I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy

Well, if you truly go from "rough to ready" you need more than just one
plane to do it properly. Initially you'll use a scrub plane to hog off wood
quickly and get it close to flat. Then clean this up with a jack plane or
fore plane. At this point it is probably pretty good. You'll want a
jointer to get the edges nice and straight and square the faces. And you'll
want a smoothing plane to get the surface finish-ready. If the grain is
gnarly (maybe not too likely with red oak, but you never know), you might
want a high-angle smoother or a scraping plane. So, if you just have the
one plane, (probably a smoother ?) you might be in for a tough time. If
you have multiple irons, you could grind one with a curved profile and open
the mouth and probably get away with it for roughing out and getting close
to flat. I'm sure it can be done, and if you enjoy the process you'll
probably learn a lot and have a blast.

Mike


"Billy Smith" wrote in message
. ..
I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy

"Billy Smith" wrote in message
. ..

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Mike already gave you an excellent reply. One thing that might have been
assumed, but is not true. Do you have a decent bench or some means of
supporting the boards when you plane them? A plane without a good steady
support for the work piece is a lost cause.

With a few clamps and some ingenuity, you can turn a table saw top into a
workable make-do work surface for planing.

Bob

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 14:37:16 -0500, "Billy Smith"
wrote:

I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy



go for it. hand tools are a joy to use...

Mike has a good post. Two questions:
1.How big are your arms?
2. How's the aerobic conditioning?
Seriously.

Bob

"Mike in Mystic" wrote in message
news
Well, if you truly go from "rough to ready" you need more than just one
plane to do it properly. Initially you'll use a scrub plane to hog off
wood
quickly and get it close to flat. Then clean this up with a jack plane or
fore plane. At this point it is probably pretty good. You'll want a
jointer to get the edges nice and straight and square the faces. And
you'll
want a smoothing plane to get the surface finish-ready. If the grain is
gnarly (maybe not too likely with red oak, but you never know), you might
want a high-angle smoother or a scraping plane. So, if you just have the
one plane, (probably a smoother ?) you might be in for a tough time. If
you have multiple irons, you could grind one with a curved profile and
open
the mouth and probably get away with it for roughing out and getting close
to flat. I'm sure it can be done, and if you enjoy the process you'll
probably learn a lot and have a blast.

Mike


"Billy Smith" wrote in message
. ..
I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy

Mike already gave you an excellent reply. One thing that might have been
assumed, but is not true. Do you have a decent bench or some means of
supporting the boards when you plane them? A plane without a good steady
support for the work piece is a lost cause.
With a few clamps and some ingenuity, you can turn a table saw top into a
workable make-do work surface for planing.


He can also do jointing with the table saw with a purchased or home made jig.
DAGS on these quoted terms: "table saw jointing" & "jointing on the table saw"
The Table Saw Book:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books
Jim Tolpin's Table Saw Magic, Second Edition:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books

I do not own a table saw, I am no expert, just would love to "have" a table
saw, myself. Just trying to help.

Alex

In article ,
says...
I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy




I can't see why it would be stupid. Did quite a bit of it myself when I
first started and hand tools were about all I had.


--
MikeG
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net

"Billy Smith" wrote in message
. ..
I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy



I would suggest trying one board, or maybe one side of one board.
Then consider that a surface planer will do a nicer job in 8 seconds.
I think you will rather get the oak dinensioned at the shop and spend your
energy on the construction of the cabinet.
B

Well, if you truly go from "rough to ready" you need more than just one
plane to do it properly. Initially you'll use a scrub plane to hog off wood
quickly and get it close to flat. Then clean this up with a jack plane or
fore plane. At this point it is probably pretty good. You'll want a
jointer to get the edges nice and straight and square the faces. And you'll
want a smoothing plane to get the surface finish-ready. If the grain is
gnarly (maybe not too likely with red oak, but you never know), you might
want a high-angle smoother or a scraping plane. So, if you just have the
one plane, (probably a smoother ?) you might be in for a tough time. If
you have multiple irons, you could grind one with a curved profile and open
the mouth and probably get away with it for roughing out and getting close
to flat. I'm sure it can be done, and if you enjoy the process you'll
probably learn a lot and have a blast.


