A DIY & home improvement forum. DIYbanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » DIYbanter forum » Do - it - Yourself » UK diy
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions.

Trianco Boiler Cutting Out Constantly



 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old December 14th 04, 11:24 PM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Question Trianco Boiler Cutting Out Constantly

Hi

I have a trianco eurotrader boiler, in a external boiler house. I had the oil pump, motor and photocell replaced approx one month ago after the boiler wouldn't work. Since then the boiler has continued to trip every once and a while. Now it it tripping after a couple of minutes. I have had a look at the forum and have taken the plug out of the water pump to see if it is turning - it is turning but I can't see if it is pumping alot of water. Should alot of water come out of this hole when the pump is running and the plug is out? If I press the button on the trip the boiler fires up and works for a short period then trip again. Any help is appreciated as I have already spent 190 on the above items and am weary of the person who fixed the boiler. I don't know whether to believe him or not.

cheers
Ads
  #2  
Old December 15th 04, 12:45 PM
John
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"technics100" wrote in message
...

Hi

I have a trianco eurotrader boiler, in a external boiler house. I had
the oil pump, motor and photocell replaced approx one month ago after
the boiler wouldn't work. Since then the boiler has continued to trip
every once and a while. Now it it tripping after a couple of minutes.
I have had a look at the forum and have taken the plug out of the water
pump to see if it is turning - it is turning but I can't see if it is
pumping alot of water. Should alot of water come out of this hole when
the pump is running and the plug is out? If I press the button on the
trip the boiler fires up and works for a short period then trip again.
Any help is appreciated as I have already spent 190 on the above items
and am weary of the person who fixed the boiler. I don't know whether
to believe him or not.


Is the oil supply restricted by a blocked oil filter or a mostly closed
valve?
Is the fuel contaminated with water?
If its tripping the lockout on the burner it will not be the heated water
system which is causing it.
Which make of burner is fitted to the boiler since Trianco use several types
such as Riello, Inter-oil, RDB, Monoflame etc etc. Certainly if you have
already had a new motor, oil pump, and photocell there is a limited number
of possible other alternatives provided the parts fitted were new.
Can you describe exactly what happens step by step from starting to lockout
along with the timing.
As a guide the burner motor should start to rotate, run for a few seconds
driving the fan to purge the combustion chamber clear with fresh air, The
ignition spark will commence and then the oil solenoid valve will open
usually with an audible click. At this point you should hear the flame
ignite. The light of the flame will illuminate the photocell which informs
the sequence control box it is healthy. The ignition spark stops and the
burner continues to run until the thermostat is satisfied or the power is
removed. If no flame light is seen within about 10 seconds the burner stops
and the sequence control goes to lockout. This varies but it will not reset
straight away on most sequence controllers, requiring a few minutes to allow
an internal timer to reset


  #3  
Old December 15th 04, 10:25 PM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Default

Is the oil supply restricted by a blocked oil filter or a mostly closed
valve?
Is the fuel contaminated with water?
If its tripping the lockout on the burner it will not be the heated water
system which is causing it.
Which make of burner is fitted to the boiler since Trianco use several types
such as Riello, Inter-oil, RDB, Monoflame etc etc. Certainly if you have
already had a new motor, oil pump, and photocell there is a limited number
of possible other alternatives provided the parts fitted were new.
Can you describe exactly what happens step by step from starting to lockout
along with the timing.
As a guide the burner motor should start to rotate, run for a few seconds
driving the fan to purge the combustion chamber clear with fresh air, The
ignition spark will commence and then the oil solenoid valve will open
usually with an audible click. At this point you should hear the flame
ignite. The light of the flame will illuminate the photocell which informs
the sequence control box it is healthy. The ignition spark stops and the
burner continues to run until the thermostat is satisfied or the power is
removed. If no flame light is seen within about 10 seconds the burner stops
and the sequence control goes to lockout. This varies but it will not reset
straight away on most sequence controllers, requiring a few minutes to allow
an internal timer to reset[/quote]


