Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
Reply |
|
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails,
the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? or is there an even better option? I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! -- [george] |
#2
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
George (dicegeorge) wrote in
There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? or is there an even better option? I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! I'm with you on that - being scared of ladders is nature's way of stopping you plunging to the ground from one. As far as the roof is concerned, have you thought about sprayed foam insulation? I have to admit to having had something to do with these folks on a commercial basis a while back but they do claim that it's cheaper than having a re-roof and there's the benefit of insulation and a permanent fix for the tiles. http://www.foamspray.co.uk/benefits.html -- PeterMcC If you feel that any of the above is incorrect, inappropriate or offensive in any way, please ignore it and accept my apologies. |
#3
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 17:15:12 +0100, PeterMcC wrote:
As far as the roof is concerned, have you thought about sprayed foam insulation? I have to admit to having had something to do with these folks on a commercial basis a while back but they do claim that it's cheaper than having a re-roof and there's the benefit of insulation and a permanent fix for the tiles. http://www.foamspray.co.uk/benefits.html We have that here on a rented place (that we might end up buying one day...) Seems fine, *but* almost anyone I mention it to sucks their teeth and says 'ooh the damp gets into the joists'. Any first hand experiences, good or bad? |
#4
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
George (dicegeorge) wrote:
There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! That's a good idea anyway. Tanner-'op |
#5
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
In article , Tanner-'op
writes George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. Totally agree, a failsafe (faildry?) system has to be better than one which allows damp ingress on a single point of failure. or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) I thought all slate roofs were close boarded but that's what living in Scotlandshire does for your perceptions. If cost isn't an object and you might insulate or convert the loft later then a breathable membrane in place of felt would be a further improvement. Any (unlikely) damp ingress below the membrane would have a chance of escape in warmer weather, saving timbers from potential rot. -- fred Plusnet - I hope you like vanilla |
#6
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Seems fine, *but* almost anyone I mention it to sucks their teeth and says 'ooh the damp gets into the joists'. The danger is that any rain blown under the slates will be trapped for much longer than normal between slate and insulation and will lead to wood rot in the rafters. |
#7
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
|
#8
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
"fred" wrote in message ... In article , Tanner-'op writes George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. Totally agree, a failsafe (faildry?) system has to be better than one which allows damp ingress on a single point of failure. Except a single point of failure (a single slate slipping) does not result in a leak unless the slate below is also faulty. Anyway I fail to understand the reliance on a material with a much lesser life than the 100 years plus of 2 layers of slate. OK there are now better materials than traditional felt. Jim A |
#9
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Jim Alexander wrote:
"fred" wrote in message ... In article , Tanner-'op writes George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. Totally agree, a failsafe (faildry?) system has to be better than one which allows damp ingress on a single point of failure. Except a single point of failure (a single slate slipping) does not result in a leak unless the slate below is also faulty. Well that's what the felt is there for - just in case more than one slate breaks or slips! Anyway I fail to understand the reliance on a material with a much lesser life than the 100 years plus of 2 layers of slate. Slate is a rather brittle material, especially if a ridge tile blows off and bounces down the roof or, frost gets into a small crack and does it 'dirty work' over a period of time! OK there are now better materials than traditional felt. You have to use a 'permeable membrane' material now rather than the old bituminous felt. Tanner-'op |
#10
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Jim Alexander wrote:
"fred" wrote in message ... In article , Tanner-'op writes George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. Totally agree, a failsafe (faildry?) system has to be better than one which allows damp ingress on a single point of failure. Except a single point of failure (a single slate slipping) does not result in a leak unless the slate below is also faulty. Anyway I fail to understand the reliance on a material with a much lesser life than the 100 years plus of 2 layers of slate. OK there are now better materials than traditional felt. Jim A Without felt you'd be in trouble if it rained halfway through the job. Certainly easier than lugging tarpaulins over the roof |
#11
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
fred wrote:
In article , Tanner-'op writes George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. Totally agree, a failsafe (faildry?) system has to be better than one which allows damp ingress on a single point of failure. or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) I thought all slate roofs were close boarded but that's what living in Scotlandshire does for your perceptions. If cost isn't an object and you might insulate or convert the loft later then a breathable membrane in place of felt would be a further improvement. Any (unlikely) damp ingress below the membrane would have a chance of escape in warmer weather, saving timbers from potential rot. Fred, No not all slate roofs are close boarded - that is usually reserved for the 'better' class of building and the 'normal' house these days (and in the past) is simply trussed, felted, battened and tiled - using a permeable (breathable) sraking felt as a matter of course. Tanner-'op |
#12
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
"PeterMcC" wrote in message ... George (dicegeorge) wrote in There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? or is there an even better option? I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! I'm with you on that - being scared of ladders is nature's way of stopping you plunging to the ground from one. As far as the roof is concerned, have you thought about sprayed foam insulation? I have to admit to having had something to do with these folks on a commercial basis a while back but they do claim that it's cheaper than having a re-roof and there's the benefit of insulation and a permanent fix for the tiles. If you watched any consumer advice programmes you would avoid spray on insulation at all costs! Keep well away. Get your local builder to do the job and use what he suggests. |
#13
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
If you watched any consumer advice programmes you would avoid spray on insulation at all costs! Keep well away. Are you sure that doesn't just mean stay away from cowboy contractors? The principle seems to work well enough though I wouldn't risk it myself. |
#14
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Building next to ours had the foam treatment about 15 years ago. I sucked my teeth at the time but it appears I was wrong. A friend also had foam on the back of unfelted slates. That seems to have been good for many years. However 15 years isn't long in the lifetime of a roof - and usually there is some hope both of reusing roof coverings and that the rafters will not need attention - neither may be possible when a foam treated roof finally does need attention. Another factor is professionalism. I would suspect that a foam treatment could be used to patch up a failing roof without fixing the real problems - rain leakage may no longer be seen - but rafter damage may be occurring. |
#15
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
On 28 Apr, 16:56, "George \(dicegeorge\)"
wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? or is there an even better option? I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! -- * * * * * * * * * *[george] If you have this situation it is indicative of the current roof reaching the end of its useful life. It is certainly better to re- cover that just patch. I would suggest that a breathable membrane is better than 'felt' see : http://www.bbacerts.co.uk/pdf/brtu.pdf You should not have to spend too much on new slates as the existing slates should be perfectly ok, unless they are spalling or going 'mushy' , so don't pay for a whole roof of slates when you shouldn't need more than 10% replacement (broken, missing). Whatever you do don't use that stick-on-foam stuff it will rot the woodwork. best of luck |
#16
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
George (dicegeorge) wrote:
There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? Well there are better materials that last longer, and yes you should use SOMETHING. or is there an even better option? I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! No criticism on that score from me.;-) |
#17
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Rob wrote:
"PeterMcC" wrote in message ... George (dicegeorge) wrote in There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? or is there an even better option? I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! I'm with you on that - being scared of ladders is nature's way of stopping you plunging to the ground from one. As far as the roof is concerned, have you thought about sprayed foam insulation? I have to admit to having had something to do with these folks on a commercial basis a while back but they do claim that it's cheaper than having a re-roof and there's the benefit of insulation and a permanent fix for the tiles. If you watched any consumer advice programmes you would avoid spray on insulation at all costs! Keep well away. Get your local builder to do the job and use what he suggests. The point is te roof is a cold roof typically, so the insulation does bugger all. On sound timbers, it probably means they will rot in 25 years instead of 100 years. |
#18
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Tanner-'op wrote:
George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. The purpoe is to avoid low pressure over the slates due to wind ripping them off: the felt later is not for waterproofing, it is for windproofing. By and large there are too many holes in it where nail;s get driven through to rely on it for waterproofing. I know then when my roof was felted up before tiling, there were loads of leaks when it rained, ****ing all over the timbers. or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! That's a good idea anyway. Tanner-'op |
#19