Least expensive scrub plane: http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/

Alex

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 21:25:43 GMT, "Bob Schmall"
calmly ranted:

Mike has a good post. Two questions:
1.How big are your arms?

Billy's arms will be bigger when he's done with the project.


2. How's the aerobic conditioning?

It'll be better when he's done.


Seriously.

Yes, it's serious sweatwork, but it's worth it if the old bod
can handle it.


-- Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Turkey and Drive --

"Billy Smith" wrote in message
. ..
(snip)

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.
--------------
Why not use veneered MDF for the large bits and solid wood for the edges?
Unless someone is going to attack it with an axe they'll never know.

Many, many, moons ago I made a coffee table from rough oak and mahogany. No
access to power tools as it was a school project and everything had to be
done by hand, so to speak. Anyway, the bottom line is that it is do-able,
but you need access to a whole range of good hand-tools. Or, resort to
pre-engineered product that will give the desired result with less pain.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter.
--------------
That has to be a big plus. I'm in a similar position, although the cost of
my tools is starting to feed the inbuilt demand chain of the wife.
Nevertheless, there are some power tools I just don't want as I consider
them to be a little too dangerous for the occasional dabbler such as myself.
Others I simply don't have space for. But I reckon we can size rough lumber
accurately without too much kit, or herculean effort, with a decent saw and
a router - and a few jigs.

I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?
---------------
I don't think you'll do the wood,or yourself, justice by attacking it
under-tooled.

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 14:27:01 -0800, "AAvK" wrote:

Least expensive scrub plane: http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/


Least expensive scrub plane:

A #4

A coarse and fine stone to put some crown on the iron.

A file to open the mouth (if needed)

A screwdriver to shunt the frog back.

Finding two boards 5+ feet long that are the width
of the sides of the book case could take some
searching. Finding two that size that don't have a
significant twist, bow, crook orcupping is not trivial
- and "significant doesn't mean Obvious - doesn't
take much of any of them to make for trouble along
the way or at assembly time.

(if you want to experience "kickback" just start
ripping stock that's cupped, bowed, twisted or
crooked.)

But there's a bit of work and more than a bit of
knowledge and skills, along with several planes,
needed to get 5 foot boards flat on both faces, both
faces parallel, two parallel straight edges square
to the top and bottom faces.

Do you know how to check a board for cupping,
twists, bowing etc. so you know where wood
must be removed? A flat surface bigger than
your board is needed as a reference against
which you'll check your progess and identify
where you need to work the board some more.

Do you have a way of holding the board on
edge so you can plane one straight and square?
You can get the other edge straight and square
on the table saw after you've got your good
edge. But you need one straight, squared
edge.

Do yo know how to read the grain so you
know which direction to plane in order to
avoid tear out, splitting etc., especially
on the face of a board that's probably
not quarter sawn?

There's a lot to know if you want to
Neander, in addition to the physical work
involved. You can learn it on project
wood, but I wouldn't recomend it. Try
a box or a small shelf or cabinet first.

Though I put the following together
assuming power tools, if you adjust
for hand planing, the info may be
helpful (alll one line)

http://home.comcast.net/~charliebcz/CabProcess3.html

charlie b

"Bob Schmall" wrote

: Mike has a good post. Two questions:
: 1.How big are your arms?
: 2. How's the aerobic conditioning?
: Seriously.

Equally seriously, how flat is your bench top?

