[cc]

A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..

[Leon]

"cc" wrote in message
oups.com...
A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..


No, The dust coating helps filter the smaller particles on a bag but on a
cartridge it simply restricts air flow. Clean the inside of the filter and
air flow should increase. Did you by any chance replace the cartridge with
one that filters smaller particles? If so, there is part of your problem.
And, you want to insure no restrictions are present.

[Toller]

"cc" wrote in message
oups.com...
A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..

It has a 14a motor. It never really pulls.
And it only gets worse when it builds up dust on it.

[Greg O]

"cc" wrote in message
oups.com...
A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..


I have the HF unit with just bags on it and it works great. May I ask how
much, what diameter, and length duct or hose you have on it?
Greg

[Steve Hall]

On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 21:19:41 -0700, cc wrote:

A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the
cartridge need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag)
before it really pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience
with this model personally, although opinions are always
welcome..thanks all..

If you read http://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/Index.cfm, it
says no 14A/110 motor can produce 1200 CFM. Best case scenario is
around 600 CFM BEFORE any ducting. After 4" dia. hose and filters,
this will drop to 300 CFM at nozzle end. This matches Wynn
Environmental's test of the HF collector with their filters
(http://www.wynnenv.com/9e300bl_conversion.htm). Their measurement
after a bit of use is 330 CFM at 3800 FPM. (This is the benefit of a
cyclone separator, it keeps the filter from getting clogged.)

BTW, Bill's research recommends 800 CFM and 4000 FPM *AT THE TOOL* as
the bare minimum to be safe. Opinions here vary on how overboard this
is (from completely to not at all), but advertising a 15A/110 motor
dust collector at 1200 CFM ? Caveat emptor!

--
Steve Hall [ digitect dancingpaper com ]

[cc]

On Apr 26, 5:44 pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"cc" wrote in message

oups.com...

A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..

I have the HF unit with just bags on it and it works great. May I ask how
much, what diameter, and length duct or hose you have on it?
Greg

I have 10' or so going to the RAS, with a blast gate, straight run, no
turns..second port goes to seperator trash can, 3', no turns, with
blast gate..all using 4" flexible tubing..??

[Greg O]

"cc" wrote in message
oups.com...


I have 10' or so going to the RAS, with a blast gate, straight run, no
turns..second port goes to seperator trash can, 3', no turns, with
blast gate..all using 4" flexible tubing..??

It should handle that, no problem!
I use a couple 15 foot flex hoses, no blast gates, and my el-cheap-o HF
collector works great!
Greg

[Dr. Deb]

cc wrote:

A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..

I doubled the filter bags, which of course doubled the through put. But
then I decided to get all the dust out of the shop that I could and used
the blower assembly to power a cyclone and ducted the discharge outside
into an "outhouse" (complete with a "half moon" on the door.) Works very
well and the shop is cleaner.

Deb

[cc]

On Apr 26, 9:10 pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"cc" wrote in message

oups.com...

I have 10' or so going to the RAS, with a blast gate, straight run, no
turns..second port goes to seperator trash can, 3', no turns, with
blast gate..all using 4" flexible tubing..??

It should handle that, no problem!
I use a couple 15 foot flex hoses, no blast gates, and my el-cheap-o HF
collector works great!
Greg

then what is the problem with my setup? the filter is the one
recommended from Wynn Environmental, and the durotex version (lifetime
filter)..even my shop vac seems to suck more..

[[email protected]]

On Apr 26, 6:24 pm, Steve Hall
wrote:
On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 21:19:41 -0700, cc wrote:

A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the
cartridge need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag)
before it really pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience
with this model personally, although opinions are always
welcome..thanks all..

If you readhttp://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/Index.cfm, it
says no 14A/110 motor can produce 1200 CFM. Best case scenario is
around 600 CFM BEFORE any ducting. After 4" dia. hose and filters,
this will drop to 300 CFM at nozzle end. This matches Wynn
Environmental's test of the HF collector with their filters
(http://www.wynnenv.com/9e300bl_conversion.htm). Their measurement
after a bit of use is 330 CFM at 3800 FPM. (This is the benefit of a
cyclone separator, it keeps the filter from getting clogged.)

BTW, Bill's research recommends 800 CFM and 4000 FPM *AT THE TOOL* as
the bare minimum to be safe. Opinions here vary on how overboard this
is (from completely to not at all), but advertising a 15A/110 motor
dust collector at 1200 CFM ? Caveat emptor!

