Hi
I've just installed an bathroom, using a newly-installed internal soil
stack, with a dergo valve to ventilate the soil stack, located in the
bathroom next to the loo/bath, behind an access panel (as directed by
the groundwork company who recently fitted the new soil pipe for me).

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo? He's expecting the Dergo still to be there when I've
finished; why? If the soil stack is open to the air, then what's the
Dergo for?

In due course I'm fitting another bathroom, which will share the same
soil stack (ie with two toilets) - which is on the BC application too
- does that have anything to do with it?

Obviously I need to go back to the BCO and find out exactly what I
need to do (and it doesn't sound too drastic); but I'd just like to
know what I'm talking about first!

Thanks
David

"Lobster" wrote in message
om...
Hi
I've just installed an bathroom, using a newly-installed internal soil
stack, with a dergo valve to ventilate the soil stack, located in the
bathroom next to the loo/bath, behind an access panel (as directed by
the groundwork company who recently fitted the new soil pipe for me).

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo? He's expecting the Dergo still to be there when I've
finished; why? If the soil stack is open to the air, then what's the
Dergo for?

In due course I'm fitting another bathroom, which will share the same
soil stack (ie with two toilets) - which is on the BC application too
- does that have anything to do with it?

Obviously I need to go back to the BCO and find out exactly what I
need to do (and it doesn't sound too drastic); but I'd just like to
know what I'm talking about first!

You require an open vent stack at the 4th or 5th house, the end of run, like
end of a cul-de-sec. Find out from the council, before you do what he says.
If he is making you do something that is unnecessary show he the regs. Some
BCOs are way behind in some fields.

Check out http://www.hepworthplumbing.co.uk and go to HepVO. Use these
traps on all appliances and all is fine: no open stack needed. Hepworth
will help you with the regs and give you details to give to the BCO.

"IMM" wrote in message ...
"Lobster" wrote in message
om...
Hi
I've just installed an bathroom, using a newly-installed internal soil
stack, with a dergo valve to ventilate the soil stack, located in the
bathroom next to the loo/bath, behind an access panel (as directed by
the groundwork company who recently fitted the new soil pipe for me).

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo? He's expecting the Dergo still to be there when I've
finished; why? If the soil stack is open to the air, then what's the
Dergo for?

In due course I'm fitting another bathroom, which will share the same
soil stack (ie with two toilets) - which is on the BC application too
- does that have anything to do with it?

Obviously I need to go back to the BCO and find out exactly what I
need to do (and it doesn't sound too drastic); but I'd just like to
know what I'm talking about first!

You require an open vent stack at the 4th or 5th house, the end of run, like
end of a cul-de-sec. Find out from the council, before you do what he says.
If he is making you do something that is unnecessary show he the regs. Some
BCOs are way behind in some fields.

Thanks - yes sounds the same info I got from the groundwork guys, as
being the reason why we didn't need an open vent: because it's a
mid-terrace and the houses on both sides have open soil stacks. SWMBO
pointed this out to the BCO when he inspected, but he said we still
needed an open vent in our property. Sounds iffy to me!

Will play this one by ear I think; sounds like a relatively trivial
alteration and I really don't want to **** the guy off by
second-guessing him, as I really need to stay on good terms with him
for what's coming next (readers may remember my posts of a few weeks
back asking about running the soil from house A into the internal soil
stack of house B!)

David

I must admit I have fallen into requiring each property had a natural vented
SVP, when really it should be every 4th property and head of run (but won't
in future).

However I always insist on an air test on the new plumbing with the
AAV/Durgo in position, as we have found they do leak (foul) air out.

RT




"Lobster" wrote in message
om...
"IMM" wrote in message
...
"Lobster" wrote in message
om...
Hi
I've just installed an bathroom, using a newly-installed internal soil
stack, with a dergo valve to ventilate the soil stack, located in the
bathroom next to the loo/bath, behind an access panel (as directed by
the groundwork company who recently fitted the new soil pipe for me).

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo? He's expecting the Dergo still to be there when I've
finished; why? If the soil stack is open to the air, then what's the
Dergo for?

In due course I'm fitting another bathroom, which will share the same
soil stack (ie with two toilets) - which is on the BC application too
- does that have anything to do with it?