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Tanner-'op wrote: George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. The purpoe is to avoid low pressure over the slates due to wind ripping them off: the felt later is not for waterproofing, it is for windproofing. You cannot avoid "low pressure over the roof" - and it is usually the low pressure that lifts the slates off on the leeward side of the roof (this creates a vacuum and 'sucks' the slates upwards and snapping them) and not on the windward side. Direct wind pressure usually just pushes the slates down onto each other/ The felt is for 'windproofing' ?? Not sure what mean here as the felt has no wind proofong qualities as such in this situation - it is there simply as stop-gap against water penetration. As a matter of interest, you need a certain amount of airflow under the edges of the felt/slates/tiles/eaves/cavites to prevent interstitial condensation forming on the underside of the felt in the attic. Stopping all that airflow can cause trouble - as people have found to their cost when insulating the cavities and loft space without leaving room for an airflow. By and large there are too many holes in it where nail;s get driven through to rely on it for waterproofing. I know then when my roof was felted up before tiling, there were loads of leaks when it rained, ****ing all over the timbers. Then the felt was poorly fixed or nails have 'missed' the rafters - I have seen roofs around 20 tiles missing and no water in the attic! or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) Tanner-'op |
#20
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:12:35 +0100, a particular chimpanzee,
"Tanner-'op" randomly hit the keyboard and produced: Jim Alexander wrote: OK there are now better materials than traditional felt. You have to use a 'permeable membrane' material now rather than the old bituminous felt. You don't "have to"; bituminous felt is still acceptable. I would go for a breather membrane, though. -- Hugo Nebula "If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this, just how far from the pack have you strayed?" |
#21
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:16:07 +0100, a particular chimpanzee,
"Tanner-'op" randomly hit the keyboard and produced: fred wrote: I thought all slate roofs were close boarded but that's what living in Scotlandshire does for your perceptions. No not all slate roofs are close boarded - that is usually reserved for the 'better' class of building and the 'normal' house these days (and in the past) is simply trussed, felted, battened and tiled - using a permeable (breathable) sraking felt as a matter of course. AFAIK it is a requirement for all new roofs in Scotland, not so in the rest of the UK. It may have been used on higher status buildings in the past where a higher standard of weatherproofing may have been needed (by the coast, for example), but it was by no means common, and it is virtually unknown these days (except when the roofer is Scottish). -- Hugo Nebula "If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this, just how far from the pack have you strayed?" |
#22
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Tanner-'op wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote: Tanner-'op wrote: George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. The purpoe is to avoid low pressure over the slates due to wind ripping them off: the felt later is not for waterproofing, it is for windproofing. You cannot avoid "low pressure over the roof" - and it is usually the low pressure that lifts the slates off on the leeward side of the roof (this creates a vacuum and 'sucks' the slates upwards and snapping them) and not on the windward side. Direct wind pressure usually just pushes the slates down onto each other/ Exactly,. By having the felt, you also guarantee that the air inside the loft at a higher pressure cant travel to wards that low pressure and push te slates off. I.e. the felt allows a low pressure area in BITH sides f the slates. The felt is for 'windproofing' ?? Not sure what mean here as the felt has no wind proofong qualities as such in this situation - it is there simply as stop-gap against water penetration. No, it is not. It is there to prevent the above. It does very little to prevent water ingress which is why we dont have fully felted rooves, and we do have many tiled rooves without felty. As a matter of interest, you need a certain amount of airflow under the edges of the felt/slates/tiles/eaves/cavites to prevent interstitial condensation forming on the underside of the felt in the attic. Stopping all that airflow can cause trouble - as people have found to their cost when insulating the cavities and loft space without leaving room for an airflow. I know that: that's the big danger point. It allows the inside pressure to be at atmospheric when a low pressure zone exists outside: thats why the felt is needed, to stop that blowing back out except via the eaves.. By and large there are too many holes in it where nail;s get driven through to rely on it for waterproofing. I know then when my roof was felted up before tiling, there were loads of leaks when it rained, ****ing all over the timbers. Then the felt was poorly fixed or nails have 'missed' the rafters - I have seen roofs around 20 tiles missing and no water in the attic! So have I, when its eithetr not raining or its all soaked into the insulation/ or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) Tanner-'op |
#23
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Hugo Nebula wrote:
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:12:35 +0100, a particular chimpanzee, "Tanner-'op" randomly hit the keyboard and produced: Jim Alexander wrote: OK there are now better materials than traditional felt. You have to use a 'permeable membrane' material now rather than the old bituminous felt. You don't "have to"; bituminous felt is still acceptable. I would go for a breather membrane, though. Permeable membrane is not needed in a 'cold roof' Its there to vent 'warm roof' spaces where the joists are covered and there is very little movement past them as they are insulated, with a small air gap. |