Jeff G
--
Jeff Gorman, West Yorkshire, UK
Email: username is amgron
ISP is clara.co.uk
www.amgron.clara.net

"Billy Smith" wrote in message
. ..
I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

Thanks,
Billy



You know what Billy? If it weren't for the wonders of the internet and
newsgroups like this, you'd have just gone ahead and grabbed your hand plane
and given that oak a shot, wouldn't you? Sure you would have - you'd have
said to yourself, "self..., let's see what this plane will do", and you'd
have kept on talking to yourself until you had that board planed down. Then
you'd have said to yourself, "self, I bet I can do the whole thing this way"
and you'd have given it a whirl. You'd have probable bungled a couple of
things up, but you'd have figured out what you did wrong, fix it and move
on. That's the beauty of giving it a try, and just going for it. One of
the things the internet (and certainly not the worst thing...) has done is
to give too much opportunity to worry about it too much. Too many opinions
available, too much advise. The heck with what experienced woodworkers
would try. Heck - most of them only try what someone else recommended or
what they became comfortable with over time. Try what makes sense to you.
It is after all, supposed to be a pleasurable thing. Grab that plane and
get into that wood.
--

-Mike-

-snip-

go for it. hand tools are a joy to use...

Good quality, properly cared for and tuned hand tools are a joy to use.
I'm sure that many of us here have a story about their first paper-thin
shaving out of a freshly-sharpened plane. For me, anyway, it was something
like a religious experience.

On the other hand, low quality, beater or dull hand tools are awful, evil
and hateful.

I once heard a story from somebody that involved a poorly tuned $5 yard sale
plane, a maple bedside tabletop that was nearly perfect, but required maybe
one more pass. Poor technique and poor tuning on this fated last pass
caused the plane to chatter, leaving nicely spaced digs across the otherwise
perfect tabletop. The owner of said plane threw the plane at the benchtop.
Rather than cracking like you'd expect a cast-iron plane to do, the plane
took its revenge by taking a physics-defying bounce. It went almost
completely sideways, right through the shop window, landing softly in the
grass outside. That window was not replaced with glass - plexi seemed the
more prudent choice. Er, um, at least, that's what I heard...

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 02:57:08 +0000, Andy Dingley
calmly ranted:

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 14:27:01 -0800, "AAvK" wrote:

Least expensive scrub plane: http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/

That's an interesting tool company.


A screwdriver to shunt the frog back.

Sacre bleu! You can't say that on a family newsgroup!
(Oops, this isn't the SoffDreck.)


-- Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Turkey and Drive --

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 06:41:09 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

Least expensive scrub plane: http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/

That's an interesting tool company.

And for small volume metal planes, those are _very_ reasonable prices.
--
Smert' spamionam

Mike Marlow wrote:
You know what Billy? Grab that plane and
get into that wood.

I 2nd the motion. You might want to make a shooting board first
though, it'll make jointing easier. I just finished doing the
same sort of thing to a bunch of red oak in the hallway. My wife
says that you'll enjoy it more if you're younger than me and have
a better back. It will tighten up your forearms though.
Make some curlies.
Dave in Fairfax
--
Dave Leader
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
PATINA
http://www.Patinatools.org/

Mike Marlow wrote:
You know what Billy? If it weren't for the wonders of the internet and
newsgroups like this, you'd have just gone ahead and grabbed your hand plane
and given that oak a shot, wouldn't you? Sure you would have - you'd have
said to yourself, "self..., let's see what this plane will do", and you'd
have kept on talking to yourself until you had that board planed down. Then
you'd have said to yourself, "self, I bet I can do the whole thing this way"
and you'd have given it a whirl. You'd have probable bungled a couple of
things up, but you'd have figured out what you did wrong, fix it and move
on. That's the beauty of giving it a try, and just going for it. One of
the things the internet (and certainly not the worst thing...) has done is
to give too much opportunity to worry about it too much. Too many opinions
available, too much advise. The heck with what experienced woodworkers
would try. Heck - most of them only try what someone else recommended or
what they became comfortable with over time. Try what makes sense to you.
It is after all, supposed to be a pleasurable thing. Grab that plane and
get into that wood.
--

I agreed with this approach for the most part, until it came to the
table saw. With a handplane, you may screw up some wood while
you learn. With a table saw, especially with unprepared stock, you
can screw up some wood AND yourself. Tear out in wood isn't
good. Tear out (or amputation) of body parts is more undesirable.
With some types of trial and error, the error may involve a trip
to the emergency room.

