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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Y Plan problems
The problem is that when only CH is called the boiler will not switch off
when the programmer switches off. The same happens when both HW and CH are called for by the programmer and the HW is satisfied before the CH. The wiring seems to be fine and the mid position valve moves to the correct position at all times and is correctly controlled by the room stat and the cylinder stat. Any ideas. The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. Adam |
#2
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Y Plan problems
In message ,
ARWadsworth writes The problem is that when only CH is called the boiler will not switch off when the programmer switches off. The same happens when both HW and CH are called for by the programmer and the HW is satisfied before the CH. The wiring seems to be fine and the mid position valve moves to the correct position at all times and is correctly controlled by the room stat and the cylinder stat. Any ideas. The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. How long have you been a regular here ? How many times has someone been called a numpty for not saying what boiler they have ? -- geoff |
#3
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Y Plan problems
"geoff" wrote in message ... In message , ARWadsworth writes The problem is that when only CH is called the boiler will not switch off when the programmer switches off. The same happens when both HW and CH are called for by the programmer and the HW is satisfied before the CH. The wiring seems to be fine and the mid position valve moves to the correct position at all times and is correctly controlled by the room stat and the cylinder stat. Any ideas. The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. How long have you been a regular here ? How many times has someone been called a numpty for not saying what boiler they have ? -- geoff Worcester 24Ri Adam |
#4
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Y Plan problems
In message ,
ARWadsworth writes "geoff" wrote in message ... In message , ARWadsworth writes The problem is that when only CH is called the boiler will not switch off when the programmer switches off. The same happens when both HW and CH are called for by the programmer and the HW is satisfied before the CH. The wiring seems to be fine and the mid position valve moves to the correct position at all times and is correctly controlled by the room stat and the cylinder stat. Any ideas. The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. How long have you been a regular here ? How many times has someone been called a numpty for not saying what boiler they have ? -- geoff Worcester 24Ri I'll check tomorrow -- geoff |
#5
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Y Plan problems
"geoff" wrote in message ... In message , ARWadsworth writes "geoff" wrote in message ... In message , ARWadsworth writes The problem is that when only CH is called the boiler will not switch off when the programmer switches off. The same happens when both HW and CH are called for by the programmer and the HW is satisfied before the CH. The wiring seems to be fine and the mid position valve moves to the correct position at all times and is correctly controlled by the room stat and the cylinder stat. Any ideas. The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. How long have you been a regular here ? How many times has someone been called a numpty for not saying what boiler they have ? -- geoff Worcester 24Ri I'll check tomorrow -- geoff Cheers Adam |
#6
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Y Plan problems
On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 15:55:31 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote:
The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk Women always generalise |
#7
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Y Plan problems
"YAPH" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 15:55:31 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote: The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk Women always generalise Yes a Greenstar. Worth a shot. Cheers for that. Adam |
#8
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Y Plan problems
In message ,
ARWadsworth writes "YAPH" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 15:55:31 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote: The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk Women always generalise Yes a Greenstar. Worth a shot. Cheers for that. Common problem John ? -- geoff |
#9
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Y Plan problems
"ARWadsworth" wrote in message . com... "YAPH" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 15:55:31 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote: The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk Women always generalise Yes a Greenstar. Worth a shot. Cheers for that. Adam Which end of the wiring? The boiler end or the airing cupboard end? Adam |
#10
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Y Plan problems
"YAPH" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 15:55:31 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote: The only idea that I can come up with is that orange wire (which stays at 90v when there is no power to the valve after calling for CH only) is somehow tricking the boiler into staying running and I suspect the boiler PCB is faulty. Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk I fitted one today. The boiler now works correctly. Thanks Adam |
#11
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Y Plan problems
On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:29:56 +0100, geoff wrote:
Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. Common problem John ? Pretty obscure actually - it was about 3rd time calling W-B tech support before I found out about it. Basically it seems the small current passed by Honeywell-type mid-position valves (presumably by that 680K or whatever resistor?) can fool the electronics of these boilers (and maybe some other models? & other makes even?) into thinking they have call-for-heat at their switched-live input. The boiler I came across would jitter on an off with a relay inside chattering away until it gave up and went into lockout. I'd changed the motorised valve and W-B had been out and (as I recall) changed it again before I eventually found someone there who knew of this issue. I'd actually tried hanging a resistor across switched-live thinking that might cure it and was quite surprised at the capacitor suggestion, but it did the trick and the system's been sweet as a nut since then. Odd thing is the system had been up and running happily for a couple of years before the problem showed up (and it was one of my installs so I'm pretty sure nothing had changed in that time). -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk I forgot to take my amnesia medecine again |
#12
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Y Plan problems
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
YAPH wrote: I'd actually tried hanging a resistor across switched-live thinking that might cure it and was quite surprised at the capacitor suggestion, but it did the trick and the system's been sweet as a nut since then. Odd thing is the system had been up and running happily for a couple of years before the problem showed up (and it was one of my installs so I'm pretty sure nothing had changed in that time). Can you please explain "across switched live". What does the other side connect to, and how does it fix the problem? -- Cheers, Roger ______ Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks. PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP! |
#13
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Y Plan problems
In message , YAPH
writes On Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:29:56 +0100, geoff wrote: Worcester 24Ri Greenstar? Fit 0.47uF (275V AC X2 rated) capacitor across switched live. Common problem John ? Pretty obscure actually - it was about 3rd time calling W-B tech support before I found out about it. Basically it seems the small current passed by Honeywell-type mid-position valves (presumably by that 680K or whatever resistor?) can fool the electronics of these boilers (and maybe some other models? & other makes even?) into thinking they have call-for-heat at their switched-live input. The boiler I came across would jitter on an off with a relay inside chattering away until it gave up and went into lockout. I'd changed the motorised valve and W-B had been out and (as I recall) changed it again before I eventually found someone there who knew of this issue. I'd actually tried hanging a resistor across switched-live thinking that might cure it and was quite surprised at the capacitor suggestion, but it did the trick and the system's been sweet as a nut since then. Odd thing is the system had been up and running happily for a couple of years before the problem showed up (and it was one of my installs so I'm pretty sure nothing had changed in that time). Interesting reading cheers -- geoff |
#14
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Y Plan problems
On Thu, 08 Oct 2009 20:53:43 +0100, Roger Mills wrote:
Can you please explain "across switched live". What does the other side connect to, and how does it fix the problem? Neutral, and "dunno, it just does", respectively. -- John Stumbles There's nowt as queer as folk. Especially other folk. |
#15
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Y Plan problems
"Roger Mills" wrote in message ... In an earlier contribution to this discussion, YAPH wrote: I'd actually tried hanging a resistor across switched-live thinking that might cure it and was quite surprised at the capacitor suggestion, but it did the trick and the system's been sweet as a nut since then. Odd thing is the system had been up and running happily for a couple of years before the problem showed up (and it was one of my installs so I'm pretty sure nothing had changed in that time). Can you please explain "across switched live". What does the other side connect to, and how does it fix the problem? -- Cheers, Roger Connected across to neutral. The switched live stayed at 90V when the last call was from the CH. The cap that Geoff so kindly posted to me dropped the voltage to 3V (readings made with a DVM) after the CH was no longer called for. As to how it fixes the problem then you need Geoff or John to answer. It is long time ago that I did electronics. Adam |
#16
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Y Plan problems
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
ARWadsworth wrote: "Roger Mills" wrote in message ... In an earlier contribution to this discussion, YAPH wrote: I'd actually tried hanging a resistor across switched-live thinking that might cure it and was quite surprised at the capacitor suggestion, but it did the trick and the system's been sweet as a nut since then. Odd thing is the system had been up and running happily for a couple of years before the problem showed up (and it was one of my installs so I'm pretty sure nothing had changed in that time). Can you please explain "across switched live". What does the other side connect to, and how does it fix the problem? -- Cheers, Roger Connected across to neutral. The switched live stayed at 90V when the last call was from the CH. The cap that Geoff so kindly posted to me dropped the voltage to 3V (readings made with a DVM) after the CH was no longer called for. As to how it fixes the problem then you need Geoff or John to answer. It is long time ago that I did electronics. Adam Yes, I see - thanks. Whatever the exact electronics explanation, it apparently reduces the switched live voltage to a very low value so that the boiler is no longer fooled into firing when it shouldn't. -- Cheers, Roger ______ Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks. PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP! |
#17
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Y Plan problems
On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 11:05:51 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote:
Connected across to neutral. The switched live stayed at 90V when the last call was from the CH. The cap that Geoff so kindly posted to me dropped the voltage to 3V (readings made with a DVM) after the CH was no longer called for. So it worked? As to how it fixes the problem then you need Geoff or John to answer. It is long time ago that I did electronics. I guess it simply attenuates the voltage seen at the SL terminal caused by the high value (680K?) resistor in the motorised valve. It's too late in the night (or early in the morning!) to ask my brain to do the sums especially seeing as wot they has reactance at 50Hz in them and it's a looong time since I did that stuff, but maybe some brainy sort will be along soon to help us out here. :-) -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk Teenagers: tired of being harassed by your stupid parents? Act now! - Move out, get a job and pay your own bills, while you still know everything! |
#18
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Y Plan problems
"YAPH" wrote in message ... On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 11:05:51 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote: Connected across to neutral. The switched live stayed at 90V when the last call was from the CH. The cap that Geoff so kindly posted to me dropped the voltage to 3V (readings made with a DVM) after the CH was no longer called for. So it worked? My post on the 7th suggested that it did:-) In case you missed that post, then Thank You. Adam |
#19
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Y Plan problems
On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 09:38:49 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote:
So it worked? My post on the 7th suggested that it did:-) Yes, just checking that I'd read your post correctly. Brain in neutral and all that :-) In case you missed that post, then Thank You. Glad it helped. And to put one over on that know-it-all in Watford ducks ;-) -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk Thesaurus: extinct reptile noted for its wide vocabulary. |
#20
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Y Plan problems
In message , YAPH
writes On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 09:38:49 +0000, ARWadsworth wrote: So it worked? My post on the 7th suggested that it did:-) Yes, just checking that I'd read your post correctly. Brain in neutral and all that :-) In case you missed that post, then Thank You. Glad it helped. And to put one over on that know-it-all in Watford ducks ;-) Makes note to add 10% smugness excess on next order -- geoff |
#21
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Y Plan problems
On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 19:41:07 +0100, geoff wrote:
Makes note to add 10% smugness excess on next order Curses! :-( -- John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk A stitch in time saves nine. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. |
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