Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things rather than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things rather than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

Cheers, T i m

"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

How long before you can just print new brat or pet when one gets run over
etc.

Or print a new wife when you've worn the old one out ?

On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 09:20:08 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"T i m" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

How long before you can just print new brat or pet when one gets run over
etc.

Or print a new wife when you've worn the old one out ?

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?
Any ideas?




--

Graham.

%Profound_observation%

On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 00:36:10 +0000, Graham.
wrote:

snip

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?

Well, I am ok with it because I can understand how the mechanics place
a layer of something using an xy axis, just like most other
(Cartesian, as opposed to Delta) printers do but these also have the z
(height) axis?

Any ideas?

Well I think the formal name for the process is 'Additive
Manufacturing' but as you say there isn't anything other than plain
'3D printing' (as opposed to 'printing') that people use.

You are right though, I've had to answer the 'I don't understand why
it's called 3D printing because it's not actually printing' comment
quite a few times. I guess it's because they may not know how a 2D
printer works to realise just how close a 3D printer is mechanically
(conceptually)?

In a similar way they don't seem to be aware not all tablets are
'iPads'? 'Yes, I've got a Samsung iPad ...'?

Cheers, T i m

"Graham." wrote in message
...
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 09:20:08 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"T i m" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things
rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

How long before you can just print new brat or pet when one gets run over
etc.

Or print a new wife when you've worn the old one out ?

Do you agree that we need a better word
than printer for these futuristic machines?

Sort of, but 3D printer isnt too bad.

Any ideas?

Fraid not, I'm completely hopeless at that sort of thing.

I can recognise good ones, but am completely hopeless
at inventing new ones. My domain name is the best I
have ever managed, quick and easy, instantly memorable,
no one has ever forgotten what it is, and not already in
use which is a very difficult problem with domain names.

On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 00:36:10 +0000, Graham. wrote:

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?

Not really. It's pretty much exactly what they're doing, just using
really, really thick ink.

On 10/02/2016 08:07, Adrian wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 00:36:10 +0000, Graham. wrote:

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?

Not really. It's pretty much exactly what they're doing, just using
really, really thick ink.


Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I see, well sure beats the inflatable church...
Brian

"Adam Aglionby" wrote in message
...
Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!

On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 00:36:35 UTC, Graham. wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 09:20:08 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"T i m" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

How long before you can just print new brat or pet when one gets run over
etc.

Or print a new wife when you've worn the old one out ?

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?
Any ideas?

Replicator would do me.


I have a theory that stonehenge and the pyramids were 3D printed by aliens :-)

stuart noble wrote:

Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I wonder how strong the structure is? There doesn't seem to be
any reinforcement.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 11:16:05 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

stuart noble wrote:

Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I wonder how strong the structure is? There doesn't seem to be
any reinforcement.

I was looking at that as well, wondering if they put conventional ties
in between the inner and outer walls (and they could fairly easily),
or, if the materiel used didn't carry moisture when set, they could be
printed in from the bottom up (looking like hollow concrete blocks).

Cheers, T i m

I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way from
doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology. Constantly being
improved, but still a long way off from storing energy in the same way as
a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just round the corner.

Or LEDs. I still can't buy a plug in LED bulb to truly replace a 150w
tungsten.

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

--
*I finally got my head together, now my body is falling apart.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 10/02/2016 12:00, T i m wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 11:16:05 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

stuart noble wrote:

Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I wonder how strong the structure is? There doesn't seem to be
any reinforcement.

I was looking at that as well, wondering if they put conventional ties
in between the inner and outer walls (and they could fairly easily),
or, if the materiel used didn't carry moisture when set, they could be
printed in from the bottom up (looking like hollow concrete blocks).

Cheers, T i m


The text says "[There was] a large number of stops to install plumbing,
wiring and rebars in the concrete creation."

Cheers
--
Syd

On 10/02/2016 11:16, Chris J Dixon wrote:
stuart noble wrote:

Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I wonder how strong the structure is? There doesn't seem to be
any reinforcement.