Hand tools operate at human speed. Power tools operate much
faster. You can feel when a handtool being used is starting
to have a problem - and stop. With power tools, things go bad
before you can react.

When a woodworker gives you advice on shop safety,
count his or her fingers AND eyes before deciding if
youll use the advice.

But back to Mike's advice - there are a lot of things
in woodworking that seem too hard and complicated.
Often they're not as hard to do as they first appear,
coopered doors for example. And sometimes what
seems easy and straight foreward isn't - knife
hinges for example.
(all one line so watch the line wrap)
http://home.comcast.net/~charliebcz/...redDoors0.html

PRACTICE ON SCRAPS FIRST!

charlie b

Least expensive scrub plane: http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/

That's an interesting tool company.


You have never heard of them? Do yourself a favor and call them, there
is a lot more in their paper catalog than on their website too. I did it and
will order some parts for my Stanley 71. Lots of parts they make.

Alex

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 14:37:16 -0500, "Billy Smith"
wrote:

I'm planning to make a good bookcase, about 5 ft high,
with glass doors using red oak. This will be my first
project using solid oak. I have neither a power planer
nor a jointer but I have a good table saw. I could try
to get the wood I need ready dressed but there are
advantages to buying it rough.

I have a good hand plane and I know how to sharpen it.
If I buy rough lumber I'll have to flatten it, remove twists
and cups, and reduce it to final thickness, all with the
hand plane. I'm aware that once I get one edge very
straight I can do some of the squaring with my table saw.

I'm strictly an amateur so time does not matter. I like
using hand equipment although I've never worked
oak by hand. My question is: would I be stupid to try
to do this project with rough wood and a hand plane?

Not stupid at all. The first time I tried to handplane rough stock, I
had no idea how to do it, and it still managed to come out ok. After
a little practice, it's easy as pie. After all, people made furniture
long before there were power planers or jointers, and I have a hard
time imagining that they got their stock S4S from the lumberyard!

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

I suspect a whole pile of them would- they're called Neandertals, and
a lot of them do really nice work. I use a mix of power and hand
tools, myself, so I guess I'm a Cro-Mag, but there's definately no
reason you can't smooth a board without electricity and a ton of iron!

Thanks,
Billy


Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 14:35:39 -0800, "AAvK" wrote:


Least expensive scrub plane: http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/

That's an interesting tool company.


You have never heard of them? Do yourself a favor and call them, there
is a lot more in their paper catalog than on their website too. I did it and
will order some parts for my Stanley 71. Lots of parts they make.

All right, now this is starting to bug me... I did fill out the form
for the paper catalog, but where in the heck are the prices, or the
tools? The site only seems to have a picture of a #51 smoothing
plane, and a video that's on sale.



Alex


Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

"Tim and Stephanie" wrote
:
: I once heard a story from somebody that involved a poorly tuned $5 yard
sale
: plane, a maple bedside tabletop that was nearly perfect, but required
maybe
: one more pass. Poor technique and poor tuning on this fated last pass
: caused the plane to chatter, leaving nicely spaced digs across the
otherwise
: perfect tabletop.

To me, this seems more like skitter than chatter.

For elucidation, please see my web site - Planing Notes - Skitter and
Chatter.

Jeff G

--
Jeff Gorman, West Yorkshire, UK
Email: username is amgron
ISP is clara.co.uk
www.amgron.clara.net

All right, now this is starting to bug me... I did fill out the form
for the paper catalog, but where in the heck are the prices, or the
tools? The site only seems to have a picture of a #51 smoothing
plane, and a video that's on sale.


