[basilisk[_2_]]

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf

basilisk

[Mark & Juanita]

basilisk wrote:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf

basilisk


Is this only timbers and not dimension lumber?

Give it a few years and you're going to have to order a 7 x 7 to get a
6x6.



--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham

[basilisk[_2_]]

"Mark & Juanita" wrote in message
m...
basilisk wrote:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf

basilisk


Is this only timbers and not dimension lumber?

Give it a few years and you're going to have to order a 7 x 7 to get a
6x6.

The sizes of dimension lumber hasn't changed, I believe the reason
for the change is that the density of timber isn't what it used to be
and shrinkage in rough lumber was such that it made the old size
hard to dress completly out.

This only applied to timbers larger than 7 inches so the 6x6 size won't
change, at least not anytime soon.

basilisk

[-MIKE-]

On 2/26/10 11:16 AM, Mark & Juanita wrote:
basilisk wrote:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf

basilisk


Is this only timbers and not dimension lumber?

Give it a few years and you're going to have to order a 7 x 7 to get a
6x6.


I don't know how old that is, but the 2x's that I get, 8" and above,
have been -3/4" for as long as I can remember.

So yeah, maybe it's the square stuff.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

[basilisk[_2_]]

"-MIKE-" wrote in message
...
On 2/26/10 11:16 AM, Mark & Juanita wrote:
basilisk wrote:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf

basilisk


Is this only timbers and not dimension lumber?

Give it a few years and you're going to have to order a 7 x 7 to get a
6x6.


I don't know how old that is, but the 2x's that I get, 8" and above, have
been -3/4" for as long as I can remember.

So yeah, maybe it's the square stuff.


You are right, 2x and 4x over 8 inches wide
have been dressed 3/4 inch under nominal
since the late 1960's I believe.

basilisk

[Jim in Milwaukee]

Just bought some 1 X 6 Ponderosa Pine and it is 5 1/4.

Jim in Milwaukee

basilisk wrote:
"-MIKE-" wrote in message
...
On 2/26/10 11:16 AM, Mark & Juanita wrote:
basilisk wrote:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf

basilisk

Is this only timbers and not dimension lumber?

Give it a few years and you're going to have to order a 7 x 7 to get a
6x6.

I don't know how old that is, but the 2x's that I get, 8" and above, have
been -3/4" for as long as I can remember.

So yeah, maybe it's the square stuff.


You are right, 2x and 4x over 8 inches wide
have been dressed 3/4 inch under nominal
since the late 1960's I believe.

basilisk

[-MIKE-]

On 2/26/10 12:26 PM, basilisk wrote:
I don't know how old that is, but the 2x's that I get, 8" and above, have
been -3/4" for as long as I can remember.

So yeah, maybe it's the square stuff.


You are right, 2x and 4x over 8 inches wide
have been dressed 3/4 inch under nominal
since the late 1960's I believe.

basilisk


About 15 years ago (wow, has it been that long), when I built our first
home, I used a local sawmill for the wood for our Sharn (too big for a
shed, too small for a barn).

It was all green white pine and the joists were cut to nominal sizes...
still 1.5", but the 8's were 8" and the 10's were 10". It was strange,
but fun to see that.

Two things I distinctly remember...
1) they were straight as an arrow and a joy to work with.
b) IIRC, they shrank less than a 1/4" in the depth.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

[basilisk]

On 02/27/2010 10:34 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 26 Feb 2010 09:17:02 -0600, the infamous "basilisk"
scrawled the following:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf


That document is PS 20-05, as in 2005 printing date. There is no
change _today_ to the (diminishing) size of dimensional lumber as we
know it.

The grading agencies operating
under ALSC are just now pushing this into the mills.

I have no idea why it has taken 5 years to reach the mill level,
but I will give Timber Products Inspection(agency I work under)
a call Monday and try to find out what the process is.

I "think" these changes come from NIST and are passed to ALSC and
then to the grading agencies for comments and gripes all along
the chain of production and regulation, quasi govt. beauracracy
at it finest.

basilisk

[Larry Jaques[_2_]]

On Sun, 28 Feb 2010 11:22:12 -0600, the infamous basilisk
scrawled the following:

On 02/27/2010 10:34 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 26 Feb 2010 09:17:02 -0600, the infamous "basilisk"
scrawled the following:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf


That document is PS 20-05, as in 2005 printing date. There is no
change _today_ to the (diminishing) size of dimensional lumber as we
know it.

The grading agencies operating
under ALSC are just now pushing this into the mills.

I have no idea why it has taken 5 years to reach the mill level,
but I will give Timber Products Inspection(agency I work under)
a call Monday and try to find out what the process is.

Where are you based, b?


I "think" these changes come from NIST and are passed to ALSC and
then to the grading agencies for comments and gripes all along
the chain of production and regulation, quasi govt. beauracracy
at it finest.

Two things bother me. First, I haven't seen any recent changes in
lumber sizing. Second, you say grading agencies are just now pushing
it into the mills, but the old document is produced only to reflect
what's hitting the streets from the mills under voluntary agreement.

I'm missing something, so please tell me what you're saying here.
I first read it as a caveat to us that things were about to change,
but I then checked the copyright date.

Me's puzzled.

--
Pessimist: One who, when he has the choice of two evils, chooses both.
--Oscar Wilde (1854-1900)

[basilisk]

On 02/28/2010 06:37 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sun, 28 Feb 2010 11:22:12 -0600, the infamous basilisk
scrawled the following:

On 02/27/2010 10:34 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 26 Feb 2010 09:17:02 -0600, the infamous "basilisk"
scrawled the following:

American lumber standards has changed the dressed sizes
of timbers larger 7 inches to be 3/4's inch smaller than
nominal size.

8x8's that used to be dressed to 7.5x7.5 inches will
now be 7.25x7.25.

Just passing this along.

http://www.alsc.org/greenbook%20collection/ps20.pdf


That document is PS 20-05, as in 2005 printing date. There is no
change _today_ to the (diminishing) size of dimensional lumber as we
know it.

The grading agencies operating
under ALSC are just now pushing this into the mills.

I have no idea why it has taken 5 years to reach the mill level,
but I will give Timber Products Inspection(agency I work under)
a call Monday and try to find out what the process is.

Where are you based, b?

I'm in central Al and am planer supervisor of two planermills
at a local lumber company, that produces anything southern
yellow pine lumber and various hardwood products.

I "think" these changes come from NIST and are passed to ALSC and
then to the grading agencies for comments and gripes all along
the chain of production and regulation, quasi govt. beauracracy
at it finest.

Two things bother me. First, I haven't seen any recent changes in
lumber sizing. Second, you say grading agencies are just now pushing
it into the mills, but the old document is produced only to reflect
what's hitting the streets from the mills under voluntary agreement.

I'm missing something, so please tell me what you're saying here.
I first read it as a caveat to us that things were about to change,
but I then checked the copyright date.

Me's puzzled.

Where to start, I think I've taken for granted everyone knowing some
nomenclature that I shouldn't have.

2x, 3x and 4x stress rated lumber is graded under a set of rules known
as dimension lumber and these rules are written by regional grading
agencies to account for strenght differences in species.
In the south the rules are written by Southern Pine Inspection
Bureau, there are other grading agencies in the south but they have to
use SPIB's rules. (There are 7 rule writing agencies in US and Canada)
The rules nationwide are under the National Grading
rules which specify sizes and stress ratings for standard grades.
This allows construction designs to be portable from one region to
another. There haven't been any changes in the sizes or defect
specifications for dimension lumber.

Timbers are classed as any product bigger than a 5x5, so even a
4x12 isn't considered a timber as far as the grading rules are concerned.

The smallest commonly available timber that the size change will
apply to will be an 8x8, in the past the dressed size was 7.5x7.5
inches, soon it will be 7.25x7.25 inches, and will apply to any
timber at least 7 inches thick and wider than 7 inches.

Many years ago(too lazy to look up dates) the grading agencies were
formed to level the playing field between mills and to standardize
sizes, later the federal gov't stepped in and told the industry to
either police yourself or we will, so by voluntary agreement American
Lumber Standards was formed, their primary job is to inspect mills
as well as end users to insure that the grading agencies are playing
nice with each other and to insure the mills are properly inspected.

The mill that I work at(and most mills) are subject to grading
agency inspections monthly or more often depending on production
level of the mill, and ALSC has surprise inspections at any time,
although I am subject to ALSC inspections, they are primarily
checking to see if the grading agency reports match their findings
on inspection.

I don't know where the changes originated, changes like this can
originate from disgruntled mills at the bottom or NIST at the top,
or anywhere inbetween(for my own curiousity, I hope to find out).
As far as the date of ps20 is concerned, most likely after a change
was agreed to, ALSC give the industry nationwide a migration and
compliance date, I was notified by my grading agency on 2/19 about
the "upcoming" changes.

To make matters more complex than they already are the standards
for size and stress rating only apply to grademarked lumber and
even then if a mill or customer should want to sell or buy an alternate
size all that has to be done is include the sizing on the grademark
and it becomes legal. A good example of this is 5/4 decking, it is
common for it to be ran as 5.5 wide or 5.375, only the 5.375 size
would have to have the size on the stamp as the 5.5 is standard width.

basilisk