Chris


Somewhere it says

"that doesn’t include a large number of stops to install plumbing,
wiring and rebars"

On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 12:20:35 +0000, Syd Rumpo
wrote:

On 10/02/2016 12:00, T i m wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 11:16:05 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

stuart noble wrote:

Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I wonder how strong the structure is? There doesn't seem to be
any reinforcement.

I was looking at that as well, wondering if they put conventional ties
in between the inner and outer walls (and they could fairly easily),
or, if the materiel used didn't carry moisture when set, they could be
printed in from the bottom up (looking like hollow concrete blocks).



The text says "[There was] a large number of stops to install plumbing,
wiring and rebars in the concrete creation."


Well spotted. I remember the pictures, forget the words. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 12:01:24 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

snip

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

I'm not sure how PLA (the default 3D printer filament type) fares in
the sunlight yet because I've not had chance to test it but those
things I've printed and tested to destruction seem pretty tough?

And of course there is 3D printing and less than good 3D printing ...

Cheers, T i m

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way from
doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology. Constantly being
improved, but still a long way off from storing energy in the same way as
a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just round the corner.

The main issue with additive 3D printing is how long it takes. Because of
the need to scan a 3D space, it takes roughly the cube of the resolution.
Until this can be done in parallel, it's going to be limited by how fast the
head can move which is governed by momentum and not something that can be
massively improved.

Or LEDs. I still can't buy a plug in LED bulb to truly replace a 150w
tungsten.

That's not far off.

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

That suggests a poor choice of material. Like any kind of construction, you
have to understand the materials you use - 3d printing might be unfamiliar
but it is no different. You can 3d print in stainless steel, for instance,
which I suspect would be far stronger. At a cost, of course.

Theo

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 00:36:35 UTC, Graham. wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 09:20:08 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"T i m" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things
rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

How long before you can just print new brat or pet when one gets run
over
etc.

Or print a new wife when you've worn the old one out ?

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?
Any ideas?

Replicator would do me.

But it's not a replicator if it's designed using
a CAD system and only printed the once.

I have a theory that stonehenge and the
pyramids were 3D printed by aliens :-)

More fool you.

"Chris J Dixon" wrote in message
...
stuart noble wrote:

Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

I wonder how strong the structure is? There doesn't seem to be
any reinforcement.

Yeah, bet it starts cracking pretty quickly.

On 10/02/2016 12:01, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way from
doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology. Constantly being
improved, but still a long way off from storing energy in the same way as
a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just round the corner.

Or LEDs. I still can't buy a plug in LED bulb to truly replace a 150w
tungsten.

But you could buy a lamp.
Its like many new things, you don't get the benefit if used the old way.


The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.


Wrong sort of 3D printer.
FFF is never going to be strong in the Z axis.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way from
doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology. Constantly being
improved, but still a long way off from storing energy in the same way as
a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just round the corner.

Or LEDs. I still can't buy a plug in LED bulb to truly replace a 150w
tungsten.

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

The better 3D printers can print metal objects.

In article . com,
dennis@home wrote:
On 10/02/2016 12:01, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way
from doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology.
Constantly being improved, but still a long way off from storing
energy in the same way as a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just
round the corner.

Or LEDs. I still can't buy a plug in LED bulb to truly replace a 150w
tungsten.

But you could buy a lamp.

If I found one which suited, I might.

Its like many new things, you don't get the benefit if used the old way.

In other words, it simply doesn't do the same job. Which is important to
some.


The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.


Wrong sort of 3D printer.
FFF is never going to be strong in the Z axis.

The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding, I'd guess.
If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong, not much point other
than as a toy.

--
*Black holes are where God divided by zero *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Rod Speed wrote:
The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break
after a few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually
made new ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

The better 3D printers can print metal objects.

Metal can break too. The usual pot metal one you'd find for this sort of
thing wouldn't be any stonger.