Strange, I get the whole site here, keep trying. There is a lot there that I can see
than you have described. And more than that in the current catalog. Really cool
company so far, as far as products. Talked to a man there about having a blade
made for my #8, $30 okay, torch hardening then oil quenching, naw, Hock time.
Atmosphere controlled ovens, yes. But St. James Bay is great for a lot more
than that!

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 10:15:19 -0800, charlie b
calmly ranted:

But back to Mike's advice - there are a lot of things
in woodworking that seem too hard and complicated.
Often they're not as hard to do as they first appear,
coopered doors for example. And sometimes what

Speaking of which, have you seen this month's copy of Woodsmith?
They cover door coopering in it. JIT, eh? gd&r


-- Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Turkey and Drive --

Prometheus wrote:
All right, now this is starting to bug me... I did fill out the form
for the paper catalog, but where in the heck are the prices, or the
tools? The site only seems to have a picture of a #51 smoothing
plane, and a video that's on sale.

It bugged me too until I figured out that the website was coded
properly. That front page is really split into two sections.
UNder the bar beneath "The St. James Bay Tool Co. is another line
that you can only see the barest part of. It reads: New products
Tools Videos. Try running your cursor across that area and look
for changes in your location bar, or whatever. If it doesn't, the
URLs a
http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/newproducts.html
http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/featured.html
http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/videos.html

Hope that helps.
Dave in Fairfax
--
Dave Leader
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
PATINA
http://www.Patinatools.org/

Billy Smith wrote:

Maybe I'll just have to try a few pieces to see what it's
like but I'm wondering how many experienced woodworkers
would try this.

You're about to open Pandora's box, Billy.

Once upon a time there was a wood dorker who didn't have a planer or a
jointer. He built projects out of S4S BORG lumber, or whatever he could
salvage. He mostly made things that were functional, rather than
beautiful, and he took pride in his work, in his ability to make something
from nothing, and to make do.

This wood dorker, having in mind to make something beautiful, went to Lowe's
and bought a new Stanley #4. He took it home and tried to do something
with it, but it didn't work very well. He read about the Scarey Sharp(tm)
system, and he finally caved in and bought one of those Lee Valley
sharpening guide flummies after too many mangled edges.

He worked and fiddled, and he had a piece of steel, and he looked at this
steel, and he pronounced that it was shiney. And it was shiney. He
pronounced that it was sharp, and it was sharp enough to shave the whiskers
off a flea's bootocks, it was. He applied this plane to a piece of wood,
and it caused shavings to curl forth, and glassine smoothness to emerge
from the surface.

Then this wood dorker finally made the long avoided trek to the House of
Boards, whereupon came he unto the stack of Boards marked Walnut. He
checked his wallet, asked stupid questions about board feet and prices, and
came home with a much smaller piece of this fabled Walnut than he had
intended to buy. The most glorious wood on the Earth was not cheap.

So this wood dorker came home and he put this piece of walnut into his face
vise, and he proceded to cause shavings to curl forth from its surface. He
pronounced that the board was flat and good, and it was. Close enough.
Close enough.

Skip ahead, and the wood dorker bought a late model blue Stanley #5 from
eBay. Using only the #4 and the #5, and a forlorn Skil 3400 sawdust making
machine, the wood dorker produced an absolutely fantabulous walnut/maple
chess box.

Now the dorker has a shelf full of these planes, and he has decreed that no
lesser wood than walnut shall henceforth pass under the blades of said
planes, unless it contrasts well, or unless it's free. He has a more
mighty and powerful of tooth sawdust making machine (contractor's saw), and
he finally bought a small mechanical curl maker (benchtop jointer) to take
some of the fiddle work out of curling away the crust and revealing the
glorious grain within the magnificent walnut.

He hath proclaimed that thenceforth no S4S shall be admitted to his shop,
and you don't need a bunch of big iron to make stuff out of good wood. All
it takes is patience, practice, and sharp steel.

