Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?

In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize the cost
(ca. £5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with the uPVC variety?
I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid off the
costs through fuel savings.

What if the steel-framed windows are furnished with secondary
double-glazing? Doesn't this make them equal to uPVC?

MM

"Mike Mitchell" wrote
| Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
| insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?
| In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize
| the cost (ca. £5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with
| the uPVC variety?
| I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid
| off the costs through fuel savings.

Quite possibly longer than plastic windows last.

If your windows are old and draughty you could consider replacing them with
new Crittall windows - they're still made, but to updated standards of
insulation - which might be more in keeping with the period of your
property.

Owain

Mike Mitchell wrote:
Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?

In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize the cost
(ca. ?5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with the uPVC variety?
I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid off the
costs through fuel savings.

How much is your heating bill?
How many square meters do your windows add up to?

What if the steel-framed windows are furnished with secondary
double-glazing? Doesn't this make them equal to uPVC?

Not quite.

On 11 Jul 2004 12:41:42 GMT, Ian Stirling
wrote:

Mike Mitchell wrote:
Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?

In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize the cost
(ca. ?5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with the uPVC variety?
I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid off the
costs through fuel savings.

How much is your heating bill?
How many square meters do your windows add up to?

I don't mean for me. I mean just as a general rule.


What if the steel-framed windows are furnished with secondary
double-glazing? Doesn't this make them equal to uPVC?

Not quite.

"Owain" wrote in message
...
"Mike Mitchell" wrote
| Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
| insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?
| In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize
| the cost (ca. £5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with
| the uPVC variety?
| I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid
| off the costs through fuel savings.

Quite possibly longer than plastic windows last.

If your windows are old and draughty you could consider replacing them
with
new Crittall windows - they're still made, but to updated standards of
insulation - which might be more in keeping with the period of your
property.

Owain


Interesting, I didn't know that Crittall were still about. Mine are 85
years old (I think) with mainly original oak frames and good quality brass
furniture. All leaded lights with individual glasses. Still serviceable but
a little draughty at times.
I've been thinking about replacing them but haven't been able to find a
good alternative. Leaded lights are essential but this reduces the light by
approx. 20%. This is an old house with small and few windows, maximum light
input is also essential. Plastic/aluminium frames have very much larger
glazing bars which further restricts the light input.
I will try to find a little more info on modern Crittalls.
Many thanks
Phil

Mike Mitchell wrote:
Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?

In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize the cost
(ca. £5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with the uPVC variety?
I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid off the
costs through fuel savings.

What if the steel-framed windows are furnished with secondary
double-glazing? Doesn't this make them equal to uPVC?

MM

them crittal windows look great to me. when my placy ones are getting tired
after their 20 year lifespan, i will fit new crittall ones to match what was
once there.

steve

In article , Phil writes
Interesting, I didn't know that Crittall were still about. Mine are 85
years old (I think) with mainly original oak frames and good quality brass
furniture. All leaded lights with individual glasses. Still serviceable but
a little draughty at times.
I've read up on draught proofing steel windows with a carefully applied and
formed bead of silicone - left to set before the window is closed of course ;-),
but can't find the link. Probably came from one of the sites linked from
members page of the steel window association if you fancy having a search.
http://www.steel-window-association....mberslist.asp?
--
fred

fred wrote:
In article , Phil writes
Interesting, I didn't know that Crittall were still about. Mine are 85
years old (I think) with mainly original oak frames and good quality brass
furniture. All leaded lights with individual glasses. Still serviceable but
a little draughty at times.
I've read up on draught proofing steel windows with a carefully applied and
formed bead of silicone - left to set before the window is closed of course ;-),

I have draught-proofed my wooden windows.
Take some packing tape (you probably want to dust it with a little flour
so that it does not stick very hard, or use proper low-tack tape).
Now, place inside where the window seals.
Smear a light layer of margarine on the tape.
Now, run a bead of silicone along the outside edge of the window.
Close window.
Leave a couple of days.
Remove tape, wipe edge of silicone with a hot soapy rag to remove grease.

