The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3950/1...337967da_b.jpg

They scraped off the paint to turn it into "DAT ASS".
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5604/1...10c427bb_b.jpg

I won't even snap a picture of what they wrote on the backside.

As you may recall, I was helping a San Jose high school teacher who
needed a large bathroom pass so that she could insure (a) that only
one student left the room at a time, and (b) it was clear to everyone
what they were doing at all times, and (c) it was clear from a glance
from anywhere in the classroom that a student was out with the pass,
and (d) the pass didn't get easily lost or misplaced by the students.

I had never routed anything, so, I chose to use spray-paint stencils.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5581/1...e78b112e_c.jpg

The stencil kit I bought was too large, so, I then printed the fonts:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3880/1...bea8454c_h.jpg

I had then cut the letters out and reinforced them with clear tape:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3851/1...f5c8ff45_b.jpg

Then I spray painted the letters onto a spare yard-long pine board:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3906/1...4fecefff_b.jpg

It wasn't pretty, but, it seemed (at first) to do the job for her:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3922/1...f0088a92_c.jpg

But, one by one, the kids scraped off the letters to spell DAT ASS:
And, they carved and wrote gang graffiti on the back of the board.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5604/1...10c427bb_b.jpg

So, I sanded off the carvings, and then spray painted the whole thing
black (to discourage graffiti), and put the original printed template
back on the board:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5588/1...f5c19552_b.jpg

I then routed (is that a verb?), by hand, the letters, 3/8" deep:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3941/1...f9454d6f_c.jpg

I was actually very surprised I could route along the stencil fonts:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3940/1...4d660280_b.jpg

The result isn't all that pretty, but here is what it looked like:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3942/1...53c68513_b.jpg

After sanding and cleaning it up a bit, it looked like this:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3951/1...191d3c19_b.jpg

The letters, with only one pass of the router, were pretty rough:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3936/1...787a3ffa_b.jpg

Let's see what the little San Jose vandals do with this new attempt!


(ideas always welcome)

On 10/27/2014 2:21 AM, Danny D. wrote:
The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3950/1...337967da_b.jpg

They scraped off the paint to turn it into "DAT ASS".
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5604/1...10c427bb_b.jpg

I won't even snap a picture of what they wrote on the backside.

As you may recall, I was helping a San Jose high school teacher who
needed a large bathroom pass so that she could insure (a) that only
one student left the room at a time, and (b) it was clear to everyone
what they were doing at all times, and (c) it was clear from a glance
from anywhere in the classroom that a student was out with the pass,
and (d) the pass didn't get easily lost or misplaced by the students.

I had never routed anything, so, I chose to use spray-paint stencils.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5581/1...e78b112e_c.jpg

The stencil kit I bought was too large, so, I then printed the fonts:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3880/1...bea8454c_h.jpg

I had then cut the letters out and reinforced them with clear tape:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3851/1...f5c8ff45_b.jpg

Then I spray painted the letters onto a spare yard-long pine board:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3906/1...4fecefff_b.jpg

It wasn't pretty, but, it seemed (at first) to do the job for her:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3922/1...f0088a92_c.jpg

But, one by one, the kids scraped off the letters to spell DAT ASS:
And, they carved and wrote gang graffiti on the back of the board.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5604/1...10c427bb_b.jpg

So, I sanded off the carvings, and then spray painted the whole thing
black (to discourage graffiti), and put the original printed template
back on the board:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5588/1...f5c19552_b.jpg

I then routed (is that a verb?), by hand, the letters, 3/8" deep:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3941/1...f9454d6f_c.jpg

I was actually very surprised I could route along the stencil fonts:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3940/1...4d660280_b.jpg

The result isn't all that pretty, but here is what it looked like:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3942/1...53c68513_b.jpg

After sanding and cleaning it up a bit, it looked like this:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3951/1...191d3c19_b.jpg

The letters, with only one pass of the router, were pretty rough:
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3936/1...787a3ffa_b.jpg

Let's see what the little San Jose vandals do with this new attempt!


(ideas always welcome)




Have the teacher example dat ass every time it comes
back, and if there are any letters missing, apply
the board of education to the seat of wisdom.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 03:05:09 -0400:

Have the teacher example dat ass every time it comes
back, and if there are any letters missing, apply
the board of education to the seat of wisdom.

It's funny, but, apparently the teacher didn't want to tell me
that the spray-painted letters didn't last a week at the school.

She thought I would be upset.

I took it as a challenge, to see if I could keep a bunch of
high-school hoodlums at bay. You can't defeat them, but, you can
make it hard for them.

So, with the letters now deeply routered (is that a verb?), and
the knife marks in the back sanded out, and the back painted black
so that the gang graffiti is covered, I think I just made it
a bit harder for them to vandalize it.
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3950/1...337967da_b.jpg

Of course, the teacher told me they unscrewed her desk and hid it
two classes down the hall, so, they're formidable opponents.

But, they are kids, after all, and so, I hope that by the end of the
year, I'll have a system (titanium perhaps?) that they can't deface!

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 03:05:09 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 10/27/2014 2:21 AM, Danny D. wrote:
The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3950/1...337967da_b.jpg

They scraped off the paint to turn it into "DAT ASS".
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5604/1...10c427bb_b.jpg

I won't even snap a picture of what they wrote on the backside.

Have the teacher example dat ass every time it comes
back, and if there are any letters missing, apply
the board of education to the seat of wisdom.


