[Rick Hughes[_3_]]

I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.


The heads are 7/32" hex imperials (yep 100% sure - It's a US manufactured
product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if there is
a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !


Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have a
compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets ... but
would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I can get one
?

[Adam Aglionby]

On 8 Apr, 14:18, "Rick Hughes"
wrote:
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.

The heads are 7/32" hex imperials * (yep 100% sure - It's a US manufactured
product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if there is
a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !

Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have a
compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets ... but
would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I can get one
?

Heat or cold or combination of both , blowtorch, oxy torch applied
carefully.

http://www.arco.co.uk/products/44C4013 Freeze and release , not tried
myself but heard good things.

Mig welding nut on top of fastener, heat helps free it and gives good
surface to grip with tool.

Spark erosion was invented to remove snapped taps out of aluminium
radar guides, its the expensive but ultimate way for removing HT steel
from alloy.

7/32 will have too much slop by time come down from 1/2" drive, 6mm
drive T-bar would give more feel and torque would guess.

http://www.shop4fasteners.co.uk/acat... sert_Bits.asp

Cheers
Adam

[Baz]

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
news
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.

Snip

The screws could be fitted with thread locking compound.
Suggest you use a Hot Air Gun.

From tds.loctite.com/tds5/docs/220-EN.PDF

For Disassembly

1. Remove with standard hand tools.

2. In rare instances where hand tools do not work because

of excessive engagement length, apply localized heat to

nut or bolt to approximately 250 °C. Disassemble while

hot.

[Rick Hughes[_3_]]

"Baz" wrote in message
...

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
news
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.

Snip

The screws could be fitted with thread locking compound.
Suggest you use a Hot Air Gun.

From tds.loctite.com/tds5/docs/220-EN.PDF

For Disassembly

1. Remove with standard hand tools.

2. In rare instances where hand tools do not work because

of excessive engagement length, apply localized heat to

nut or bolt to approximately 250 °C. Disassemble while

No Thread lock used ... but guess dissimilar metals has caused the issue.

[Dave Baker]

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
news
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.


The heads are 7/32" hex imperials (yep 100% sure - It's a US
manufactured product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if there
is a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !


Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have a
compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets ...
but would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I can
get one

First off you might want to read this.

http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/ToolUse.htm

Countersunk fittings do tend to lock on very tight because of the angle and
area of the underside of the head. You need to shock these loose with
something other than an unmodified right angled allen key which can't really
be hit directly on the end very easily. A small brass or bronze drift is
ideal, especially if you can machine a pip on the end in a lathe to keep it
centred inside the allen screw so it doesn't jump about and mangle the
aluminium around it. Or just cut a bit off an old 5.5mm allen key and hammer
that. By mallet I assume you mean a wooden one. You *must* use a steel
hammer to get a proper shock loading on the drift. Hitting something with
wood will achieve three fifths of FA. If they still won't come out hit them
harder! You won't hurt anything. It's like training a dog. Once it really
knows who's boss it'll give in and stop dicking about.

To use an allen key in your impact driver simply cut a length off the long
end with an angle grinder disc and use it in a 7/32" socket.

Absolutely no point using releasing oil. The joint will be fluid tight.

You also must tighten back up each screw you loosen to take the load off the
others and when all are free remove them one at a time.

If the screws are loctited in then applying heat for a while will soften it.

Car engine oil pumps are often held together with csk allen screws and I've
had to remove god knows how many ultra tight ones over the years but nothing
has ever failed to succumb to the right technique.

I'll bet you a pound to a pint if you cut a bit off an old 5.5mm allen key,
belt that firmly with a claw hammer a few times and then just use a good
tight fitting 7/32" key they'll pop out as easy as anything.
--
Dave Baker

[Rick Hughes[_3_]]

"Dave Baker" wrote in message
...

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
news
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.


The heads are 7/32" hex imperials (yep 100% sure - It's a US
manufactured product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if there
is a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !


Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have
a compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets
... but would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I
can get one

First off you might want to read this.

http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/ToolUse.htm

Countersunk fittings do tend to lock on very tight because of the angle
and area of the underside of the head. You need to shock these loose with
something other than an unmodified right angled allen key which can't
really be hit directly on the end very easily. A small brass or bronze
drift is ideal, especially if you can machine a pip on the end in a lathe
to keep it centred inside the allen screw so it doesn't jump about and
mangle the aluminium around it. Or just cut a bit off an old 5.5mm allen
key and hammer that. By mallet I assume you mean a wooden one. You *must*
use a steel hammer to get a proper shock loading on the drift. Hitting
something with wood will achieve three fifths of FA. If they still won't
come out hit them harder! You won't hurt anything. It's like training a
dog. Once it really knows who's boss it'll give in and stop dicking about.

To use an allen key in your impact driver simply cut a length off the long
end with an angle grinder disc and use it in a 7/32" socket.

Absolutely no point using releasing oil. The joint will be fluid tight.

You also must tighten back up each screw you loosen to take the load off
the others and when all are free remove them one at a time.

If the screws are loctited in then applying heat for a while will soften
it.

Car engine oil pumps are often held together with csk allen screws and
I've had to remove god knows how many ultra tight ones over the years but
nothing has ever failed to succumb to the right technique.

I'll bet you a pound to a pint if you cut a bit off an old 5.5mm allen
key, belt that firmly with a claw hammer a few times and then just use a
good tight fitting 7/32" key they'll pop out as easy as anything.
--


Tried some heat ... no difference (don't want to apply too much)

Bought new set of metric Allen keys to make sure it's a good fit ... still
no go.

I have now ordered a socket driven allen key .... I'll give that a go with
my pneumatic impact wrench .. on lowest setting and low air pressure.

My worry is it it rounded off the screws .... be a major issue to solve.

[Dave Baker]

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
...

"Dave Baker" wrote in message
...

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
news
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.


The heads are 7/32" hex imperials (yep 100% sure - It's a US
manufactured product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if
there is a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !


Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have
a compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets
... but would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I
can get one

First off you might want to read this.

http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/ToolUse.htm

Countersunk fittings do tend to lock on very tight because of the angle
and area of the underside of the head. You need to shock these loose with
something other than an unmodified right angled allen key which can't
really be hit directly on the end very easily. A small brass or bronze
drift is ideal, especially if you can machine a pip on the end in a lathe
to keep it centred inside the allen screw so it doesn't jump about and
mangle the aluminium around it. Or just cut a bit off an old 5.5mm allen
key and hammer that. By mallet I assume you mean a wooden one. You *must*
use a steel hammer to get a proper shock loading on the drift. Hitting
something with wood will achieve three fifths of FA. If they still won't
come out hit them harder! You won't hurt anything. It's like training a
dog. Once it really knows who's boss it'll give in and stop dicking
about.

To use an allen key in your impact driver simply cut a length off the
long end with an angle grinder disc and use it in a 7/32" socket.

Absolutely no point using releasing oil. The joint will be fluid tight.

You also must tighten back up each screw you loosen to take the load off
the others and when all are free remove them one at a time.

If the screws are loctited in then applying heat for a while will soften
it.

Car engine oil pumps are often held together with csk allen screws and
I've had to remove god knows how many ultra tight ones over the years but
nothing has ever failed to succumb to the right technique.

I'll bet you a pound to a pint if you cut a bit off an old 5.5mm allen
key, belt that firmly with a claw hammer a few times and then just use a
good tight fitting 7/32" key they'll pop out as easy as anything.
--


Tried some heat ... no difference (don't want to apply too much)

Bought new set of metric Allen keys to make sure it's a good fit ... still
no go.

I have now ordered a socket driven allen key .... I'll give that a go with
my pneumatic impact wrench .. on lowest setting and low air pressure.

My worry is it it rounded off the screws .... be a major issue to solve.

Not really. You just drill the heads off and you're left with a bunch of
easily removeable threaded stubs after the cover is removed. Just use a
drill a gnat's bigger than the screw shank and drill until the head spins
off.
--
Dave Baker

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Rick Hughes wrote:
My worry is it it rounded off the screws .... be a major issue to solve.

CSK hex head are about the easiest screws to drill out.

--
*One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Rick Hughes[_3_]]

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Rick Hughes wrote:
My worry is it it rounded off the screws .... be a major issue to solve.

CSK hex head are about the easiest screws to drill out.

--
*One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


My worry would be damaging the Aluminum .... hope it does not come to this.

I have ordered a Hex socket bit .... I'll try walloping it a few times to
seat it well, and hopefully loosen the fit.
Contacted the manufacturer - he said this is very common ... suggests using
a Torx bit and driving that in ... so it cuts itself in, plus the driving in
will loosen .. and then it should come out.

He did add a standard 90 degree bend allen key is no use, needs a socketed
driver.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Rick Hughes wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Rick Hughes wrote:
My worry is it it rounded off the screws .... be a major issue to
solve.

CSK hex head are about the easiest screws to drill out.

My worry would be damaging the Aluminum .... hope it does not come to
this.

You drill using a size slightly less than the thread diameter. You'll get
a pretty good centre using the hex. A tap with a mallet on the back of the
top part should then break the head off. If the top part can then be
removed, a pair of grips on the thread should remove that. Perhaps soaked
in penetrating oil overnight if corroded. Happens all the time with BMW
disc brakes. ;-)

I have ordered a Hex socket bit .... I'll try walloping it a few times
to seat it well, and hopefully loosen the fit. Contacted the
manufacturer - he said this is very common ... suggests using a Torx
bit and driving that in ... so it cuts itself in, plus the driving in
will loosen .. and then it should come out.

Yes - the torx trick can work.

He did add a standard 90 degree bend allen key is no use, needs a
socketed driver.

Indeed.

--
*You never really learn to swear until you learn to drive *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Cicero wrote:
I would suggest that you start by using the new hex bit normally at first
- either T-bar or ratchet with steady pressure. There's no point in
risking damage from a violent assault before you need to.

My experience with impact drivers says they are less likely to break
things than steady pressure. Although a very powerful impact driver could
be different.

--
*Laugh alone and the world thinks you're an idiot.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Dave]

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Rick Hughes wrote:
My worry is it it rounded off the screws .... be a major issue to solve.

CSK hex head are about the easiest screws to drill out.

Not if they are titanium and molly coated. Can't see anyone on here
coming across them though.

Dave

[F Murtz]

Rick Hughes wrote:
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.


The heads are 7/32" hex imperials (yep 100% sure - It's a US
manufactured product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if
there is a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !


Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have
a compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets
... but would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I
can get one ?


Are they cap headed or countersunk? if cap headed try vice grips to loosen.

[F Murtz]

F Murtz wrote:
Rick Hughes wrote:
I have an expensive item that is manufactured from Billet Aluminum.
It is assembled with 316 stainless steel csk hex head screws.

I need to disassemble and the screws are stuck fast.


The heads are 7/32" hex imperials (yep 100% sure - It's a US
manufactured product)

I have tried encouraging Allen key with mallet - no good.
Applied releasing oil - no good (happy to try a specific product if
there is a particularly good one)

So far only one of the 8 have come out !


Now one way to approach this would be to use an impact driver ... I have
a compressed air 1/2" square drive impact driver, and assorted sockets
... but would need a 7/32" hex insert ............ anybody know where I
can get one ?


Are they cap headed or countersunk? if cap headed try vice grips to loosen.
Oops missed the csk.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Cicero wrote:
There wouldn't be much work done if everybody found it necessary to use
an impact driver to release every little fastener. Tools are designed
for their purpose and hand tools are more than adequate for most
purposes. An impact wrench is a specialised tool with quite limited
usefulness. Most serious people have a range of spanners to cover their
needs and learn how to use them properly.

That comment suggests you're either very skilled, or haven't used a decent
impact driver. For removing old door hinge CSK slot head wood screws,
there's nothing to beat one.

--
*I have a degree in liberal arts -- do you want fries with that

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Cicero wrote:
I believe that anything that can be done with an impact wrench / driver
in normal conditions can be done just as well with the correct hand tool
with the added bonus that there is little risk of damage from impact.
I'm a bit surprised by the example of the door hinge screws; I don't
doubt that it works but the traditional method (clean slot, couple of
taps with screwdriver) has always worked well for me. You may enjoy
using an impact driver for this job, but would you fail to do it using
only a decent screwdriver?

Takes seconds with my little Makita as opposed to ages faffing around with
an ordinary screwdriver.

--
*TEAMWORK...means never having to take all the blame yourself *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[The Medway Handyman[_2_]]

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Cicero wrote:
I believe that anything that can be done with an impact wrench /
driver in normal conditions can be done just as well with the
correct hand tool with the added bonus that there is little risk of
damage from impact. I'm a bit surprised by the example of the door
hinge screws; I don't doubt that it works but the traditional method
(clean slot, couple of taps with screwdriver) has always worked well
for me. You may enjoy using an impact driver for this job, but would
you fail to do it using only a decent screwdriver?

Takes seconds with my little Makita as opposed to ages faffing around
with an ordinary screwdriver.

Amen to that. One of THE most useful things I own.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

[Rick Hughes[_3_]]

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
...



Thought final solution may be of use ...

Tried Allen key .. no good
Tried Plus Gas & Hex bit in ratchet .. no good
Tried off cut of Allen key in socket .. no good
Tried heat ... no difference (could not go warmer than hand hot)
Tried Plus Gas .. no good
Bought proper Allen bit in socket ... no good


The problem is the screws being Stainless are reasonable soft .. and Allen
key just chews out the hex head.


Solution .... hammered in a Torx T40 bit ... then using a ratchet & 3'
extension bar the screws came out ... with hell of a crack ... kept
expecting ratchet to break each time.
First Torx bit remove screw but was ruined itself .... (was a bit from a
multi part DeWalt set) ... went and bought a couple of WEARA bits ... they
removed them with no damage to bits at all .... WERA bits really are worth
the extra.


Once the parts come back from anodizing I will reassemble with stainless
anti-seize paste.

If you were wondering what I was undoing .. it was this :
http://i771.photobucket.com/albums/x...afflad/red.jpg

well it will be that colour once anodized.

That makes up my my SkySki, which you use to have fun like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahKeh0e3EwA

[John Stumbles]

On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 20:44:31 +0100, Rick Hughes wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahKeh0e3EwA

'kinell Rick!

What's that being towed by? Looks like a line from the sky (hence the name
I guess) but what's at the other (towing) end?

--
John Stumbles

The ant has made himself illustrious through constant industry industrious
So what? Would you be calm and placid if you were full of formic acid?