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Default The House the 50s Built

On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.
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In article ,
Grimly Curmudgeon writes:
On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


Cheers - caught the last 2 mins, so I'll flip over to 4+1 and watch it.

--
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On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 21:33:45 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:

On C4 right now, will watch again.


Doesn't look as if there is a repeat, recording on Ch4 + 1, missed
the first few minutes. Part 1 of 3 in the series.

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Dave.



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Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 21:33:45 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:

On C4 right now, will watch again.


Doesn't look as if there is a repeat, recording on Ch4 + 1, missed
the first few minutes. Part 1 of 3 in the series.



http://www.channel4.com/programmes/t...-50s-built/4od



--
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Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


When my great-grandmother got a twin-tub on HP she got
her brother-in-law to add another tap and drain in the
kitchen so she didn't have to drag it out and hook it
up to the sink. She still had it when she died in 1984.
My school girlfriend's parents inthe 1980s didn't have
a fridge.

And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.

JGH


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In article
,
jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.


My father - born around 1900 - washed and dried the lunchtime dishes every
single day. He also gave his unopened pay packet to mother every Friday.

My mother never went out to work, but looked after the home and kids. But
had full control over the family income and outgoings - father simply got
some pocket money.

I think they balanced out running the home pretty well between them -
mother certainly never complained. Of course these days when so often both
parents go to work (or both not) it's a different matter.

--
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Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.


My father - born around 1900 - washed and dried the lunchtime dishes every
single day. He also gave his unopened pay packet to mother every Friday.

My mother never went out to work, but looked after the home and kids. But
had full control over the family income and outgoings - father simply got
some pocket money.

I think they balanced out running the home pretty well between them -
mother certainly never complained. Of course these days when so often both
parents go to work (or both not) it's a different matter.

In the 60s Dad's salary, which was roughly the national average income,
paid the mortgage on a nice semi in a pleasant area with a reasonably
comfortable lifestyle for us (2 cars, washing machine and a TV.). Just
the mortgage payments on that house now would be a bit more than the
national average income, assuming the same percentage deposit.

Nowadays, in most areas, two incomes are needed just to keep up with the
bills, especially if there are children. I noticed a two bedroom flat in
Oxford being advertised at the weekend at a rent of about £15,000 per
year. £300(ish) per week sounds *so* much less...

Over the last few decades, wages haven't kept up with property prices.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.
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On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 15:03:50 -0700, jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went in the kitchen"
thing was.


The kitchen is for cleaning engine parts... everyone knows that!

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Dave Plowman wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was.


My father - born around 1900 - washed and dried the lunchtime dishes every
single day. He also gave his unopened pay packet to mother every Friday.


My great-uncle on my father's side was a batchelor for 95 years,
made very nice sponge cakes. My grandather (his brother-in-law)
was the complete opposite, expected my nanan to do everything.
When she had a stroke he got me & my dad to replace the gas
cooker with an electric one "because she can't manage the gas
any more". Never thought of doing the cooking himself. After
my nanan died I think he lived on toast and baked beans until
he enrolled on a home cooking course at college

On my mother's side my great-grandmother was widowed with a
two-week-old daughter in 1918, and worked full time for the
next 40 years, her brothers all knew how to cook, etc. My
grandmother and grandfather were both headteachers, and had
seven children and the oldest, boys as well as girls, had to
cook and keep house and look after the younger children, or
they'd go hungry and feel the back of her hand

JGH
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On Fri, 8 Jun 2012 01:29:57 +0000 (UTC), Jules Richardson
wrote:

On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 15:03:50 -0700, jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went in the kitchen"
thing was.


The kitchen is for cleaning engine parts... everyone knows that!


It's odd the number of blokes who would happily cook for themselves
and learned to sew, clean, mend kit, etc, in the forces, yet were
utterly handless when it came to doing it home. Some of that, of
course was role-playing, and territory and many women of that
generation resented the hubbie's presence in the kitchen.
Otoh, the number of males nowadays who know how to sew on a button or
mend a tear is vanishingly small. Fs, it's hardly rocket science.