"Phil" wrote
| "Owain" wrote
| Interesting, I didn't know that Crittall were still about. Mine are 85
| years old (I think) with mainly original oak frames and good quality
| brass furniture. All leaded lights with individual glasses. Still
| serviceable but a little draughty at times.

Mmmm, nice. Bet there arent' amny of them left these days.

| I've been thinking about replacing them but haven't been able to
| find a good alternative. Leaded lights are essential but this
| reduces the light by approx. 20%. This is an old house with
| small and few windows, maximum light input is also essential.
| Plastic/aluminium frames have very much larger glazing bars
| which further restricts the light input.
| I will try to find a little more info on modern Crittalls.

http://www.crittall-windows.co.uk/

Owain

In article ,
Mike Mitchell writes:

I don't mean for me. I mean just as a general rule.

As a general rule, installing double glazing for energy efficiency
alone never pays. If you have money available for improving
energy efficiency of your house, probably just about anything
else you spend it on will be more effective, and stand a chance
or repaying itself within a few years, or at least withing the
lifetime of whatever you bought.

However, if there's something wrong with your existing windows
such as particularly drafty, or they're beyond repair in some
other respect, then that's a different matter, as you aren't
replacing them purely for energy efficiency reasons.

Prior to April 2001, I would also suggest avoiding the Pilkinton K
glass. The money I saved on that paid for a condensing boiler and
replacement of a single storey ceiling with a thermally insulated
one, measures which do make energy efficiency sense.
Sadly, you no longer have this choice today -- I made sure to get
mine done just before April 2001.

--
Andrew Gabriel

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 14:41:25 +0100, "Phil" wrote:


"Owain" wrote in message
t...
"Mike Mitchell" wrote
| Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
| insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?
| In terms of heating bills, how long would it take to amortize
| the cost (ca. £5,000) of replacing steel-framed windows with
| the uPVC variety?
| I reckon it would take literally years before one had paid
| off the costs through fuel savings.

Quite possibly longer than plastic windows last.

If your windows are old and draughty you could consider replacing them
with
new Crittall windows - they're still made, but to updated standards of
insulation - which might be more in keeping with the period of your
property.

Owain


Interesting, I didn't know that Crittall were still about. Mine are 85
years old (I think) with mainly original oak frames and good quality brass
furniture. All leaded lights with individual glasses. Still serviceable but
a little draughty at times.
I've been thinking about replacing them but haven't been able to find a
good alternative. Leaded lights are essential but this reduces the light by
approx. 20%. This is an old house with small and few windows, maximum light
input is also essential. Plastic/aluminium frames have very much larger
glazing bars which further restricts the light input.
I will try to find a little more info on modern Crittalls.
Many thanks
Phil


See http://www.crittall-windows.co.uk/

I replaced two wooden frames. They're dirt cheap and come in 4
sections. I got mine from a Crittall dealer, Lightfoot Windows in
Croydon. A small frame cost roughly 30 quid and will be still around
long after I have kicked the bucket, since the house was already fifty
years old and most of the frames had lasted that long already.

I hate modern uPVC replacements! Not all, but many are very, very ugly
and do not match the style of property. I reckon most of them are an
abomination.

MM

Mike Mitchell wrote in message . ..
Are Crittall's steel-framed windows of yore that much worse for
insulation than cheapo plastic-framed double-glazed units?

Certainly. But more to the point theyre also much worse than
traditional single glazed wood windows. The steel frame is an
excellant conductor of heat: not a shred of insulation there. I've
experienced them in 2 places: in one the room with the metal window
was horrendously cold, and when the window was replaced with something
modern, suddenly the place was warm and comfortable.

The other place had an enormous area of 1930s steel windows, but was
not cold. But then it had an equally vast area of radiator running the
whole length of the windows. Extremely wasteful. Must have been
something like 3x or 4x the normal amount of radiator area in that
room.

Not recommended!


What if the steel-framed windows are furnished with secondary
double-glazing? Doesn't this make them equal to uPVC?

No but it would help hugely.


Regards, NT