adding in the extra "-" in the
part number for your searches.

Did you see the fine print about the two power supplies. The outputs
are fed seperatly from VDD, which only goes to -13 volts. And that
VDD can be modulated for various effects. Using the numbers in the
"Drive capablity" section of the characteristics, it looks like the
output is a Fet pulldown with a 6k ohm load.

Here's how I would do a workalike.

Power supply. You have to use the -27 volt VGG since VDD can be
modulated. So a 12 volt or thereabouts zener, and a series resistor
should be ok to get a -12 volt supply. Which will feed some CD4000
family chips, running upside down. Their positive power supply being
the PMOS ground. Typical drain for the old chip is 3 milliamps, that
should be plenty for a handful of CMOS logic running at audio frequencies.

For each input, an input resistor, diode clamps to the CMOS power positive
(gnd) and negative supply, and a schmitt trigger buffer or inverter.
CD40106? Then use either D latches (4013) or JK ff's (4027) for the
dividers. Easier to get the short divider chains than the CD4024 if
you don't know how the external circuit is wired. If which edge is the
trigger matters, you may needed to chain one of the spare 40106 inverters
to get the right polarity to feed the flip flop.

For each output, a small p channel MOSFET, source to (PMOS) ground,
with a 6.2k ohm drain resistor to VDD. (Or maybe a jellybean PNP with a
base resistor. Depends on the sound that results, perhaps). You might
need a capacitor or RC filter across the output to slow down the edges.

Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)




I followed and agreed down to jellybean ?
Translates as general purpose, low f, low V,low A, low power?

--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

In article , N Cook wrote:

I followed and agreed down to jellybean ?
Translates as general purpose, low f, low V,low A, low power?


Sorry. (Two nations seperated by a common language).
One for your UK/American translation glossary...

Jellybean = inexpensive and commonly available

Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)
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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

Mark Zenier wrote in message
...
In article , N Cook

wrote:

I followed and agreed down to jellybean ?
Translates as general purpose, low f, low V,low A, low power?


Sorry. (Two nations seperated by a common language).
One for your UK/American translation glossary...

Jellybean = inexpensive and commonly available

Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)


Do you have bean-counters over there ?


--
Diverse Devices, Southampton, England
electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
http://home.graffiti.net/diverse:graffiti.net/



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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

N Cook wrote:

Mark Zenier wrote in message
...
In article , N Cook

wrote:

I followed and agreed down to jellybean ?
Translates as general purpose, low f, low V,low A, low power?


Sorry. (Two nations seperated by a common language).
One for your UK/American translation glossary...

Jellybean = inexpensive and commonly available

Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)


Do you have bean-counters over there ?



yes, the originals: MBA = 'Masters of Business Annihilation'.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
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Default AY1-5051 datasheet or pinout please?

Hi,

Well I managed to repair it with you fellows kind help. Much appreciated.
It wasn't a faulty AY-1-5051, it just had no VDD supply. I was able to find
that out from the scanned data sheet. I then traced the wiring to find, deep
in the dust at the bottom of the organ, a power regulator circuit which
turned out to be a -10V PSU. This was giving no output at all. A buzz round
with my DMM on diode test showed an open circuit base/emitter on an ancient
Fairchild BC208. I replaced it with a BC548A and it's now all fine.

Jack, my 82 year old friend is very pleased and reckons he'll be
entertaining his family over the holidays - but apparently his wife wants to
sabotage it ;-)

He too thanks you for the help and we both wish you all a Happy Christmas.

Cheers,
Gerry.

"toomanytoys" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have Datasheet or the pinouts for an AY1-5051 Fixed Modulus
Divider chip? I can't find them on the internet. It was made by General
Instruments (later Arizona Microchip) and is a PMOS technology.

I am trying to repair a 1960's Elka organ for an 82 year old friend. He
has had it
since nearly new and it has been reliable until now. He would rather
repair than
replace.

TIA
Gerry





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