--
*Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Rod Speed wrote:
The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break
after a few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually
made new ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

The better 3D printers can print metal objects.

Metal can break too. The usual pot metal one you'd find for this sort of
thing wouldn't be any stonger.

I have had a Panasonic bread maker for some time.

The first part to fail was the plastic catch for the dispenser
tray, so I fashioned a replacement, which was partially
successful.

When the rather abrasive seeded mix I use eventually wore off the
coating on blade and pan, it was better value to get a complete
new unit from ebay.

When the second dispenser latch failed, I came across

http://www.shapeways.com/model/181321/panasonic-sd253-breadmaker-dispenser-latch.html?li=productBox-search

Which is just the job. You'd think Panasonic could have done this
themselves.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article . com,
dennis@home wrote:
On 10/02/2016 12:01, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way
from doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology.
Constantly being improved, but still a long way off from storing
energy in the same way as a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just
round the corner.

Or LEDs. I still can't buy a plug in LED bulb to truly replace a 150w
tungsten.

But you could buy a lamp.

If I found one which suited, I might.

Its like many new things, you don't get the benefit if used the old way.

In other words, it simply doesn't do the same job. Which is important to
some.


The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break
after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.


Wrong sort of 3D printer.
FFF is never going to be strong in the Z axis.

The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding, I'd guess.
If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong,

It can and much better too.

not much point other than as a toy.

And when it can it isnt.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Rod Speed wrote:
The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break
after a few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually
made new ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

The better 3D printers can print metal objects.

Metal can break too.

But with something that was originally done in plastics, its very
unlikely that when done in metal properly that it will break.

The usual pot metal one you'd find for this sort of
thing wouldn't be any stonger.

Metal 3D printers don’t use pot metal.

On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 16:11:06 UTC, Theo wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way from
doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology. Constantly being
improved, but still a long way off from storing energy in the same way as
a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just round the corner.

The main issue with additive 3D printing is how long it takes. Because of
the need to scan a 3D space, it takes roughly the cube of the resolution.
Until this can be done in parallel, it's going to be limited by how fast the
head can move which is governed by momentum and not something that can be
massively improved.

3d printed houses are already many times faster than brick & block, and there's plenty of scope for speed increase both in laying down cement mix and in setup times.

A real step change is just starting to happen. The houses we inhabit now will seem very poorly designed & bland in a decade or 2's time.


NT

On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 18:05:05 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article . com,
dennis@home wrote:
On 10/02/2016 12:01, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.


Wrong sort of 3D printer.
FFF is never going to be strong in the Z axis.

The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding, I'd guess.
If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong, not much point other
than as a toy.

Some can. You used the wrong plastic, as well as copying a flawed design.


NT

wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 16:11:06 UTC, Theo wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

I'm wondering if they are simply the latest fad. Which may eventually
replace making things in a traditional way - but is still a long way
from
doing so, and may never. A bit like battery technology. Constantly
being
improved, but still a long way off from storing energy in the same way
as
a tank of petrol etc can. But is always just round the corner.

The main issue with additive 3D printing is how long it takes. Because
of
the need to scan a 3D space, it takes roughly the cube of the resolution.
Until this can be done in parallel, it's going to be limited by how fast
the
head can move which is governed by momentum and not something that can be
massively improved.

3d printed houses are already many times faster than brick & block, and
there's plenty of scope for speed increase both in laying down cement mix
and in setup times.

A real step change is just starting to happen.

I doubt it.

The houses we inhabit now will seem very poorly
designed & bland in a decade or 2's time.

They always do.

In article ,
wrote:
The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding, I'd
guess. If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong, not much
point other than as a toy.

Some can. You used the wrong plastic, as well as copying a flawed design.

I didn't make them. They were made commercially. By a specialist in such
things. Given what they cost, should have been the strongest plastic on
the market.

The design is indeed flawed. But if it gave a few years use in practice
before breaking but much shorter with the printed one it's fair to say it
wasn't as well made.

