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#1
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
Hi Folks,
About 7 years ago I bought a cordless drill and have used it lots since. IIRC it cost about £70 - not a professional's standard but good for DIY. Following a period of irregular use, about 18 months ago the battery began to not hold its charge for long and I discovered that there was a common problem with the charger/battery for that model. I bought a new battery pack for about £25 off eBay ( at the time I didn't know there was a charger problem too ). Anyone guessed the brand yet? Soon discovered there was a charger problem and replaced a blown power transistor in the charger though I became aware, soon after, that the replacement didn't resolve a problem with the charger not switching to trickle when the battery was fully charged thus overcharging if not watched. The original set-up recharged the battery in about 1 hour ( one reason I chose it over cheaper models ). I know that is far quicker that the recommended charge time but with auto trickle switching thought OK. Anyway, all was well, watched the time during recharging and all OK for 12 months or so. Until I was distracted during the recharging whilst practicing plastering ( not one of my skills ). The first I became aware of a serious problem was as a result of my wife shouting for me regarding the smoke coming from the battery/charger last week. The replacement battery plastic housing was overheated, swollen and distorted and the replacement £25 battery is knacked. Jump ahead 1 week. I need a cordless drill for the renovation I'm currently doing so began to look urgently for replacement. Wife saw advert in newspaper - special offer, 2 selected power tools from Wickes for £29.99 includes cordless drill option, choice of 4 or 5 different tools. I already have all of the other power tools on offer ( having bought a new sander [about £30 ] only about 3 weeks ago [sick as a pig]). Anyway, as the charge rate, for the Wickes cordless drill, required 3-5 hours I decided to buy 2 of 15.6 volt cordless drills. I'd have a second battery to be charging whilst the first was in use. The drill is OK for for DIY but lacking some of the options of my 7 yr old original. Now a 15.6 volt cordless drill has 13 of 1.2 volt subC rechargeable cells in its battery pack. My original drill was 12 volt and had 10. Each of the new Wickes drills cost me £15 and each included 13 cells in the battery pack. So assuming the mechanical part of the drill is free the cells cost only £(15/13) [ just over £1 ] each and they are making a profit even at that. Looking on the web I can't buy tabbed subC rechargeable cells for anywhere near that price. Unless I'm looking in the wrong place. Have thought about repairing, by replacing cells, my original 10 cell cordless. I could strip 10 new cells from one of my new Wickes drills and install them in the ( plastic undamaged ) original battery pack for my original cordless drill. I could then make a PROPER charger to fit into the original charger case to prevent overcharging. I'd prefer to buy 10 tabbed subC cells at something like a reasonable price which all the above would suggest was about £0.50 - £0.75 each. Does anyone have a source for such. TTFN - Colin -- The eMail address used in newsgroups is invalid - reply to group only for me to see. |
#2
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
"JDT2Q" wrote in message
.. Have thought about repairing, by replacing cells, my original 10 cell cordless. I could strip 10 new cells from one of my new Wickes drills and install them in the ( plastic undamaged ) original battery pack for my original cordless drill. I could then make a PROPER charger to fit into the original charger case to prevent overcharging. i gave up buying cheap cordless drills this year, having gone through about 5 of them in as many years, got a makita 18 volt li-ion set from screwfix for about 80 quid in one of their frequent sales. charges in 15 minutes, lasts bloomin ages on a charge, and being a li-ion battery the self discharge rate is very low (i use li-po batteries with me model airplane, have left them sitting on the shelf for over a year, and they still show 95% charged) i'm never farting about with ni-cads or mi-mh batteries again, they are old technology now, hence why they are so cheap i guess with all these chinkie knock offs, if you want tabbes sub C cells, try a radio controlled model shop, but they wont be as cheap as you want because people dont like the crappy chinkie cells the die without warning in their planes, but to be honnest, once you have bought the cells, added the charger, farted about splitting open the old pack and soldering up the cells into the same configuration, getting the pack housing closed up again, you would be more than half way towards the cost of a makita li-ion drill at screw fix, if you haddnt bought the 2 drills from wickes, then you'd prolly have the dosh right now. |
#3
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
I agree, having looked at this recently for my pro bosch tools, the
best deal on replacemnet batteries/cells is just to buy a good quality cordless tool with what you want in the bundle. Recelling or buying cells just wasn't economic. The market place is set up to work in a certain way, and that is that cordless drill bundles work out cheaper than just buying a couple of batteries, or even the cost of the cells inside them. You can go against these trends, but you'll end up paying more for less. If cell longevity and fast recharge is sufficiently important to you - then a buy a professional model tool with 15 minute charger, that is designed and built to have the cells cycled frequently. Lots of very competitive offers out there, and if you can afford it, as the previous poster says, Li-ion is very good. |
#4
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
gazz wrote:
"JDT2Q" wrote in message .. Have thought about repairing, by replacing cells, my original 10 cell cordless. I could strip 10 new cells from one of my new Wickes drills and install them in the ( plastic undamaged ) original battery pack for my original cordless drill. I could then make a PROPER charger to fit into the original charger case to prevent overcharging. i gave up buying cheap cordless drills this year, having gone through about 5 of them in as many years, Couldn't agree more. BTDTGTTS. I've been running a couple of Makita's with ni cads for over three years now, in daily use, no hint of battery failure. When they do eventually go I'll buy Makita again but with li-ion. The chargers with decent tools are already 'proper'. Good quality cells & proper chargers are part of what you pay for with better brands. -- Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk |
#5
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-Ccells requested.
