Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 10:20:49 +0000, Clint Sharp
Gave us:

In message , MassiveProng
writes
On Sat, 3 Mar 2007 23:56:14 +0000, Clint Sharp
Gave us:

I think, you just rant. Please get it right. Maybe you could use that
DVD to calibrate your anger response, maybe you could eBay it and your
home audio system to pay for some anger management?


**** you, you ****ing retard. Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.
For the moment I really think you need to avoid situations where your
'intellect' and experience could be challenged as it seems to provoke an
anger response which must be detrimental to whichever course of therapy
you are in. If you're not in therapy, you should consider it. Life's too
short to be that angry all the time.


You're an idiot. You are wrong about FPDs, you are wrong about how a
DVD player produces sound, and you are wrong about me.

Is there ANYTHING in the world that you are right about?

Your mother should be a jailed felon for not flushing your retarded
ass, the moment she shat you out of her retarded ass. You are a ****
stain on society.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:


Now, go off, change your nym again and see how many posts you can make
before I recognize you.


You're an idiot. If I EVER wanted to be hidden, it would be no
problem, you stupid ****tard.

EVERY nym I EVER chose always held like data, so there was never an
intent to hide, you retarded ****!

It takes a true troll retard like you to act like you have some
brains, and yet prove with every post that you are more disturbed than
I could ever be.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

QUOTED:
"Are you suggesting that I should drag it across town, spend $200 and be
without it for 2 weeks just to get it adjusted by some obstinate, E-1 grade
line tech, instead of using a brand new DMM w .03% accuracy to tweak it
myself? I'm quite sure that my Micronta is up to the task to be honest."

A calibration house would NOT use a 0.03% DMM to calibrate your scope
with, you pathetic piece of ****!

What part of that don't you understand?

What part of that proves that you are a brainless, pathetic piece of
**** do you not understand?

PLEASE READ MY POSTS BEFORE ****ING
YOURSELF!!!!!

**** you. I read the thread. It doesn't matter who the author is,
and when it is you, you retarded ****, it becomes glaringly obvious
due to your total stupidity. Just like the "E-1 grade tech" remark.
You prove with your every post that it is you that is an incompetent
*******.

If you don't understand something just ask for help.

**** you. It is you that lacks the basic understanding that errors
chain together.

A .03%
METER CAN BE USED, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT METER IS AVAILABLE WITH NIST CERTS,
NOW CAN'T IT????

NOPE.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 10:35:24 +0000, Clint Sharp
Gave us:

In message , Anthony Fremont
writes
MassiveProng wrote:
On Sat, 3 Mar 2007 23:56:14 +0000, Clint Sharp
Gave us:

I think, you just rant. Please get it right. Maybe you could use that
DVD to calibrate your anger response, maybe you could eBay it and
your home audio system to pay for some anger management?


**** you, you ****ing retard. Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.

Man does that ever sound like a personal threat.


I'm not the least worried by him. He's just an interesting diversion,
provoking an anger response from him is a bit like shooting fish in a
barrel but it's starting to get boring as it's so easy and his
vocabulary is pretty small really.


You are both ****ing retards. It would not, nor could not be found
to be "a threat" by any court in the land.

Grow the **** up, you retards. You two are meant for each other.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:38:28 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:

Please see my earlier post regarding the use of a shunt box for a DVM.


What a joke that was. When is a 1.1M resistor EVER a current shunt?

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

QUOTED:
"Are you suggesting that I should drag it across town, spend $200
and be without it for 2 weeks just to get it adjusted by some
obstinate, E-1 grade line tech, instead of using a brand new DMM w
.03% accuracy to tweak it myself? I'm quite sure that my Micronta
is up to the task to be honest."

A calibration house would NOT use a 0.03% DMM to calibrate your scope
with, you pathetic piece of ****!

Did I say they would? I said I would tweak it myself and that it would be
good enough. Stay on track, you're here to prove why it won't work.

What part of that don't you understand?

What part of that proves that you are a brainless, pathetic piece of
**** do you not understand?

PLEASE READ MY POSTS BEFORE ****ING
YOURSELF!!!!!

**** you. I read the thread. It doesn't matter who the author is,
and when it is you, you retarded ****, it becomes glaringly obvious
due to your total stupidity. Just like the "E-1 grade tech" remark.
You prove with your every post that it is you that is an incompetent
*******.

Is that an apology? Where are your scematics and submissions?

If you don't understand something just ask for help.

**** you. It is you that lacks the basic understanding that errors
chain together.

Show one post where I demonstrated that I don't understand that. You can't.

The problem here is that you read something and then, in your twisted little
way, you interpret it as the poster is stupid and then you go off on some
totaly different train of thought. Like Don Quixote you then procede to
fight a battle against an illusion. You then begin to see every response as
though it's calling you a liar, even if they are just trying to put you back
on track. Many of your comments were valid, but they weren't germane to the
discussion at that point, just like the one you just made here.

You make it sound like the OP was going to cal some critical lab equipment
at home and that lives were at stake. Then you go on to tout calibrating
your home theater by using a DVD/CD. And that's fine for home theater, but
for lab quality work (like you constantly brag about, and compare everything
to) considering the use of a signal from a CD is just F*CKING STUPID!!! 1Hz
accuracy would be atrocious and you know that very well.


A .03%
METER CAN BE USED, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT METER IS AVAILABLE WITH NIST
CERTS, NOW CAN'T IT????

NOPE.

Now tell us why not? Exactly what kind of standard is required to adjust
a scope's vertical response to 3% as it's specs state? And why wouldn't a
..03% meter with traceable certs be good enough? I'm not saying it isn't,
since I never even visited a cal lab, much less worked in one. I just want
to hear your expert opinion on what is required.

You need to understand the concept of ACCEPTABLE ERROR, there is no
perfection only "good enough". What is "good enough" is in the eye of the
beholder, not yours.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:11:09 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:

Here is a good "trick" to measure low currents with your DVM.
Make a switchable shunt box with (at least) the following full
scale ranges: 200nA (shunt resistor 1.11 megs), 2uA (shunt resistor
101K), 20uA (shunt resistor 10.0K), 200uA (shunt resistor 1.00K).
Put a twisted pair of leads (red, black) with banana plugs (red,
black) running out of the box via a small grommet, to plug into your
DVM set to the 200mV scale; a pair of (red, black) banana jacks with
0.75 "spacing is mounted on the box for your test leads.
Hint: add to the legend the parallel resistance of the system
(200nA/1M, 2uA/100K, etc) as a reminder of the resistance of this
current meter scheme.
Added hint: the 200MV scale is good for 20nA full scale, just
remember the meter resistance is 10 megs.