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On 08/06/2012 01:25, John Williamson wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.


My father - born around 1900 - washed and dried the lunchtime dishes
every
single day. He also gave his unopened pay packet to mother every Friday.

My mother never went out to work, but looked after the home and kids. But
had full control over the family income and outgoings - father simply got
some pocket money.

I think they balanced out running the home pretty well between them -
mother certainly never complained. Of course these days when so often
both
parents go to work (or both not) it's a different matter.

In the 60s Dad's salary, which was roughly the national average income,
paid the mortgage on a nice semi in a pleasant area with a reasonably
comfortable lifestyle for us (2 cars, washing machine and a TV.). Just
the mortgage payments on that house now would be a bit more than the
national average income, assuming the same percentage deposit.

Nowadays, in most areas, two incomes are needed just to keep up with the
bills, especially if there are children. I noticed a two bedroom flat in
Oxford being advertised at the weekend at a rent of about £15,000 per
year. £300(ish) per week sounds *so* much less...

Over the last few decades, wages haven't kept up with property prices.


It's a complicated picture. For example, average first time buyer
price-income ratios haven't changed that much over the last 30 years
(c.7 London, 4 everywhere else). And property prices, taking into
account wild swings, have 'only' risen by about inflation since the mid-70s.

But increasingly 'averages' are a cold comfort to many.

Rob
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On Fri, 08 Jun 2012 04:26:40 +0100, Rob wrote:


It's a complicated picture. For example, average first time buyer
price-income ratios haven't changed that much over the last 30 years
(c.7 London, 4 everywhere else). And property prices, taking into
account wild swings, have 'only' risen by about inflation since the mid-70s.

But increasingly 'averages' are a cold comfort to many.

Rob


It is different though. Just prior to me buying in 1967 loans were frequently
limited to 2.5x a single salary. Under no circumstences would the Building
Society take my wife's earnings in to account. In the end I managed to get 3x
but it was touch and go, I vividly remember visiting the pay office and trying
to get a reluctant pay clerk to included my overtime, because without it I
couldn't borrow quite enough. In the end I won and got the £2700 I required.
We generally accepted such limitations, but once lending simply became a another
market place, prices increased.

Andy C.
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Grimly Curmudgeon wrote
Jules Richardson wrote
jgharston wrote


And I've always wondered how valid this
"men never went in the kitchen" thing was.


The kitchen is for cleaning engine parts... everyone knows that!


It's odd the number of blokes who would happily cook for
themselves and learned to sew, clean, mend kit, etc, in the
forces, yet were utterly handless when it came to doing it home.


Not really that odd at all.

Some of that, of course was role-playing, and territory


And just not bothering with stuff someone else is prepared to do.

and many women of that generation
resented the hubbie's presence in the kitchen.


Sure, fools abound.

Otoh, the number of males nowadays who know how
to sew on a button or mend a tear is vanishingly small.


I don't believe that with buttons.

Corse there are plenty who don't bother.

Plenty too stupid to do even the most basic
diy too, let alone stuff like build their own
house to save a hell of a lot of money etc.

Fs, it's hardly rocket science.


Sure, but that's true of basic diy too.
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On Jun 7, 9:33*pm, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.

People bought this stuff then (50s) in the (usually correct)
expectation that it would last a lifetime. (Often from the
electricity board.) They used to hire out stuff as well.



It was Hoover that first turned out the stuff for the masses. But it
was cheap ****. Back then I used to repair it.
The first automatic washing machine for the masses was was my
speciality.
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On Jun 8, 6:28*am, Andy Cap wrote:
On Fri, 08 Jun 2012 04:26:40 +0100, Rob wrote:
It's a complicated picture. For example, average first time buyer
price-income ratios haven't changed that much over the last 30 years
(c.7 London, 4 everywhere else). And property prices, taking into
account wild swings, have 'only' risen by about inflation since the mid-70s.


But increasingly 'averages' are a cold comfort to many.


