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#1
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase
shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food. |
#2
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
Jim Thompson
Wrote in message: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food. Do you remember the MXR Phase 90? It was a guitar effects pedal that used a chain of op amp all-pass filters: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-pass_filter as a phase shift network and a JFET as a voltage variable resistance in parallel with the resistor to ground to vary the phase. Could one build something similar just for a higher frequency, maybe? 500 MHz GBW op amps are not terribly expensive these days; use PHEMTs as the variable resistance elements? -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#3
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 13:17:32 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson Do you want to buy it as a part, or build it into one of your IC designs? How much phase shift do you need? There are tons of analog IQ modulator chips around, some with a built-in 90 degree phase shifter. They can do full the 360 degrees if you apply sin/cos multiplier inputs. Small phase shifts can be done with a varicap RC or LC network. Or an RC or LC shifter and a multiplier or two. Extreme: an inductor-varicap variable-delay transmission line. The HP8133A had several, insanely long ones. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com |
#4
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On 1/13/2015 3:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote:
Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson I've used a variation of the normal op amp all-pass filter for this, except with a high frequency diff amp: *---------------* | | 0-----*-----RRRR-------*----| | | | | | | R | Diff amp | | Gain of 0.5 R | | | R | *-----Out | | | | | | | | | GND | | | | | *-----RRRR--*----*----| | | | | | | | *---------------* | L | L | L | L L | L | L | L --- Varactor | ^ | | | *---RRRR----0 V_phi | | | | CCC | CCC big C | | GND GND You pick the voltage divider to have a gain of 0.5; the series L resonates the varactor just past the low-voltage end of V_phi; and the shunt inductor resonates the series combination just past the high end of V_phi. You can get about 150 degrees in one stage, with linearity of +- a few degrees. Good medicine. Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net |
#5
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On 14/01/2015 7:17 AM, Jim Thompson wrote:
Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? Pair of AD834 multipliers adding complementary (sine and cosine) variable proportions of in-phase and a quadrature signals? http://www.analog.com/static/importe...eets/AD834.pdf http://www.analog.com/static/importe...tes/AN-212.pdf If Analog Devices has been able to make the AD834 since the late 1980's, Jim should be able to put together something fairly quickly. Getting the in-phase and quadrature components may not be trivial if the frequency range involved isn't just 210 MHz, but "The Art of Electronics" talks about wide-band quadrature networks (originally developed for single-side-band radio) which can cover a respectable range of frequencies. -- Bill Sloman, Sydney |
#6
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On 14/01/2015 07:17, Jim Thompson wrote:
Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson It would be helpful if you indicated whether your input signal was a constant sinusoid, square wave or some arbitrary signal (in which case it would also be helpful if you indicated the signal bandwidth, as this makes a difference). It would also be useful to know whether the phase shift should be proportional to the voltage, or the time delay through the circuit should be proportional to the voltage, or whatever the control function should be. Also the linearity of the control input would be an important spec. as well as any requirement on the phase noise introduced (e.g. if there is noise added to the phase control signal). |
#7
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 19:18:37 -0500, Phil Hobbs
wrote: On 1/13/2015 3:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson I've used a variation of the normal op amp all-pass filter for this, except with a high frequency diff amp: *---------------* | | 0-----*-----RRRR-------*----| | | | | | | R | Diff amp | | Gain of 0.5 R | | | R | *-----Out | | | | | | | | | GND | | | | | *-----RRRR--*----*----| | | | | | | | *---------------* | L | L | L | L L | L | L | L --- Varactor | ^ | | | *---RRRR----0 V_phi | | | | CCC | CCC big C | | GND GND You pick the voltage divider to have a gain of 0.5; the series L resonates the varactor just past the low-voltage end of V_phi; and the shunt inductor resonates the series combination just past the high end of V_phi. You can get about 150 degrees in one stage, with linearity of +- a few degrees. Good medicine. Cheers Phil Hobbs That's what the customer is currently using except for a capacitance multiplier made with an AD834(?) ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food. |
#8
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 15:54:17 -0800, John Larkin
wrote: On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 13:17:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson Do you want to buy it as a part, or build it into one of your IC designs? How much phase shift do you need? There are tons of analog IQ modulator chips around, some with a built-in 90 degree phase shifter. They can do full the 360 degrees if you apply sin/cos multiplier inputs. Crikey! Why didn't I think of that... marvelous! Thanks for the pointer! Small phase shifts can be done with a varicap RC or LC network. Or an RC or LC shifter and a multiplier or two. Extreme: an inductor-varicap variable-delay transmission line. The HP8133A had several, insanely long ones. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food. |
#9