On Mon, 6 Apr 2009 00:24:01 +0100
"JDT2Q" wrote: Hi Folks, About 7 years ago I bought a cordless drill and have used it lots since. IIRC it cost about £70 - not a professional's standard but good for DIY. Don't bother with cheap drills. Buy a Makita (or Metabo, etc.. i.e. good) Li-On. You will thank God every few minutes that you did. Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. R. |
#6
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
I'd prefer to buy 10 tabbed subC cells at something like a reasonable price which all the above would suggest was about £0.50 - £0.75 each. Does anyone have a source for such. TTFN - Colin Try here for batteries:- http://www.rapidonline.com/Electrical-Power/Batteries |
#7
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article ,
TheOldFellow wrote: Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. ********. Good quality Ni-Cads or NiMH are fine for cordless tools. They just have different characteristics to LiOn. Poor quality cells of any type are a waste of money. -- *Stable Relationships Are For Horses. * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#8
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
TheOldFellow writes:
On Mon, 6 Apr 2009 00:24:01 +0100 "JDT2Q" wrote: Hi Folks, About 7 years ago I bought a cordless drill and have used it lots since. IIRC it cost about £70 - not a professional's standard but good for DIY. Don't bother with cheap drills. Buy a Makita (or Metabo, etc.. i.e. good) Li-On. You will thank God every few minutes that you did. Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. I don't think NiMh belongs in the same bracket as NiCd. I have a Makita with a pair of NiMh packs. The only problem I've noticed with the NiMh batteries is their self-discharge rate, which means that if you don't use them for a long time, there's not much juice left, but I find that if I pick the thing up, use it until the used battery is flat and put that on charge, it has charged up before the spare pack has run down. I've used this same pair of packs in a "bursty" pattern (periods of no use, then fairly heavy use) for seven years without any sign of trouble. NiCd batteries are a different story, and NiMh -- which are easily damaged by bad charging -- with a poorly designed charger would be no good at all. -- Jón Fairbairn http://www.chaos.org.uk/~jf/Stuff-I-dont-want.html (updated 2009-01-31) |
#10
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-Ccells requested.
On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 11:03:00 +0100
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: In article , TheOldFellow wrote: Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. ********. Good quality Ni-Cads or NiMH are fine for cordless tools. They just have different characteristics to LiOn. Poor quality cells of any type are a waste of money. I thought that too - until I bought a Metabo Li-On drill 3 years ago. 14v works like 18v, always ready, no worries about putting it away discharged, charges in 15 minutes... The list goes on and on. The more infrequently you use it, but assuming you need to do quite a bit when you do need it, the more sense it makes to have a Li-On drill. I don't use any other cordless tools, so I can't say anything about them. Poor quality in any tool is a waste of money - you learn that quite early on - the trick is avoiding them, and price/branding isn't what it used to be. I have an B&D 1/4" router that is over forty years old - still works fine - I wouldn't buy a B&D toilet roll today. R. |
#11
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
On 6 Apr, 00:24, "JDT2Q" wrote:
Wife saw advert in newspaper - special offer, 2 selected power tools from Wickes for £29.99 includes cordless drill option, choice of 4 or 5 different tools. NiCd batteries are being banned from sale fairly soon (EU rules against cadmium) and a good thing too, as NiMH does everything slightly better to no disadvantage. As a result, new NiCd drills (esp. Makita for some reason) are on sale at very good prices at the moment. Try Screwfix. Or spend some money and go for Li-ion, which is much nicer in use, albeit more costly. |
#12
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
On 6 Apr, 12:00, TheOldFellow wrote:
I thought that too - until I bought a Metabo Li-On drill 3 years ago. It's no great surprise that a Metabo with unobtainium batteries works better than a Happy Shopper with a hamster wheel inside. A B&Q cheapie Li-ion that worked better than Metabo's offering with NiCds would be a clearer indication of the _technology's_ virtues. |
#13
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article ,
TheOldFellow wrote: On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 11:03:00 +0100 "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote: In article , TheOldFellow wrote: Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. ********. Good quality Ni-Cads or NiMH are fine for cordless tools. They just have different characteristics to LiOn. Poor quality cells of any type are a waste of money. I thought that too - until I bought a Metabo Li-On drill 3 years ago. 14v works like 18v, always ready, no worries about putting it away discharged, charges in 15 minutes... The list goes on and on. I'd expect a top of the pile make to be good regardless of the battery type. Ultra fast charging may be useful - but a better solution is two batteries which will recharge within a normal time for one being used up - and if this is 15 minutes you're probably not using the correct tool for the job. ;-) The more infrequently you use it, but assuming you need to do quite a bit when you do need it, the more sense it makes to have a Li-On drill. I have a NiMh drill which seems to hold its charge quite well enough for my use. Which certainly isn't every day. Good Ni-Cads don't self discharge as fast as some think either. I don't use any other cordless tools, so I can't say anything about them. Poor quality in any tool is a waste of money - you learn that quite early on - the trick is avoiding them, and price/branding isn't what it used to be. I have an B&D 1/4" router that is over forty years old - still works fine - I wouldn't buy a B&D toilet roll today. B&D have always been a bit variable. A brand doesn't necessarily guarantee consistency of design or quality. Except perhaps at the top end. What really matters with any cordless tool battery wise is that the battery retains its performance for a good time. And I'm pretty certain when LiIoN become common at the bottom end they'll have no better a service life than the others they replace. After all they want to shift new product after a while. -- *Be nice to your kids. They'll choose your nursing home. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#14
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
TheOldFellow wrote:
On Mon, 6 Apr 2009 00:24:01 +0100 "JDT2Q" wrote: Hi Folks, About 7 years ago I bought a cordless drill and have used it lots since. IIRC it cost about £70 - not a professional's standard but good for DIY. Don't bother with cheap drills. Buy a Makita (or Metabo, etc.. i.e. good) Li-On. You will thank God every few minutes that you did. Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. I don't agree that NiCd or NiMh are necessarily a waste of money. You can have excellent service from wither if you start with decent ones. I have had 4.5 years use of the original 3 18V NiMh packs that came with my Makita combi and they are only just beginning to show a slight reduction in capacity - however they are still very good. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#15
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article ,
John Rumm wrote: Don't bother with cheap drills. Buy a Makita (or Metabo, etc.. i.e. good) Li-On. You will thank God every few minutes that you did. Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. I don't agree that NiCd or NiMh are necessarily a waste of money. You can have excellent service from wither if you start with decent ones. I have had 4.5 years use of the original 3 18V NiMh packs that came with my Makita combi and they are only just beginning to show a slight reduction in capacity - however they are still very good. Absolutely. To hear some people talk you'd think rechargeables started with LiIon. -- *Reality is the illusion that occurs due to the lack of alcohol * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#16
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 16:53:13 +0100, John Rumm wrote:
TheOldFellow wrote: On Mon, 6 Apr 2009 00:24:01 +0100 "JDT2Q" wrote: Hi Folks, About 7 years ago I bought a cordless drill and have used it lots since. IIRC it cost about £70 - not a professional's standard but good for DIY. Don't bother with cheap drills. Buy a Makita (or Metabo, etc.. i.e. good) Li-On. You will thank God every few minutes that you did. Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. I don't agree that NiCd or NiMh are necessarily a waste of money. You can have excellent service from wither if you start with decent ones. I have had 4.5 years use of the original 3 18V NiMh packs that came with my Makita combi and they are only just beginning to show a slight reduction in capacity - however they are still very good. Seconded. When I see a DeWalt or Makita Li-Ion drill at something over £250 a pop, then compare them with the sub-£20 18V I use, I just can't see that these "professional" units are 10 times better. For my use, they're not even twice as good (since both have 2 batteries). OK, it might be Porsche vs. Ford, but most people are qute content with cheap/cheerful/gets-the-job-done. |
#17
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
B&D have always been a bit variable. A brand doesn't necessarily guarantee consistency of design or quality. Except perhaps at the top end. Granted they are all mains, but I have a B&D hammer drill, a B&D planer & a B&D 185mm circular saw. I've found them all to be excellent. Circular saw is a bit of a heavy lump, which is its only drawback. -- Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk |
#18
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
I re-celled one pack of my Ryobi kit because the two drills in it are fine.
Decent tabbed cells are about £2 each though. It *is* a lot of work and expense, but I hate throwing good hardware away. Cheap cordless drills are false economy though. |
#19
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
pete wrote:
On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 16:53:13 +0100, John Rumm wrote: TheOldFellow wrote: On Mon, 6 Apr 2009 00:24:01 +0100 "JDT2Q" wrote: Hi Folks, About 7 years ago I bought a cordless drill and have used it lots since. IIRC it cost about £70 - not a professional's standard but good for DIY. Don't bother with cheap drills. Buy a Makita (or Metabo, etc.. i.e. good) Li-On. You will thank God every few minutes that you did. Nicad and Nimh batteries are a waste of money - however cheap they are. I don't agree that NiCd or NiMh are necessarily a waste of money. You can have excellent service from wither if you start with decent ones. I have had 4.5 years use of the original 3 18V NiMh packs that came with my Makita combi and they are only just beginning to show a slight reduction in capacity - however they are still very good. Seconded. When I see a DeWalt or Makita Li-Ion drill at something over £250 a pop, then compare them with the sub-£20 18V I use, I just can't see that these "professional" units are 10 times better. For my use, they're not even twice as good (since both have 2 batteries). My drill with three NiMh batteries was about £250 IIRC. I would say it is easily more than 10x better than the cheap tat versions. The whole package just works so much better. OK, it might be Porsche vs. Ford, but most people are qute content with cheap/cheerful/gets-the-job-done. No objection to cheap'n'cheerful, its the gets the job done bit that is in question. Good battery drills not only make the job much easier, they will also do a much wide range of jobs in the first place. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#20
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article ,
The Medway Handyman wrote: Dave Plowman (News) wrote: B&D have always been a bit variable. A brand doesn't necessarily guarantee consistency of design or quality. Except perhaps at the top end. Granted they are all mains, but I have a B&D hammer drill, a B&D planer & a B&D 185mm circular saw. I've found them all to be excellent. Circular saw is a bit of a heavy lump, which is its only drawback. Yes - I've got several older B&D mains tools which are good - I've not felt the need to replace them which says something. Duds were their jigsaw where the support roller only lasts a few weeks, the electronic two speed control not much longer and a fairly expensive router where the fan disintegrated followed by the armature burning out. Spares are available but very expensive. Then of course there is the notorious Scorpion saw and their electric stapler. -- *The severity of the itch is proportional to the reach * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#21
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article , pete
wrote: I don't agree that NiCd or NiMh are necessarily a waste of money. You can have excellent service from wither if you start with decent ones. I have had 4.5 years use of the original 3 18V NiMh packs that came with my Makita combi and they are only just beginning to show a slight reduction in capacity - however they are still very good. Seconded. When I see a DeWalt or Makita Li-Ion drill at something over £250 a pop, then compare them with the sub-£20 18V I use, I just can't see that these "professional" units are 10 times better. For my use, they're not even twice as good (since both have 2 batteries). There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. OK, it might be Porsche vs. Ford, but most people are qute content with cheap/cheerful/gets-the-job-done. 'Ford' drivers often are because they ain't ever driven a 'Porsche'. ;-) -- *Okay, who stopped the payment on my reality check? * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#22
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , pete wrote: I don't agree that NiCd or NiMh are necessarily a waste of money. You can have excellent service from wither if you start with decent ones. I have had 4.5 years use of the original 3 18V NiMh packs that came with my Makita combi and they are only just beginning to show a slight reduction in capacity - however they are still very good. Seconded. When I see a DeWalt or Makita Li-Ion drill at something over £250 a pop, then compare them with the sub-£20 18V I use, I just can't see that these "professional" units are 10 times better. For my use, they're not even twice as good (since both have 2 batteries). There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. Agreed. My (several) Makita drills/drivers/impact drivers feel like they are almost part of your hand, the ergonomics are superb, speed control is excellent and, as you say, low end torque is brill. Speed control is so good you can use a Mak on plastic ceiling roses without cracking them for example. I'd rate a 12v Mak against a 14.4v or even 18v cheapie any day. Didn't have that opinion until I started using stuff six days a week on sometimes demanding jobs. -- Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk |
#23
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. |
#24
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:45:23 +0100, dennis@home wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. One thing you need to remember is that the professionals on this NG have a different set of values from "us" amateurs - who maybe do a little woodworking or suchlike from time to time. For a start, anything they buy is classed as a business expense. So they claim back the VAT _and_ buy things using pre-taxed income (and without N.I. either) That automatically means that they have to earn far less - usually less than half as much to buy a tool than the rest of us. Also, they value reliability and ruggedness more than we (well, I) do. If one of my tools breaks down, I just go and do something else with my spare time. For a pro, if a tool breaks - that's lost income. (Same with havig to wait for batteries to charge). So while it's nice to be able to pick their brains and get advice of how to do jobs, we must remember that their opinions about what is value for money are based on a different set of requirements than amateurs have. |
#25
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
On 7 Apr, 09:21, pete wrote:
On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:45:23 +0100, dennis@home wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. One thing you need to remember is that the professionals on this NG have a different set of values from "us" amateurs - who maybe do a little woodworking or suchlike from time to time. For a start, anything they buy is classed as a business expense. So they claim back the VAT _and_ buy things using pre-taxed income (and without N.I. either) That automatically means that they have to earn far less - usually less than half as much to buy a tool than the rest of us. Also, they value reliability and ruggedness more than we (well, I) do. If one of my tools breaks down, I just go and do something else with my spare time. For a pro, if a tool breaks - that's lost income. (Same with havig to wait for batteries to charge). So while it's nice to be able to pick their brains and get advice of how to do jobs, we must remember that their opinions about what is value for money are based on a different set of requirements than amateurs have. wise words - well written! cheers jim |
#26
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
On 07 Apr 2009 08:21:20 GMT, pete wrote:
On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:45:23 +0100, dennis@home wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. One thing you need to remember is that the professionals on this NG have a different set of values from "us" amateurs - who maybe do a little woodworking or suchlike from time to time. And ironically often means 'we' (amateurs) have a more difficult job, like learning to play an instrument on a 'learners' version? Re the quality of cells etc. I used to race RC electric cars and I know how much difference a make of a particular spec cell can make (generally directly related to the price). However, I guess it's possible (in not actually probable) that a manufacturer of a big branded cordless product could use at least reasonable spec cells? I was thinking that they would still have to balance their reputation with cost / profit etc. A good mate has just given me 3 of his Dewalt 12V drills as I have one and he has moved over (up?) to later spec stuff. They also came with flat batteries and 2 of the 3 seem to have recovered sufficiently for me to do a small job with each (and they were still going when I'd finished). I was also given a Hi-Cap battery (2Ah) that still seems to be pretty dead but luckily being 12V and NiMH I still have some RC chargers that might be able to cycle the pack and maybe get them going again. Thinking on this irregular use thing I was wondering if I could keep the cells on some tiny solar panels, just enough to compensate for the self discharge? Cheers, T i m |
#27
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article ,
dennis@home wrote: There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. The amount of current a cell can supply is one mark of its quality. And I can assure you cheap ones can't supply as much current. Think it's down to the internal resistance - and a low internal resistance makes the speed controller work better. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. I can assure you it did. I'd bought a second battery before re-celling the old one. Chalk and cheese. -- *In "Casablanca", Humphrey Bogart never said "Play it again, Sam" * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#28
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
In article ,
pete wrote: I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. One thing you need to remember is that the professionals on this NG have a different set of values from "us" amateurs - who maybe do a little woodworking or suchlike from time to time. For a start, anything they buy is classed as a business expense. So they claim back the VAT _and_ buy things using pre-taxed income (and without N.I. either) That automatically means that they have to earn far less - usually less than half as much to buy a tool than the rest of us. I'm not a pro and can't claim back anything for a tool of this sort. Or at least haven't tried to. Also, they value reliability and ruggedness more than we (well, I) do. If one of my tools breaks down, I just go and do something else with my spare time. For a pro, if a tool breaks - that's lost income. (Same with havig to wait for batteries to charge). Really for simple DIY you're better off with a mains drill. You're unlikely to be far enough away from a socket to make this a problem. But for some reason simple DIYers want a cordless one - even although they have nothing going for them in terms of drilling performance. And lots of disadvantages. So while it's nice to be able to pick their brains and get advice of how to do jobs, we must remember that their opinions about what is value for money are based on a different set of requirements than amateurs have. I certainly wouldn't deny a cheap cordless drill will do what it says on the box. But then so will a cheap chisel - but will need sharpening more often and may not take as keen an edge as a good one. Many here are into DIY because they enjoy it - as well as it perhaps being a necessity, cost wise. And decent tools add to that enjoyment. Try telling a golfer the cheapest clubs do the job just as well. ;-) -- *Everybody lies, but it doesn't matter since nobody listens* Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
#29
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
dennis@home wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. Two points really; firstly the cheaper cells often don't supply the same current - so the run speed may be the same, but the maximum torque is less - sometime by quite a margin. Secondly remember that battery packs are made from multiple cells. The cheaper cells are often less well matched than the batter quality ones. A pack made from mismatched cells will not perform as well to start with, and will also fail sooner since individual cells will fail doe to abuse sooner. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. They probably were in a sense... -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#30
Posted to uk.d-i-y
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cellsrequested.
pete wrote:
On Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:45:23 +0100, dennis@home wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... There's a world of difference between a cheapo drill and a decent one in performance - and mainly down to the better batteries. Good make batteries give much more low end torque and make the tool more useful for screwdriving, etc. I re-celled a PPro 18v with decent cells and it improved it enormously. But it doesn't feel as nice to use as my Makita. I find this hard to understand. Even cheap cells will supply more than enough current for the motor to run at its maximum. I do know that cheap cells may not last as long but I seriously doubt if you could make a PPro run better by just swapping the cells unless the original cells were already faulty. One thing you need to remember is that the professionals on this NG have a different set of values from "us" amateurs - who maybe do a little woodworking or suchlike from time to time. Some of us amateurs appreciate there is more to a tool than just price though... For a start, anything they buy is classed as a business expense. So they claim back the VAT _and_ buy things using pre-taxed income (and without N.I. either) That automatically means that they have to earn far less - usually less than half as much to buy a tool than the rest of us. Indeed, very true. Also, they value reliability and ruggedness more than we (well, I) do. If one of my tools breaks down, I just go and do something else with my spare time. For a pro, if a tool breaks - that's lost income. (Same with havig to wait for batteries to charge). If you can charge in a hour or so, then you can do useful work by the simple expedient of have a spare batt or two. If it takes 16 hours however, then its a practical hindrance regardless of if you are doing work for reward or fun! So while it's nice to be able to pick their brains and get advice of how to do jobs, we must remember that their opinions about what is value for money are based on a different set of requirements than amateurs have. I would say they are not as different in reality as you might expect. Many non business people may fall into the trap of not attaching value to their time and as a result underestimate the cost of doing various jobs. However there are other scales by which an amateur may wish to measure these things. One decent quality tool may be more versatile than the budget one, and hence can replace several - keeping the overall cost the same, and improving the value. One may care about the quality of the result - and with some budget tools you wont achieve the same quality of work regardless of how much extra time you are prepared to lavish on the job. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#31
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DIY cordless drill battery repair - cheap source for sub-C cells requested.
pete wrote:
One thing you need to remember is that the professionals on this NG have a different set of values from "us" amateurs - who maybe do a little woodworking or suchlike from time to time. For a start, anything they buy is classed as a business expense. So they claim back the VAT _and_ buy things using pre-taxed income (and without N.I. either) That automatically means that they have to earn far less - usually less than half as much to buy a tool than the rest of us. Also, they value reliability and ruggedness more than we (well, I) do. If one of my tools breaks down, I just go and do something else with my spare time. For a pro, if a tool breaks - that's lost income. (Same with havig to wait for batteries to charge). So while it's nice to be able to pick their brains and get advice of how to do jobs, we must remember that their opinions about what is value for money are based on a different set of requirements than amateurs have. Quite right Pete. -- Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk |
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