Tell us, oh master... what does placing a 1,1 meg resistor in
series with a circuit's power source do to the voltage presented to
the circuit?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=ohms+law

It drops it like any other shunt would. If you were designing precision
equipment, would you attempt to measure nA by using a .01Ohm resistor? Read
Ed's post, he is right about being able to measure low currents that way,
just as Robert is here. They just don't work if the current is varying over
a wide range. But for static current measurements, THEY WILL WORK FINE.

Shunt resistors are typically less than an ohm. Show me where
ANYONE uses a 1.1 meg resistor os a current shunt.

You've got to be kidding! Don't you design/build HV supplies? Tell me that
your feedback circuits sense the full output voltage. HA HA HA I guess
you don't use any micros, huh? Or do you just use a 100Ohm and .01Ohm
resistive divider to sense that 50KV output? I'd really like to see that.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

It drops it like any other shunt would.


Sub one ohm shunts affect the circuit very little. A ****ing 1.1
meg resistor is NEVER used as a shunt resistor, and would drastically
affect ANY circuit.

How can you be so thick?

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

Tell me that
your feedback circuits sense the full output voltage.


Voltage dividers are completely different than current shunts, you
retarded ****.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

HA HA HA I guess
you don't use any micros, huh? Or do you just use a 100Ohm and .01Ohm
resistive divider to sense that 50KV output? I'd really like to see that.


You're a goddamned retard. This is about current shunts, not
voltage feedback dividers, you stupid twit!

You should go get with BAH. You are showing us that you are at her
speed.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

It drops it like any other shunt would.


Sub one ohm shunts affect the circuit very little. A ****ing 1.1
meg resistor is NEVER used as a shunt resistor, and would drastically
affect ANY circuit.

How can you be so thick?

No understanding of Ohms law wrt low currents.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

Tell me that
your feedback circuits sense the full output voltage.


Voltage dividers are completely different than current shunts, you
retarded ****.

No understanding of Ohms law. (now I see where Phil gets this from ;0)

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

"David L. Jones" wrote in
oups.com:

On Mar 4, 12:38 pm, MassiveProng
wrote:
On 2 Mar 2007 15:09:30 -0800, "David L. Jones"
Gave us:

Which is why you do it for each range and then spot check it to see
that there is no funny business. Perfectly valid technique for home
calibration of a scope vertical scale.

Dave :)

It doesn't matter how many "places" you "spot check" it, you are not
going to get the accuracy of your comparison standard on the device
you intend to set with it. What you do is take the basic INaccuracy
of the device needing to be set, and add to it the basic INaccuracy of
the standard to which you are setting it. You CANNOT get any closer
than that. So, a 0.5% meter, and a 0.5% scope cannot be used together
to make the scope that accurate. You need a *finer* standard than the
accuracy level you wish to achieve.

You need to understand that as a basic fact, chucko.

LMAO!
If I use 0.5% accurate meter to adjust a something, then the accuracy
of that adjusted device at that point in time at that adjusted value
*becomes* 0.5%.

Until you turn off the "something"(DUT),the ambient temp changes,or some
hours pass(drift);then it reverts to it's specified accuracy.

4X better is the minimum for a cal standard over the DUT.
Any less has to be noted on the cal certificate.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

"Anthony Fremont" wrote in
:

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

QUOTED:
"Are you suggesting that I should drag it across town, spend $200
and be without it for 2 weeks just to get it adjusted by some
obstinate, E-1 grade line tech, instead of using a brand new DMM w
.03% accuracy to tweak it myself? I'm quite sure that my Micronta
is up to the task to be honest."

A calibration house would NOT use a 0.03% DMM to calibrate your scope
with, you pathetic piece of ****!

Did I say they would? I said I would tweak it myself and that it
would be good enough. Stay on track, you're here to prove why it
won't work.

What part of that don't you understand?

What part of that proves that you are a brainless, pathetic piece of
**** do you not understand?

PLEASE READ MY POSTS BEFORE ****ING
YOURSELF!!!!!

**** you. I read the thread. It doesn't matter who the author is,
and when it is you, you retarded ****, it becomes glaringly obvious
due to your total stupidity. Just like the "E-1 grade tech" remark.
You prove with your every post that it is you that is an incompetent
*******.

Is that an apology? Where are your scematics and submissions?

If you don't understand something just ask for help.

**** you. It is you that lacks the basic understanding that errors
chain together.

Show one post where I demonstrated that I don't understand that. You
can't.

The problem here is that you read something and then, in your twisted
little way, you interpret it as the poster is stupid and then you go
off on some totaly different train of thought. Like Don Quixote you
then procede to fight a battle against an illusion. You then begin to
see every response as though it's calling you a liar, even if they are
just trying to put you back on track. Many of your comments were
valid, but they weren't germane to the discussion at that point, just
like the one you just made here.

You make it sound like the OP was going to cal some critical lab
equipment at home and that lives were at stake. Then you go on to
tout calibrating your home theater by using a DVD/CD. And that's fine
for home theater, but for lab quality work (like you constantly brag
about, and compare everything to) considering the use of a signal from
a CD is just F*CKING STUPID!!! 1Hz accuracy would be atrocious and
you know that very well.


A .03%
METER CAN BE USED, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT METER IS AVAILABLE WITH NIST
CERTS, NOW CAN'T IT????

NOPE.

Now tell us why not? Exactly what kind of standard is required to
adjust a scope's vertical response to 3% as it's specs state?

0.75% or better accuracy.(4X or better)
(and that would be "adjust to within 3%". the actual result may be better
than 3%;you just can't depend on it staying that way for any length of
time.)


And why
wouldn't a .03% meter with traceable certs be good enough? I'm not
saying it isn't, since I never even visited a cal lab, much less
worked in one. I just want to hear your expert opinion on what is
required.

You need to understand the concept of ACCEPTABLE ERROR, there is no
perfection only "good enough". What is "good enough" is in the eye of
the beholder, not yours.






--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

"Anthony Fremont" wrote in
:

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:11:09 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:

Here is a good "trick" to measure low currents with your DVM.
Make a switchable shunt box with (at least) the following full
scale ranges: 200nA (shunt resistor 1.11 megs), 2uA (shunt resistor
101K), 20uA (shunt resistor 10.0K), 200uA (shunt resistor 1.00K).
Put a twisted pair of leads (red, black) with banana plugs (red,
black) running out of the box via a small grommet, to plug into your
DVM set to the 200mV scale; a pair of (red, black) banana jacks with
0.75 "spacing is mounted on the box for your test leads.
Hint: add to the legend the parallel resistance of the system
(200nA/1M, 2uA/100K, etc) as a reminder of the resistance of this
current meter scheme.
Added hint: the 200MV scale is good for 20nA full scale, just
remember the meter resistance is 10 megs.