Rob


It is different though. Just prior to me buying in 1967 loans were frequently
limited to 2.5x a single salary. Under no circumstences would the Building
Society take my wife's earnings in to account. In the end I managed to get 3x
but it was touch and go, I vividly remember visiting the pay office and trying
to get a reluctant pay clerk to included my overtime, because without it I
couldn't borrow quite enough. In the end I won and got the 2700 I required.
We generally accepted such limitations, but once lending simply became a another
market place, prices increased.


In 1987 I still had to hunt around before I could find someone willing
to give me a x2.5 mortgage at 100%. And if I hadn't been employed by
one of the largest companies in the area I don't think they even would
have let me through the door.

--
Halmyre


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On 08/06/2012 07:14, harry wrote:
On Jun 7, 9:33 pm, Grimly wrote:
On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.

People bought this stuff then (50s) in the (usually correct)
expectation that it would last a lifetime. (Often from the
electricity board.) They used to hire out stuff as well.



It was Hoover that first turned out the stuff for the masses. But it
was cheap ****. Back then I used to repair it.
The first automatic washing machine for the masses was was my
speciality.


The video clip is on Utube.

I am having a chuckle to myself now about the role reversal. My wife has
the auto everything in the kitchen even bread makers and probably some I
dont even know about.
Now me I am going backward as I do more DIY now than when I was younger.
So her life has got easier and mine harder. :-(
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harry wrote:
On Jun 7, 9:33 pm, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.

People bought this stuff then (50s) in the (usually correct)
expectation that it would last a lifetime. (Often from the
electricity board.) They used to hire out stuff as well.



It was Hoover that first turned out the stuff for the masses. But it
was cheap ****. Back then I used to repair it.
The first automatic washing machine for the masses was was my
speciality.


The Hoover Keymatic? We had one, which was a great education in how
automation could be implemented. It worked well for ages, until we ran
out of spare controllers, and later, microswitches for the controllers.
It helped that Dad was an electrical engineer.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.
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On Thu, 7 Jun 2012 23:14:49 -0700 (PDT) Harry wrote :
They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.


I think this is one of the extraordinary changes in recent times -
first mass production cars start of 20C; in my 1960s junior school
class only a handful of children came from car-owning families.
Colour TV, video, mobile phones, broadband have gone from being
technically exotic to mainstream within a decade or so.

--
Tony Bryer, Greentram: 'Software to build on',
Melbourne, Australia www.greentram.com

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On Friday, June 8, 2012 8:32:38 AM UTC+1, Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes I still don't have a dishwasher.

Brian


Just fitting a new kitchen. Not fitting a dish washer - wife does not want one, and from my experience you need none or two, since one is invariably full of clean plates, and then you have to quickly remove all these to do the next load.
There is a place one "could" go, with plumbing and drainage just behind the boxing of the soil pipe ... just in case.

Also I think we have just decided not to fit a waste disposal unit under the sink. Just under the sink is 4" drainage, so there's no problem with big-ish stuff going down there. Anything bigger should be composted, recycled etc. should it not (I am not particularly eco). This would not be the case if the sink drained to a grid outside. I am wondering how I can rig up a "flush" to wash the u-bend right through.
There will be a spare socket under the sink ... just in case.

Simon.


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In article ,
jgharston writes:
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


When my great-grandmother got a twin-tub on HP she got
her brother-in-law to add another tap and drain in the
kitchen so she didn't have to drag it out and hook it
up to the sink. She still had it when she died in 1984.


My grandmother had a separate washtub machine and spin
drier. I never saw the washtub used, and when she moved
in her 80's to be nearer mum, she didn't bring the washtub,
although the spin drier did come.

At that point, mum was taking and doing much of her washing,
but she did sometimes wash her things in the kitchen sink.
I once offered to get her a washing machine (she could well
have afforded one), and she said "No. What would I do whilst
I waited for it to finish?". A priceless comment from
another time and generation...

My school girlfriend's parents inthe 1980s didn't have
a fridge.


