[SonomaProducts.com]

OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW

[SonomaProducts.com]

On Mar 27, 2:56*pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:

OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

Oh, boy, here we go again. :-)

General consensus here is that the grounding wire is not necessary. Google
Groups search will turn up hundreds of posts here on the subject.

Being a safety nut I'll probably do it. I have seen it detailed so
specifically in the Grizzly and other help docs. But I can be
convinced with science so maybe I'll research that while I look around
for answers about using pvc or abs.

Thanks for the reminder.

[Nova]

SonomaProducts.com wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW

I used 4" schedule 40. No ground.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

[Doug Miller]

In article , "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

Oh, boy, here we go again. :-)

General consensus here is that the grounding wire is not necessary. Google
Groups search will turn up hundreds of posts here on the subject.

[Puckdropper[_2_]]

"SonomaProducts.com" wrote in news:ec5c1687-a7b7-40c9-
:

OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW

Bill Pentz has a recommendation on his site to run two strips of aluminum
tape along the pipe. One on the inside and one on the outside on the
same spot in the pipe. Then drill a hole through the pipe and connect
the two pieces.

Here's the link to the referenced site:
http://billpentz.com/woodworking/Cyc...ticElectricity

I'm working on setting up dust collection, too. I might be going
overboard, but I'll probably go with 6" PVC pipe to the machines. (I'm
also planning on a ClearVue cyclone that'll power the whole thing.)

Puckdropper
--
On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as
some writers are incorrigible.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

[Steve Turner]

SonomaProducts.com wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW

I just went through this whole exercise - I didn't buy any of my
ductwork from Grizzly because they only sell the top of the line stuff
and their price is Out Of This World. Choosing not to use PVC, the only
other option I found was galvanized "snap lock". The HVAC industry uses
it, and they also carry a measly inventory of it at Lowe's Depot, but
good luck trying to find any gauge thicker than 30 at ANY of those
places (you need at least 26 gauge). I looked and LOOKED and found that
pretty much the only games in town are Penn State and KenCraft:

http://www.pennstateind.com/store/ductwork.html
http://www.kencraftcompany.com/Dustindex.htm

I bought a significant amount of stuff from both companies, and I can
tell you right now - Go with KenCraft for everything you can unless they
just don't have what you need. The quality is better and they ship it
FAST! Penn State has *some* good stuff (if you can figure it out ahead
of time from their mediocre descriptions), but some of it is crap and
they take *forever* to ship it. Let me know if you want particulars and
I can probably help you out.

--
Any given amount of traffic flow, no matter how
sparse, will expand to fill all available lanes.
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

[Gordon Shumway]

On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 21:56:02 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:

In article , "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

Oh, boy, here we go again. :-)

General consensus here is that the grounding wire is not necessary. Google
Groups search will turn up hundreds of posts here on the subject.

You're right that a ground isn't necessary for safety reasons. But
think of how much static cling you get when you cut a piece of PVC
with your miter saw for example. Now imagine that static cling for
the entire run of your ungrounded dust collection piping. It makes
clean up a real bitch.

That is the only reason I grounded my system and it works great.

G.S.

[Leon]

"SonomaProducts.com" wrote in message
...
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW


About 3 years ago I finally added a DC, I have two 10', 4" diameter clear
flex hoses connected to it. The 2 hoses form "1", 20' hose that I simply
move to which ever tool I am using. IIRC the hose and connectors on sale
cost me about $40, 3 years ago. I have never wanted for any thing more
permanent.

[Leon]

"Leon" wrote in message
...

"SonomaProducts.com" wrote in message
...
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW


About 3 years ago I finally added a DC, I have two 10', 4" diameter clear
flex hoses connected to it. The 2 hoses form "1", 20' hose that I simply
move to which ever tool I am using. IIRC the hose and connectors on sale
cost me about $40, 3 years ago. I have never wanted for any thing more
permanent.


BTY I used no ground wire but have once or twice gotten a pretty good zap
from it. I use mine with a 16' garage door open just in case fumes want to
collect high.