Tell us, oh master... what does placing a 1,1 meg resistor in
series with a circuit's power source do to the voltage presented to
the circuit?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=ohms+law

It drops it like any other shunt would.

all current measuring devices add resistance to the circuit,affecting it.
Just like any DMM parallels its input resistance with what it's put
across,loading the circuit under test.

If you were designing
precision equipment, would you attempt to measure nA by using a .01Ohm
resistor? Read Ed's post, he is right about being able to measure low
currents that way, just as Robert is here. They just don't work if
the current is varying over a wide range. But for static current
measurements, THEY WILL WORK FINE.

Shunt resistors are typically less than an ohm. Show me where
ANYONE uses a 1.1 meg resistor os a current shunt.

(you use the 1.1 shunt value externally because the DMMs 10 Meg parallel
resistance brings the effective R down to 1.0.)




--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

Jim Yanik wrote:
"Anthony Fremont" wrote:

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"

A .03%
METER CAN BE USED, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT METER IS AVAILABLE WITH
NIST CERTS, NOW CAN'T IT????

NOPE.

Now tell us why not? Exactly what kind of standard is required to
adjust a scope's vertical response to 3% as it's specs state?

0.75% or better accuracy.(4X or better)
(and that would be "adjust to within 3%". the actual result may be
better than 3%;you just can't depend on it staying that way for any
length of time.)

Thanks Jim, I feel like I finally heard something I could put some stock
into. Just to set the record straight, would it be legitimate to "certify"
a device to 3% (DUT specs) using a .03% accurate DMM that has an NIST cert?
Really, it's just a matter of personal curiosity now.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

I think, you just rant. Please get it right. Maybe you could use that
DVD to calibrate your anger response, maybe you could eBay it and
your home audio system to pay for some anger management?

**** you, you ****ing retard. Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.

Man does that ever sound like a personal threat.

Actually it is.

For MiniPrick aka MassiveProng to be acting this way just invites
prosecution and demonstrates how stupid this person really is. Does
anyone really believe that any professional in metrology specializing
in instrumentation calibriation would act this way? Of course not. And
would you believe any advice he might offer. Not me. I doubt he even
owns much knows how to use a multimeter.

FYI...if anyone wants to take the time to put this stupid fool in his
place, your local law enforcement will be happy to help you. One of
the interesting benefits of the Patriot Act is that they can and will
find anyone who likes to post threats on the Internet....including
Google Groups.

Now let's sit back and watch the personal attack I receive from this
clown for calling him what he is.

TMT



On Mar 4, 3:16 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:
MassiveProng wrote:
On Sat, 3 Mar 2007 23:56:14 +0000, Clint Sharp
Gave us:

I think, you just rant. Please get it right. Maybe you could use that
DVD to calibrate your anger response, maybe you could eBay it and
your home audio system to pay for some anger management?

**** you, you ****ing retard. Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.

Man does that ever sound like a personal threat.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:55:41 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

It drops it like any other shunt would.


Sub one ohm shunts affect the circuit very little. A ****ing 1.1
meg resistor is NEVER used as a shunt resistor, and would drastically
affect ANY circuit.

How can you be so thick?

No understanding of Ohms law wrt low currents.


Well, then you should study more.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:56:44 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 13:31:17 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

Tell me that
your feedback circuits sense the full output voltage.


Voltage dividers are completely different than current shunts, you
retarded ****.

No understanding of Ohms law. (now I see where Phil gets this from ;0)

Then you should study more, dip****.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On 4 Mar 2007 13:03:39 -0800, "Too_Many_Tools"
Gave us:


I think, you just rant. Please get it right. Maybe you could use that
DVD to calibrate your anger response, maybe you could eBay it and
your home audio system to pay for some anger management?

**** you, you ****ing retard. Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.

Man does that ever sound like a personal threat.

Actually it is.

No, it isn't you retarded ****.

For MiniPrick aka MassiveProng to be acting this way just invites
prosecution

You're an idiot, boy.

and demonstrates how stupid this person really is.

It is not a threat, dumb****.

Does
anyone really believe that any professional in metrology specializing
in instrumentation calibriation would act this way?

Show me where I said that, dip****. I didn't I said that I had
worked in cal labs, and that I work in QA.

Stop making **** up, you ****ing retard.

Of course not. And
would you believe any advice he might offer.

You're an idiot.

Not me. I doubt he even
owns much knows how to use a multimeter.

Far far moreso than your retarded ass does. That's why you don't
see me running around DESIGN newsgroups asking about calibration of my
instruments. If you had ANY brains at all, you wouldn't be asking
either. Then you went several steps further proving to us just how
retarded you are in subsequent posts. Good job, dip****.

FYI...if anyone wants to take the time to put this stupid fool in his
place,

Haven't broken any laws, you retarded ****head.

your local law enforcement will be happy to help you.

You're an idiot.

One of
the interesting benefits of the Patriot Act is that they can and will
find anyone who likes to post threats on the Internet....including
Google Groups.

There was no threat, you retarded ****head. This is NOT google
groups you ****ing retard. This is Usenet!

Now let's sit back and watch the personal attack I receive from this
clown for calling him what he is.

I can call you whatever I want, dumb****. I haven't broken any law.

So eat **** and die, you stupid ****.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:

On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:11:09 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:


Here is a good "trick" to measure low currents with your DVM.
Make a switchable shunt box with (at least) the following full scale
ranges: 200nA (shunt resistor 1.11 megs), 2uA (shunt resistor 101K),
20uA (shunt resistor 10.0K), 200uA (shunt resistor 1.00K).
Put a twisted pair of leads (red, black) with banana plugs (red,
black) running out of the box via a small grommet, to plug into your DVM
set to the 200mV scale; a pair of (red, black) banana jacks with 0.75
"spacing is mounted on the box for your test leads.
Hint: add to the legend the parallel resistance of the system
(200nA/1M, 2uA/100K, etc) as a reminder of the resistance of this
current meter scheme.
Added hint: the 200MV scale is good for 20nA full scale, just
remember the meter resistance is 10 megs.



Tell us, oh master... what does placing a 1,1 meg resistor in
series with a circuit's power source do to the voltage presented to
the circuit?