Go for it, Billy! You're in for an awakening!

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
http://rosegarden.sourceforge.net/tutorial/

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 17:24:11 GMT, Dave in Fairfax
wrote:

Prometheus wrote:
All right, now this is starting to bug me... I did fill out the form
for the paper catalog, but where in the heck are the prices, or the
tools? The site only seems to have a picture of a #51 smoothing
plane, and a video that's on sale.

It bugged me too until I figured out that the website was coded
properly. That front page is really split into two sections.
UNder the bar beneath "The St. James Bay Tool Co. is another line
that you can only see the barest part of. It reads: New products
Tools Videos. Try running your cursor across that area and look
for changes in your location bar, or whatever. If it doesn't, the
URLs a
http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/newproducts.html
http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/featured.html
http://www.stjamesbaytoolco.com/videos.html

Ahh, yes. When I looked again, there are just three tiny lines there.
Thanks!

Hope that helps.
Dave in Fairfax

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 15:32:21 -0500, Silvan
wrote:


You're about to open Pandora's box, Billy.

Once upon a time there was a wood dorker who didn't have a planer or a
jointer. He built projects out of S4S BORG lumber, or whatever he could
salvage. He mostly made things that were functional, rather than
beautiful, and he took pride in his work, in his ability to make something
from nothing, and to make do.

This wood dorker, having in mind to make something beautiful, went to Lowe's
and bought a new Stanley #4. He took it home and tried to do something
with it, but it didn't work very well. He read about the Scarey Sharp(tm)
system, and he finally caved in and bought one of those Lee Valley
sharpening guide flummies after too many mangled edges.

He worked and fiddled, and he had a piece of steel, and he looked at this
steel, and he pronounced that it was shiney. And it was shiney. He
pronounced that it was sharp, and it was sharp enough to shave the whiskers
off a flea's bootocks, it was. He applied this plane to a piece of wood,
and it caused shavings to curl forth, and glassine smoothness to emerge
from the surface.

Then this wood dorker finally made the long avoided trek to the House of
Boards, whereupon came he unto the stack of Boards marked Walnut. He
checked his wallet, asked stupid questions about board feet and prices, and
came home with a much smaller piece of this fabled Walnut than he had
intended to buy. The most glorious wood on the Earth was not cheap.

So this wood dorker came home and he put this piece of walnut into his face
vise, and he proceded to cause shavings to curl forth from its surface. He
pronounced that the board was flat and good, and it was. Close enough.
Close enough.

Skip ahead, and the wood dorker bought a late model blue Stanley #5 from
eBay. Using only the #4 and the #5, and a forlorn Skil 3400 sawdust making
machine, the wood dorker produced an absolutely fantabulous walnut/maple
chess box.

Now the dorker has a shelf full of these planes, and he has decreed that no
lesser wood than walnut shall henceforth pass under the blades of said
planes, unless it contrasts well, or unless it's free. He has a more
mighty and powerful of tooth sawdust making machine (contractor's saw), and
he finally bought a small mechanical curl maker (benchtop jointer) to take
some of the fiddle work out of curling away the crust and revealing the
glorious grain within the magnificent walnut.

He hath proclaimed that thenceforth no S4S shall be admitted to his shop,
and you don't need a bunch of big iron to make stuff out of good wood. All
it takes is patience, practice, and sharp steel.


ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

Go for it, Billy! You're in for an awakening!

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 20:01:17 -0600, Prometheus
wrote:


ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

Where I am, Mahogany is 30% more than Walnut. G

Barry

Prometheus wrote:

ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

There is no other wood. Not mahogany, nor mango nor mesquite, not cherry
nor chestnut nor curly maple, not birch nor beech nor balsam, not hickory,
nor hackberry, nor holly. No, there is only one wood, and walnut is its
name.

(Though the other woods can be used sparingly to good effect as long as they
are relegated to serve as contrasting elements with walnut.