The boiler does everything as you describe and will run from cold until it get hot and then it seems to trip. It trips a transparent box which lights amber, I just press the button in the middle of this box and the light goes out, the boiler starts and runs until it trips again. trips sooner when its hot

I was reading this forum and around the net and thought that the central heating pump wasn't pumping the hot water away from the boiler quick enough thus causing it to trip. I left the boiler on a very low temp setting all day and it has been running fine for approx 14hrs. Is there any way to check the pump, to make sure its pumping at the right speed. its a Grundfos UPS15-50. Any suggestion is appreciated.

cheers
  #4  
Old December 16th 04, 01:11 PM
John
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"technics100" wrote in message
...


SNIP


The boiler does everything as you describe and will run from cold until
it get hot and then it seems to trip. It trips a transparent box which
lights amber, I just press the button in the middle of this box and the
light goes out, the boiler starts and runs until it trips again. trips
sooner when its hot


Thr transparent box will probably say Sartronic 830 or something similar on
it and this is the sequence control which operates the burner and monitors
the flame when a heat demand is present. You still haven't told me what make
the burner is but using a Sartronic suggests you may have an Inter-Oil
burner unit with a Danfoss oil pump (the black block thing with the oil pipe
going in). If you do then depending on the age it will probably have a
solenoid coil mounted on a shaft. One fairly common failure mode found of
late is for these coils to go open circuit when hot but remake when cooled
by an indeterminate amount taking anything from a couple of minutes to
several hours for the problem to occur. Its sheer indeterminate period often
makes it very difficult to pin down. Other makes of fuel pump are also used
so all I can reiterate is please give full details of your burner and oil
pump etc. BTW have you checked the oil filter yet and was there any coating
of sediment/muck on the element?


I was reading this forum and around the net and thought that the central
heating pump wasn't pumping the hot water away from the boiler quick
enough thus causing it to trip. I left the boiler on a very low temp
setting all day and it has been running fine for approx 14hrs. Is there
any way to check the pump, to make sure its pumping at the right speed.
its a Grundfos UPS15-50. Any suggestion is appreciated.


Not all boilers have an overheat trip and in general all the overheat trip
will do is remove all power from the boiler panel thus "usually" the power
on light and others are simply dead along with the boiler until the overheat
stat is manually reset. The lockout button has no connection with the
thermostat system. This does suggest howver that the burner will fire for
shorter run periods and whatever is causing the lockouts is not getting the
same energised periods and avoiding the thermal effects.



  #5  
Old December 16th 04, 07:15 PM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Default

Hi

The sequential control is indeed a Sartronic 830, I dont know where the burner is, The oil pump is Danfoss Type BFP 11LS, the motor is bentone with a box above it which is Danfoss Type EBI.

Where is the oil filter and how do I check it? also how do I check for contanination in the oil? Where is the solenoid?

sorry about all the questions but I am new to this.

cheers for your help
  #6  
Old December 17th 04, 05:48 PM
John
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"technics100" wrote in message
...

Hi

The sequential control is indeed a Sartronic 830, I dont know where the
burner is, The oil pump is Danfoss Type BFP 11LS, the motor is bentone
with a box above it which is Danfoss Type EBI.


The EB1 electronic ignition generator could be a prime suspect especially
with thermal effects being suspected. Since you said in an earlier post the
oil pump was new this should be out of the loop for tracking this fault.
Presumably the motor capacitor is integral with the motor but if not this is
another possible option especially if you can watch the unit for some time
and maybe catch it being sluggish to start the motor spinning.

Where is the oil filter and how do I check it? also how do I check for
contanination in the oil? Where is the solenoid?