Shunt resistors are typically less than an ohm. Show me where
ANYONE uses a 1.1 meg resistor os a current shunt.
I think i said nothing about a series resistor.
Take that handheld DVM and note (rare exceptions) that its input
resistance is 10 megs onany of the voltage scales.
Take further note that the most sensitive scale is (almost always)
200mVFS.
So, by the simple application of ohms law, driving the meter for full
scale reading, the current thru the meter is 20nAFS.
Now, if one places a 1.11Meg resistor in parallel with the DVM, then
the equivalent input rtesistance would then be 1.00Megs and that would
mean, by the simple application of ohms law, driving the meter for full
scale reading, the current thru the meter is 200nAFS.
Und so wieder.

Now if you happen to have a *different* meter that has current scales
moer sensitive than 2mAFS, then this "trick" would not be needed.
Or....if you have absolutely no need for 3.5 or4.5 digit readings of
low currents via your handheld DVM, then this is moot.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:

On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:38:28 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:


Please see my earlier post regarding the use of a shunt box for a DVM.



What a joke that was. When is a 1.1M resistor EVER a current shunt?
What part of ohm's law do you not understand?

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

Laugh, laugh, laugh.....

Thanks for proving my argument MiniPrick.

Keep it up and you will be telling the officer how to fine tune your
cavity search.

TMT





On Mar 4, 4:57 pm, MassiveProng
wrote:
On 4 Mar 2007 13:03:39 -0800, "Too_Many_Tools"
Gave us:



I think, you just rant. Please get it right. Maybe you could use that
DVD to calibrate your anger response, maybe you could eBay it and
your home audio system to pay for some anger management?

**** you, you ****ing retard. Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.

Man does that ever sound like a personal threat.

Actually it is.

No, it isn't you retarded ****.



For MiniPrick aka MassiveProng to be acting this way just invites
prosecution

You're an idiot, boy.

and demonstrates how stupid this person really is.

It is not a threat, dumb****.

Does
anyone really believe that any professional in metrology specializing
in instrumentation calibriation would act this way?

Show me where I said that, dip****. I didn't I said that I had
worked in cal labs, and that I work in QA.

Stop making **** up, you ****ing retard.

Of course not. And
would you believe any advice he might offer.

You're an idiot.

Not me. I doubt he even
owns much knows how to use a multimeter.

Far far moreso than your retarded ass does. That's why you don't
see me running around DESIGN newsgroups asking about calibration of my
instruments. If you had ANY brains at all, you wouldn't be asking
either. Then you went several steps further proving to us just how
retarded you are in subsequent posts. Good job, dip****.

FYI...if anyone wants to take the time to put this stupid fool in his
place,

Haven't broken any laws, you retarded ****head.

your local law enforcement will be happy to help you.

You're an idiot.

One of
the interesting benefits of the Patriot Act is that they can and will
find anyone who likes to post threats on the Internet....including
Google Groups.

There was no threat, you retarded ****head. This is NOT google
groups you ****ing retard. This is Usenet!

Now let's sit back and watch the personal attack I receive from this
clown for calling him what he is.

I can call you whatever I want, dumb****. I haven't broken any law.

So eat **** and die, you stupid ****.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

"Anthony Fremont" wrote in
:

Jim Yanik wrote:
"Anthony Fremont" wrote:

MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"

A .03%
METER CAN BE USED, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT METER IS AVAILABLE WITH
NIST CERTS, NOW CAN'T IT????

NOPE.

Now tell us why not? Exactly what kind of standard is required to
adjust a scope's vertical response to 3% as it's specs state?

0.75% or better accuracy.(4X or better)
(and that would be "adjust to within 3%". the actual result may be
better than 3%;you just can't depend on it staying that way for any
length of time.)

Thanks Jim, I feel like I finally heard something I could put some
stock into. Just to set the record straight, would it be legitimate
to "certify" a device to 3% (DUT specs) using a .03% accurate DMM that
has an NIST cert? Really, it's just a matter of personal curiosity
now.




I'd be leery of that method because vertical gain check is generally done
with a dynamic signal(calibrated sq.wave),to eliminate drift of your
reference (ground) position.Like a TEK PG506.(I wish I had one.)

IIRC,you used a DC source "transfer calibrated" with the DMM to check the
vert.gain.So,literally,the DMM was the "standard" used as the reference,and
that would be listed on the cert.,along with the DC supply.
You just have to be careful to recheck the 0v reference trace position to
be sure it didn't drift.

Gain is usually adjusted on one attenuator setting,and the other ranges
checked to see that they are WITHIN the 3% tolerance,as the attenuators
themselves are usually not adjustable for gain,unless it's a differential
amp,like the 7A13.(don't know about scopes other than TEK.)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Mar 5, 6:11 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:
MassiveProng wrote:
On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 04:23:21 -0600, "Anthony Fremont"
Gave us:

QUOTED:
"Are you suggesting that I should drag it across town, spend $200
and be without it for 2 weeks just to get it adjusted by some
obstinate, E-1 grade line tech, instead of using a brand new DMM w
.03% accuracy to tweak it myself? I'm quite sure that my Micronta
is up to the task to be honest."

A calibration house would NOT use a 0.03% DMM to calibrate your scope
with, you pathetic piece of ****!

Did I say they would? I said I would tweak it myself and that it would be
good enough. Stay on track, you're here to prove why it won't work.

What part of that don't you understand?

What part of that proves that you are a brainless, pathetic piece of
**** do you not understand?

PLEASE READ MY POSTS BEFORE ****ING
YOURSELF!!!!!

**** you. I read the thread. It doesn't matter who the author is,
and when it is you, you retarded ****, it becomes glaringly obvious
due to your total stupidity. Just like the "E-1 grade tech" remark.
You prove with your every post that it is you that is an incompetent
*******.

Is that an apology? Where are your scematics and submissions?

If you don't understand something just ask for help.

**** you. It is you that lacks the basic understanding that errors
chain together.

Show one post where I demonstrated that I don't understand that. You can't.

The problem here is that you read something and then, in your twisted little
way, you interpret it as the poster is stupid and then you go off on some
totaly different train of thought. Like Don Quixote you then procede to
fight a battle against an illusion. You then begin to see every response as
though it's calling you a liar, even if they are just trying to put you back
on track. Many of your comments were valid, but they weren't germane to the
discussion at that point, just like the one you just made here.

Read him like book!

You make it sound like the OP was going to cal some critical lab equipment
at home and that lives were at stake. Then you go on to tout calibrating
your home theater by using a DVD/CD. And that's fine for home theater, but
for lab quality work (like you constantly brag about, and compare everything
to) considering the use of a signal from a CD is just F*CKING STUPID!!! 1Hz
accuracy would be atrocious and you know that very well.