[Lee Michaels]

"Leon" wrote

BTY I used no ground wire but have once or twice gotten a pretty good zap
from it. I use mine with a 16' garage door open just in case fumes want
to collect high.
Texas chili fumes??

Seriously though, what fumes would accumlate from machining the wood?
Sanding, cutting, planing, etc do not seem like the kind of thing to produce
fumes.

[Lee Michaels]

"Leon" wrote

About 3 years ago I finally added a DC, I have two 10', 4" diameter clear
flex hoses connected to it. The 2 hoses form "1", 20' hose that I simply
move to which ever tool I am using. IIRC the hose and connectors on sale
cost me about $40, 3 years ago. I have never wanted for any thing more
permanent.
Which DC did you buy?

Do I understand that the DC is stationary and you just move the hoses?

How long does that take each time?

How noisy is that to have the DC so close?

[Art Greenberg]

On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:46:02 -0700 (PDT), SonomaProducts.com wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

I used PVC sewer & drain pipe, 6-inch for the run up to the ceiling from
the DC (a Jet DC-1200CK) and for the horizontals along the ceiling.
4-inch for the drops. Cast aluminum blast gates (the gate itself is
steel) mounted using plastic electrical tape as a gasket (the ID of the
pipe is a tad larger than the OD of the blast gate flange) and pop
rivets to hold them in, about a foot off the floor. PVC flex pipe from
there to the machine (no more than a few feet). No ground. No issues. In
use for about 3 years now.

The S&D pipe is a thin-wall (lighter than SCH40) with bell ends so no
coupling is needed to join straight runs. I found it very easy to work
with.

Since I was gluing up plastic pipe, I included a few clean-outs. I
figured they would come in handy if for some reason I had a jam. I just
used a Y fitting instead of an elbow in a couple of places, and I put a
threaded cap fitting on the open port of the fitting. I have to say that
I've never had the occasion to use them, so maybe they were not really
necessary.

--
Art Greenberg
artg at eclipse dot net

[Robatoy[_2_]]

On Mar 27, 9:20*pm, "Lee Michaels"
wrote:

Sanding, cutting, planing, etc do not seem like the kind of thing to produce
fumes.

That is Texas, remember? LOTS of fumes. G

[Puckdropper[_2_]]

Art Greenberg wrote in
m:

*snip*


Since I was gluing up plastic pipe, I included a few clean-outs. I
figured they would come in handy if for some reason I had a jam. I
just used a Y fitting instead of an elbow in a couple of places, and I
put a threaded cap fitting on the open port of the fitting. I have to
say that I've never had the occasion to use them, so maybe they were
not really necessary.


Murphy's law says if you didn't have them then a piece would have gotten
stuck the first time you used it. ;-)

The way I see it, cleanouts could also be used for additional drops.
Just put several of them on the main line, and when you need another
drop take the cap off and connect your pipe.

Puckdropper
--
On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as
some writers are incorrigible.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

[montyhp]

On Mar 27, 5:15*pm, Steve Turner wrote:
SonomaProducts.com wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW

I just went through this whole exercise - I didn't buy any of my
ductwork from Grizzly because they only sell the top of the line stuff
and their price is Out Of This World. *Choosing not to use PVC, the only
other option I found was galvanized "snap lock". *The HVAC industry uses
it, and they also carry a measly inventory of it at Lowe's Depot, but
good luck trying to find any gauge thicker than 30 at ANY of those
places (you need at least 26 gauge). *I looked and LOOKED and found that
pretty much the only games in town are Penn State and KenCraft:

[snip]


I finished my raised floor this year and put in the snap lock ducting
from lowes/home depot. I used the regular stuff they had, it is
probably 30 gauge. I did a test by running a few lengths and shutting
off the end with a blast gate. I couldn't collapse it. My DC is the
old 220V grizzly (I think it is 2 HP). I run it directly out in the
back of the shop with no bags because I get extra suction that way. I
have had no problems with the thin stuff and I have plenty of suction
for saw, planer and jointer (not all at the same time, run through
blast gates).

I did have to go to 4-5 different stores to get all the correct
fittings. BTW, I ran the 6" size and use 6 to 4" reducers for the
hoses. I guess I violated every rule in Bill Pentz's book, but I have
absolutely no complaints.

My experience

Montyhp

[LRod[_2_]]

On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:07:32 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
wrote:

On Mar 27, 2:56*pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:

Oh, boy, here we go again. :-)

General consensus here is that the grounding wire is not necessary. Google
Groups search will turn up hundreds of posts here on the subject.

Being a safety nut I'll probably do it. I have seen it detailed so
specifically in the Grizzly and other help docs. But I can be
convinced with science so maybe I'll research that while I look around
for answers about using pvc or abs.

Safety has nothing to do with it any more than spreading scraps of
paper in your yard keeps the elephants away. Can't happen, and a
friend of mine who's at MIT wrote this article a few years ago after
conducting some experiments and running some math:
http://home.comcast.net/~rodec/woodw.../DC_myths.html

If you can find a single documented case of a home shop dust
collection system exploding you will win the grand prize of being the
first. No one else has, becuase it can't happen.

All the stories of grain elevators and factories are true. The problem
is scale. The conditions in those places (huge volume, huge quantity
of fine particulate, etc.) which can lead to static spark explosion
don't exist in any home shop--even if you have a 2000 ft^2 out
building.

If you want a metaphor to put it in perspective, watch a movie about
ships (WWII are fine examples). Whenever it comes to explosions and
sinking, they always use models. You can always tell it's a model by
the water. Water molecules can't scale down. Splashes and foam are the
same size whether it's a model or a real ship creating them.



--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net
http://www.normstools.com

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

email addy de-spam-ified due to 1,000 spams per month.
If you can't figure out how to use it, I probably wouldn't
care to correspond with you anyway.

[Leon]

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote

BTY I used no ground wire but have once or twice gotten a pretty good zap
from it. I use mine with a 16' garage door open just in case fumes want
to collect high.
Texas chili fumes??

Seriously though, what fumes would accumlate from machining the wood?
Sanding, cutting, planing, etc do not seem like the kind of thing to
produce fumes.

Applying a finish? Spraying a finish?

[Gerald Ross[_2_]]

Art Greenberg wrote:
On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:46:02 -0700 (PDT), SonomaProducts.com wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

I used PVC sewer & drain pipe, 6-inch for the run up to the ceiling from
the DC (a Jet DC-1200CK) and for the horizontals along the ceiling.
4-inch for the drops. Cast aluminum blast gates (the gate itself is
steel) mounted using plastic electrical tape as a gasket (the ID of the
pipe is a tad larger than the OD of the blast gate flange) and pop
rivets to hold them in, about a foot off the floor. PVC flex pipe from
there to the machine (no more than a few feet). No ground. No issues. In
use for about 3 years now.

The S&D pipe is a thin-wall (lighter than SCH40) with bell ends so no
coupling is needed to join straight runs. I found it very easy to work
with.

Since I was gluing up plastic pipe, I included a few clean-outs. I
figured they would come in handy if for some reason I had a jam. I just
used a Y fitting instead of an elbow in a couple of places, and I put a
threaded cap fitting on the open port of the fitting. I have to say that
I've never had the occasion to use them, so maybe they were not really
necessary.

Seems that if you use a larger pipe for the horizontal runs the air
flow is going to slow down and drop a lot of it's load of sawdust.
I used the same type of pipe and glued only every other joint. The
others I sealed with duct tape. When I had the wire inside it would
snag stuff and start a blockage. Got rid of the wire and no more problems.

--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA

Don't abandon hope: your Tom Mix
decoder ring arrives tomorrow.

[dpb]

LRod wrote:
....

If you can find a single documented case of a home shop dust
collection system exploding you will win the grand prize of being the
first. No one else has, becuase it can't happen.
....

I generally agree w/ the article (and was going to post that a
substantial portion was published in FWW a few years ago) but you've
taken a liberty in the above statement. I haven't studied it thoroughly
to see what changes/updates have been made, but I don't believe the
conclusion drawn is "impossible", only "improbable".

It depends on the local conditions and, as noted, size and dust density.

--

[Steve Turner]

montyhp wrote:
I finished my raised floor this year and put in the snap lock ducting
from lowes/home depot. I used the regular stuff they had, it is
probably 30 gauge. I did a test by running a few lengths and shutting
off the end with a blast gate. I couldn't collapse it. My DC is the
old 220V grizzly (I think it is 2 HP). I run it directly out in the
back of the shop with no bags because I get extra suction that way. I
have had no problems with the thin stuff and I have plenty of suction
for saw, planer and jointer (not all at the same time, run through
blast gates).

I did have to go to 4-5 different stores to get all the correct
fittings. BTW, I ran the 6" size and use 6 to 4" reducers for the
hoses. I guess I violated every rule in Bill Pentz's book, but I have
absolutely no complaints.

My experience

Montyhp

That's good to know, but it would be nice if we all knew the exact
definition of "thin stuff" - 30 gauge from one vendor isn't the same as
30 gauge from another. I used my micrometer on samples of ducting from
practically every BORG and HVAC supply place within a 20 mile radius and
I wound up with almost as many thicknesses as there were samples. I
even found two different thicknesses of 6"x24" at a single Lowe's
because their supplies came from two different vendors. I bought
practically every piece of the "thicker" stuff they had because it was
cheaper (!) - they were closing it out OF COURSE (bastages!). I wound
up using a few smaller forty-fives (and what not) of the "thin stuff"
from the BORGs because of easy availability, and I figured they'd be far
less likely to collapse; I've had no trouble either, but for the longer
straight tubes I didn't want to resort to using it. Some of that tubing
is so thin you can literally bend it between the tips of your thumb and
forefinger. Knowing how much suction my 2HP Grizzly cyclone pulls I
didn't want to risk it.

--
See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad!
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

[Leon]

"dpb" wrote in message ...
LRod wrote:
...

If you can find a single documented case of a home shop dust
collection system exploding you will win the grand prize of being the
first. No one else has, becuase it can't happen.
...

I generally agree w/ the article (and was going to post that a substantial
portion was published in FWW a few years ago) but you've taken a liberty
in the above statement. I haven't studied it thoroughly to see what
changes/updates have been made, but I don't believe the conclusion drawn
is "impossible", only "improbable".

It depends on the local conditions and, as noted, size and dust density.



Absolutely agree, the DC could cause a chain reaction problem other
substances other than saw dust. There are plenty of flammables in the
typical shop that only need a spark to start something undesirable.

[Bob Haar]

Applying a finish? Spraying a finish?

Yes, but the topic was dust collection. I would not advise using a dust
collection system to deal with fumes from finishing. Instead, an exhaust fan
system that is separate from dust collection would seem to be in order. A
dust collection system will just reticulate the fumes.

If you are doing wood machining and finishing operations at the same time,
you should have separate work areas.

[[email protected]]

I see several mentions of fumes here with regard to the dust
collection system. It has been my understanding that the hazard is
related to dust, not fumes. This is more similar to the grain dust
explosion that can occur in grain elevators - but on a smaller scale.

BTW - Woodsmith magazine ran an article, in this months issue,
regarding small shop dust collection and duct options. They discuss
metal, flex and PVC as options and PVC was presented as a viable
option. They state that "Studies suggest this (static explosion) is
highly unlikely to happen with dust collectors in a home shop."
However, to alleviate fears (and probably make their lawyer happy)
they briefly discuss grounding using copper wire,

RonB

[LRod[_2_]]

On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 08:53:45 -0500, dpb wrote:

LRod wrote:
...

If you can find a single documented case of a home shop dust
collection system exploding you will win the grand prize of being the
first. No one else has, becuase it can't happen.
...

I generally agree w/ the article (and was going to post that a
substantial portion was published in FWW a few years ago) but you've
taken a liberty in the above statement. I haven't studied it thoroughly
to see what changes/updates have been made, but I don't believe the
conclusion drawn is "impossible", only "improbable".