Grandparents had a gas fridge. The gas board converted it
to natural gas, but the pilot light was forever going out
after that. Grandfather eventually went into the gas board
offices, and kicked up a fuss until eventually they agreed
to buy them an electric fridge instead.

And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.


All the men in my family (back as far as I knew, my grandfather)
have been proficient cooks in the kitchen, not cooking as often
as their wives, but significantly nevertheless.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
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In article ,
Owain writes:
On Jun 7, 11:03*pm, jgharston wrote:
When my great-grandmother got a twin-tub on HP she got
her brother-in-law to add another tap and drain in the
kitchen so she didn't have to drag it out and hook it
up to the sink.

That's what's really needed to operate one efficiently. A floor drain
is also a good ideas as inevitably there are drips.
She still had it when she died in 1984.

Flats I moved into in 1988 and 1994 came with a twin-tub.


Hotpoint still had enough demand for their twin tub to keep
manufacturing it into the 1990's at least, and there's still
enough demand to keep a number of companies going refurbishing
and reselling them.

--
Andrew Gabriel
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In article ,
Jules Richardson writes:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 15:03:50 -0700, jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went in the kitchen"
thing was.


The kitchen is for cleaning engine parts... everyone knows that!


I was thinking that too, but I guess that probably took off more
in the 1960's and 1970's, than 1950's.

Those wipe-clean formica worktops would certainly have been easier
to clean than getting the engine oil off an wooden worktop of earlier
times;-)

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
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In article
,
harry wrote:
On Jun 7, 9:33 pm, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.


We were anything but wealthy - but had a washing machine in the early
'50s. A basic single tub Hoover. Most of my pals parents had too.

People bought this stuff then (50s) in the (usually correct)
expectation that it would last a lifetime. (Often from the
electricity board.) They used to hire out stuff as well.


Hiring wasn't common in Scotland. People had more sense.


It was Hoover that first turned out the stuff for the masses. But it
was cheap ****. Back then I used to repair it.
The first automatic washing machine for the masses was was my
speciality.


The original single tub Hoovers were well made. Their first twin tub not.
We had an AEG twin tub. Which lasted about 30 years with a few minor
repairs. My mother didn't want an automatic as they cost so much more to
run.

--
*Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article
,
jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.


My father - born around 1900 - washed and dried the lunchtime dishes every
single day. He also gave his unopened pay packet to mother every Friday.

My mother never went out to work, but looked after the home and kids. But
had full control over the family income and outgoings - father simply got
some pocket money.

I think they balanced out running the home pretty well between them -
mother certainly never complained. Of course these days when so often both
parents go to work (or both not) it's a different matter.


I agree.

SWMBO and myself have both had to work and when we were both in London, it
was a complete PITA - all it takes is one train to be delayed and you have
angry childcare person ringing...

We both switched to lower paid jobs - mine being at King's College very near
to Charing Cross (my terminal station) with 2 days working from home thrown
in - and SWMBO switched to working more locally - both of which has made a
huge difference.

But I do feel for the modern family - it's very difficult on a normal salary
to pay a mortgage...

It really is time the country adapted with better provision of pre and after
school clubs...

--
Tim Watts
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John Williamson wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went
in the kitchen" thing was. Most of my ancestors on my
mother's side were fishermen, and if you couldn't cook
you starved.


My father - born around 1900 - washed and dried the lunchtime dishes
every single day. He also gave his unopened pay packet to mother every
Friday.

My mother never went out to work, but looked after the home and kids. But
had full control over the family income and outgoings - father simply got
some pocket money.

I think they balanced out running the home pretty well between them -
mother certainly never complained. Of course these days when so often
both parents go to work (or both not) it's a different matter.

In the 60s Dad's salary, which was roughly the national average income,
paid the mortgage on a nice semi in a pleasant area with a reasonably
comfortable lifestyle for us (2 cars, washing machine and a TV.). Just
the mortgage payments on that house now would be a bit more than the
national average income, assuming the same percentage deposit.


Ditto - engineering civil service salary (not exactly massive) paid for a 3
bed semi with a 100' garden in a nice small town plus car.

If you compare house price inflation from the 60's to present, it far
outstrips the inflation on everything else.

--
Tim Watts
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In article om,
Rob wrote:
It's a complicated picture. For example, average first time buyer
price-income ratios haven't changed that much over the last 30 years
(c.7 London, 4 everywhere else). And property prices, taking into
account wild swings, have 'only' risen by about inflation since the
mid-70s.


I bought this house in the mid '70s as a first time buyer. Had to scrape
together a larger than minimum deposit as my salary as a (fairly junior)
BBC sound engineer wouldn't cover a maximum mortgage. So sold the car and
borrowed some from parents.

The same sort of house in this street is now selling for 80 times what I
paid.

If you used the same multiplier to my salary, a BBC sound engineer would
now be earning approx a quarter million a year. I'd guess the actual
figure these days is more like 40 grand.

--
*Wrinkled was not one of the things I wanted to be when I grew up

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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Tony Bryer wrote
Harry wrote


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.


I think this is one of the extraordinary changes in recent times -
first mass production cars start of 20C; in my 1960s junior school
class only a handful of children came from car-owning families.


Fark, cant remember any of mine from the 50s that didn't.

Colour TV, video, mobile phones, broadband have gone from
being technically exotic to mainstream within a decade or so.


Lot longer than that with the first few.
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Terry Fields wrote:


Did anyone enjoy the BBC's Transit of Venus programme?


Was that the program about converting at Ford into a luxurious passion
wagon?

Terry Fields



--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.


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Brian Gaff wrote

Yes I still don't have a dishwasher.


Bet you have a washing machine tho.


Grimly Curmudgeon wrote


On C4 right now, will watch again.
Turns out to be more interesting than I thought it would be - only one
thing, it makes out that as soon as the new gadgets came out, they
become commonplace - what a load of ******** that is.


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sm_jamieson wrote
Brian Gaff wrote


Yes I still don't have a dishwasher.


Just fitting a new kitchen. Not fitting a dish washer


Mad.

- wife does not want one,


Time for a new one of those.

and from my experience you need none or two,


Nope.

since one is invariably full of clean plates, and then you
have to quickly remove all these to do the next load.


I just replace the clean ones with dirty ones as they
are used and run it when there are no clean ones left.

Hardly rocket science.

There is a place one "could" go, with plumbing and drainage
just behind the boxing of the soil pipe ... just in case.


Also I think we have just decided not to
fit a waste disposal unit under the sink.


I don't bother with those, not enough waste to bother with.

Just under the sink is 4" drainage, so there's no
problem with big-ish stuff going down there.
Anything bigger should be composted, recycled etc.


Don't bother with that either with the kitchen stuff.

should it not (I am not particularly eco).


I'm not at all apart from growing my own veg
in the summer just because it tastes better.

This would not be the case if the sink drained to a grid
outside. I am wondering how I can rig up a "flush" to
wash the u-bend right through. There will be a spare
socket under the sink ... just in case.


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Rod Speed wrote:
Tony Bryer wrote
Harry wrote


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s.
It was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became
commonplace.


I think this is one of the extraordinary changes in recent times -
first mass production cars start of 20C; in my 1960s junior school
class only a handful of children came from car-owning families.


Fark, cant remember any of mine from the 50s that didn't.


In the UK, very few families owned cars even into the late 60s.

Colour TV, video, mobile phones, broadband have gone from being
technically exotic to mainstream within a decade or so.


Lot longer than that with the first few.


Colour TV was first broadcast here in 1967, and by the end of the 70s,
among people that I knew, about 90% had a colour set. There was an
immediate obvious benefit from colour. Admittedly, it was invented in
the 1920s, but it didn't leave the laboratory until long after that.

Video recording took 30? years from the first industrial models to the
first domestic models, then another 15 until the format wars between
Betamax and VHS. Home videos didn't really take off here until the
killer application of being able to watch a movie at home became
possible with the advent of 3 hour tapes and video rental shops, then,
within five years, almost everybody had a video recorder or player.

The first cellphones were introduced here in 1985, and by 1988, I was
the first coach driver in London to have one, and that situatrion lasted
a year or so, then in the early 90s, I was driving groups round with a
dozen or so phones in a group of 40 people. Nowadays, within 20 years,
it's common for passengers on the coach to text each other rather than
talk, and there are more mobile phones in use than there are people in
the UK. I've even had texts from someone at the back of the coach asking
me to turn the heating up.

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In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
Those wipe-clean formica worktops would certainly have been easier
to clean than getting the engine oil off an wooden worktop of earlier
times;-)


Or later trends. ;-)

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John Williamson wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Tony Bryer wrote
Harry wrote


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s. It was
not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became commonplace.


I think this is one of the extraordinary changes in recent times - first
mass production cars start of 20C; in my 1960s junior school class only
a handful of children came from car-owning families.


Fark, cant remember any of mine from the 50s that didn't.


In the UK, very few families owned cars even into the late 60s.


I find that rather hard to believe given the sales of the minor and mini
etc.

Colour TV, video, mobile phones, broadband have gone from being
technically exotic to mainstream within a decade or so.


Lot longer than that with the first few.


Colour TV was first broadcast here in 1967, and by the end of the 70s,
among people that I knew, about 90% had a colour set.


And that's about 35 years.

There was an immediate obvious benefit from colour. Admittedly, it was
invented in the 1920s, but it didn't leave the laboratory until long after
that.


Sure, I was talking about mainstream, not invention.

Video recording took 30? years from the first industrial models to the
first domestic models,


They were pretty common in the 70s here.

then another 15 until the format wars between Betamax and VHS. Home videos
didn't really take off here until the killer application of being able to
watch a movie at home became possible with the advent of 3 hour tapes and
video rental shops, then, within five years, almost everybody had a video
recorder or player.


And that was well before a decade ago too.

The first cellphones were introduced here in 1985, and by 1988, I was the
first coach driver in London to have one, and that situatrion lasted a
year or so, then in the early 90s, I was driving groups round with a dozen
or so phones in a group of 40 people.


And that's 20 years ago.

Nowadays, within 20 years, it's common for passengers on the coach to
text each other rather than talk, and there are more mobile phones in use
than there are people in the UK. I've even had texts from someone at the
back of the coach asking me to turn the heating up.


How do they know your number ?



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Rod Speed wrote:
John Williamson wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Tony Bryer wrote
Harry wrote


They were the playthings of the relatively wealthy in the 1950s. It
was not until the 1960s that all theses appliances became commonplace.


I think this is one of the extraordinary changes in recent times -
first mass production cars start of 20C; in my 1960s junior school
class only a handful of children came from car-owning families.


Fark, cant remember any of mine from the 50s that didn't.


In the UK, very few families owned cars even into the late 60s.


I find that rather hard to believe given the sales of the minor and mini
etc.

Shrug If you will insist on believing the marketing talk...

Colour TV, video, mobile phones, broadband have gone from being
technically exotic to mainstream within a decade or so.


Lot longer than that with the first few.


Colour TV was first broadcast here in 1967, and by the end of the 70s,
among people that I knew, about 90% had a colour set.


And that's about 35 years.

? First broadcast to 90% ownership was a *lot* less than 35 years.

then another 15 until the format wars between Betamax and VHS. Home
videos didn't really take off here until the killer application of
being able to watch a movie at home became possible with the advent of
3 hour tapes and video rental shops, then, within five years, almost
everybody had a video recorder or player.


And that was well before a decade ago too.

The first cellphones were introduced here in 1985, and by 1988, I was
the first coach driver in London to have one, and that situatrion
lasted a year or so, then in the early 90s, I was driving groups round
with a dozen or so phones in a group of 40 people.


And that's 20 years ago.

Your point being what, exactly? The point you were answering was that
these tchnologies all became common within a few years of being
introduced to the mass market.

Nowadays, within 20 years, it's common for passengers on the coach to
text each other rather than talk, and there are more mobile phones in
use than there are people in the UK. I've even had texts from someone
at the back of the coach asking me to turn the heating up.


How do they know your number ?


Because, as part of the customer service procedure on tours, I told 'em.
Except that it's not *my* number, it's a company number.

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On 6/7/2012 11:22 PM, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Fri, 8 Jun 2012 01:29:57 +0000 (UTC), Jules Richardson
wrote:

On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 15:03:50 -0700, jgharston wrote:
And I've always wondered how valid this "men never went in the kitchen"
thing was.


The kitchen is for cleaning engine parts... everyone knows that!


It's odd the number of blokes who would happily cook for themselves
and learned to sew, clean, mend kit, etc, in the forces, yet were
utterly handless when it came to doing it home. Some of that, of
course was role-playing, and territory and many women of that
generation resented the hubbie's presence in the kitchen.
Otoh, the number of males nowadays who know how to sew on a button or
mend a tear is vanishingly small. Fs, it's hardly rocket science.


The number of _women_ who know how to sew on a button is vanishingly
small, too.
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Halmyre wrote:
On Jun 8, 6:28 am, Andy Cap wrote:
On Fri, 08 Jun 2012 04:26:40 +0100, Rob wrote:
It's a complicated picture. For example, average first time buyer
price-income ratios haven't changed that much over the last 30 years
(c.7 London, 4 everywhere else). And property prices, taking into
account wild swings, have 'only' risen by about inflation since the mid-70s.


But increasingly 'averages' are a cold comfort to many.


Rob


It is different though. Just prior to me buying in 1967 loans were frequently
limited to 2.5x a single salary. Under no circumstences would the Building
Society take my wife's earnings in to account. In the end I managed to get 3x
but it was touch and go, I vividly remember visiting the pay office and trying
to get a reluctant pay clerk to included my overtime, because without it I
couldn't borrow quite enough. In the end I won and got the 2700 I required.
We generally accepted such limitations, but once lending simply became a another
market place, prices increased.


In 1987 I still had to hunt around before I could find someone willing
to give me a x2.5 mortgage at 100%. And if I hadn't been employed by
one of the largest companies in the area I don't think they even would
have let me through the door.


I needed a 95% mortgage in 1982. The BS was good enough to recognise that a
student taking the course that I was on had a high probability of getting a
good job.

House price inflation at the time meant that after three years the mortgage
was less than 1/3 rd of the sale value. Happy days.
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harry wrote:

It was Hoover that first turned out the stuff for the masses. But it
was cheap ****. Back then I used to repair it.
The first automatic washing machine for the masses was was my
speciality.


The first AWM for the masses was Bendix, not Hoover.
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In article ,
John Williamson wrote:
Fark, cant remember any of mine from the 50s that didn't.


In the UK, very few families owned cars even into the late 60s.


If you made that the '50s, maybe. By the '60s, the average family did have
a car.

Colour TV, video, mobile phones, broadband have gone from being
technically exotic to mainstream within a decade or so.


Lot longer than that with the first few.


Colour TV was first broadcast here in 1967, and by the end of the 70s,
among people that I knew, about 90% had a colour set. There was an
immediate obvious benefit from colour. Admittedly, it was invented in
the 1920s, but it didn't leave the laboratory until long after that.


Video recording took 30? years from the first industrial models to the
first domestic models, then another 15 until the format wars between
Betamax and VHS. Home videos didn't really take off here until the
killer application of being able to watch a movie at home became
possible with the advent of 3 hour tapes and video rental shops, then,
within five years, almost everybody had a video recorder or player.


Pro VTRs became practical in the late '50s. The first domestic cassette
VCR was the Philips N1500, introduced in '72. But there were reel to reel
domestic machines before that. Snag was the limited playing time and of
course cost. VHS had all but won the format wars by about '80 (in the UK)
so it was more like 25, not 45 years, from the first mainstream use of
videotape to VHS being the standard.

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