A .03%
METER CAN BE USED, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT METER IS AVAILABLE WITH NIST
CERTS, NOW CAN'T IT????

NOPE.

Now tell us why not? Exactly what kind of standard is required to adjust
a scope's vertical response to 3% as it's specs state? And why wouldn't a
.03% meter with traceable certs be good enough? I'm not saying it isn't,
since I never even visited a cal lab, much less worked in one. I just want
to hear your expert opinion on what is required.

You need to understand the concept of ACCEPTABLE ERROR, there is no
perfection only "good enough". What is "good enough" is in the eye of the
beholder, not yours.

I don't think it's any use, after all MassiveProng didn't know that
modern scopes still only have a few percent vertical accuracy, so
obviously he's not quite up to speed on all this low precision stuff :-

Perhaps that nameless 4 channel 100MHz scope of his has some
astonishing vertical accuracy?

Dave :)

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 00:16:54 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:

MassiveProng wrote:

On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:11:09 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:


Here is a good "trick" to measure low currents with your DVM.
Make a switchable shunt box with (at least) the following full scale
ranges: 200nA (shunt resistor 1.11 megs), 2uA (shunt resistor 101K),
20uA (shunt resistor 10.0K), 200uA (shunt resistor 1.00K).
Put a twisted pair of leads (red, black) with banana plugs (red,
black) running out of the box via a small grommet, to plug into your DVM
set to the 200mV scale; a pair of (red, black) banana jacks with 0.75
"spacing is mounted on the box for your test leads.
Hint: add to the legend the parallel resistance of the system
(200nA/1M, 2uA/100K, etc) as a reminder of the resistance of this
current meter scheme.
Added hint: the 200MV scale is good for 20nA full scale, just
remember the meter resistance is 10 megs.



Tell us, oh master... what does placing a 1,1 meg resistor in
series with a circuit's power source do to the voltage presented to
the circuit?

Shunt resistors are typically less than an ohm. Show me where
ANYONE uses a 1.1 meg resistor os a current shunt.
I think i said nothing about a series resistor.

Dip****. You said "shunt box" Shunts are series devices.

Take that handheld DVM and note (rare exceptions) that its input
resistance is 10 megs onany of the voltage scales.

Whoopie!

Take further note that the most sensitive scale is (almost always)
200mVFS.

Hahahahaha!

So, by the simple application of ohms law, driving the meter for full
scale reading, the current thru the meter is 20nAFS.
Now, if one places a 1.11Meg resistor in parallel with the DVM, then
the equivalent input rtesistance would then be 1.00Megs and that would
mean, by the simple application of ohms law, driving the meter for full
scale reading, the current thru the meter is 200nAFS.
Und so wieder.


Which says NOTHING about using it to measure current through a
circuit element.

Now if you happen to have a *different* meter that has current scales
moer sensitive than 2mAFS, then this "trick" would not be needed.

Trick? You have defined no trick, and you even have the gall to
declare that your setup isn't used in series.

Or....if you have absolutely no need for 3.5 or4.5 digit readings of
low currents via your handheld DVM, then this is moot.

You need to re-examine your claims.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 00:19:41 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:

MassiveProng wrote:

On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:38:28 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:


Please see my earlier post regarding the use of a shunt box for a DVM.



What a joke that was. When is a 1.1M resistor EVER a current shunt?
What part of ohm's law do you not understand?


It's the part YOU do not understand that is in question here.

What part of "you change the circuit so much that it is no longer
the same circuit" do you not understand?

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On 4 Mar 2007 17:15:16 -0800, "Too_Many_Tools"
Gave us:


Thanks for proving my argument MiniPrick.

You have proven nothing, you top posting Usenet retard!

Keep it up and you will be telling the officer how to fine tune your
cavity search.

When you see a crime committed you let someone know, asshole.
Until then shut the **** up, you retarded twit.

TMT

Yes, you.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On 5 Mar 2007 01:46:21 -0800, "David L. Jones"
Gave us:


I don't think it's any use, after all MassiveProng didn't know that
modern scopes still only have a few percent vertical accuracy,


Said the total retard that then proceeded to tell us all about his 2%
scope.

Ooops.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Mar 5, 9:48 pm, MassiveProng
wrote:
On 5 Mar 2007 01:46:21 -0800, "David L. Jones"
Gave us:



I don't think it's any use, after all MassiveProng didn't know that
modern scopes still only have a few percent vertical accuracy,

Said the total retard that then proceeded to tell us all about his 2%
scope.

2% ain't too bad in the scope world, didn't you know? - oh that's
right, you didn't know!
LMAO!

We are all still anxiously awaiting your link to a scope that does
better than a percent or two on the vertical...
What's the matter, your frantic Google search failed you?
Come on, there has to be at least one out there surely, try harder...

Dave :)

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 19:12:15 -0800 MassiveProng
wrote in Message id:
:

Meet up with me, and I'll show you
how I manage it.

It's considered polite to bathe regularly enough to deter open sores
erupting across your flesh before making such requests.

HTH.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

Anthony Fremont wrote:
ehsjr wrote:

Anthony Fremont wrote:

ehsjr wrote:


But I'm curious as to what home circuits need meters
that can read voltage accurately to 3 decimal places?
2 decimal places? The question for current measurement:
in what home brew circuit design/troubleshooting do you
need accuracy below the tens of mA digit ? *Need*, not


You surely didn't mean tens of _mA_, did you?

I surely meant tens of mA.

I build stuff with PICs as

you know, and some of it is designed to run on batteries and needs
to go for long periods of time unattended. The current draw for a
12F683 running at 31kHz is 11uA, sleep current is 50nA. If I could
only measure current to "tens of mA", I'd never know if the PIC was
setup right for low current draw and I certainly couldn't have any
idea of expected battery life. I wouldn't even know if it was
sleeping until it ate thru some batteries in a few days instead of
six or eight months. I think I have a need to measure fractions of
a uA.

You may, but not accuracy below the tens of _mA_ digit.
When you need accuracy below tens of mA, you measure
voltage across a resistance. It doesn't make a lot of


Isn't that exactly how my DMM does it?

I don't know what your meter does. I assume it's
like any other. If so, it uses a shunt and develops
a voltage across the shunt so it is the same principle
as what I'm taking about, but not the same values.
AFAIK, they don't use a megohm neighborhood shunt
for low current - but then, I don't have any
meters with an nA scale.



sense to look for your meter to be accurate to 8 decimal
places for your .00000005 amp reading.


Now come on, the 8 decimal places is only assuming that the scale is in an
Amps range. The meter would be in the 500uA full scale range where 50nA is
only 2 decimal places.


Perhaps I did not make the point clearly.
When you are using your DMM and measuring something in
the neighborhood of 8 decimal places, like tens of nA,
your meter, regardless of scale, will be less accurate
than when it is measuring something in the 2 decimal
place neighborhood. The meter itself is more susceptable
to uncertainty the lower you go. AFAIK, the current
shunt even for low current scales has a much lower
resistance than the 2meg or 100 k I mentioned. That
means that the meter has to work with a lower level
than the 110 mv those resistors produce.

Regarding scaling - DMM's have tens of mV in 2 decimal
places. Most DMM's do not have tens of nA in 2 decimal
places. To get an 8th decimal point current reading into
the 2 decimal point range, convert it to mV with a resistor.

To put it in another perspective, consider a Fluke 187.
It will give .01 uA resolution (2 digits after the decimal)
on the 500 ua scale at a claimed accuracy of +/- .25%.
We'll ignore the further 20 count uncertaincy. That's
a +/- 1.25 uA error. That measurement is useless for the
55 nA current measurement you need. The meter could show
500.00 or 500.05 or 501.25 or whatever and you would not
know whether you had 55 nA or not. On that scale, the
meeter cannot be accurate to 2 decimal places. And you
cannot throw away the third digit after the decimal - it
doesn't exist on the meter, the resolution is too poor.

The same meter, on the 3 volt (3000mV) scale is accurate
to within +/- .025% which is +/- 75 uV - again, ignoring
the further 5 count uncertainty. On the 3 volt scale
with the technique I mentioned where you throw away the
third digit after the decimal, the error is meaningless.
That digit happens to be accurate on this meter and scale,
so the error is meaningless, even if you keep it.




Here's how you do it with accuracy at the tens of _mV_ digit:

For 11 uA, put a 10K .01% resistor in series with
the supply and measure .11 volts across it. The voltage
would range from 0.109989 to 0.110011. Keep only
2 decimal places. Your computed current, worst case,
would be off by 1 uA


For 50 nA, use a 2 meg 1% resistor and measure .10
volts across it. The voltage would range from .099
to .101 taking the 1% into account. Throw out the
last digit. Your current computation would be off
worst case, by 5 nA.


Those are fine ways to measuring static current levels, but they will not
work for me. Until the PIC goes to sleep, the current draw is much higher.
So much so that it would never power up thru a 2M resistor.

So I guess you're stuck with a need that the fancy Fluke
mentioned above cannot meet. How _do_ you measure the
55 nA?

What I would do is bypass the resistor with a switch so
the PIC can power up and run, and monitor it while it
is active by whatever technique you choose, so that you
know it is active. When it goes inactive, open the switch
to measure the voltage across the resistor.



With a voltmeter accurate to 2 decimal places.
I don't know why you would


If your volt meter has a 1V maximum at full scale and one can live with 10%
error, then I agree. If it has a 100V range, then you need .01% accuracy on
your equipment to make your measurements, right?



Anyone who is not smart enough to turn his meter
range down from the 100V scale to measure mV
is not smart enough to need nA measurements.

Measuring mV with the range set to 100 is stupid.
And 10% error for a DMM is stupid. I know you are
*not* stupid. So what is your point?

Ed

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

ehsjr wrote:
Anthony Fremont wrote:
ehsjr wrote:

sense to look for your meter to be accurate to 8 decimal
places for your .00000005 amp reading.


Now come on, the 8 decimal places is only assuming that the scale is
in an Amps range. The meter would be in the 500uA full scale range
where 50nA is only 2 decimal places.


Perhaps I did not make the point clearly.
When you are using your DMM and measuring something in
the neighborhood of 8 decimal places, like tens of nA,

The meter doesn't change accuracy based upon the scale it's using, it only
changes resolution. It remains .03% accurate. Whether reading Amps,
milliamps, or microamps.

your meter, regardless of scale, will be less accurate
than when it is measuring something in the 2 decimal
place neighborhood. The meter itself is more susceptable

I guess I wasn't clear or we're not understanding each other. The meter
will be in a ranger where 500uA is the full scale reading. 10's of nA is
two decimal places.

to uncertainty the lower you go. AFAIK, the current
shunt even for low current scales has a much lower
resistance than the 2meg or 100 k I mentioned. That
means that the meter has to work with a lower level
than the 110 mv those resistors produce.

Regarding scaling - DMM's have tens of mV in 2 decimal
places. Most DMM's do not have tens of nA in 2 decimal
places. To get an 8th decimal point current reading into
the 2 decimal point range, convert it to mV with a resistor.

To put it in another perspective, consider a Fluke 187.
It will give .01 uA resolution (2 digits after the decimal)
on the 500 ua scale at a claimed accuracy of +/- .25%.
We'll ignore the further 20 count uncertaincy. That's
a +/- 1.25 uA error. That measurement is useless for the
55 nA current measurement you need. The meter could show
500.00 or 500.05 or 501.25 or whatever and you would not
know whether you had 55 nA or not. On that scale, the

Your error calculation is assuming a full scale reading. The error
(neglecting the count uncertainty) at 50nA is only .125nA, it wouldn't even
show on the display.

But at 50nA it would read .03 to .07uA on my meter including the 2d
uncertainty, plenty good enough for me.

meeter cannot be accurate to 2 decimal places. And you
cannot throw away the third digit after the decimal - it
doesn't exist on the meter, the resolution is too poor.

The same meter, on the 3 volt (3000mV) scale is accurate
to within +/- .025% which is +/- 75 uV - again, ignoring
the further 5 count uncertainty. On the 3 volt scale
with the technique I mentioned where you throw away the
third digit after the decimal, the error is meaningless.
That digit happens to be accurate on this meter and scale,
so the error is meaningless, even if you keep it.

Try looking at the Extech I just ordered. .1%+2d 50000 count.


Here's how you do it with accuracy at the tens of _mV_ digit:

For 11 uA, put a 10K .01% resistor in series with
the supply and measure .11 volts across it. The voltage
would range from 0.109989 to 0.110011. Keep only
2 decimal places. Your computed current, worst case,
would be off by 1 uA


For 50 nA, use a 2 meg 1% resistor and measure .10
volts across it. The voltage would range from .099
to .101 taking the 1% into account. Throw out the
last digit. Your current computation would be off
worst case, by 5 nA.


Those are fine ways to measuring static current levels, but they
will not work for me. Until the PIC goes to sleep, the current draw
is much higher. So much so that it would never power up thru a 2M
resistor.