Speaking of holly... Holly is really expensive and rare, isn't it? My
grandfather has three 70' holly "bushes" with 12" dia. trunks. He might be
sitting on a fortune, mightn't he? Or not?

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
http://rosegarden.sourceforge.net/tutorial/

Silvan wrote:
Prometheus wrote:


ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.


There is no other wood. Not mahogany, nor mango nor mesquite, not cherry
nor chestnut nor curly maple, not birch nor beech nor balsam, not hickory,
nor hackberry, nor holly. No, there is only one wood, and walnut is its
name.

(Though the other woods can be used sparingly to good effect as long as they
are relegated to serve as contrasting elements with walnut.

Speaking of holly... Holly is really expensive and rare, isn't it? My
grandfather has three 70' holly "bushes" with 12" dia. trunks. He might be
sitting on a fortune, mightn't he? Or not?



http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/TechSheets...Docs/Ilex.html
Looks like a bit of shrinkage. I seem to recall something about
twisting as it dries.
Joe

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 20:01:17 -0600, Prometheus
calmly ranted:

ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

Only that brown and white striped African crap they call try to call
"mahogany" is cheaper than any walnut I've ever seen. I think Holstein
or Guernsey genes got mixed in those trees somehow. It turned the
trees into 90% sapwood and 10% heartwood. sigh


-- Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Turkey and Drive --

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:51:14 GMT, Ba r r y
wrote:

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 20:01:17 -0600, Prometheus
wrote:


ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

Where I am, Mahogany is 30% more than Walnut. G

All depends on where you're at, I suppose! FWIW, I like Walnut better
than Mahogany anyways.



Barry

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:58:44 -0500, Silvan
wrote:

Prometheus wrote:

ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

There is no other wood. Not mahogany, nor mango nor mesquite, not cherry
nor chestnut nor curly maple, not birch nor beech nor balsam, not hickory,
nor hackberry, nor holly. No, there is only one wood, and walnut is its
name.

(Though the other woods can be used sparingly to good effect as long as they
are relegated to serve as contrasting elements with walnut.

Speaking of holly... Holly is really expensive and rare, isn't it? My
grandfather has three 70' holly "bushes" with 12" dia. trunks. He might be
sitting on a fortune, mightn't he? Or not?

Too bad they're not wood, you might be onto something...


Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 15:16:31 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 20:01:17 -0600, Prometheus
calmly ranted:

ROFL!!! Though I'd have to say there are many fine woods less
expensive than Walnut- Mahogany and Ash come to mind, along with
others.

Only that brown and white striped African crap they call try to call
"mahogany" is cheaper than any walnut I've ever seen. I think Holstein
or Guernsey genes got mixed in those trees somehow. It turned the
trees into 90% sapwood and 10% heartwood. sigh

Hmm. The last piece I bought seemed to be the real deal, but I don't
have anything else to compare it to. It's got a nice reddish-brown
color with no white to speak of, and a fairly close grain. The
hardwood supplier (which I do trust, after building a relationship
with them) assured me that it was the real McCoy. $3.60 a bf,
compared to $4.25 a bf for Walnut. The walnut is the stuff I have
trouble with, actually- there is a fair amount of white on the edges
of the planks. I try to work the contrast into what I'm making, but
it sure isn't that consistant as far as color goes.

-- Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Turkey and Drive --

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

I once did a project like this. I bought rough red oak and surfaced
it with a Millers Falls jointer plane my dad gave me. He used to use
the plane for trimming and fitting doors as a trim carpenter in the
50s. The plane is about 16-18" long but I'm too busy baking for
Thanksgiving to go out and measure it accurately for you. I sharpened
it to perfection and used it for almost everything after that project.

The project was to make table leaves for an old oak table. So I
learned to not only surface the tops but to plane the edges so that I
could glue them up properly.

Make a couple of winding sticks and learn how to use them.

Mike