Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

Michael Mcneil wrote:
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots ?20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for ?3. Anyone tried the laser?

It's great, cuts through 6" concrete with ease, and under a tenner.

Seriously though.

First impressions: Crap quality, the batteries won't even fit in the
battery holder.
Second impressions: Don't try to put the batteries in the laser hole.

Reasonable design of tripod, fairly stable when locked.
Not perhaps the solidest design, but it is a tenner.
I would have considered buying another one for my camera, if I'd
been able to have a look at it.

The level bit of it is detachable, can project either a dot in line
with the level, a dot at right angles to the end of the level, or
a plane of light along the line of the level, and of rotatable
axis.
This can be attatched either across, or up from the rotatable platform.

It's not especially bright, it may be getting reterofitted with a
laser-pointer diode.

"Ian Stirling" wrote in message
...
Michael Mcneil wrote:
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots ?20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for ?3. Anyone tried the laser?

It's great, cuts through 6" concrete with ease, and under a tenner.

Seriously though.

First impressions: Crap quality, the batteries won't even fit in the
battery holder.
Second impressions: Don't try to put the batteries in the laser hole.


Not tried the laser. Got a pair of their boots - they were OK.

I got a set of three spanners sometime ago for £3.99. They are fine too.
I also got a measuring tape from there which seems OK.

Tools are no better or worse than anyone else's cr*ppy tools!

Got 2 of the props at 3.99 a piece. lifts to 2.9m (screwfix's lifts to 2.09m
for £17.99).
One of the supports,
screws, bolts and screw storage box.

Also got some clothes pegs for the wife

Arthur


"Michael Mcneil" wrote in message
news:e05d04a3831ff05e37f86aab7878b46b.45219@mygate .mailgate.org...
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 23:57:51 GMT, Peter Twydell
strung together this:

I once went to a wife-swapping party and managed to swap mine for a
newish SDS drill...

Lucky bar steward, all I got was another wife that wasn't much better
than the original!
--

SJW
A.C.S. Ltd

In article , Arthur
writes
Got 2 of the props at 3.99 a piece. lifts to 2.9m (screwfix's lifts to 2.09m
for £17.99).
One of the supports,
screws, bolts and screw storage box.

Also got some clothes pegs for the wife


Not much of an exchange.

I once went to a wife-swapping party and managed to swap mine for a
newish SDS drill...


--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!

"Michael Mcneil" wrote in message
news:e05d04a3831ff05e37f86aab7878b46b.45219@mygate .mailgate.org...
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?

Buy cheap - buy again. When will people learn!

In article ,
Peter Twydell wrote:
I once went to a wife-swapping party and managed to swap mine for a
newish SDS drill...

But which made the most noise?

--
*Rehab is for quitters.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 10:51:15 GMT, R Taylor wrote:

"PJ" wrote in message
...

"Michael Mcneil" wrote in message
news:e05d04a3831ff05e37f86aab7878b46b.45219@mygate .mailgate.org...
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?

Buy cheap - buy again. When will people learn!



I would usually agree 'buy cheap buy twice' however:

laser level - £10 - perfectly adequate for DIY - saving over screwfix £35

props - £2.99ea - again, perfectly adequate - saving over screwfix on 4 - c£59

'stanley' locking screw case £2.48 identical to screwfix's £13.99 offering
except the 'stanley' sticker - saving on 2 - £23.02

total saving on items I was going to buy anyway = £117

Nice if you can get 'em. Tried two stores near us for the props, round
about mid day Thursday. Neither had stocked them.....

"PJ" wrote in message
...

"Michael Mcneil" wrote in message
news:e05d04a3831ff05e37f86aab7878b46b.45219@mygate .mailgate.org...
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?

Buy cheap - buy again. When will people learn!



I would usually agree 'buy cheap buy twice' however:

laser level - £10 - perfectly adequate for DIY - saving over screwfix £35

props - £2.99ea - again, perfectly adequate - saving over screwfix on 4 - c£59

'stanley' locking screw case £2.48 identical to screwfix's £13.99 offering
except the 'stanley' sticker - saving on 2 - £23.02

total saving on items I was going to buy anyway = £117




RT

On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 10:51:15 GMT, "R Taylor"
wrote:


"PJ" wrote in message
...

"Michael Mcneil" wrote in message
news:e05d04a3831ff05e37f86aab7878b46b.45219@mygate .mailgate.org...
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?

Buy cheap - buy again. When will people learn!



I would usually agree 'buy cheap buy twice' however:

laser level - £10 - perfectly adequate for DIY - saving over screwfix £35

props - £2.99ea - again, perfectly adequate - saving over screwfix on 4 - c£59


Are you sure that they are adequate?

I suppose that it does depend on the standard of accuracy and
longevity that you are willing to accept.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news
On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 10:51:15 GMT, "R Taylor"
wrote:


"PJ" wrote in message
...

"Michael Mcneil" wrote in message
news:e05d04a3831ff05e37f86aab7878b46b.45219@mygate .mailgate.org...
Laser level less than a tenner. Workshoes and boots £20ish, and a pair
of handplanes for £3. Anyone tried the laser?

Buy cheap - buy again. When will people learn!



I would usually agree 'buy cheap buy twice' however:

laser level - £10 - perfectly adequate for DIY - saving over screwfix £35

props - £2.99ea - again, perfectly adequate - saving over screwfix on 4 - c£59


Are you sure that they are adequate?

Yes. I've already used them. they all do what they are supposed to do.

I suppose that it does depend on the standard of accuracy and
longevity that you are willing to accept.

I'm not sure what you mean. the props prop, the screw cases hold screws and are
(on closer inspection) actually better quality than the stanley screw cases and
the laser level is accurate to ~1mm / m. for £9.99

besides, at that price they are almost disposable


RT

besides, at that price they are almost disposable

I bought a Makita drill 21 years ago. I used it daily for my work and when I
changed career I used it for the odd job. I have used it a lot recently
because I've been doing loads of work on my house. It cost me £90+ 21 years
ago and since then it's had one set of brushes and two replacement chucks
(my fault cos I hit them with hammer when I lose the key!). It still works
perfectly well. £90+ for a drill 21 years ago was a small fortune. B&D
professional drills were around £35. Thing is though that I know when I pick
the drill up it will work and it will work well. It's proved to be a damn
good investment. I also have a Makita angle grinder and sander which I've
had for 15+ years and they've never let me down. I bought quality
engineering and reliability. Buy your cheap screwfix Ferm gear or your Lidl
similar ****e and you don't get that level of reliability. Like you say,
they're disposable but at 9am at night when it packs up half way through a
job you may wish you'd bought better.

In article ,
PJ wrote:
Buy your cheap screwfix Ferm gear or your Lidl similar ****e and you
don't get that level of reliability. Like you say, they're disposable
but at 9am at night when it packs up half way through a job you may wish
you'd bought better.

Also, they're never as nice to use. Poorer balance, less tactile controls,
and not as accurate. A bit like comparing cars. All cars will get you from
A to B at reasonable comfort, but some are much more pleasant to drive
than others.

--
*Is there another word for synonym?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Lurch" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 23:57:51 GMT, Peter Twydell
strung together this:

I once went to a wife-swapping party and managed to swap mine for a
newish SDS drill...

Lucky bar steward, all I got was another wife that wasn't much better
than the original!

You did it twice? What a loser!

"PJ" wrote in message
...
besides, at that price they are almost disposable

I bought a Makita drill 21 years ago. I used it daily for my work and when
I
changed career I used it for the odd job. I have used it a lot recently
because I've been doing loads of work on my house. It cost me £90+ 21
years
ago and since then it's had one set of brushes and two replacement chucks
(my fault cos I hit them with hammer when I lose the key!). It still works
perfectly well. £90+ for a drill 21 years ago was a small fortune. B&D
professional drills were around £35. Thing is though that I know when I
pick
the drill up it will work and it will work well. It's proved to be a damn
good investment. I also have a Makita angle grinder and sander which I've
had for 15+ years and they've never let me down. I bought quality
engineering and reliability. Buy your cheap screwfix Ferm gear or your
Lidl
similar ****e and you don't get that level of reliability. Like you say,
they're disposable but at 9am at night when it packs up half way through a
job you may wish you'd bought better.

Or two or three of them and picked one up and used that, and still saved a
wedge on Makita's. I have had a B&D for 24 years and that still goes and
it was a re-con at the time, and cost only a few quid, well I can't remember
the cost as it was so cheap. If it was £90 I would have remembered.

I am not interested in buying expensive tools that work well PJ, your
posts are masterpieces of logic. It explains how a length of extrusion
at £100 a ton can cost £100 or £10 for a 12 inch length depending on who
put the bubbles in in a remarkably lucid way.

It doesn't explain why the Japanese could import steel and etc turn it
into a motor car and transport it clear across the world and sell it
cheaper at a profit than British Leyland could produce and sell Mini at
a loss. As for VFM, a 1970's Marina would be worth what in today's
money? I would love to have another Datsun Violet.

Being in the trade and using these things regularly I would still like
to know why a 4' level costs £44 and a 2' level cost me £17. I admit all
a while ago and both fair quality.

I have never bought a cheap level that was worth having, hence the
original question.

As for Ferm tools: I was using one this week. The 32V hammer drill -not
SDS. After the first day when it went from fully charged but unused to
flat in less than a dozen holes into concrete I was able to use it all
day.

Not a patch on an SDS but not an SDS. I would never have expected such
capabilities from a battery drill that costs £55 a few days ago. I had
considered getting a battery SDS but for the occasional use I have for
one I'd as soon have two of those. When one packs up or gets stolen I
just go and get the other one.

Quality is all very well but today's crop of childen are more likely to
be criminals than citizens in 4 or 5 years time and the damage a crack
addict can do at the moment is bad enough. So I am not looking to stock
my shed with expensive toys for them to get hold of thanks.


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"PJ" wrote in message
...
besides, at that price they are almost disposable

I bought a Makita drill 21 years ago.

snip memory lane blah

but at 9am at night when it packs up half way through a
job you may wish you'd bought better.

you're making a lot of assumptions, matey, the main one being that I'm
unable to distinguish cheap unusable crap from inexpensive kit which
is suitable for the uses to which I'm going to put them.

I bought 4 props, TUV marked and identical to the 'expensive' screwfix ones
the 2 screw cases are better quality than the (far) more expensive stanley
ones and & the cheap laser level is also TUV marked and solid state.

why would any of these (in your topsy turvy world) "fail at 9am at night"
solely because I've bought them at a deep discount from one retailer
rather than another ?

using your logic, anything bought 'cheap' at the wholesalers is poorer quality
and more prone to failure than the same item bought further down the supply
chain at retail.

tell us, does quality 'grow' on an item as it moves down the supply chain ?

you're not making sense.

Quality is all very well but today's crop of childen are more likely to
be criminals than citizens in 4 or 5 years time and the damage a crack
addict can do at the moment is bad enough. So I am not looking to stock
my shed with expensive toys for them to get hold of thanks.

Christ! I think I need a drink. So negative and pessimistic I just went into
immediate depression.

you're not making sense.

Of course I am. OK, I'll give you the props and the screw cases but things
like drills etc. at a tenner just have to be lesser quality than a "proper"
make. I also agree that some of the proper makes (Makita being a good
example) are over priced but reliability is what some are after - not cheap
deals. Laser levels at cheap price are going to be less precision than more
expensive ones but I agree it may not matter to the average DIY bod.
Personally I'll stick to buying tools that will last me a long long time
thanks.

In article ,
PJ wrote:
Christ! I think I need a drink. So negative and pessimistic I just went
into immediate depression.

Make sure that drink isn't alcohol, then. It's a depressant.

--
*When you've seen one shopping centre you've seen a mall.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message


Make sure that drink isn't alcohol, then. It's a depressant.

Not if he is going to stick his head in the sand. Or if he want's the
courage to flog his old tools and buy new cheap stuff as an investment.




--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

How did we go from props and levels to power tools?

I've bought some Lidl stuff in the past as well. You'll find a lot of
stuff they are selling is many times the exact same product sold by
Screwfix or the sheds for much more money. Nothing wrong in saving
some money.
If you're only doing a few jobs what's wrong with buying a £9.99 laser
level as opposed to a £100 Stabila. This is a DIY newsgroup, some
people forget this.

On 10 Jul 2004 04:00:39 -0700, (StealthUK) wrote:

How did we go from props and levels to power tools?

I've bought some Lidl stuff in the past as well. You'll find a lot of
stuff they are selling is many times the exact same product sold by
Screwfix or the sheds for much more money. Nothing wrong in saving
some money.
If you're only doing a few jobs what's wrong with buying a £9.99 laser
level as opposed to a £100 Stabila. This is a DIY newsgroup, some
people forget this.


That is true, but DIY does not automatically equate to cheapness,
inaccuracy and poor quality either in terms of tools and materials
used or the result.




..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Steve Firth wrote:
All cars will get you from A to B at reasonable comfort, but some are
much more pleasant to drive than others.

Yeh, but people still insist on buying BMWs.

;-)

--
*Don't use no double negatives *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
PJ wrote:
Christ! I think I need a drink. So negative and pessimistic I just went
into immediate depression.

Make sure that drink isn't alcohol, then. It's a depressant.

Disagree. It always seems to cheer me up.

Not if he is going to stick his head in the sand. Or if he want's the
courage to flog his old tools and buy new cheap stuff as an investment.

Now that's a really sensible post/suggestion - not.

"Huge" wrote in message
...
"PJ" writes:

[14 lines snipped]

they're disposable but at 9am at night when it packs up half way through
a
job you may wish you'd bought better.

9am at night???

Oh sorry, did I say I was perfect?

Andy Hall wrote:

That is true, but DIY does not automatically equate to cheapness,
inaccuracy and poor quality either in terms of tools and materials
used or the result.


In fact very often it's the opposite, which is one of the main reasons I
do the work myself. If you're working on your own place you will
generally do so with greater care and attention to detail than all but
the best tradesmen.


--
Grunff

In fact very often it's the opposite, which is one of the main reasons I
do the work myself. If you're working on your own place you will
generally do so with greater care and attention to detail than all but
the best tradesmen.

So surely if you are aiming to achieve a good job you will need the best
tools you can get/afford?

PJ wrote:
In fact very often it's the opposite, which is one of the main reasons I
do the work myself. If you're working on your own place you will
generally do so with greater care and attention to detail than all but
the best tradesmen.


So surely if you are aiming to achieve a good job you will need the best
tools you can get/afford?

Erm, yes - have I argued differently?


--
Grunff

PJ wrote:

In fact very often it's the opposite, which is one of the main reasons I
do the work myself. If you're working on your own place you will
generally do so with greater care and attention to detail than all but
the best tradesmen.

So surely if you are aiming to achieve a good job you will need the best
tools you can get/afford?

The best tools do not guarantee the best job.

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..


That is true, but DIY does not automatically equate to cheapness,
inaccuracy and poor quality either in terms of tools and materials
used or the result.

Yes, and I've not said anything to the contrary. I use a standard
level frequently and have one Rabone (for 14 years) and one Stabila -
both take a lot of abuse and have served me well.
I bought a Wickes £30 laser level tripod kit last year. I've used it
twice and it was accurate and did what I asked of it. If I had a need
for a laser level as often as I use my standard levels then I
certainly would have bought a Stabila because in my experience the
quality brand products will take far more abuse and normally be a
better bet in the long run. In this case the cheaper product served my
needs.

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
.. .
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

All cars will get you from A to B at reasonable comfort, but some are
much
more pleasant to drive than others.

Yeh, but people still insist on buying BMWs.

Why I don't know , when better cheaper chars are available, Look at Toyota
and Honda.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On 10 Jul 2004 04:00:39 -0700, (StealthUK) wrote:

How did we go from props and levels to power tools?

I've bought some Lidl stuff in the past as well. You'll find a lot of
stuff they are selling is many times the exact same product sold by
Screwfix or the sheds for much more money. Nothing wrong in saving
some money.
If you're only doing a few jobs what's wrong with buying a £9.99 laser
level as opposed to a £100 Stabila. This is a DIY newsgroup, some
people forget this.


That is true, but DIY does not automatically equate to cheapness,
inaccuracy and poor quality either in terms of tools and materials
used or the result.

But it certainly does not equate to day to day use in longevity. That should
be kept in mind.

IMM wrote:

Why I don't know , when better cheaper chars are available, Look at Toyota
and Honda.

ROFL!!!
ROFLMAO!!!

Speaking as someone who has owned a wide range of cars, including
Toyotas, Hondas and BMWs, and as someone who also does all their own car
work, I can tell you that the difference between BMWs and Toyotas/Hondas
is enormous, both in how they drive and how they are put together.

--
Grunff

IMM wrote:

But it certainly does not equate to day to day use in longevity. That should
be kept in mind.

Yes, but as has been pointed out many, many times in the past -
longevity is only one of the important properties. Performance and user
experience are at least as important. This is where cheap tools fall
down almost every time.

--
Grunff

R Taylor wrote:
I bought 4 props, TUV marked and identical to the 'expensive'
screwfix ones the 2 screw cases are better quality than the (far)

Inspired by this thread, looked up the nearest Lidl, drove to Leeds, found
they hadn't got any props, got directed to another store, they didn't either
:-( Nothing, nada, zip, of any worth in the useful practical items section.
Wasn't tempted by the "Eruption" aftershave either.
To compound things, seeing as I was in Leeds I thought I'd go to Ikea - on a
Saturday.

--
Toby.

'One day son, all this will be finished'

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 21:01:16 +0100, "IMM" strung
together this:

better cheaper chars are available, Look at Toyota
and Honda.

Do you do it on purpose?
--

SJW
A.C.S. Ltd

In article ,
IMM wrote:
All cars will get you from A to B at reasonable comfort, but some
are much more pleasant to drive than others.

Yeh, but people still insist on buying BMWs.

Why I don't know , when better cheaper chars are available, Look at
Toyota and Honda.

That should depress their sales, then.

--
*I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.