--
*Why is it considered necessary to screw down the lid of a coffin?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote
wrote

The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding,
I'd guess. If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong,
not much point other than as a toy.

Some can. You used the wrong plastic, as well as copying a flawed design.

I didn't make them. They were made commercially. By a specialist in such
things.

Who clearly used the wrong plastic for that particular item
or was too stupid to realise that he should have used metal.

Given what they cost, should have been the strongest plastic on the
market.

Doesn’t mean that he used that, or that it is adequate for the design.

The design is indeed flawed. But if it gave a few years
use in practice before breaking but much shorter with
the printed one it's fair to say it wasn't as well made.

Yes, but that may just be because currently plastic isnt what
should have been used for that part when it is 3D printed.

On Thursday, 11 February 2016 03:26:13 UTC, Rod Speed wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote
tabbypurr wrote

The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding,
I'd guess. If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong,
not much point other than as a toy.

Some can. You used the wrong plastic, as well as copying a flawed design.

I didn't make them. They were made commercially. By a specialist in such
things.

Who clearly used the wrong plastic for that particular item
or was too stupid to realise that he should have used metal.

Given what they cost, should have been the strongest plastic on the
market.

Doesn't mean that he used that, or that it is adequate for the design.

The design is indeed flawed. But if it gave a few years
use in practice before breaking but much shorter with
the printed one it's fair to say it wasn't as well made.

Yes, but that may just be because currently plastic isnt what
should have been used for that part when it is 3D printed.

this is scary, Rod's correct.


NT

On 11/02/2016 00:36, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
wrote:
The original was simply a lump of plastic. Injection moulding, I'd
guess. If a 3D printer can't make the same and as strong, not much
point other than as a toy.

Some can. You used the wrong plastic, as well as copying a flawed design.

I didn't make them. They were made commercially. By a specialist in such
things. Given what they cost, should have been the strongest plastic on
the market.

Just because they are expensive doesn't mean they aren't made cheaply.
You do not get what you pay for if there is no competition.


The design is indeed flawed. But if it gave a few years use in practice
before breaking but much shorter with the printed one it's fair to say it
wasn't as well made.


With FFF in plastic you may have to look at the design and change it to
take into account the weakness in the Z axis. If you can't then you need
to look elsewhere.

In article . com,
dennis@home wrote:
I didn't make them. They were made commercially. By a specialist in
such things. Given what they cost, should have been the strongest
plastic on the market.

Just because they are expensive doesn't mean they aren't made cheaply.
You do not get what you pay for if there is no competition.

There is competition. This firm was chosen (not by me) as it is a market
leader in this sort of work.

--
*I want it all and I want it delivered

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Thu, 11 Feb 2016 09:30:08 +0000, dennis@home
wrote:

snip

With FFF in plastic you may have to look at the design and change it to
take into account the weakness in the Z axis. If you can't then you need
to look elsewhere.

What weakness in the Z axis?

If the printer is configured and running properly then each new layer
should fully fuse itself to the previous layer? We extrude PLA at
around 200 DegC and using a heated bed (60 DegC).

Don't get me wrong, I have had faulty prints where the nozzle has say
partially blocked for a few seconds, the size / consistency of the
extrusion has been compromised and so a fault is created affecting the
Z axis but that's a 'manufacturing' not 'materials' fault.

I'll print a couple of solid beams and see how accurately I can test
them for bending / delaminating failure.

Cheers, T i m

On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 16:23:03 UTC, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 10 February 2016 00:36:35 UTC, Graham. wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 09:20:08 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"T i m" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 9 Feb 2016 12:14:22 -0800 (PST), Adam Aglionby
wrote:

Started with a Rep-Rap and a `model` castle

http://www.totalkustom.com/3d-castle-completed.html

Saw that previously.

and is moving forward impressively, actual machine building things
rather
than just renderings

http://www.3ders.org/articles/201509...ted-hotel.html

Brilliant, well, unless you are a bricklayer of course.