--
Steve Hall [ digitect dancingpaper com ]

It doesn't matter what the true HP or CFM of this unit is. The fact is
very many of us on this forum are using it for smaller shops (one tool
at a time) and it works great. If the OP is getting bad results with
his described setup, something is out of whack, and it's not because
the specs are optimistic. Mine is ducted all over the shop with leaky
blast gates and 4" PVC that is screwed, not glued together and it
works fine for one machine at a time. Shure, shure I could glue the
joints and get the expensive metal blast gates but it's not worth it
because IT WORKS FINE.

To the OP, I'd guess that either your cartridge is badly clogged, your
DC is defective, or you have a BIG leak somewhere. Since you probably
have checked the cartridge and the integrity of your ducting, you
might well have a bad DC.

Now, I will say that your expectations of "suction" may be wrong. The
DC will not generate nearly as much negative pressure as your shop
vac. It moves much more air, but will not suck nearly as hard. That
said, the 4" flex hose moved along the shop floor should suck up a
swath of fine sawdust similar to a vac.

How does it do on the RAS? Mine pretty much catches everything on a 90
degree crosscut. Yours should work as well or better because your
setup seems to be much more elegant than mine.

Tom

[Dave Hall]

On 27 Apr 2007 21:49:31 -0700, cc wrote:

On Apr 26, 9:10 pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"cc" wrote in message

oups.com...

I have 10' or so going to the RAS, with a blast gate, straight run, no
turns..second port goes to seperator trash can, 3', no turns, with
blast gate..all using 4" flexible tubing..??

It should handle that, no problem!
I use a couple 15 foot flex hoses, no blast gates, and my el-cheap-o HF
collector works great!
Greg

then what is the problem with my setup? the filter is the one
recommended from Wynn Environmental, and the durotex version (lifetime
filter)..even my shop vac seems to suck more..

A shop vac should "suck more" than a DC, if we are talking actual
suction. The DC should move MUCH more air. There is a difference. Kind
of like a garden hose with 50 PSI of water vs. a firemans hose with 5
PSI. The garden hose will put out water at more pressure and would be
my choice for washing the car, but the fireman's hose will put out
more water volume and would be my choice for filling a swimming pool.

Dave Hall

[Leon]

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...


A shop vac should "suck more" than a DC, if we are talking actual
suction. The DC should move MUCH more air. There is a difference. Kind
of like a garden hose with 50 PSI of water vs. a firemans hose with 5
PSI. The garden hose will put out water at more pressure and would be
my choice for washing the car, but the fireman's hose will put out
more water volume and would be my choice for filling a swimming pool.

Dave Hall

Are yuh shure bout that 5 psi on a fire hose??? It takes pressure to shoot
a stream of water a hundred feet.

[Dave Hall]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 14:28:46 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:


"Dave Hall" wrote in message
.. .


A shop vac should "suck more" than a DC, if we are talking actual
suction. The DC should move MUCH more air. There is a difference. Kind
of like a garden hose with 50 PSI of water vs. a firemans hose with 5
PSI. The garden hose will put out water at more pressure and would be
my choice for washing the car, but the fireman's hose will put out
more water volume and would be my choice for filling a swimming pool.

Dave Hall

Are yuh shure bout that 5 psi on a fire hose??? It takes pressure to shoot
a stream of water a hundred feet.


I wasn't trying to say that a fireman's hose would only have 5 PSI. In
fact if I am not mistaken a fire hose attached off the same main as a
garden hose will have the same water pressure in PSI as long as the
line it is attached to is at least as big as the hose. The analogy
that I was trying to create was if you had a small water hose in a
high pressure environment it would be great for a pressure use like
washing the car (BTW I certainly would not want to wash my car with a
fire hose at 50 PSI). If you are in a low pressure environment a fire
hose will still move lots of water which is nice for filling the pool.
Obviously this is not a perfect analogy for a number of reasons, not
the least of which is that air and water systems are not comparable,
but I find it the best way that I have been able to get the basic
concept of a DC vs. a vac across to folks who don't want to read some
200 page treatise on dust collection theories and have never actually
worked with a DC. For most people the DC volume vs. the vacs
"sucktion" is a foreign concept.

Dave Hall

[Cal]

On 25 Apr 2007 21:19:41 -0700, cc wrote:

A different question...new DC (yes, HF based on many reviews), new
hosing, cartridge filter on top, etc....

Not getting much suction, regardless of what point..does the cartridge
need to get some dust coating on it (like a felt bag) before it really
pulls? Am looking for someone who has experience with this model
personally, although opinions are always welcome..thanks all..

For sawdust, you should have a relatively small hose to keep air
VELOCITY up. (28mm is about right -- sorry inch-o-philes lol
28mm is about 1-1/8")