It depends on the local conditions and, as noted, size and dust density.

I'm comfortable with the liberty I took. Based on Rod's article and my
paragraph noting the utter lack of evidence of it ever happening in a
home shop makes it a lock in my book. Other's books may vary.

Yes, "improbable" was Rod's conclusion. And I understand that the lack
of evidence is not evidence, but it sure is an extremely powerful
indicator when considered in conjunction with the article.



--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net
http://www.normstools.com

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

email addy de-spam-ified due to 1,000 spams per month.
If you can't figure out how to use it, I probably wouldn't
care to correspond with you anyway.

[mac davis[_5_]]

On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 07:46:31 -0500, "Leon"
wrote:


"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
.. .

"Leon" wrote

BTY I used no ground wire but have once or twice gotten a pretty good zap
from it. I use mine with a 16' garage door open just in case fumes want
to collect high.
Texas chili fumes??

Seriously though, what fumes would accumlate from machining the wood?
Sanding, cutting, planing, etc do not seem like the kind of thing to
produce fumes.

Applying a finish? Spraying a finish?

I don't do spray finishes, but any finish I do use is pretty much done
outdoors...
My dust management in the shop isn't THAT good ;-]


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

[mac davis[_5_]]

On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 21:22:22 -0400, "Lee Michaels"
wrote:


"Leon" wrote

About 3 years ago I finally added a DC, I have two 10', 4" diameter clear
flex hoses connected to it. The 2 hoses form "1", 20' hose that I simply
move to which ever tool I am using. IIRC the hose and connectors on sale
cost me about $40, 3 years ago. I have never wanted for any thing more
permanent.
Which DC did you buy?

Do I understand that the DC is stationary and you just move the hoses?

How long does that take each time?

How noisy is that to have the DC so close?

Not sure if "close counts" here.. He said the DC hose was 20 feet long..
My system has the DC in the corner of the shop, with runs to the lathe and
bandsaw..
Since my shop is 18 x 22', I'm guessing that I'm closer to the DC than Leon is..
I do use a "muffler" from PSI, which is a big improvement...


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

[Limp Arbor]

On Mar 27, 4:46*pm, "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?


DO YOU HAVE A DEATH WISH?!

I know a guy, who knows a guy, who heard of a guy that built his home
DC system with PVC. He ripped every piece in half and foiled taped
the outside and the inside of every pipe, used gold-plated copper
bolts to connect the in*out layers of foil. He then pounded 8' copper
grounding rods every two feet and connected them to the piping. Even
after all of this he brushed up against the piping with his flannel
shirt and produced a static explosion that killed hundreds!

Seriously, I would only have one concern. A static shock could
startle you and cause some part of your body to come in contact with
some part of a moving tool.

I recently bought some galvanized HVAC ductwork for my house and it
was surprisingly cheap. A 6" round duct 5' long was as cheap at the
supply house as the 4" metal dryer ducts are at the Borg. I don't
know the guage of it but it seems that it could withstand the suction
of a DC. They had long sweep 90s, Wyes, 45s, and numerous other
fittings. Defintely worth a trip to your local supply house to see
what is available.

[[email protected]]

On Mar 27, 9:11*pm, Robatoy wrote:

That is Texas, remember? LOTS of fumes. G

Hey.... knock it off up there!

VBG

mmmmmm..... chili....beer....

Buddy, that's real gas, not fumes!

Robert

[[email protected]]

On Mar 28, 11:58*am, Limp Arbor wrote:
On Mar 27, 4:46*pm, "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:

OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

DO YOU HAVE A DEATH WISH?!

I know a guy, who knows a guy, who heard of a guy that built his home
DC system with PVC. *He ripped every piece in half and foiled taped
the outside and the inside of every pipe, used gold-plated copper
bolts to connect the in*out layers of foil. *He then pounded 8' copper
grounding rods every two feet and connected them to the piping. *Even
after all of this he brushed up against the piping with his flannel
shirt and produced a static explosion that killed hundreds!

Seriously, I would only have one concern. *A static shock could
startle you and cause some part of your body to come in contact with
some part of a moving tool.

I recently bought some galvanized HVAC ductwork for my house and it
was surprisingly cheap. *A 6" round duct 5' long was as cheap at the
supply house as the 4" metal dryer ducts are at the Borg. *I don't
know the guage of it but it seems that it could withstand the suction
of a DC. *They had long sweep 90s, Wyes, 45s, and numerous other
fittings. *Defintely worth a trip to your local supply house to see
what is available.

Second that. When we were building our house I installed the dryer
vent and some other short runs of venting not related to HVAC. The
vent, exterior fitting and a few clamps came up to about $25-30. You
can also get the elbows that will adjust from 90 to 45 degrees. Got
me thinking about future dust use.

RonB

[Leon]

"Bob Haar" wrote in message
...

Applying a finish? Spraying a finish?

Yes, but the topic was dust collection. I would not advise using a dust
collection system to deal with fumes from finishing. Instead, an exhaust
fan
system that is separate from dust collection would seem to be in order. A
dust collection system will just reticulate the fumes.

If you are doing wood machining and finishing operations at the same time,
you should have separate work areas.


In an ideal setup you may have a different finishing environment. If you
use gel stains and varnishes dust can be wiped off the surface that was
varnished 10 minutes prior.

Regardless accidents happen when you least expect them to happen. If you
are using a product that produces flammable fumes, many contact cements fall
into this category, and then you for some reason turn the collector on....


It really does not matter what you are sucking up if you have a static build
up and get that spark wood is not the only thing to worry about.

Having said that the DC is not the only thing in the shop than can produce
this type spark either.

[Leon]

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote

About 3 years ago I finally added a DC, I have two 10', 4" diameter
clear flex hoses connected to it. The 2 hoses form "1", 20' hose that I
simply move to which ever tool I am using. IIRC the hose and connectors
on sale cost me about $40, 3 years ago. I have never wanted for any
thing more permanent.
Which DC did you buy?

The Jet with the large canister filter and remote control.


Do I understand that the DC is stationary and you just move the hoses?

It is on rollers however I stay in place unless I need to change out the
bag.


How long does that take each time?

To change hoses, about 10 seconds max to disconnect from one tool and carry
to the next. I use the cone shaped quick disconnects, they are friction
fit.


How noisy is that to have the DC so close?

Quieter than any tool that it is attached to. I will actually leave it
running a few minutes at a time between cuts on the TS. I will say that
when connected to and running with the planer, the planer becomes noticeably
louder. I am not too sure about every dust collector but most are many
times less loud than the typical shop vac.

[Steve Turner]

Leon wrote:
"Lee Michaels" wrote in message

How noisy is that to have the DC so close?

Quieter than any tool that it is attached to. I will actually leave it
running a few minutes at a time between cuts on the TS. I will say that
when connected to and running with the planer, the planer becomes noticeably
louder. I am not too sure about every dust collector but most are many
times less loud than the typical shop vac.

Not the case with my 2HP Grizzly cyclone. That thing ROARS. What you
said about the planer is true for me though; sucking air through the
planer makes it a LOT louder than running it by itself.

--
See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad!
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

[Phisherman[_2_]]

On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:46:02 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
wrote:

OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW


Use Sched 40 PVC, no ground needed. PVC is easy to work, seals well,
cheap, available and low turbulance.

[Lew Hodgett[_5_]]

"Phisherman" wrote:

Use Sched 40 PVC, no ground needed. PVC is easy to work, seals
well,
cheap, available and low turbulance.

ABS can also be used depending on your color preference.

It will be lighter in weight and lower cost than PVC.

Lew

[Puckdropper[_2_]]

"Leon" wrote in
:

*snip*

Quieter than any tool that it is attached to. I will actually leave
it running a few minutes at a time between cuts on the TS. I will say
that when connected to and running with the planer, the planer becomes
noticeably louder. I am not too sure about every dust collector but
most are many times less loud than the typical shop vac.