Obviously I need to go back to the BCO and find out exactly what I
need to do (and it doesn't sound too drastic); but I'd just like to
know what I'm talking about first!

You require an open vent stack at the 4th or 5th house, the end of run,
like
end of a cul-de-sec. Find out from the council, before you do what he
says.
If he is making you do something that is unnecessary show he the regs.
Some
BCOs are way behind in some fields.

Thanks - yes sounds the same info I got from the groundwork guys, as
being the reason why we didn't need an open vent: because it's a
mid-terrace and the houses on both sides have open soil stacks. SWMBO
pointed this out to the BCO when he inspected, but he said we still
needed an open vent in our property. Sounds iffy to me!

Will play this one by ear I think; sounds like a relatively trivial
alteration and I really don't want to **** the guy off by
second-guessing him, as I really need to stay on good terms with him
for what's coming next (readers may remember my posts of a few weeks
back asking about running the soil from house A into the internal soil
stack of house B!)

David

Lobster wrote:

Hi
I've just installed an bathroom, using a newly-installed internal soil
stack, with a dergo valve to ventilate the soil stack, located in the
bathroom next to the loo/bath, behind an access panel (as directed by
the groundwork company who recently fitted the new soil pipe for me).

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo? He's expecting the Dergo still to be there when I've
finished; why? If the soil stack is open to the air, then what's the
Dergo for?

In due course I'm fitting another bathroom, which will share the same
soil stack (ie with two toilets) - which is on the BC application too
- does that have anything to do with it?

Obviously I need to go back to the BCO and find out exactly what I
need to do (and it doesn't sound too drastic); but I'd just like to
know what I'm talking about first!


Dergos and vents serve two different purposes. The durgo is there to
stop suction emptying nearby traps. The stack is there to vent off
poitive pressure noxious gasses.

The posituve pressure vent need not be fast acting, and so is allowed to
be I think as small as 2" diameter. The negative pressure stuff needs to
act fast in a flush, and so is normally full bore to the vent or durgo.





Thanks
David

"River Tramp" wrote in message
. ..

I must admit I have fallen into requiring each property had a natural
vented
SVP, when really it should be every 4th property and head of run (but
won't
in future).

However I always insist on an air test on the new plumbing with the
AAV/Durgo in position, as we have found they do leak (foul) air out.

HepVo traps are the better option, dispensing with Durgos (air admittance
valve) and their bulk.

"Lobster" wrote in message
om...
"IMM" wrote in message
...
"Lobster" wrote in message
om...
Hi
I've just installed an bathroom, using a newly-installed internal
soil
stack, with a dergo valve to ventilate the soil stack, located in
the
bathroom next to the loo/bath, behind an access panel (as directed
by
the groundwork company who recently fitted the new soil pipe for
me).

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can
be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo? He's expecting the Dergo still to be there when I've
finished; why? If the soil stack is open to the air, then what's
the
Dergo for?

In due course I'm fitting another bathroom, which will share the
same
soil stack (ie with two toilets) - which is on the BC application
too
- does that have anything to do with it?

Obviously I need to go back to the BCO and find out exactly what I
need to do (and it doesn't sound too drastic); but I'd just like to
know what I'm talking about first!

You require an open vent stack at the 4th or 5th house, the end of
run,
like
end of a cul-de-sec. Find out from the council, before you do what he
says.
If he is making you do something that is unnecessary show he the regs.
Some
BCOs are way behind in some fields.

Thanks - yes sounds the same info I got from the groundwork guys, as
being the reason why we didn't need an open vent: because it's a
mid-terrace and the houses on both sides have open soil stacks. SWMBO
pointed this out to the BCO when he inspected, but he said we still
needed an open vent in our property. Sounds iffy to me!

Will play this one by ear I think; sounds like a relatively trivial
alteration and I really don't want to **** the guy off by
second-guessing him, as I really need to stay on good terms with him
for what's coming next (readers may remember my posts of a few weeks
back asking about running the soil from house A into the internal soil
stack of house B!)

David

On 13 Feb 2004 05:36:13 -0800, a particular chimpanzee named
(Lobster) randomly hit the keyboard and
produced:

The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo?