Oddly enough, I agree with the Storming guy this time. A
school is supposed to teach children so they become responsible
adults. It's not an assault class where the medal goes to the one
that breaks the most "laws".
New pass. Anyone altering it in even the tiniest way gets
punished. No exceptions.
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012

On 10/27/2014 4:19 AM, Danny D. wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 03:05:09 -0400:

Have the teacher example dat ass every time it comes
back, and if there are any letters missing, apply
the board of education to the seat of wisdom.

It's funny, but, apparently the teacher didn't want to tell me
that the spray-painted letters didn't last a week at the school.

She thought I would be upset.

I took it as a challenge, to see if I could keep a bunch of
high-school hoodlums at bay. You can't defeat them, but, you can
make it hard for them.

So, with the letters now deeply routered (is that a verb?), and
the knife marks in the back sanded out, and the back painted black
so that the gang graffiti is covered, I think I just made it
a bit harder for them to vandalize it.
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3950/1...337967da_b.jpg

Of course, the teacher told me they unscrewed her desk and hid it
two classes down the hall, so, they're formidable opponents.

But, they are kids, after all, and so, I hope that by the end of the
year, I'll have a system (titanium perhaps?) that they can't deface!




Ideally, the kids are supposed to be learning obedience
to law, and some other things like that. If they are
defacing the potty pass, maybe they can hold it till
class is over? Are these illegal non citizens who started
their visit to our country by violating the border laws?

I'm not encouraged when our border agencies permit such
incredible disrespect for law.


http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014...ted-to-mexico/

-
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 10/27/2014 5:44 AM, Shadow wrote:
On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 03:05:09 -0400, Stormin Mormon
Have the teacher example dat ass every time it comes
back, and if there are any letters missing, apply
the board of education to the seat of wisdom.


Oddly enough, I agree with the Storming guy this time. A
school is supposed to teach children so they become responsible
adults. It's not an assault class where the medal goes to the one
that breaks the most "laws".
New pass. Anyone altering it in even the tiniest way gets
punished. No exceptions.
[]'s

Sigh. Your reputation is forever destroyed,
having agreed with a religious whack job
right winger dinger. You'd better vote twice
in the election, to begin to repair the
damage.

Resurrect Reagan!

-
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 08:19:38 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

But, they are kids, after all, and so, I hope that by the end of the
year, I'll have a system (titanium perhaps?) that they can't deface!

8" Ball and Chain

- Made of Metal with an Iron Chain
- Ball Is about 8" in Diameter
- Chain Is about 26" Long - Shackle Is about 3.5" Wide

https://tinyurl.com/naeexp4

But get a "real" one
--
Somtimes you just have a bad day at the dungeon

Oren wrote:
On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 08:19:38 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

But, they are kids, after all, and so, I hope that by the end of the
year, I'll have a system (titanium perhaps?) that they can't deface!
8" Ball and Chain

- Made of Metal with an Iron Chain
- Ball Is about 8" in Diameter
- Chain Is about 26" Long - Shackle Is about 3.5" Wide

Among the various things I saw used for this purpose while I was going
through school,
I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.


https://tinyurl.com/naeexp4

But get a "real" one

Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.

One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 08:09:39 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 10/27/2014 5:44 AM, Shadow wrote:
On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 03:05:09 -0400, Stormin Mormon
Have the teacher example dat ass every time it comes
back, and if there are any letters missing, apply
the board of education to the seat of wisdom.


Oddly enough, I agree with the Storming guy this time. A
school is supposed to teach children so they become responsible
adults. It's not an assault class where the medal goes to the one
that breaks the most "laws".
New pass. Anyone altering it in even the tiniest way gets
punished. No exceptions.
[]'s

Sigh. Your reputation is forever destroyed,
having agreed with a religious whack job
right winger dinger. You'd better vote twice
in the election, to begin to repair the
damage.

Resurrect Reagan!


OMG, what have I done ....
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012

Jonathan Williams wrote:
Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.

One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.

It's pretty pathetic when people earning upwards of $100K a year (or more),
who deal with children, have to resort to this kind of question and
discussion. Really? Stupid ideas like toilet seats, wrenchs, plungers?
Good grief - this is foolish. The entire topic was nothing short of
foolish.

--

-Mike-

Mike Marlow wrote:
Jonathan Williams wrote:
Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.
One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.
It's pretty pathetic when people earning upwards of $100K a year (or more),
who deal with children, have to resort to this kind of question and
discussion. Really? Stupid ideas like toilet seats, wrenchs, plungers?
Good grief - this is foolish. The entire topic was nothing short of
foolish.

The datass suggests the perfect solution has not been found. I think
it's like "cat and mouse" to the students.

Bill wrote, on Tue, 28 Oct 2014 00:21:04 -0400:

The data suggests the perfect solution has not been found. I think
it's like "cat and mouse" to the students.

I fully expect the students to deface this new paddle.
But, short of making it out of titanium, I wasn't sure how to proceed.
It's kind of like a game of whack-a-mole.

"Danny D." wrote:

I fully expect the students to deface this new paddle.
But, short of making it out of titanium, I wasn't sure how to
proceed.
It's kind of like a game of whack-a-mole.
--------------------------------------------------
A piece of 3/8" steel plate and a welder to form the welded
characters from puddled welding rod.

Lew

Lew Hodgett wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 21:50:36 -0700:

A piece of 3/8" steel plate and a welder to form the welded characters
from puddled welding rod.

Then it's a weapon!

On 10/27/2014 10:15 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jonathan Williams wrote:
Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.

One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.

It's pretty pathetic when people earning upwards of $100K a year (or more),
who deal with children, have to resort to this kind of question and
discussion. Really? Stupid ideas like toilet seats, wrenchs, plungers?
Good grief - this is foolish. The entire topic was nothing short of
foolish.

I agree there is foolishness in this thread, BUT the foolishness is not
that the discussion is taking place, but that the teacher must revert to
such things to keeps some sort of order in the class room. Where are
the parents supporting the teacher to keep these little criminals from
disrupting the class room.

Oh I forgot they were brought up to have self esteem not be to be good
citizen, and respect the people who are trying to help them learn

Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 10/27/2014 10:15 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jonathan Williams wrote:
Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.

One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.

It's pretty pathetic when people earning upwards of $100K a year (or
more), who deal with children, have to resort to this kind of
question and discussion. Really? Stupid ideas like toilet seats,
wrenchs, plungers? Good grief - this is foolish. The entire topic
was nothing short of foolish.

I agree there is foolishness in this thread, BUT the foolishness is
not that the discussion is taking place, but that the teacher must
revert to such things to keeps some sort of order in the class room. Where
are the parents supporting the teacher to keep these little
criminals from disrupting the class room.

Oh I forgot they were brought up to have self esteem not be to be good
citizen, and respect the people who are trying to help them learn

Agreed - that was the point I was trying to make but I think I got a little
off track and did not make my point well. For godssake - can't a teacher
with a Masters degree figure out how to deal with kids? They sure did when
I went to school. Parents - well that's a whole 'nother topic...

As for this whole foolishness of self-esteem - well...

--

-Mike-

Mike Marlow wrote:
Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 10/27/2014 10:15 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jonathan Williams wrote:
Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.
One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.
It's pretty pathetic when people earning upwards of $100K a year (or
more), who deal with children, have to resort to this kind of
question and discussion. Really? Stupid ideas like toilet seats,
wrenchs, plungers? Good grief - this is foolish. The entire topic
was nothing short of foolish.

I agree there is foolishness in this thread, BUT the foolishness is
not that the discussion is taking place, but that the teacher must
revert to such things to keeps some sort of order in the class room. Where
are the parents supporting the teacher to keep these little
criminals from disrupting the class room.

Oh I forgot they were brought up to have self esteem not be to be good
citizen, and respect the people who are trying to help them learn
Agreed - that was the point I was trying to make but I think I got a little
off track and did not make my point well. For godssake - can't a teacher
with a Masters degree figure out how to deal with kids?

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you and
I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at least not
the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to say:
"When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to remember that
your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )



They sure did when
I went to school. Parents - well that's a whole 'nother topic...

As for this whole foolishness of self-esteem - well...

Bill wrote:

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you
and I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at
least not the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to
say: "When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to
remember that your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )


I don't agree Bill. I don't think the kids are all that different. The
parents and the teachers are a lot different - don't want to hurt the self
esteem of kids, and all that crap. Kids though are still kids. They will
do what they can get away with just like they always have. Today they can
get away with more because adults are not adults these days. Teachers
pamaper kids and parents don't parent. Both are afraid to do anything that
might offend the brat. Too much psychology involved in dealing with kids
today.

--

-Mike-

On 10/28/2014 4:13 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you
and I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at
least not the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to
say: "When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to
remember that your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )


I don't agree Bill. I don't think the kids are all that different. The
parents and the teachers are a lot different - don't want to hurt the self
esteem of kids, and all that crap. Kids though are still kids. They will
do what they can get away with just like they always have. Today they can
get away with more because adults are not adults these days. Teachers
pamaper kids and parents don't parent. Both are afraid to do anything that
might offend the brat. Too much psychology involved in dealing with kids
today.

I fully agree, and until the parents talk, or are forced to talk the
responsibility for the children they bring into the world the kid
problems will only get worse.

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 16:13:33 -0400, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

Bill wrote:

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you
and I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at
least not the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to
say: "When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to
remember that your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )

That's only half of the saying we were taught in college. It was
called the "Engineer's Creed: The engineer designs the best possible
product, on the specified schedule, at the lowest possible cost
but..."


I don't agree Bill. I don't think the kids are all that different. The
parents and the teachers are a lot different - don't want to hurt the self
esteem of kids, and all that crap. Kids though are still kids. They will
do what they can get away with just like they always have. Today they can
get away with more because adults are not adults these days. Teachers
pamaper kids and parents don't parent. Both are afraid to do anything that
might offend the brat. Too much psychology involved in dealing with kids
today.

+1

When I was in school, the father of family with the most screwed up
kids (one committed suicide, IIRC) was a child psychologist. The
goofy ******* tried to run me over once.

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 18:32:38 -0400, wrote:
When I was in school, the father of family with the most screwed up
kids (one committed suicide, IIRC) was a child psychologist. The
goofy ******* tried to run me over once.

Hey, you can't fault him for that. I'd have tried to run you over too.

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 19:01:27 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 18:32:38 -0400, wrote:
When I was in school, the father of family with the most screwed up
kids (one committed suicide, IIRC) was a child psychologist. The
goofy ******* tried to run me over once.

Hey, you can't fault him for that. I'd have tried to run you over too.


You do act a lot like a child psychologist nutter. I bet your kids
are some messed up, too.

Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you
and I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at
least note that the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to
say: "When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to
remember that your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )

I don't agree Bill. I don't think the kids are all that different. The
parents and the teachers are a lot different - don't want to hurt the self
esteem of kids, and all that crap.

I don't disagree with you, Mike. You said it all here in your next
sentence. Mom (and dad?)-- and maybe society shares the blame too, isn't
raising the same kids that it used to. Maybe I should say that a baby
is a baby is baby, but what that baby grows into
has changed, on the average, over the years. Of course, the results
vary by school district, along with socio-economic background too.

Would anyone argue that today's kids aren't more "sex savvy"? Sex is
practically forced down their throats by the media.


Kids though are still kids. They will
do what they can get away with just like they always have. Today they can
get away with more because adults are not adults these days. Teachers
pamaper kids and parents don't parent. Both are afraid to do anything that
might offend the brat. Too much psychology involved in dealing with kids
today.

On 10/28/2014 3:13 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you
and I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at
least not the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to
say: "When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to
remember that your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )


I don't agree Bill. I don't think the kids are all that different. The
parents and the teachers are a lot different - don't want to hurt the self
esteem of kids, and all that crap. Kids though are still kids. They will
do what they can get away with just like they always have. Today they can
get away with more because adults are not adults these days. Teachers
pamaper kids and parents don't parent. Both are afraid to do anything that
might offend the brat. Too much psychology involved in dealing with kids
today.


Perzakly Mike. Kids do as they see and are taught. Parents today are
of the generation that believes in unearned entitlement. They don't
know any better and their kids know nothing else. They want to treat
every one the same good or bad. They have lost the wisdom to
distinguish right from wrong.

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 20:07:51 -0400, wrote:
You do act a lot like a child psychologist nutter. I bet your kids
are some messed up, too.

It was a joke. Miserable sense of humour you have.

On Tue, 28 Oct 2014 21:11:23 -0400, Bill
wrote:

Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

Mike, I think that you may be overlooking the fact that the kids you
and I went to school with are not the same as the kids of today, at
least note that the dilemma varies by school district, I think.
This sort of reminds me of something a previous boss of mine use to
say: "When you're up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to
remember that your original intention was to drain the swamp!" : )

I don't agree Bill. I don't think the kids are all that different. The
parents and the teachers are a lot different - don't want to hurt the self
esteem of kids, and all that crap.

I don't disagree with you, Mike. You said it all here in your next
sentence. Mom (and dad?)-- and maybe society shares the blame too, isn't
raising the same kids that it used to. Maybe I should say that a baby
is a baby is baby, but what that baby grows into
has changed, on the average, over the years. Of course, the results
vary by school district, along with socio-economic background too.

Raising kids is certainly different but the children themselves
aren't. When I see kids running around a restaurant cutting up
(putting the condiment containers in their mouth, and worse), that's
all on the parents. "Society" has nothing to do with it.

Would anyone argue that today's kids aren't more "sex savvy"? Sex is
practically forced down their throats by the media.

Well, so to speak. ;-) ...but, yes, you're absolutely correct, here.
You have the left, who think this a marvy idea. Children aren't
allowed to be innocent, anymore.


Kids though are still kids. They will
do what they can get away with just like they always have. Today they can
get away with more because adults are not adults these days. Teachers
pamaper kids and parents don't parent. Both are afraid to do anything that
might offend the brat. Too much psychology involved in dealing with kids
today.

On 10/28/2014 9:06 AM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 10/27/2014 10:15 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jonathan Williams wrote:
Bill wrote, on Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:37:49 -0400:

I vaguely recollect a toilet seat being one of them. Like a pink
wrench, no one will steal it.

One teacher in this San Jose school district,uses a toilet plunger,
for the same effect.

It's pretty pathetic when people earning upwards of $100K a year (or
more),
who deal with children, have to resort to this kind of question and
discussion. Really? Stupid ideas like toilet seats, wrenchs, plungers?
Good grief - this is foolish. The entire topic was nothing short of
foolish.

I agree there is foolishness in this thread, BUT the foolishness is not
that the discussion is taking place, but that the teacher must revert to
such things to keeps some sort of order in the class room. Where are the
parents supporting the teacher to keep these little criminals from
disrupting the class room.

Oh I forgot they were brought up to have self esteem not be to be good
citizen, and respect the people who are trying to help them learn

My knee jerk reaction to the original posting in this thread was not
"What's wrong with these kids?", but rather, "What's wrong with this
teacher?"

To me, the whole idea of using some (any) ginormous item as a hall pass
is stupid, demeaning, and completely counterproductive... not to
mention, an exercise in futility. What does this really accomplish?

The good old days were certainly different, but they weren't necessarily
always that good. Still, if this is how our educators are now treating
our kids, what should we expect from the kids?

Danny's willingness and efforts to help this teacher are admirable, but
I'm afraid she needs a kind of help that can't be found in a wood shop.
Clearly she is in the wrong profession, and a big chunk of wood is not
going to change that. Foolishness, yes. But it makes me a little sad for
the kids.

--
This is my signature. Really. I'm not kidding. Stop reading now.

John Paquay wrote, on Thu, 30 Oct 2014 04:51:58 -0400:

My knee jerk reaction to the original posting in this thread was not
"What's wrong with these kids?", but rather, "What's wrong with this
teacher?"

She's brand new to teaching, but, it turns out that classroom management
is a standard problem in these multi-ethnic San Jose schools.

One teacher uses a bathroom plunger, as his bathroom pass.

To me, the whole idea of using some (any) ginormous item as a hall pass
is stupid, demeaning, and completely counterproductive... not to
mention, an exercise in futility. What does this really accomplish?

What it (attempts to) accomplish is the reduce undue interruptions of
the classroom environment.

We all know that the kids can go to the bathroom plenty of other times,
but, all kids will take advantage of a "free pass" out of jail, if
even for only 10 minutes (which they can synchronize with other friends,
if they're clever).

What the pass does, first and foremost, is it discourages such intents.
Also, it allows the teacher to continue teaching, uninterrupted, as
the students just get up, grab the pass, and return, unannounced.

It also is very clear to everyone, what the purpose of the kid is,
whether grabbing the pass or walking the hallways. It's also not
something they can leave hidden in the hallway while they surreptitiously
run a'muck about the hallways or outdoors to catch a smoke or whatever.

Likewise, it prevents multiple kids (from the same classroom anyway)
leaving the room at any one time.

Furthermore, it's obvious to all whether the bathroom pass is in use or
not. It's like the red sign on an airplane bathroom door showing it's in
use, rather than what we have to do at a McDonalds, which is to jiggle
the doorknob repeatedly to find out if someone is in there.

And, being so large (on purpose), the kids, who almost certainly don't
like it, can't lose it easily.

At the very least, it's objectionable to carry (as you noted), which
would further discourage the unnecessary potty breaks.

Rest assured, this teacher has at least one kid a day out of her 200,
walk out on the class without excuse. She has kids banging on the table,
and calling her a b*ch, and plenty of disciplinary problems, all of which
are common through all the classes, as she told me most of these kids are
being weeded out of the system through their behavior in *all* their
classes.

I also find this behavior strange, as *my* kids have always had comments
on their report cards of "very polite", "always helpful", "pitches in to
volunteer every time I ask", and even once "raises hand to answer
questions too often!".

Heh heh ... the apple doesn't fall far from the tree ...

The good old days were certainly different, but they weren't necessarily
always that good. Still, if this is how our educators are now treating
our kids, what should we expect from the kids?

I think this teacher, who is brand new, is learning on the job. In
California, they go through 3 semesters of graduate training, to obtain a
preliminary teaching certificate, two semesters of which have on-the-job
training of sorts.

Then, they're thrown to the wolves for 2 more years, until they get their
preliminary teaching certificate cleared. At that point, they also get
tenure (which is kind'a soon, if you ask me), and then they're bona-fide
teachers.

The clearance process, apparently, starts with three weeks of training on
"classroom management", which I found odd when I saw that it's the
*first* thing they re-train the preliminary-credentialed teachers on.

I'm afraid she needs a kind of help that can't be found in a wood shop.
Clearly she is in the wrong profession, and a big chunk of wood is not
going to change that. Foolishness, yes. But it makes me a little sad for
the kids.

Out of 200 kids that she has, she estimated, to me, that about 10% are
the ones using the bathroom pass constantly. The rest sit and listen.

You have to remember these are Algebra classes, where probably only a
small percentage of the kids (maybe 1/3?) actually care to learn it. It's
a required class for the rest, which they hope to never see again during
the rest of their lives.

When is the last time you or I graphed a quadratic equation, for example?
Could each of us solve a binomial equation to save our lives?
(Building suspension bridges in the redwoods notwithstanding...
https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7532/1...aaeda78c_c.jpg

"Danny D." wrote in message ...

The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!

I'd take a different approach... As a complete unmolested lettered board it
is a bathroom pass. If altered it is not a bathroom pass and subjects the
student carrying it to the same penalties as any other "no pass" or "altered
pass" infraction. This would require the cooperation of the teachers and
administration who monitor student movement in the hallways... It may
require a few repair jobs in the beginning but I suspect that it would not
take long for the kids to figure this out. Maybe have two or three board
passes initially so there is always a good one available for the kids who
really need to go, or who have to deal with their monthly issues.

John

On 10/30/2014 01:19 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:


The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!


Spare the rod - spoil the child.
If you don't believe it, look at the mess we got now.

Danny D. wrote:
John Paquay wrote, on Thu, 30 Oct 2014 04:51:58 -0400:

My knee jerk reaction to the original posting in this thread was not
"What's wrong with these kids?", but rather, "What's wrong with this
teacher?"
She's brand new to teaching, but, it turns out that classroom management
is a standard problem in these multi-ethnic San Jose schools.

One teacher uses a bathroom plunger, as his bathroom pass.

To me, the whole idea of using some (any) ginormous item as a hall pass
is stupid, demeaning, and completely counterproductive... not to
mention, an exercise in futility. What does this really accomplish?
What it (attempts to) accomplish is the reduce undue interruptions of
the classroom environment.

We all know that the kids can go to the bathroom plenty of other times,
but, all kids will take advantage of a "free pass" out of jail, if
even for only 10 minutes (which they can synchronize with other friends,
if they're clever).

What the pass does, first and foremost, is it discourages such intents.
Also, it allows the teacher to continue teaching, uninterrupted, as
the students just get up, grab the pass, and return, unannounced.

It also is very clear to everyone, what the purpose of the kid is,
whether grabbing the pass or walking the hallways. It's also not
something they can leave hidden in the hallway while they surreptitiously
run a'muck about the hallways or outdoors to catch a smoke or whatever.

Likewise, it prevents multiple kids (from the same classroom anyway)
leaving the room at any one time.

Furthermore, it's obvious to all whether the bathroom pass is in use or
not. It's like the red sign on an airplane bathroom door showing it's in
use, rather than what we have to do at a McDonalds, which is to jiggle
the doorknob repeatedly to find out if someone is in there.

And, being so large (on purpose), the kids, who almost certainly don't
like it, can't lose it easily.

At the very least, it's objectionable to carry (as you noted), which
would further discourage the unnecessary potty breaks.

Rest assured, this teacher has at least one kid a day out of her 200,
walk out on the class without excuse. She has kids banging on the table,
and calling her a b*ch, and plenty of disciplinary problems, all of which
are common through all the classes, as she told me most of these kids are
being weeded out of the system through their behavior in *all* their
classes.

I also find this behavior strange, as *my* kids have always had comments
on their report cards of "very polite", "always helpful", "pitches in to
volunteer every time I ask", and even once "raises hand to answer
questions too often!".

Heh heh ... the apple doesn't fall far from the tree ...

The good old days were certainly different, but they weren't necessarily
always that good. Still, if this is how our educators are now treating
our kids, what should we expect from the kids?
I think this teacher, who is brand new, is learning on the job. In
California, they go through 3 semesters of graduate training, to obtain a
preliminary teaching certificate, two semesters of which have on-the-job
training of sorts.

Then, they're thrown to the wolves for 2 more years, until they get their
preliminary teaching certificate cleared. At that point, they also get
tenure (which is kind'a soon, if you ask me), and then they're bona-fide
teachers.

The clearance process, apparently, starts with three weeks of training on
"classroom management", which I found odd when I saw that it's the
*first* thing they re-train the preliminary-credentialed teachers on.

I'm afraid she needs a kind of help that can't be found in a wood shop.
Clearly she is in the wrong profession, and a big chunk of wood is not
going to change that. Foolishness, yes. But it makes me a little sad for
the kids.
Out of 200 kids that she has, she estimated, to me, that about 10% are
the ones using the bathroom pass constantly. The rest sit and listen.

You have to remember these are Algebra classes, where probably only a
small percentage of the kids (maybe 1/3?) actually care to learn it. It's
a required class for the rest, which they hope to never see again during
the rest of their lives.

When is the last time you or I graphed a quadratic equation, for example?
Could each of us solve a binomial equation to save our lives?
You graph a quadratic function, and solve a quadratic equation.
I use the binomial formula almost everyday.
How about the Gamma function? Bring it on! ; )


(Building suspension bridges in the redwoods notwithstanding...
https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7532/1...aaeda78c_c.jpg

John Grossbohlin wrote, on Thu, 30 Oct 2014 13:19:42 -0400:

As a complete unmolested lettered board it is a bathroom pass. If
altered it is not a bathroom pass ...

I like that idea!

The kids would police the kids.

Danny D. wrote:
John Paquay wrote, on Thu, 30 Oct 2014 04:51:58 -0400:

My knee jerk reaction to the original posting in this thread was not
"What's wrong with these kids?", but rather, "What's wrong with this
teacher?"

She's brand new to teaching, but, it turns out that classroom
management is a standard problem in these multi-ethnic San Jose
schools.


Well - that's a big part of your problem. Rather than teaching kids things,
parents and teachers rally around excuses for what the things exist. I wish
you the best - deal with the problems you are creating.


One teacher uses a bathroom plunger, as his bathroom pass.

Brilliant! Shear stupidity - so why shouldn't everyone else follow suit?


To me, the whole idea of using some (any) ginormous item as a hall
pass is stupid, demeaning, and completely counterproductive... not to
mention, an exercise in futility. What does this really accomplish?

What it (attempts to) accomplish is the reduce undue interruptions of
the classroom environment.


Brain dead thinking. But that's fine - do that kind of thinking where you
live. What in the hell do you really think you are solving with this kind
of approach?


We all know that the kids can go to the bathroom plenty of other
times, but, all kids will take advantage of a "free pass" out of
jail, if
even for only 10 minutes (which they can synchronize with other
friends, if they're clever).

You just keep on letting those kids outsmart you. I'm sure you'll win that
way...



What the pass does, first and foremost, is it discourages such
intents.

Bull****! Are you and the teachers at that school that stupid as to really
believe this? If so - muck in your own mire.

Also, it allows the teacher to continue teaching,
uninterrupted, as
the students just get up, grab the pass, and return, unannounced.

Really? Do you even think about the things like this that you post?



It also is very clear to everyone, what the purpose of the kid is,
whether grabbing the pass or walking the hallways. It's also not
something they can leave hidden in the hallway while they
surreptitiously run a'muck about the hallways or outdoors to catch a
smoke or whatever.

Dear Parent...



Likewise, it prevents multiple kids (from the same classroom anyway)
leaving the room at any one time.

Really? The high paid teacher is this dumb as to not be aware of this
syndrome? Really?



Furthermore, it's obvious to all whether the bathroom pass is in use
or not. It's like the red sign on an airplane bathroom door showing
it's in use, rather than what we have to do at a McDonalds, which is
to jiggle the doorknob repeatedly to find out if someone is in there.

Yeah - when I was a kid I had a really hard time understanding a locked
door - are you really this stupid? How about facilities that accomodate 4
kids at once - where does that fit into your foolish thinking?


And, being so large (on purpose), the kids, who almost certainly don't
like it, can't lose it easily.

Oh man - that just can't be anymore stupid.


At the very least, it's objectionable to carry (as you noted), which
would further discourage the unnecessary potty breaks.

Really? What in the hell is the problem you are looking to solve? I think
you have a California mindset which just does not think at all.



Rest assured, this teacher has at least one kid a day out of her 200,
walk out on the class without excuse.

Really? Then fire the teacher. That is her or his responsibility to make
sure that kind of thing does not happen. Screw the 200 number - that's a
classic over-exageration - how many students in any one class session? The
total number is completely meaningless.


She has kids banging on the
table, and calling her a b*ch, and plenty of disciplinary problems,
all of which are common through all the classes, as she told me most
of these kids are being weeded out of the system through their
behavior in *all* their classes.

Guess you guys need to improve your school disciplines and forget looking at
magic tokens like stupid wood fobs for a key to the boys room. Do you
really belive that is going to fix the problems you guys have created in
your schools? Really? Are you really that dumb?


I also find this behavior strange, as *my* kids have always had
comments on their report cards of "very polite", "always helpful",
"pitches in to volunteer every time I ask", and even once "raises
hand to answer questions too often!".

Good for you! That's what is necessary - not stupid fobs.



I think this teacher, who is brand new, is learning on the job. In
California, they go through 3 semesters of graduate training, to
obtain a preliminary teaching certificate, two semesters of which
have on-the-job training of sorts.


Kudos to you for trying to help a new teacher but don't you see that the
problem is so much bigger than that?

Then, they're thrown to the wolves for 2 more years, until they get
their preliminary teaching certificate cleared. At that point, they
also get tenure (which is kind'a soon, if you ask me), and then
they're bona-fide teachers.

Well - you might want to take the problem up with your school district. You
guys created the problem and stupid ideas like wooden fobs is not going to
fix that problem.



The clearance process, apparently, starts with three weeks of
training on "classroom management", which I found odd when I saw that
it's the *first* thing they re-train the preliminary-credentialed
teachers on.

Oh well...


You have to remember these are Algebra classes, where probably only a
small percentage of the kids (maybe 1/3?) actually care to learn it.
It's a required class for the rest, which they hope to never see
again during the rest of their lives.

We have to remember? Really? Are you that stupid? They are in school.
They are there to learn what they are told to be taught. We have to
remember? I see the very root of this problem...


When is the last time you or I graphed a quadratic equation, for
example? Could each of us solve a binomial equation to save our lives?
(Building suspension bridges in the redwoods notwithstanding...

Competely irrelevent! We did do it when we were in school. What does it
matter at all when the last time was that we did it. I'll tell you that I
have used that knowledge throughout my life - though it may not have been on
a daily basis - but when I needed it, I could call on it. You are making
excuses for dumbing down our already stupid kids even more?

--

-Mike-

Bill wrote:
Danny D. wrote:
John Paquay wrote, on Thu, 30 Oct 2014 04:51:58 -0400:

My knee jerk reaction to the original posting in this thread was not
"What's wrong with these kids?", but rather, "What's wrong with this
teacher?"
She's brand new to teaching, but, it turns out that classroom management
is a standard problem in these multi-ethnic San Jose schools.

One teacher uses a bathroom plunger, as his bathroom pass.

To me, the whole idea of using some (any) ginormous item as a hall pass
is stupid, demeaning, and completely counterproductive... not to
mention, an exercise in futility. What does this really accomplish?
What it (attempts to) accomplish is the reduce undue interruptions of
the classroom environment.

We all know that the kids can go to the bathroom plenty of other times,
but, all kids will take advantage of a "free pass" out of jail, if
even for only 10 minutes (which they can synchronize with other friends,
if they're clever).

What the pass does, first and foremost, is it discourages such intents.
Also, it allows the teacher to continue teaching, uninterrupted, as
the students just get up, grab the pass, and return, unannounced.

It also is very clear to everyone, what the purpose of the kid is,
whether grabbing the pass or walking the hallways. It's also not
something they can leave hidden in the hallway while they
surreptitiously
run a'muck about the hallways or outdoors to catch a smoke or whatever.

Likewise, it prevents multiple kids (from the same classroom anyway)
leaving the room at any one time.

Furthermore, it's obvious to all whether the bathroom pass is in use or
not. It's like the red sign on an airplane bathroom door showing it's in
use, rather than what we have to do at a McDonalds, which is to jiggle
the doorknob repeatedly to find out if someone is in there.

And, being so large (on purpose), the kids, who almost certainly don't
like it, can't lose it easily.

At the very least, it's objectionable to carry (as you noted), which
would further discourage the unnecessary potty breaks.

Rest assured, this teacher has at least one kid a day out of her 200,
walk out on the class without excuse. She has kids banging on the table,
and calling her a b*ch, and plenty of disciplinary problems, all of
which
are common through all the classes, as she told me most of these kids
are
being weeded out of the system through their behavior in *all* their
classes.

I also find this behavior strange, as *my* kids have always had comments
on their report cards of "very polite", "always helpful", "pitches in to
volunteer every time I ask", and even once "raises hand to answer
questions too often!".

Heh heh ... the apple doesn't fall far from the tree ...

The good old days were certainly different, but they weren't
necessarily
always that good. Still, if this is how our educators are now treating
our kids, what should we expect from the kids?
I think this teacher, who is brand new, is learning on the job. In
California, they go through 3 semesters of graduate training, to
obtain a
preliminary teaching certificate, two semesters of which have on-the-job
training of sorts.

Then, they're thrown to the wolves for 2 more years, until they get
their
preliminary teaching certificate cleared. At that point, they also get
tenure (which is kind'a soon, if you ask me), and then they're bona-fide
teachers.

The clearance process, apparently, starts with three weeks of
training on
"classroom management", which I found odd when I saw that it's the
*first* thing they re-train the preliminary-credentialed teachers on.

I'm afraid she needs a kind of help that can't be found in a wood shop.
Clearly she is in the wrong profession, and a big chunk of wood is not
going to change that. Foolishness, yes. But it makes me a little sad
for
the kids.
Out of 200 kids that she has, she estimated, to me, that about 10% are
the ones using the bathroom pass constantly. The rest sit and listen.

You have to remember these are Algebra classes, where probably only a
small percentage of the kids (maybe 1/3?) actually care to learn it.
It's
a required class for the rest, which they hope to never see again during
the rest of their lives.

When is the last time you or I graphed a quadratic equation, for
example?
Could each of us solve a binomial equation to save our lives?
You graph a quadratic function, and solve a quadratic
equation. I use the binomial formula almost everyday.
How about the Gamma function? Bring it on! ; )

Here's a nice problem (an example of a "Galton-Watson" process).
Start with 1 thing "alive" at generation 0.
Assume it has a 25% chance of dying, a 50% chance of living, and a 25%
chance of doubling after each generation.
Assume this is true of all such "things". What is the probability that
there will be exactly 1 thing alive after 2 generations?

I believe that a great solution technique to problems like this has been
(re-)discovered numerous times.
Hint: If the question is changed to What is the probability that there
will be exactly k things alive after n generations?
The answer is the same as the value of the coefficient on x^k of the
function f(x)=(1/4 + 1/2 x + 1/4 x^2) composed with itself n times.
That this is true I find pretty darn amazing. And it follows from the
Binomial formula, which you brought up.
The books I've seen leave the reader to figure that out for themselves,
so I won't take the fun out of it.
Suggestion: Start with a "probability tree".





(Building suspension bridges in the redwoods notwithstanding...
https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7532/1...aaeda78c_c.jpg

On 10/30/2014 12:20 PM, Danny D. wrote:

She has kids banging on the table,
and calling her a b*ch, and plenty of disciplinary problems, all of which
are common through all the classes, as she told me most of these kids are
being weeded out of the system through their behavior in *all* their
classes.


I've suspected since the beginning that the
bathroom pass is just a bandaid on a larger
problem. This supports my guess.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 10/30/2014 1:54 PM, Edward R. Rooney wrote:
On 10/30/2014 01:19 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:


The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!


Spare the rod - spoil the child.
If you don't believe it, look at the mess we got now.

In the Bible days, the rod was used to
nudge sheep back into the flock. Not to
beat the sheep.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 18:40:41 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 10/30/2014 1:54 PM, Edward R. Rooney wrote:
On 10/30/2014 01:19 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:


The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!


Spare the rod - spoil the child.
If you don't believe it, look at the mess we got now.

In the Bible days, the rod was used to
nudge sheep back into the flock. Not to
beat the sheep.

It gets their attention. That should be all that's needed.

On 10/30/2014 6:40 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 10/30/2014 1:54 PM, Edward R. Rooney wrote:
On 10/30/2014 01:19 PM, John Grossbohlin wrote:


The kids in the San Jose school district ruined the Bathroom Pass!


Spare the rod - spoil the child.
If you don't believe it, look at the mess we got now.

In the Bible days, the rod was used to
nudge sheep back into the flock. Not to
beat the sheep.

You can spank children and not beat them. If you had ever had children
you would know that sometime a pop on the bottom is the only way to get
their attention. Discipline must be consistently applied, and ALL
people in a position to give discipline, must work to basically the same
standard. ie per Theodore_Roosevelt "Speak softly and carry a big stick"

Though children quickly understand that grandpa has slightly different
standards of performance than dad. The same applies in all situations
the child is place. They are intelligent creature, understand the
environment, and what is permissibly in that environment. Otherwise,
you would not get the Alien Abduction Syndrome when you let your kids go
with someone else. (Alien Abduction Syndrome: The child who has been a
terror all afternoon, but later when when a friend's mom returns him,
she tells what a perfect child you have)

The problem comes about when you have a parent that thinks the the
teacher, the police, and every one else in the world are out to get
them. So they think that whenever anything happens to THEIR child,
someone is discriminating against or picking on THEIR child.

"Danny D." wrote:

John Paquay wrote, on Thu, 30 Oct 2014 04:51:58 -0400:

My knee jerk reaction to the original posting in this thread was not
"What's wrong with these kids?", but rather, "What's wrong with this
teacher?"

She's brand new to teaching, but, it turns out that classroom management
is a standard problem in these multi-ethnic San Jose schools.

One teacher uses a bathroom plunger, as his bathroom pass.

To me, the whole idea of using some (any) ginormous item as a hall pass
is stupid, demeaning, and completely counterproductive... not to
mention, an exercise in futility. What does this really accomplish?

What it (attempts to) accomplish is the reduce undue interruptions of
the classroom environment.

We all know that the kids can go to the bathroom plenty of other times,
but, all kids will take advantage of a "free pass" out of jail, if
even for only 10 minutes (which they can synchronize with other friends,
if they're clever).


The local high school has a single person restroom in each classroom.
Problem, solved.


--
Anyone wanting to run for any political office in the US should have to
have a DD214, and a honorable discharge.