I'd love to see a little more consistency in tool loudness ratings. Some
would tell you how loud they were (at 3'), but most others would not.
When your only method to choose is the box and return policy, more
information is a great thing.

Before I turn on the shop vac, the first thing I do is put on hearing
protection. I hate hearing that thing run! (A quiet one's in my future,
but considering I just bought a cyclone it'll be a little while.)

Puckdropper
--
On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as
some writers are incorrigible.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

[SonomaProducts.com]

Thanks all. Lots of good info.

If I can find a local source for the PVc S&D as described by Bill
Pentz I'll probably go that way. I'll check out the kent ctraft and
Penn State stuff too.

Thanks again.

On Mar 27, 1:46*pm, "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:
OK, so I figured when I formalize my dust collection for the home shop
I'll just go to Grizzly and order all the metal pipe, fittings and
blast gates I need. Going all metal I'll avoid the static problems.
Going with smooth pipe I avoid the friction loss of flex, yada, yada.
Well even with a very conservitive 2 branch run it is a bit costly.

So if I go plastic and religiously run the copper wire, etc. can I
just use standard ABS or something of the sort?

BW

[Puckdropper[_2_]]

"SonomaProducts.com" wrote in news:ec1af69b-1890-45e7-
:

Thanks all. Lots of good info.

If I can find a local source for the PVc S&D as described by Bill
Pentz I'll probably go that way. I'll check out the kent ctraft and
Penn State stuff too.

Thanks again.


If you've got a Menards around you, ask at the Building Materials desk.
They won't carry something that big inside, but they might carry it
outside.

Puckdropper
--
On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as some
writers are incorrigible.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

[Leon]

"Puckdropper" puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote in message
...

I'd love to see a little more consistency in tool loudness ratings. Some
would tell you how loud they were (at 3'), but most others would not.
When your only method to choose is the box and return policy, more
information is a great thing.

A demo in the store would be nice. I did that with all of the compressors I
looked at when I bought my last one.



Before I turn on the shop vac, the first thing I do is put on hearing
protection. I hate hearing that thing run! (A quiet one's in my future,
but considering I just bought a cyclone it'll be a little while.)

There are a few shop type vacs that do not require hearing protection, the
Fein and Festool to name a couple. I have the Festool and it is completrly
drown out by the sound of my sanders, Domino, or hand drill when they are be
used at the same time. The big problem with both of those vacs is that they
both pretty much cost the same amount as a decent DC.

[Art Greenberg]

On 28 Mar 2009 07:30:18 GMT, Puckdropper wrote:
Art Greenberg wrote in
m:

*snip*


Since I was gluing up plastic pipe, I included a few clean-outs. I
figured they would come in handy if for some reason I had a jam. I
just used a Y fitting instead of an elbow in a couple of places, and
I put a threaded cap fitting on the open port of the fitting. I have
to say that I've never had the occasion to use them, so maybe they
were not really necessary.


Murphy's law says if you didn't have them then a piece would have gotten
stuck the first time you used it. ;-)

Indeed.

The way I see it, cleanouts could also be used for additional drops.
Just put several of them on the main line, and when you need another
drop take the cap off and connect your pipe.

Murphy's Law also states that, having put cleanouts in for later
addition of drops, no such drops would ever be needed.

--
Art Greenberg
artg at eclipse dot net

[Art Greenberg]

On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 09:20:27 -0400, Gerald Ross wrote:
Seems that if you use a larger pipe for the horizontal runs the air
flow is going to slow down and drop a lot of it's load of sawdust.

With my DC, that has never been a problem.

But the relationship between pipe diameter and air velocity is precisely
why I used 4 inch pipe for the drops.

I used the same type of pipe and glued only every other joint. The
others I sealed with duct tape.

Thats a great idea. You just have to make sure you have enough space and
slack int he installation to permit separating the pipe.

When I had the wire inside it would snag stuff and start a blockage.
Got rid of the wire and no more problems.

No "ground" wire in my setup.

--
Art Greenberg
artg at eclipse dot net