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 18:28:39 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote: On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 19:18:37 -0500, Phil Hobbs wrote: On 1/13/2015 3:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson I've used a variation of the normal op amp all-pass filter for this, except with a high frequency diff amp: *---------------* | | 0-----*-----RRRR-------*----| | | | | | | R | Diff amp | | Gain of 0.5 R | | | R | *-----Out | | | | | | | | | GND | | | | | *-----RRRR--*----*----| | | | | | | | *---------------* | L | L | L | L L | L | L | L --- Varactor | ^ | | | *---RRRR----0 V_phi | | | | CCC | CCC big C | | GND GND You pick the voltage divider to have a gain of 0.5; the series L resonates the varactor just past the low-voltage end of V_phi; and the shunt inductor resonates the series combination just past the high end of V_phi. You can get about 150 degrees in one stage, with linearity of +- a few degrees. Good medicine. Cheers Phil Hobbs That's what the customer is currently using except for a capacitance multiplier made with an AD834(?) ...Jim Thompson For small phase shifts, you could bias a jfet or something, with a d-g feedback cap, and vary Vgs (ie, transconductance) to change the phase shift. Dirt cheap. An inductor somewhere might be interesting. People used to make FM modulators like that, with toobs. Pre-emphasis made phase shift into frequency shift. Reactance tube modulator, something like that. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com |
#10
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
John Larkin Wrote in message:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 18:28:39 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 19:18:37 -0500, Phil Hobbs wrote: On 1/13/2015 3:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson I've used a variation of the normal op amp all-pass filter for this, except with a high frequency diff amp: *---------------* | | 0-----*-----RRRR-------*----| | | | | | | R | Diff amp | | Gain of 0.5 R | | | R | *-----Out | | | | | | | | | GND | | | | | *-----RRRR--*----*----| | | | | | | | *---------------* | L | L | L | L L | L | L | L --- Varactor | ^ | | | *---RRRR----0 V_phi | | | | CCC | CCC big C | | GND GND You pick the voltage divider to have a gain of 0.5; the series L resonates the varactor just past the low-voltage end of V_phi; and the shunt inductor resonates the series combination just past the high end of V_phi. You can get about 150 degrees in one stage, with linearity of +- a few degrees. Good medicine. Cheers Phil Hobbs That's what the customer is currently using except for a capacitance multiplier made with an AD834(?) ...Jim Thompson For small phase shifts, you could bias a jfet or something, with a d-g feedback cap, and vary Vgs (ie, transconductance) to change the phase shift. Dirt cheap. An inductor somewhere might be interesting. People used to make FM modulators like that, with toobs. Pre-emphasis made phase shift into frequency shift. Reactance tube modulator, something like that. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com My go-to toob book, "Electron Tube Circuits", by Samuel Seeley, second edition 1958 -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#11
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
John Larkin Wrote in message:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 18:28:39 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 19:18:37 -0500, Phil Hobbs wrote: On 1/13/2015 3:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson I've used a variation of the normal op amp all-pass filter for this, except with a high frequency diff amp: *---------------* | | 0-----*-----RRRR-------*----| | | | | | | R | Diff amp | | Gain of 0.5 R | | | R | *-----Out | | | | | | | | | GND | | | | | *-----RRRR--*----*----| | | | | | | | *---------------* | L | L | L | L L | L | L | L --- Varactor | ^ | | | *---RRRR----0 V_phi | | | | CCC | CCC big C | | GND GND You pick the voltage divider to have a gain of 0.5; the series L resonates the varactor just past the low-voltage end of V_phi; and the shunt inductor resonates the series combination just past the high end of V_phi. You can get about 150 degrees in one stage, with linearity of +- a few degrees. Good medicine. Cheers Phil Hobbs That's what the customer is currently using except for a capacitance multiplier made with an AD834(?) ...Jim Thompson For small phase shifts, you could bias a jfet or something, with a d-g feedback cap, and vary Vgs (ie, transconductance) to change the phase shift. Dirt cheap. An inductor somewhere might be interesting. People used to make FM modulators like that, with toobs. Pre-emphasis made phase shift into frequency shift. Reactance tube modulator, something like that. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com My go to toob book, "Electron Tube Circuits", by Samuel Seeley, second edition 1958, has a section on reactance tube modulators: https://www.dropbox.com/s/yojzh3ztmp...24122.jpg?dl=0 -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#12
Posted to sci.electronics.design,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic,sci.electronics.basics
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Voltage-Variable Phase Shifter
bitrex Wrote in message:
John Larkin Wrote in message: On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 18:28:39 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: On Tue, 13 Jan 2015 19:18:37 -0500, Phil Hobbs wrote: On 1/13/2015 3:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote: Anyone have ideas regarding how to implement a voltage-variable phase shifter useable at 210MHz? ...Jim Thompson I've used a variation of the normal op amp all-pass filter for this, except with a high frequency diff amp: *---------------* | | 0-----*-----RRRR-------*----| | | | | | | R | Diff amp | | Gain of 0.5 R | | | R | *-----Out | | | | | | | | | GND | | | | | *-----RRRR--*----*----| | | | | | | | *---------------* | L | L | L | L L | L | L | L --- Varactor | ^ | | | *---RRRR----0 V_phi | | | | CCC | CCC big C | | GND GND You pick the voltage divider to have a gain of 0.5; the series L resonates the varactor just past the low-voltage end of V_phi; and the shunt inductor resonates the series combination just past the high end of V_phi. You can get about 150 degrees in one stage, with linearity of +- a few degrees. Good medicine. Cheers Phil Hobbs That's what the customer is currently using except for a capacitance multiplier made with an AD834(?) ...Jim Thompson For small phase shifts, you could bias a jfet or something, with a d-g feedback cap, and vary Vgs (ie, transconductance) to change the phase shift. Dirt cheap. An inductor somewhere might be interesting. People used to make FM modulators like that, with toobs. Pre-emphasis made phase shift into frequency shift. Reactance tube modulator, something like that. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing laser drivers and controllers jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com My go-to toob book, "Electron Tube Circuits", by Samuel Seeley, second edition 1958 -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ Sorry, something weird going on with my Android newsgroup reader. Anyway, I was going to say that the book has a section on reactance tube modulators: https://www.dropbox.com/s/yojzh3ztmp...24122.jpg?dl=0 -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
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