The solenoid is the bit with the flex connected to it on the oil pump
discharge. The oil filter is usually on the outlet from the oil tank but
sometimes inside the house or boiler casing. To carry out a basic check on
the fuel system try shutting the oil supply valve, disconnect the oil pipe
from the pump, put the end into a clear (clean) bottle at least 2 litres,
turn on the oil and run about 1.5 litres of oil in to check that it flows
freely and fast enough to satisfy a usage rate of about 5 or 6 litres per
hour for every 1000 BTU of boiler rating.
Turn off and restore the connections.
Allow the sample in the bottle to stand and look to see if you can see any
water lying in the bottom of the bottle (under the fuel) or any debris of
any kind. Then dip a small piece of rag into the liquied, take it outside
and light it in a safe place. If it burns easily you should be ok on that
front.

sorry about all the questions but I am new to this.

cheers for your help


--
technics100



  #7  
Old December 17th 04, 10:41 PM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Default

I had the boiler guy out today to have a look at it. He said that the oil had water in it, but couldn't see where it was getting in. The oil line runs underground for a few meters, so it may have a hole in it and be taking in water. He replaced the jet and said it was soaked with water. Boiler is running now, but I just have to find out where the water is getting in.
  #8  
Old December 17th 04, 11:26 PM
Rod Hewitt
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

technics100 wrote in
:


I had the boiler guy out today to have a look at it. He said that the
oil had water in it, but couldn't see where it was getting in. The oil
line runs underground for a few meters, so it may have a hole in it and
be taking in water. He replaced the jet and said it was soaked with
water. Boiler is running now, but I just have to find out where the
water is getting in.


Condensation within the storage tank? Seems more likely than water pushing
its way into a pipe.

--
Rod

www.annalaurie.co.uk
  #9  
Old December 18th 04, 08:09 AM
John
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"technics100" wrote in message
...

I had the boiler guy out today to have a look at it. He said that the
oil had water in it, but couldn't see where it was getting in. The oil
line runs underground for a few meters, so it may have a hole in it and
be taking in water. He replaced the jet and said it was soaked with
water. Boiler is running now, but I just have to find out where the
water is getting in.

Very unlikely to be entering against the pressure of oil within the pipe!
The usual place for water to get in to oil is via the top of the tank which
someone has stood upon causing the "dishing" to collect rainwater which
eventually rust through. Other places possible are sight gauges which have
lost their rain cap and are located under a leaking gutter, tank lids which
fit poorly and are under a leaking gutter also.
Is your tank located where someone you could have upset might find it
entertaining to put a hose into it?
Its a very remote possibility that you might have had a contaminated load
delivered but I'd put this a long way behind any other sources.
If your tank is set up correctly it should slope away from the outlet and
have a drain at the low end. If you have one, run some off from here into a
bucket and check visually and by dipping a bit of cloth for a burnability
test for water ( I went to a tank last year which had been vandalised and
found clear liquid for a depth of about 200mm but it wouldn't burn, after a
lot of draining off this underlying water eventually fuel arrived). Its
often possible to get rid of any water collected in the tank via this
method, in fact in days of old it was normal to do this as part of a six
monthly service, usually blaming water found on condensation rather than the
real source of refinery contamination. Modern production and storage methods
have all but stopped water being delivered in the fuel.


  #10  
Old December 22nd 04, 10:27 AM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2004
Posts: 10
Default

FAO John

Please Help

A new jet was put into the boiler on Friday and it was working fine until monday when it tripped. I then syphoned oil from the bottom of thetank to see if there was water in it. There wasn't. Since then it has started to trip more and more often. now it only runs for 15-30 mins and then trips. The boiler guy said its definitly getting water mixed with it. There is no water at the bottom of the tank. what do I do next? The tank is plastic...

cheers
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Trianco boiler problems dmc UK diy 2 December 11th 04 06:55 PM
Help me experts - my central heating / boiler is waking us up ! Blonks UK diy 4 March 31st 04 01:34 AM
Near death boiler + replacing a boiler David Hearn UK diy 9 January 26th 04 12:44 PM
Boiler cutting out a_mcbride UK diy 6 December 19th 03 12:34 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.SEO by vBSEO ©2010, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2004-2014 DIYbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.