So I guess you're stuck with a need that the fancy Fluke
mentioned above cannot meet. How _do_ you measure the
55 nA?

That's why I didn't buy the Fluke. The meter I bought will give me 10nA
resolution. I know it won't be dead on when reading 50nA, but it will be
close enough that I know that I didn't leave some pull-ups turned on or some
other peripheral pidling away the juice. In current mode the Extech will be
good enough for me to be sure of what's happening. Any worse accuracy, and
I couldn't be sure.

What I would do is bypass the resistor with a switch so
the PIC can power up and run, and monitor it while it
is active by whatever technique you choose, so that you
know it is active. When it goes inactive, open the switch
to measure the voltage across the resistor.

Yes, I have done time-wasting methods like this before, that's why I want a
new meter, DSO and a logic analyzer.
:-)



With a voltmeter accurate to 2 decimal places.
I don't know why you would


If your volt meter has a 1V maximum at full scale and one can live
with 10% error, then I agree. If it has a 100V range, then you need
.01% accuracy on your equipment to make your measurements, right?



Anyone who is not smart enough to turn his meter
range down from the 100V scale to measure mV
is not smart enough to need nA measurements.

Measuring mV with the range set to 100 is stupid.
And 10% error for a DMM is stupid. I know you are
*not* stupid. So what is your point?

The 10% error is due to your technique not the DMM, you said so yourself,
and I quote:

" For 11 uA, put a 10K .01% resistor in series with
the supply and measure .11 volts across it. The voltage
would range from 0.109989 to 0.110011. Keep only
2 decimal places. Your computed current, worst case,
would be off by 1 uA

For 50 nA, use a 2 meg 1% resistor and measure .10
volts across it. The voltage would range from .099
to .101 taking the 1% into account. Throw out the
last digit. Your current computation would be off
worst case, by 5 nA."

By my calculations, a 5nA error on a 50nA reading is a 10% error or did I
miss something?

I agree that these techniques are valid and worthwhile at times, but I will
stick with the convenience and accuracy of a $200 meter instead of buying $5
resistors. :-) I've got a tracking number and it should be here tomorrow,
I can't wait. I reall can't wait til my scope gets here. :-)))))))

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

David L. Jones wrote:
On Mar 6, 7:41 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:

I agree that these techniques are valid and worthwhile at times, but
I will stick with the convenience and accuracy of a $200 meter
instead of buying $5 resistors. :-) I've got a tracking number and
it should be here tomorrow, I can't wait. I reall can't wait til my
scope gets here. :-)))))))

We expect internal pics to be posted ASAP!

Well, I guess while I'm in there butchering up the knob spring and resetting
the cal using my Micronta, I might as swell snap some pics. ;-)

I'm curious about the build quality of the Extech...

Me too, for that much money it better be as good as a Fluke.

The scope wont be here for a couple of weeks. :-( I hope it's as good as
the manual makes it sound. What do you think of this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/OWON-PORTABAL-DI...QQcmdZViewItem

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

On Mar 6, 9:36 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:
David L. Jones wrote:
On Mar 6, 7:41 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:
I agree that these techniques are valid and worthwhile at times, but
I will stick with the convenience and accuracy of a $200 meter
instead of buying $5 resistors. :-) I've got a tracking number and
it should be here tomorrow, I can't wait. I reall can't wait til my
scope gets here. :-)))))))

We expect internal pics to be posted ASAP!

Well, I guess while I'm in there butchering up the knob spring and resetting
the cal using my Micronta, I might as swell snap some pics. ;-)

No fair waving the red flag at the bull now, he must be tired from all
that charging!

I'm curious about the build quality of the Extech...

Me too, for that much money it better be as good as a Fluke.

The scope wont be here for a couple of weeks. :-( I hope it's as good as
the manual makes it sound. What do you think of this:http://cgi.ebay.com/OWON-PORTABAL-DI...EDU5022M-25MHZ...

Love the Jinglish:
"Digital popularization storm-the best substitute of EDU series
digital oscilloscope for analog oscilloscope

EDU digital storage oscilloscope is the best choice to substitute for
traditional analog oscilloscope though it don't coming with surprising
function and specification. Thanks to the creative R&D thoughts and
strict cost control, EDU series is outstanding when compete with
analog oscilloscope even in price.
EDU digital storage oscilloscopes display by STN LCD big screen in
compact design, it is available at bandwidth of 20MHz to 40MHz and
real sample rate of 100Ms/S.The series satisfy the detection of
electric manufacturing production lines as well as basic mathematics
needs.

Hesitation is wasting! We highly expect the "Digital popularization
storm "will bring the reliable measurement instruments which "Meet
your best needs" for you."

Hilarious!

25MHz bandwidth and 100MS/s ain't exactly going to blow the lab down.
It sucks for sure, but the question is only buy how much?

Dave :)

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

Anthony Fremont wrote:

The scope wont be here for a couple of weeks. :-( I hope it's as
good as the manual makes it sound. What do you think of this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/OWON-PORTABAL-DI...QQcmdZViewItem

Oops wrong one, try he
http://www.saelig.com/miva/merchant....gory_Code=PSSA

60MHz, TFT 6K depth, all the normal bells and whistles (USB memory stick,
printer etc) and I think it might have a 7.8" screen. Not bad for under
$600. It seems to be a match for the current generation of thin (6") depth
units from China. For only $70 more, you get a 3hr battery and charger.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

David L. Jones wrote:
On Mar 6, 9:36 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:
David L. Jones wrote:
On Mar 6, 7:41 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:
I agree that these techniques are valid and worthwhile at times,
but I will stick with the convenience and accuracy of a $200 meter
instead of buying $5 resistors. :-) I've got a tracking number
and it should be here tomorrow, I can't wait. I reall can't wait
til my scope gets here. :-)))))))

We expect internal pics to be posted ASAP!

Well, I guess while I'm in there butchering up the knob spring and
resetting
the cal using my Micronta, I might as swell snap some pics. ;-)

No fair waving the red flag at the bull now, he must be tired from all
that charging!

I'm curious about the build quality of the Extech...

Me too, for that much money it better be as good as a Fluke.

The scope wont be here for a couple of weeks. :-( I hope it's as
good as
the manual makes it sound. What do you think of
this:http://cgi.ebay.com/OWON-PORTABAL-DI...EDU5022M-25MHZ...

Love the Jinglish:
"Digital popularization storm-the best substitute of EDU series
digital oscilloscope for analog oscilloscope

EDU digital storage oscilloscope is the best choice to substitute for
traditional analog oscilloscope though it don't coming with surprising
function and specification. Thanks to the creative R&D thoughts and
strict cost control, EDU series is outstanding when compete with
analog oscilloscope even in price.
EDU digital storage oscilloscopes display by STN LCD big screen in
compact design, it is available at bandwidth of 20MHz to 40MHz and
real sample rate of 100Ms/S.The series satisfy the detection of
electric manufacturing production lines as well as basic mathematics
needs.

Hesitation is wasting! We highly expect the "Digital popularization
storm "will bring the reliable measurement instruments which "Meet
your best needs" for you."

Hilarious!

25MHz bandwidth and 100MS/s ain't exactly going to blow the lab down.
It sucks for sure, but the question is only buy how much?

Check that other one at Saelig, it's made by Owon. 60MHz 250Msa/s 6K
PDS6062T not bad looking.

Yeah that's what I loved about the Rigol manual, not a trace of engrish
anywhere. I wonder if a customer wrote it for them. ;-)

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

MassiveProng wrote:

On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 00:16:54 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:


MassiveProng wrote:


On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 10:11:09 GMT, Robert Baer
Gave us:



Here is a good "trick" to measure low currents with your DVM.
Make a switchable shunt box with (at least) the following full scale
ranges: 200nA (shunt resistor 1.11 megs), 2uA (shunt resistor 101K),
20uA (shunt resistor 10.0K), 200uA (shunt resistor 1.00K).
Put a twisted pair of leads (red, black) with banana plugs (red,
black) running out of the box via a small grommet, to plug into your DVM
set to the 200mV scale; a pair of (red, black) banana jacks with 0.75
"spacing is mounted on the box for your test leads.
Hint: add to the legend the parallel resistance of the system
(200nA/1M, 2uA/100K, etc) as a reminder of the resistance of this
current meter scheme.
Added hint: the 200MV scale is good for 20nA full scale, just
remember the meter resistance is 10 megs.



Tell us, oh master... what does placing a 1,1 meg resistor in
series with a circuit's power source do to the voltage presented to
the circuit?

Shunt resistors are typically less than an ohm. Show me where
ANYONE uses a 1.1 meg resistor os a current shunt.

I think i said nothing about a series resistor.


Dip****. You said "shunt box" Shunts are series devices.


Take that handheld DVM and note (rare exceptions) that its input
resistance is 10 megs onany of the voltage scales.


Whoopie!


Take further note that the most sensitive scale is (almost always)
200mVFS.


Hahahahaha!


So, by the simple application of ohms law, driving the meter for full
scale reading, the current thru the meter is 20nAFS.
Now, if one places a 1.11Meg resistor in parallel with the DVM, then
the equivalent input rtesistance would then be 1.00Megs and that would
mean, by the simple application of ohms law, driving the meter for full
scale reading, the current thru the meter is 200nAFS.
Und so wieder.



Which says NOTHING about using it to measure current through a
circuit element.


Now if you happen to have a *different* meter that has current scales
moer sensitive than 2mAFS, then this "trick" would not be needed.


Trick? You have defined no trick, and you even have the gall to
declare that your setup isn't used in series.


Or....if you have absolutely no need for 3.5 or4.5 digit readings of
low currents via your handheld DVM, then this is moot.


You need to re-examine your claims.
Use a dictionary, if you have one and look up the word "shunt".
Hint: do not use the quotes.

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

David L. Jones wrote:

On Mar 6, 9:36 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:

David L. Jones wrote:

On Mar 6, 7:41 am, "Anthony Fremont" wrote:

I agree that these techniques are valid and worthwhile at times, but
I will stick with the convenience and accuracy of a $200 meter
instead of buying $5 resistors. :-) I've got a tracking number and
it should be here tomorrow, I can't wait. I reall can't wait til my
scope gets here. :-)))))))

We expect internal pics to be posted ASAP!

Well, I guess while I'm in there butchering up the knob spring and resetting
the cal using my Micronta, I might as swell snap some pics. ;-)


No fair waving the red flag at the bull now, he must be tired from all
that charging!


I'm curious about the build quality of the Extech...

Me too, for that much money it better be as good as a Fluke.

The scope wont be here for a couple of weeks. :-( I hope it's as good as
the manual makes it sound. What do you think of this:http://cgi.ebay.com/OWON-PORTABAL-DI...EDU5022M-25MHZ...


Love the Jinglish:
"Digital popularization storm-the best substitute of EDU series
digital oscilloscope for analog oscilloscope

EDU digital storage oscilloscope is the best choice to substitute for
traditional analog oscilloscope though it don't coming with surprising
function and specification. Thanks to the creative R&D thoughts and
strict cost control, EDU series is outstanding when compete with
analog oscilloscope even in price.
EDU digital storage oscilloscopes display by STN LCD big screen in
compact design, it is available at bandwidth of 20MHz to 40MHz and
real sample rate of 100Ms/S.The series satisfy the detection of
electric manufacturing production lines as well as basic mathematics
needs.

Hesitation is wasting! We highly expect the "Digital popularization
storm "will bring the reliable measurement instruments which "Meet
your best needs" for you."

Hilarious!

25MHz bandwidth and 100MS/s ain't exactly going to blow the lab down.
It sucks for sure, but the question is only buy how much?

Dave :)

...."basic mathematics needs" ?????

Calibration Of Electronic Equipment In The Home Workshop
 

Robert Baer wrote:
David L. Jones wrote:


Love the Jinglish:
"Digital popularization storm-the best substitute of EDU series
digital oscilloscope for analog oscilloscope

EDU digital storage oscilloscope is the best choice to substitute for
traditional analog oscilloscope though it don't coming with
surprising function and specification. Thanks to the creative R&D
thoughts and strict cost control, EDU series is outstanding when
compete with analog oscilloscope even in price.
EDU digital storage oscilloscopes display by STN LCD big screen in
compact design, it is available at bandwidth of 20MHz to 40MHz and
real sample rate of 100Ms/S.The series satisfy the detection of
electric manufacturing production lines as well as basic mathematics
needs.

Hesitation is wasting! We highly expect the "Digital popularization
storm "will bring the reliable measurement instruments which "Meet
your best needs" for you."

Hilarious!

25MHz bandwidth and 100MS/s ain't exactly going to blow the lab down.
It sucks for sure, but the question is only buy how much?

Dave :)

..."basic mathematics needs" ?????

Presumably they are talking about cursors and the auto-math features like
Vavg, Vpp, Vrms, duty cycle etc.... Act now, hesitation is wasting! ;-)