Having built and run a Cartesian 3d printer I can feel every movement
of that concrete printers motions. In fact it seems quite scene in
comparison with our dinky thing.

Even thought the printer frame has to be pretty strong, rigid and
accurate, it's funny how any slight imperfections are normally ironed
out on the next pass (assuming they matter in the first place).

It constantly amazes me re the uses I hear people putting them to.

A mates daughter makes cakes and (currently) buys (hopes to make for
herself soon) 3d printed shape cutters for all sort of cake occasions.

A mate recently bought some new steel framed chairs for his kitchen
and some of the rubber feet were missing. It took me 5 minutes to
measure and draw on the PC ... and maybe an hour and a half to print,
four new feet that he says work better than the originals.

It still seem weird to be able to think of something, draw and print
it and have it in your hand the same morning (like drilling / cutting
jigs and templates, brackets and the like).

I still remember the old days when I had to go down the cold workshop
and file, drill, saw ... ;-)

How long before you can just print new brat or pet when one gets run
over
etc.

Or print a new wife when you've worn the old one out ?

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?
Any ideas?

Replicator would do me.

But it's not a replicator if it's designed using
a CAD system and only printed the once.

what has only printed once got to do with it ?

got two of these in my lab, earlier models anyway.

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/8754711/?grossPrice=Y&cm_mmc=UK-PLA-_-google-_-PLA_UK_EN_Computing_And_Peripherals-_-3D_Printing_And_Scanning&mkwid=s5PaDqrLW_dc|pcrid| 88057058523|pkw||pmt||prd|8754711&gclid=CJPB-_nu78oCFc0y0wodHgkAKg

and one of these downstairs

Objet30 Prime

On Wednesday, February 10, 2016 at 8:35:25 AM UTC, stuart noble wrote:
On 10/02/2016 08:07, Adrian wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 00:36:10 +0000, Graham. wrote:

Do you agree that we need a better word than printer for these
futuristic machines?

Not really. It's pretty much exactly what they're doing, just using
really, really thick ink.


Interesting that the local sand in The Philippines includes a proportion
of volcanic ash, which presumably makes it easier to pump through the
machinery. I think they might have trouble with normal sharp sand

His first project was in the U.S., pumped concrete and continuous pour with moving forms is around already.

On Wednesday, February 10, 2016 at 1:13:22 PM UTC, T i m wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 12:01:24 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

snip

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

I'm not sure how PLA (the default 3D printer filament type) fares in
the sunlight yet because I've not had chance to test it but those
things I've printed and tested to destruction seem pretty tough?

And of course there is 3D printing and less than good 3D printing ...

Cheers, T i m

Unfortunately none of the current prinatble plastics appear to like UV exposure , aprt from post cure

https://www.3dhubs.com/materials

On 11/02/16 15:25, Adam Aglionby wrote:
On Wednesday, February 10, 2016 at 1:13:22 PM UTC, T i m wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2016 12:01:24 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

snip

The one experience I've had of 3d printers is some clips made for the
parcel shelf on the old Rover. The originals are plastic and break after a
few years. The 3D replacements after a few weeks. I eventually made new
ones from ally plate. Which are far stronger.

I'm not sure how PLA (the default 3D printer filament type) fares in
the sunlight yet because I've not had chance to test it but those
things I've printed and tested to destruction seem pretty tough?

And of course there is 3D printing and less than good 3D printing ...

Cheers, T i m

Unfortunately none of the current prinatble plastics appear to like UV exposure , aprt from post cure

https://www.3dhubs.com/materials

I think the view to take is that robotiic deposition rather than robotic
removal (as in CNC mills and lathes) is the next stage, what you deposit
and how, is rather a wide range of possibilities.

I can imagine a robot with pipes and arms that yu feed sand cement water
and piles of bricks into that lays ten thousand bricks in a day.



--
A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on
its shoes.