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Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube
broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Rig up a pair of wire meshes to the 8kV with a blue florescent tube behind = high powered insectecutor. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
On May 26, 1:50 pm, Beloved Leader
wrote: A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Google on "Jacob's Ladder". They are a great use for old neon transformers. H. R. (Bob) Hofmann |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Meat Plow" wrote in message ... On Sat, 26 May 2007 11:50:30 -0700, Beloved Leader wrote: A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Great for torture using a couple jumper cables. Wired to the letterbox stops bills & junkmail. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"ian field" writes:
"Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Rig up a pair of wire meshes to the 8kV with a blue florescent tube behind = high powered insectecutor. Jacob's Ladder, Tesla Coil driver, and CO2 laser power supply, to name 3 uses. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name AND either lasers or electronics is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Well you can get $20-$50 on ebay for it if nothing else. Neon transformers are great fun to play with, current limited high voltage, 8KV is enough for a classic Jacob's Ladder, those are always cool. You can also experiment with making crude discharge lamps and any number of other things. Grab it. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
ian field wrote:
"Meat Plow" wrote in message ... On Sat, 26 May 2007 11:50:30 -0700, Beloved Leader wrote: A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Great for torture using a couple jumper cables. Wired to the letterbox stops bills & junkmail. That will get you room an board at the big house. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Exactly the right voltage for a home electric chair - and more than enough amps. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Homer J Simpson" wrote in message news:Jw36i.49265$g63.23956@edtnps82... "Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Exactly the right voltage for a home electric chair - and more than enough amps. Nowhere near, most NST are good for 20-30mA and by their nature are current limited, potentially dangerous, but not automatically lethal. Microwave oven transformers on the other hand are another thing entirely. Safety is important, and any high voltage should be respected and used carefully, but overblown dire warnings accomplish nothing. I was playing with NSTs by the time I was 10 years old, I've made it this far. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
Meat Plow wrote:
On Sun, 27 May 2007 00:15:45 +0000, James Sweet wrote: Nowhere near, most NST are good for 20-30mA and by their nature are current limited, potentially dangerous, but not automatically lethal. Microwave oven transformers on the other hand are another thing entirely. Safety is important, and any high voltage should be respected and used carefully, but overblown dire warnings accomplish nothing. I was playing with NSTs by the time I was 10 years old, I've made it this far. So it can't kill then? If you have certain medical conditions, or someone hits you over the head with it. it takes about 15 ma through the heart to stop it. Unless you are holding both terminals when someone turns it on, its unlikely that you'll grab the second terminal. You are more likely to be injured trying to get away from it. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Many years ago we had one in the lab that we were using in an ozone generator. One lunch time, being more madcap than usual, we tried to drive it with an amplified audio source to seee if we could actually produce a spark gap transmitter. Charlie |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"James Sweet" wrote in
news:R446i.2003$eO5.1662@trndny08: "Homer J Simpson" wrote in message news:Jw36i.49265$g63.23956@edtnps82... "Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Exactly the right voltage for a home electric chair - and more than enough amps. Nowhere near, most NST are good for 20-30mA and by their nature are current limited, potentially dangerous, but not automatically lethal. A true statement but.... 15 mA is enough to 'freeze on' to a current source. That can EASILY happen with 110 VAC, harder with 8 KV. More likely to throw you across the room. On the other hand 15 uA across the heart region is sufficient to induce ventricular fibrillation (uncoordinated quivering of the heart) which WILL be fatal if CPR and/or defibrillation is not administered within very few minutes. Microwave oven transformers on the other hand are another thing entirely. Safety is important, and any high voltage should be respected and used carefully, but overblown dire warnings accomplish nothing. I was playing with NSTs by the time I was 10 years old, I've made it this far. -- bz 73 de N5BZ k please pardon my infinite ignorance, the set-of-things-I-do-not-know is an infinite set. remove ch100-5 to avoid spam trap |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
On May 26, 7:15 pm, "James Sweet" wrote:
"Homer J Simpson" wrote in messagenews:Jw36i.49265$g63.23956@edtnps82... "Beloved Leader" wrote in message oups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Exactly the right voltage for a home electric chair - and more than enough amps. Nowhere near, most NST are good for 20-30mA and by their nature are current limited, potentially dangerous, but not automatically lethal. Microwave oven transformers on the other hand are another thing entirely. Safety is important, and any high voltage should be respected and used carefully, but overblown dire warnings accomplish nothing. I was playing with NSTs by the time I was 10 years old, I've made it this far. Aha!! That might explain a lot of things about you. G BOb HOfmann |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Meat Plow" wrote in message ... On Sun, 27 May 2007 00:15:45 +0000, James Sweet wrote: "Homer J Simpson" wrote in message news:Jw36i.49265$g63.23956@edtnps82... "Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Exactly the right voltage for a home electric chair - and more than enough amps. Nowhere near, most NST are good for 20-30mA and by their nature are current limited, potentially dangerous, but not automatically lethal. Microwave oven transformers on the other hand are another thing entirely. Safety is important, and any high voltage should be respected and used carefully, but overblown dire warnings accomplish nothing. I was playing with NSTs by the time I was 10 years old, I've made it this far. So it can't kill then? I'd never say *can't* in that context, but it's *unlikely* to kill you. That said, you still need to treat it with respect, getting bit by a NST will definitely hurt, likely cause a significant burn, and you may will rip your hand open jerking away or crack your head on the floor when you fall. It will probably not *kill* you, but it won't be pleasant by any means. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
Beloved Leader wrote:
}A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. }... }Is there any reason I should grab it? 1: if you have several MILES of electric fence and you really want those uppity cows to know exactly who is boss... 2: you can conduct your own experiment with lightning flashes and primordial soup, looking for pre-historic amino acids 3: many years back an acquaintance had a billing disagreement with the local baby Bell (US Worst, if you have to know). In the midst of this, Worst decided to show him who had the upper hand by disconnecting his service. He figured that since he didn't need the phone lines (being disconnected), they would make a perfect test bed for an experiment he had been pondering for quite some time. To wit, how many volts do you need to induce "cross-talk" between line pairs from a house to the CO? He waited till 3am (to decrease the chance of a nasty surprise to any neighbors) then he ran his high voltage (non-current-limited) XFMR to his phone line (having dis-connected it from his house wiring and dis-connected the anti-lighting stuff) and plugged it in. The house lights dimmed a bit for about 30 seconds, then came back full. To be thorough, he then grounded on side of the secondary and ran both sides of the phone line to the hot side of the secondary and re-powered for 30 seconds. The phone company had several trucks in the neighborhood the next day...some of the repairmen were asking residents if they saw where the lightning had hit. He did this a few more nights before he got bored and payed his bill, figuring it had cost Worst more than it had cost him. Stan. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
Stan wrote:
3: many years back an acquaintance had a billing disagreement with the local baby Bell (US Worst, if you have to know). In the midst of this, Worst decided to show him who had the upper hand by disconnecting his service. He figured that since he didn't need the phone lines (being disconnected), they would make a perfect test bed for an experiment he had been pondering for quite some time. To wit, how many volts do you need to induce "cross-talk" between line pairs from a house to the CO? He waited till 3am (to decrease the chance of a nasty surprise to any neighbors) then he ran his high voltage (non-current-limited) XFMR to his phone line (having dis-connected it from his house wiring and dis-connected the anti-lighting stuff) and plugged it in. The house lights dimmed a bit for about 30 seconds, then came back full. To be thorough, he then grounded on side of the secondary and ran both sides of the phone line to the hot side of the secondary and re-powered for 30 seconds. The phone company had several trucks in the neighborhood the next day...some of the repairmen were asking residents if they saw where the lightning had hit. He did this a few more nights before he got bored and payed his bill, figuring it had cost Worst more than it had cost him. What an ass. Someone could have died because he blew out a lot of people's phone service. BTW, that was a criminal act that would have put him in jail for sevral years. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... ian field wrote: "Meat Plow" wrote in message ... On Sat, 26 May 2007 11:50:30 -0700, Beloved Leader wrote: A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Great for torture using a couple jumper cables. Wired to the letterbox stops bills & junkmail. That will get you room an board at the big house. I've heard the cells are actually quite small and cramped. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"James Sweet" wrote in message news:sL56i.79$2v5.34@trndny06... "Meat Plow" wrote in message ... On Sun, 27 May 2007 00:15:45 +0000, James Sweet wrote: "Homer J Simpson" wrote in message news:Jw36i.49265$g63.23956@edtnps82... "Beloved Leader" wrote in message ups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Exactly the right voltage for a home electric chair - and more than enough amps. Nowhere near, most NST are good for 20-30mA and by their nature are current limited, potentially dangerous, but not automatically lethal. Microwave oven transformers on the other hand are another thing entirely. Safety is important, and any high voltage should be respected and used carefully, but overblown dire warnings accomplish nothing. I was playing with NSTs by the time I was 10 years old, I've made it this far. So it can't kill then? I'd never say *can't* in that context, but it's *unlikely* to kill you. That said, you still need to treat it with respect, getting bit by a NST will definitely hurt, likely cause a significant burn, and you may will rip your hand open jerking away or crack your head on the floor when you fall. It will probably not *kill* you, but it won't be pleasant by any means. That's why it should be used on someone else! |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... Stan wrote: 3: many years back an acquaintance had a billing disagreement with the local baby Bell (US Worst, if you have to know). In the midst of this, Worst decided to show him who had the upper hand by disconnecting his service. He figured that since he didn't need the phone lines (being disconnected), they would make a perfect test bed for an experiment he had been pondering for quite some time. To wit, how many volts do you need to induce "cross-talk" between line pairs from a house to the CO? He waited till 3am (to decrease the chance of a nasty surprise to any neighbors) then he ran his high voltage (non-current-limited) XFMR to his phone line (having dis-connected it from his house wiring and dis-connected the anti-lighting stuff) and plugged it in. The house lights dimmed a bit for about 30 seconds, then came back full. To be thorough, he then grounded on side of the secondary and ran both sides of the phone line to the hot side of the secondary and re-powered for 30 seconds. The phone company had several trucks in the neighborhood the next day...some of the repairmen were asking residents if they saw where the lightning had hit. He did this a few more nights before he got bored and payed his bill, figuring it had cost Worst more than it had cost him. What an ass. Someone could have died because he blew out a lot of people's phone service. BTW, that was a criminal act that would have put him in jail for sevral years. Its a pity the high & mighty ******* telcos in the UK all use fibre. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
On May 26, 4:39 pm, Sam Goldwasser wrote:
"ian field" writes: "Beloved Leader" wrote in message oups.com... A local shop has a neon sign in the trash. It fell, and the tube broke. I suppose the power supply is good. The specs are on the power supply: 7000-8000 volts output. I can't think of any use for it, and it's not as if I have room for any more junk. Is there any reason I should grab it? Jacob's Ladder, Tesla Coil driver, and CO2 laser power supply, to name 3 uses. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ:http://www.repairfaq.org/ Thanks to everyone for all the suggestions. I don't know where I'm going to put it, but I might just go grab the thing tonight. Even if I can't use it, I can surely find a good home for it. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
On May 26, 4:39 pm, Sam Goldwasser wrote:
Jacob's Ladder, Tesla Coil driver, and CO2 laser power supply, to name 3 uses. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ:http://www.repairfaq.org/ Adding the Wikipedia link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neon_Sign_Transformer |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
On Jun 8, 12:09 pm, Beloved Leader
wrote: On May 26, 4:39 pm, Sam Goldwasser wrote: Jacob's Ladder, Tesla Coil driver, and CO2 laser power supply, to name 3 uses. I grabbed it a few days ago. So far, I haven't plugged it in. Thanks to everyone for all the help and encouragement. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
ian field wrote:
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... Stan wrote: 3: many years back an acquaintance had a billing disagreement with the local baby Bell (US Worst, if you have to know). In the midst of this, Worst decided to show him who had the upper hand by disconnecting his service. He figured that since he didn't need the phone lines (being disconnected), they would make a perfect test bed for an experiment he had been pondering for quite some time. To wit, how many volts do you need to induce "cross-talk" between line pairs from a house to the CO? He waited till 3am (to decrease the chance of a nasty surprise to any neighbors) then he ran his high voltage (non-current-limited) XFMR to his phone line (having dis-connected it from his house wiring and dis-connected the anti-lighting stuff) and plugged it in. The house lights dimmed a bit for about 30 seconds, then came back full. To be thorough, he then grounded on side of the secondary and ran both sides of the phone line to the hot side of the secondary and re-powered for 30 seconds. The phone company had several trucks in the neighborhood the next day...some of the repairmen were asking residents if they saw where the lightning had hit. He did this a few more nights before he got bored and payed his bill, figuring it had cost Worst more than it had cost him. What an ass. Someone could have died because he blew out a lot of people's phone service. BTW, that was a criminal act that would have put him in jail for sevral years. Its a pity the high & mighty ******* telcos in the UK all use fibre. If its all fiber, why did the phone company have to send out a fleet of service trucks? -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... ian field wrote: "Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... Stan wrote: 3: many years back an acquaintance had a billing disagreement with the local baby Bell (US Worst, if you have to know). In the midst of this, Worst decided to show him who had the upper hand by disconnecting his service. He figured that since he didn't need the phone lines (being disconnected), they would make a perfect test bed for an experiment he had been pondering for quite some time. To wit, how many volts do you need to induce "cross-talk" between line pairs from a house to the CO? He waited till 3am (to decrease the chance of a nasty surprise to any neighbors) then he ran his high voltage (non-current-limited) XFMR to his phone line (having dis-connected it from his house wiring and dis-connected the anti-lighting stuff) and plugged it in. The house lights dimmed a bit for about 30 seconds, then came back full. To be thorough, he then grounded on side of the secondary and ran both sides of the phone line to the hot side of the secondary and re-powered for 30 seconds. The phone company had several trucks in the neighborhood the next day...some of the repairmen were asking residents if they saw where the lightning had hit. He did this a few more nights before he got bored and payed his bill, figuring it had cost Worst more than it had cost him. What an ass. Someone could have died because he blew out a lot of people's phone service. BTW, that was a criminal act that would have put him in jail for sevral years. Its a pity the high & mighty ******* telcos in the UK all use fibre. If its all fiber, why did the phone company have to send out a fleet of service trucks? -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida When NTL started out they laid fiber just about everywhere, but the street level distribution is co-ax - the fibre infrastructure means you can't obliterate their exchange by shoving a million volts down their co-ax. |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
ian field wrote:
When NTL started out they laid fiber just about everywhere, but the street level distribution is co-ax - the fibre infrastructure means you can't obliterate their exchange by shoving a million volts down their co-ax. You CAN"T "Shove a million volts down their coax". Look up some datasheets on vasrious cables and see just how low some of the voltage ratings are. Fused disk and spiral insulators are the worst, teflon is the best, in the same sizes. -- Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to prove it. Member of DAV #85. Michael A. Terrell Central Florida |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... ian field wrote: When NTL started out they laid fiber just about everywhere, but the street level distribution is co-ax - the fibre infrastructure means you can't obliterate their exchange by shoving a million volts down their co-ax. You CAN"T "Shove a million volts down their coax". Look up some datasheets on vasrious cables and see just how low some of the voltage ratings are. Fused disk and spiral insulators are the worst, teflon is the best, in the same sizes. Back in the days of rotary selector telephone exchanges you could cause a fair amount of excitement at the exchange by linking the phone jack to the mains socket - but alas no more! |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
In article ,
"ian field" wrote: "Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... ian field wrote: When NTL started out they laid fiber just about everywhere, but the street level distribution is co-ax - the fibre infrastructure means you can't obliterate their exchange by shoving a million volts down their co-ax. You CAN"T "Shove a million volts down their coax". Look up some datasheets on vasrious cables and see just how low some of the voltage ratings are. Fused disk and spiral insulators are the worst, teflon is the best, in the same sizes. Back in the days of rotary selector telephone exchanges you could cause a fair amount of excitement at the exchange by linking the phone jack to the mains socket - but alas no more! Do the FO cables have metal jackets to protect agains abrasion and provide strength? If so, you can always melt the metal jackets with a zillion amps. and what's inside will go 'Poof." Al |
Neon Sign Power Supply: What's the Use?
People have been connecting weird stuff to telephone lines for about a
hundred and twenty years, and the companies are pretty much prepared for this sort of thing. Telephone systems have always been designed on the assumption that wires will be 'cross-connected,' meaning that someone or something will somehow connect telephone wires to power wires. The insulation of the system is designed for a few hundred volts, which was necessary for some old-fashioned frequency-division multiplexing they were using. The traditional protection devices are overvoltage protectors, which used to be a carbon-electrode spark gap but are now (I think) gas discharge tubes, plus overcurrent fuses known in telephone company terminology as 'heat coils.' It's the latter that are the major protection against power-line cross-connections, because while the intermittent ninety volts 20 Hz AC that the central office generates to ring your telephone is not vastly different from US power line voltage, steady application of power-line voltage will force considerable current through a telephone receiver for an extended period. The heat coil is calibrated to open after a short time under such conditions. M Kinsler |
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