An air-admittance valve ("Durgo" is a trade name) can be used in lieu
of an open stack for a single house, if the drain connects to a vented
common drain or sewer.

The BBA certificate for Durgo says, "To contribute to the ventilation
of the underground drain and to minimise the effects of excessive back
pressures when a drain blockage occurs, the branch or main drain
serving a stack or stacks fitted with Durgo valves may require venting
at a point upstream of the stack connection. For guidance the
following should be noted (see Figure 5):
(a) For up to and including four dwellings, 1, 2, or 3 storeys in
height, additional drain venting is not required. Where a drain serves
more than four such dwellings equipped with the valve, the drain
should be vented according to the following rule, either by a
conventional open-topped ventilating stack or discharge stack:
5 to 10 such dwellings — conventional ventilation to be provided at
the head of the system
11 to 20 such dwellings — conventional ventilation to be provided at
the mid-point and at the head of the system".
(BBA Certificate 97/3427 http://www.bbacerts.co.uk/certs/34/3427.html)
--
Hugo Nebula
"The fact that no-one on the internet wants a piece of this
shows you just how far you've strayed from the pack".

Hugo Nebula wrote:

On 13 Feb 2004 05:36:13 -0800, a particular chimpanzee named
(Lobster) randomly hit the keyboard and
produced:


The BCO came to sign this off yesterday - unfortunately I wasn't
there, but he said it was currently inadequate. Because I'd used a
Dergo valve I apparently need to install a separate vent pipe (can be
narrower than a 4" soil pipe) up through the roof, open to the air.
This has confused me because why do I need both an open pipe as well
as a Dergo?


An air-admittance valve ("Durgo" is a trade name) can be used in lieu
of an open stack for a single house, if the drain connects to a vented
common drain or sewer.

The BBA certificate for Durgo says, "To contribute to the ventilation
of the underground drain and to minimise the effects of excessive back
pressures when a drain blockage occurs, the branch or main drain
serving a stack or stacks fitted with Durgo valves may require venting
at a point upstream of the stack connection. For guidance the
following should be noted (see Figure 5):
(a) For up to and including four dwellings, 1, 2, or 3 storeys in
height, additional drain venting is not required. Where a drain serves
more than four such dwellings equipped with the valve, the drain
should be vented according to the following rule, either by a
conventional open-topped ventilating stack or discharge stack:
5 to 10 such dwellings -- conventional ventilation to be provided at
the head of the system
11 to 20 such dwellings -- conventional ventilation to be provided at
the mid-point and at the head of the system".



Point of information.
A rond tuit came home to roost this week, adn yes, not 2 bathroom was
deemed to be teh target of 'when are you going to sort that out' ....

To cut a long story short, the loo came out completely,, and had a
lastic bag taped over the soil stack to keep the pongs down.

Every time i empty the bath (this on a vented stack by the way) the bag
first bulges out under positive pressure, then gets sucked in by
negative pressure. Quite a bit in both cases. I weould point out that te
stack this is all conneceted too has a 3" pipe about 10m long venting
down the back of the house, and the bath waste joins it below the loo pipe.

The basin trap - coupled to the bath waste - gurgles as well.

I was surprised at the pressure changes. With a durgo, there might well
be enough local pressure build up to pop the odd trap.

Vent your stacks guys. Even if teh regs say you don't need to.



(BBA Certificate 97/3427 http://www.bbacerts.co.uk/certs/34/3427.html)

On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 10:38:58 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:


A rond tuit came home to roost this week, adn yes, not 2 bathroom was
deemed to be teh target of 'when are you going to sort that out' ....


A question here.

Is it generic or is it just me that when you eventually get started on
such a tuit, that about half an hour into it, another tuit becomes
more important and one gets diverted onto that?



..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Andy Hall wrote:

On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 10:38:58 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:



A rond tuit came home to roost this week, adn yes, not 2 bathroom was
deemed to be teh target of 'when are you going to sort that out' ....



A question here.

Is it generic or is it just me that when you eventually get started on
such a tuit, that about half an hour into it, another tuit becomes
more important and one gets diverted onto that?



Generic. shes now started gazing at 'net pictures of giant baths with a
huge price tag for the 4th bathroom. The BIG ONE.



.andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl