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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
Looking at replacing the AAA NiAh rechargable batteries in a Binatone
phone. They seem to have lost some of the original capacity when used during calls. Originally supplied with 2 off 1.2v 650 mAh. What is the significance of the last value? Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Would that increase the 'storage' period? David J |
#2
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
In message , David J
writes Looking at replacing the AAA NiAh rechargable batteries in a Binatone phone. They seem to have lost some of the original capacity when used during calls. Originally supplied with 2 off 1.2v 650 mAh. What is the significance of the last value? Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Would that increase the 'storage' period? Current is measured in Amps and milliamps. A cell with a capacity of 650 mAH would in theory deliver 650mA for one hour then go flat, or perhaps 325mA for two hours. Your 1000mA cell has about a third more storage capacity than the old ones and so should in theory last a third longer. In practise the time between charges is also dependent on the cells' self-discharge rate. But you can safely use 1000mA cells and should expect to be able to use the phone for longer between charges. -- Bernard Peek |
#3
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
In uk.d-i-y, David J wrote:
Looking at replacing the AAA NiAh rechargable batteries in a Binatone phone. They seem to have lost some of the original capacity when used during calls. Originally supplied with 2 off 1.2v 650 mAh. What is the significance of the last value? Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Would that increase the 'storage' period? Yes and yes, as long as you can make them fit physically. -- Mike Barnes |
#4
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:01:12 +0100, David J
wrote: What is the significance of the last value? It relates to the amount of energy stored in the battery expressed as the number of mA it can supply for one hour (although it is actually measured at a 5 or 10 hour discharge rate as using a one hour rate would be misleading). Rather simplistically 650mA battery can supply 65mA for 10 hours or 130mA for 5 hours. Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Yes Would that increase the 'storage' period? If by that you mean would it increase the use you got out of the phone between charges then yes it would. |
#5
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:01:12 +0100, David J wrote:
Looking at replacing the AAA NiAh rechargable batteries in a Binatone phone. They seem to have lost some of the original capacity when used during calls. Originally supplied with 2 off 1.2v 650 mAh. What is the significance of the last value? Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Would that increase the 'storage' period? It's a very coarse indication of how long they will work, under load. However a lot of battery makers consider this figure more of a marketing tool - which allows them to charge more, simply by writing a bigger number of their products. It's almost impossible to verify the mAh rating of a battery as there are too many variables and dependencies on how it is used. A higher value may mean the batteries will supply more juice, ot it may just mean the manufacturer is less troubled my a conscience than others. However, the capacity of even good brands can be killed by having a poor charger in the phone's base - in which case no amount of mAh will help, if the phone overcharges and thereby destroys the batteries. |
#6
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:01:12 +0100, David J wrote:
What is the significance of the last value? Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Would that increase the 'storage' period? And be aware that Lidl have 4 x AAA, 4 x AA, 2 x C, 2 x D, or 9v NiMH batteries on offer from the 1st Oct for £2.49/pack. The AA size are 2500mAHr. These may well be fast to disappear items... -- Cheers Dave. |
#7
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:13:01 +0100, Peter Parry
wrote: On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:01:12 +0100, David J wrote: What is the significance of the last value? It relates to the amount of energy stored in the battery expressed as the number of mA it can supply for one hour (although it is actually measured at a 5 or 10 hour discharge rate as using a one hour rate would be misleading). Rather simplistically 650mA battery can supply 65mA for 10 hours or 130mA for 5 hours. Could a 1000mAh be used instead. Yes Would that increase the 'storage' period? If by that you mean would it increase the use you got out of the phone between charges then yes it would. Thanks for all the replies. My slight confusion is from trying to get an explanation on Wiki he http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rechargeable_batteries where there is a comparison table for different types of rechargeable cells. The parameter that looks closest to the value in mAh we have discussed above is described as Specific Power, and is measured in W/kg. The 'capacity' is not listed. For the NiMh type they list a Power range of 250 - 1000. But that unit is more to do with 'efficiency' (as a power-to weight ratio) rather than 'capacity' surely? David J |
#8
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
In message , David J
writes Thanks for all the replies. My slight confusion is from trying to get an explanation on Wiki he http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rechargeable_batteries where there is a comparison table for different types of rechargeable cells. The parameter that looks closest to the value in mAh we have discussed above is described as Specific Power, and is measured in W/kg. The 'capacity' is not listed. For the NiMh type they list a Power range of 250 - 1000. But that unit is more to do with 'efficiency' (as a power-to weight ratio) rather than 'capacity' surely? That page shows mass-efficiency and volumetric efficiency, watt-hours per litre. But that particular article is written from an academic viewpoint comparing different battery technologies, rather than being written for someone who wants to know which pack to choose at the supermarket. It doesn't mention the new low discharge rate "hybrid" NiMH batteries. These might be a better choice for your phone because their self-discharge rate is lower. If you find that your batteries have gone flat even though you haven't used the phone then these new batteries might be a good choice for you. You can recognise them because they are usually sold fully charged. -- Bernard Peek |
#9
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
David J wrote:
Looking at replacing the AAA NiAh rechargable batteries in a Binatone phone. They seem to have lost some of the original capacity when used during calls. Originally supplied with 2 off 1.2v 650 mAh. What is the significance of the last value? not a lot Could a 1000mAh be used instead. yes. Would that increase the 'storage' period? No. David J |
#10
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
Bernard Peek wrote:
It doesn't mention the new low discharge rate "hybrid" NiMH batteries. These might be a better choice for your phone because their self-discharge rate is lower. If you find that your batteries have gone flat even though you haven't used the phone then these new batteries might be a good choice for you. You can recognise them because they are usually sold fully charged. It depends if the phone is kept on the cradle most of the time. If it is, the batteries will be on trickle charge so the self-discharge won't matter. If you keep the phone switched on but off the cradle, the batteries will probably go flat in a week or two anyway. It's only if you turn the phone off for months that the self-discharge becomes an issue. Personally I'd buy a cheap'n'nasty pair of batteries for a phone, as you can't be sure the charger is any good. Unless you talk for hours and hours on end without putting the phone back on the cradle, the batteries are probably going to be sufficient - higher capacity is better. Until the charger kills them, at which point you just have to buy some new ones. Theo |
#11
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Sep 28, 2:01*pm, David J wrote:
Looking at replacing the AAA NiAh rechargable batteries in a Binatone phone. *They seem to have lost some of the original capacity when used during calls. Originally supplied with 2 off 1.2v 650 mAh. What is the significance of the last value? *Could a 1000mAh be used instead. *Would that increase the 'storage' period? yes and yes. IIRC Poundland have 2 AAA rechargeables for £1. Either 650 or 350mAh, I forget. NT |
#12
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
NT wrote:
yes and yes. IIRC Poundland have 2 AAA rechargeables for ?1. Either 650 or 350mAh, I forget. 350mAh. And their 2xAAs for a pound are 850mAh. I thought of this thread while I was passing them today :-) Theo |
#13
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On 30 Sep 2009 01:07:40 +0100 (BST), Theo Markettos wrote:
And their 2xAAs for a pound are 850mAh. I thought of this thread while I was passing them today :-) 0.0588/mAHr Where as Lidl (on offer from tommorow) 4 x AA are 2500mAHr and £2.49 (0.0249/mAHr). IIRC the Lidl 4 x AAA are 850mAHr again for £2.49 (0.0732p/mAHr) half the price per mAHr of poundland. -- Cheers Dave. |
#14
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Sep 28, 6:07*pm, Theo Markettos
wrote: Bernard Peek wrote: It doesn't mention the new low discharge rate "hybrid" NiMH batteries. These might be a better choice for your phone because their self-discharge rate is lower. If you find that your batteries have gone flat even though you haven't used the phone then these new batteries might be a good choice for you. You can recognise them because they are usually sold fully charged. It depends if the phone is kept on the cradle most of the time. *If it is, the batteries will be on trickle charge so the self-discharge won't matter. |
#15
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Sep 30, 7:56*am, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote: On 30 Sep 2009 01:07:40 +0100 (BST), Theo Markettos wrote: And their 2xAAs for a pound are 850mAh. *I thought of this thread while I was passing them today :-) 0.0588/mAHr Where as Lidl (on offer from tommorow) 4 x AA are 2500mAHr and £2.49 (0.0249/mAHr). IIRC the Lidl 4 x AAA are 850mAHr again for £2.49 (0.0732p/mAHr) half the price per mAHr of poundland. it really comes down to whats near the purchaser, getting there will cost far more than the cells themselves. NT |
#16
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:59:49 -0700 (PDT), NT wrote:
it really comes down to whats near the purchaser, getting there will cost far more than the cells themselves. This is true. The nearest Lidl is 30 miles away so to drive there (60 mile round trip) costs about £20. Don't know where the nearest Poundland is, but it'll be of the same order whether it's in Penrith, Carlisle or Hexham. Of course I wouldn't do a single trip but make it part of a larger one visiting other places. There would be extra mileage but only 5 miles (about £1.50). -- Cheers Dave. |
#17
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Sep 30, 12:35*pm, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote: On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:59:49 -0700 (PDT), NT wrote: it really comes down to whats near the purchaser, getting there will cost far more than the cells themselves. This is true. The nearest Lidl is 30 miles away so to drive there (60 mile round trip) costs about £20. Don't know where the nearest Poundland is, but it'll be of the same order whether it's in Penrith, Carlisle or Hexham. Of course I wouldn't do a single trip but make it part of a larger one visiting other places. There would be extra mileage but only 5 miles (about £1.50). thats probably the main reason I do get poundland stuff, its right where I go anyway. No time or cost to being there. Even if I use half the stuff just once, its worth it. NT |
#18
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
Man at B&Q wrote:
Indeed. All the ones I've seen have specific warnings against leaving them on thecradle all the time. The batteries get slowly poached. MBQ I don't deny they say that (including ours). Nor that batteries might deteriorate if always on cradle. But having left ours like that for something like 8 years, I am not going to try the experiment to compare! Especially as ours are always fully charged ready for a mammoth conversation without worry. Friends who do not put them on cradle are forever suffering flat batteries and seem to have to replace them regularly. -- Rod |
#19
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:13:52 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:01:12 +0100, David J wrote: And be aware that Lidl have 4 x AAA, 4 x AA, 2 x C, 2 x D, or 9v NiMH batteries on offer from the 1st Oct for £2.49/pack. The AA size are 2500mAHr. These may well be fast to disappear items... Last time they had these on offer I bought a load of the AAAs. I generally use them in LED torches and they get quite a bit of use, and have held up well. -- John Stumbles Little Johnny's gone away, his like we'll see no more For what he thought was H20 was H2SO4 |
#20
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 07:56:44 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:
IIRC the Lidl 4 x AAA are 850mAHr again for £2.49 (0.0732p/mAHr) half the price per mAHr of poundland. IIRC last year's lot were 1000mAh -- John Stumbles This sig intentionally left blank |
#21
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "Man at B&Q" saying something like: Personally I'd buy a cheap'n'nasty pair of batteries for a phone, as you can't be sure the charger is any good. * Indeed. All the ones I've seen have specific warnings against leaving them on thecradle all the time. The batteries get slowly poached. Takes ages to kill them, though. My DECT handsets needed new AAA cells last year, after about four years on the original puny ones. |
#22
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember John Stumbles saying something like: On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 07:56:44 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote: IIRC the Lidl 4 x AAA are 850mAHr again for £2.49 (0.0732p/mAHr) half the price per mAHr of poundland. IIRC last year's lot were 1000mAh 6 months ago, the ones I got from Lidl's were 900mAHr. Depends on what supplier deals they've reached I suppose. |
#23
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Thu, 01 Oct 2009 04:22:57 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
6 months ago, the ones I got from Lidl's were 900mAHr. Depends on what supplier deals they've reached I suppose. Could have been 900 - my er whatyoucallit for storing information in your head isn't always reliable :-) -- John Stumbles militant pacifist |
#24
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Sep 30, 7:45*pm, Rod wrote:
Man at B&Q wrote: Indeed. All the ones I've seen have specific warnings against leaving them on thecradle all the time. The batteries get slowly poached. MBQ I don't deny they say that (including ours). Nor that batteries might deteriorate if always on cradle. But having left ours like that for something like 8 years, I am not going to try the experiment to compare! Especially as ours are always fully charged ready for a mammoth conversation without worry. Friends who do not put them on cradle are forever suffering flat batteries and seem to have to replace them regularly. -- Rod Same experience here, 4 DECT phones in the house, all kept in cradles when not in use - for 4 years or so, can still handle SWMBO's mammmoth 1 hour 'quick chats' when necessary. |
#25
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Oct 1, 4:02*am, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote: We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "Man at B&Q" saying something like: Personally I'd buy a cheap'n'nasty pair of batteries for a phone, as you can't be sure the charger is any good. * Indeed. All the ones I've seen have specific warnings against leaving them on thecradle all the time. The batteries get slowly poached. Takes ages to kill them, though. My DECT handsets needed new AAA cells last year, after about four years on the original puny ones. We're on the second set of batteries in less than 6 years. BT branded cordless phone. TBH ICBA to keep taking them off the cradle so the batteries cook. MBQ |
#26
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
In uk.d-i-y, Man at B&Q wrote:
On Oct 1, 4:02*am, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "Man at B&Q" saying something like: Personally I'd buy a cheap'n'nasty pair of batteries for a phone, as you can't be sure the charger is any good. * Indeed. All the ones I've seen have specific warnings against leaving them on thecradle all the time. The batteries get slowly poached. Takes ages to kill them, though. My DECT handsets needed new AAA cells last year, after about four years on the original puny ones. We're on the second set of batteries in less than 6 years. BT branded cordless phone. TBH ICBA to keep taking them off the cradle so the batteries cook. Our BT-branded cordless's batteries are still going strong after eight and a half years of being on the cradle almost continuously. Not trusting my memory as to how long I'd had those phones, I looked out the receipt. John Lewis, March 2001. Price £179.99 each. [Gulp] -- Mike Barnes |
#27
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NiMh rechargeable batteries
On Oct 1, 7:22*pm, Mike Barnes wrote:
In uk.d-i-y, Man at B&Q wrote: On Oct 1, 4:02*am, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "Man at B&Q" saying something like: Personally I'd buy a cheap'n'nasty pair of batteries for a phone, as you can't be sure the charger is any good. * Indeed. All the ones I've seen have specific warnings against leaving them on thecradle all the time. The batteries get slowly poached. Takes ages to kill them, though. My DECT handsets needed new AAA cells last year, after about four years on the original puny ones. We're on the second set of batteries in less than 6 years. BT branded cordless phone. TBH ICBA to keep taking them off the cradle so the batteries cook. Our BT-branded cordless's batteries are still going strong after eight and a half years of being on the cradle almost continuously. Not trusting my memory as to how long I'd had those phones, I looked out the receipt. John Lewis, March 2001. Price £179.99 each. [Gulp] At that price it should have a more intelligent charger! MBQ |
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