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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions.

expanding foam



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 16th 10, 09:11 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 1,214
Default expanding foam

Hi,

I sometimes use expanding foam. Are all types of foam the same? I see
that toolstation sell a fast curing foam for use as an adhesive for
plasterboard and celotex and the like:

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Adhe.../sd2857/p60449

Is it worth getting or is it not much different to the "normal" foam?

I remember once using low expansion foam but I still got it everywhere
It didn't seem any less expansive than the "normal" type! But no
canoes were hurt in the process

I tool the advice on this group to buy a proper foam gun. It really is
worthwhile for occasional DIY use where otherwise you would waste half
the tin. It was the everbuild model, also from TS, and I have been
very happy with it.

I see there is also fire retardant foam. If you use fast cure foam,
normal foam, and fire foam, do you need three applicator guns? If I
wanted to unscrew my usual foam to use a tin of the fast cure type,
would foam gush everywhere or could I mix and match canisters all day?
I suppose that the neck of each canister would also need a good clean
to prevent that foaming shut?

Thanks.
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  #2  
Old July 17th 10, 12:37 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 565
Default expanding foam


"Fred" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I sometimes use expanding foam. Are all types of foam the same? I see
that toolstation sell a fast curing foam for use as an adhesive for
plasterboard and celotex and the like:

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Adhe.../sd2857/p60449

Is it worth getting or is it not much different to the "normal" foam?

I remember once using low expansion foam but I still got it everywhere
It didn't seem any less expansive than the "normal" type! But no
canoes were hurt in the process

I tool the advice on this group to buy a proper foam gun. It really is
worthwhile for occasional DIY use where otherwise you would waste half
the tin. It was the everbuild model, also from TS, and I have been
very happy with it.

I see there is also fire retardant foam. If you use fast cure foam,
normal foam, and fire foam, do you need three applicator guns? If I
wanted to unscrew my usual foam to use a tin of the fast cure type,
would foam gush everywhere or could I mix and match canisters all day?
I suppose that the neck of each canister would also need a good clean
to prevent that foaming shut?

Thanks.



You are supposed to be able to remove the can from gun ... so you can attach
a can of cleaning fluid. ...
trouble is they often don't re-seal once you have started using them
.............

  #3  
Old July 18th 10, 04:02 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 1,214
Default expanding foam

On Fri, 16 Jul 2010 23:37:30 +0100, "Rick Hughes"
wrote:

You are supposed to be able to remove the can from gun ... so you can attach
a can of cleaning fluid. ...
trouble is they often don't re-seal once you have started using them


Hi, I just took the can off to see and despite the trigger being
locked shut by the knob on the end, foam still leaked out, so as you
both say in theory the cans should come off and seal, but in practice,
it looks like they don't.

I noticed the date on the bottom of the can for the first time too. It
says best before June. Oh well, there's only a drop left. What happens
past the expiry date? Does it not expand so controllably? I see
reviews on the screwfix web site complain about short-dated fire foam.
Is that more critical? Does it lose its fire resistant properties
after that date?

TIA
  #4  
Old July 18th 10, 04:06 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 1,214
Default expanding foam

On Fri, 16 Jul 2010 21:49:21 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

Its a little different - sets faster and expands less after initial
application. So you can push the board into place, and it won't expand
it away again. I have used the ordinary stuff for fixing plasterboard.
Its fine as long as you make sure its tacked or otherwise held in place
until the foam sets.


Since my ordinary foam can is almost empty, I might just buy the fast
setting stuff to avoid the hassle. I don't want my wall sloping!

In theory you can remove a can and it should seal - however in reality
they do it about as well as the normal "disposable" cans. i.e. leave it
a day and the used can will probably have depressurzied. If swapping
between a couple of cans in the space of a few hours, however you would
probably be ok.


But if you swapped can A for can B and then fitted can A again,
wouldn't that still leave you with an open can (B), which would
quickly become useless? Or were you thinking more along the lines of
swap A for B, use B completely, and then refit A all in the space of
the same afternoon?

Thanks.
  #5  
Old July 29th 10, 11:07 AM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 1,214
Default expanding foam

On Sun, 18 Jul 2010 18:26:13 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

two guns would be sensible if using two different types
of foam regularly.


I had a can of "normal" foam that I found had expired in June. I used
this up and replaced it with a new can of the same foam and there was
a difference: the fresh foam came out much faster and expanded more.
I'm not sure whether that was an advantage or a disadvantage but there
is obviously some deterioration with age.

Near the end of the can of old foam, I could hear that there was
something left when I shook the can but it just squirted "air" out of
the nozzle when I tried to use it. I am sure it was not air but
something far more poisonous. What would it be: butane? Is that the
propellant?

When I unscrewed the empty can, foam leaked out the can-end of the
gun. Does this mean the valve in the gun is faulty? The trigger was
locked closed so it shouldn't have leaked, should it? And why was
there foam in the gun considering it was only spraying gas out the
other end?

I bought a third can, this time of the adhesive foam, and a new gun,
to fix my celotex with. I think I did this partly for the novelty: I
had never used this foam before. It occurred to me afterwards, why
didn't I use a grab adhesive like gripfill, no more nails, etc. I
wonder whether they would have been less messy? Is there an advantage
to using the foam? the only thing I can think of is that it is easy to
cover large areas. I wonder whether a tube of something would have had
more initial grip? I think that might be my fault though, because I
think you are supposed to apply the foam and wait for it to go tacky
before pushing into place.

I used all this glue foam up in one day and when that was empty, it
was empty and it came off the gun completely clean too, so I think
there must have been a problem with either the other can or other gun
or both.

When using the gun cleaner spray to clean up the gun, I saw it
contained acetone. I never expected that. I thought it was cellulose
thinners, I don't know why. You used to be able to buy small bottles
of acetone from the chemist. I wonder if they have been banned now? if
not, it might be worth getting one for cleaning of wet foam.

Thanks.
  #6  
Old August 2nd 10, 04:56 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 1,214
Default expanding foam

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 13:13:37 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

Depends on where the valves are in the gun. Mine has a sprung ball valve
near the inlet, and then a second on the outlet itself (formed from a
long rod attached to the trigger that runs up the length of the delivery
pipe). IME you will always get a bit of seepage on the can end since
there will be wet foam about that was moments ago constrained by
pressure from expanding, suddenly exposed to moist air.


I had seepage from the can end which was surprising since no foam,
only propellant, was coming from the other end! But I had heard a
quiet hiss from the nozzle when the trigger was locked, so I'm sure
something isn't shutting completely.

The foam will conform to any odd shape or size gap - so you can position
the board where you want it and let it set - even if that means at one
place its 10mm from the substrate. You would need one big pile of
gripfil to deal with a gap like that.


Luckily I didn't have any big gaps to fill, but I see your point. But
if fitting closely, I think grip adhesives would be just as good?

Yup foam cleaner is basically acetone. Probably about the only way to
buy it in larger quantities these days!


So do thinners do nothing to foam then? I wonder whether I got that
idea from?

Thanks.
  #7  
Old August 8th 10, 09:42 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: 1,214
Default expanding foam

On Mon, 02 Aug 2010 23:35:24 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

r if very close, the spray on impact adhesive would probably be good.


Hadn't thought of that, thanks for the suggestion. I'll remember that
if there is a next time.

White spirit - nope don;t think so. Cellulose may - not tried. Don't
think IPA will do it either.


I was thinking of the cellulose variety but not sure why. I've
probably got my wires crossed though.
 




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