#24
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
CUT. As far as the roof is concerned, have you thought about sprayed foam insulation? I have to admit to having had something to do with these folks on a commercial basis a while back but they do claim that it's cheaper than having a re-roof and there's the benefit of insulation and a permanent fix for the tiles. If you watched any consumer advice programmes you would avoid spray on insulation at all costs! Keep well away. Get your local builder to do the job and use what he suggests. NO!! don't get your local builder to do the job. Get a recommended roofing contractor. As far as spray on, it only holds on the underside of the slates or tiles on in the roof space. When the exposed bottom half falls out where does the rain go. From professional experience getting a tile or slate out, of a sprayed roof is a nightmare. You have to go inside and cut away all the foam about 18" all round to release one tile or slate. If you ever have to strip a roof all the slates or tiles are covered in the crap. Everything is stuck together, spars, lath's and outer covering. From a professional, KEEP WELL AWAY FROM SPRAY ON By the way any roof either new or re roofed must by regs have a vapour barrier underlay. |
#25
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
George (dicegeorge) wrote:
At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? or is there an even better option? I'm very happy with my DuPont Tyvek Supro sealed counter-battened permeable membrane system, this tells you everything you need to know: http://www2.dupont.com/Tyvek_Constru...oofs_tyvek.pdf It provides good ventilation to stop water vapor developing in the loft, but also stops the wind blowing through, especially if you seal under the eaves carriers with expanding foam. Using this technique gets the most out of your insulation so keeps your heating bills down since the heat is not blown away through the loft. On the slate front I'm very pleased with Spannish Forna, you might want to have a word with these guys: http://www.bellevueroofingsupplies.co.uk/ who seems to cut a very good deal, but they like you to collect from any distance. One word of caution, be very careful with how your contractor intends to deal with the edges, abutments, verges, valleys, whatever. A number of GRP products, such as secret gutters for abutments are available which ensure you don't get leak problems, far too many try to bodge flashings without soakers or secret gutters. I had to re-timber a roof because of lack of attention to detail in this area. Roofing really seems to be a case of the devil being in the detail. |
#26
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
what is 'close boarded' ?
A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) -- [george] ~ "Tanner-'op" wrote in message ... George (dicegeorge) wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. A good decision. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? There is every reason to *USE* felt. The main one is that if a slate slips or breaks then the felt (if properly fitted) will prevent water from entering the roof space until the slate can be replaced. or is there an even better option? A close boarded roof with felt and slate (Welsh slate being the best) but the cost will frighten you! :-) I will use a professional for this as I almost broke my back in a fall a few years ago, and ladders scare me! That's a good idea anyway. Tanner-'op |
#27
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
In article , The Natural
Philosopher writes Hugo Nebula wrote: On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:12:35 +0100, a particular chimpanzee, "Tanner-'op" randomly hit the keyboard and produced: Jim Alexander wrote: OK there are now better materials than traditional felt. You have to use a 'permeable membrane' material now rather than the old bituminous felt. You don't "have to"; bituminous felt is still acceptable. I would go for a breather membrane, though. Permeable membrane is not needed in a 'cold roof' Its there to vent 'warm roof' spaces where the joists are covered and there is very little movement past them as they are insulated, with a small air gap. Indeed, making it future proof in case you want to build into the roofspace and want to maximise the usable space. -- fred Plusnet - I hope you like vanilla |
#28
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
In article , Hugo Nebula
abuse@localhost.? writes On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:16:07 +0100, a particular chimpanzee, "Tanner-'op" randomly hit the keyboard and produced: fred wrote: I thought all slate roofs were close boarded but that's what living in Scotlandshire does for your perceptions. No not all slate roofs are close boarded - that is usually reserved for the 'better' class of building and the 'normal' house these days (and in the past) is simply trussed, felted, battened and tiled - using a permeable (breathable) sraking felt as a matter of course. AFAIK it is a requirement for all new roofs in Scotland, not so in the rest of the UK. It may have been used on higher status buildings in the past where a higher standard of weatherproofing may have been needed (by the coast, for example), but it was by no means common, and it is virtually unknown these days (except when the roofer is Scottish). I've never seen an unboarded roof in Scotland but that's not authoritative of course. Tell a lie, I have, but it was a barn. -- fred Plusnet - I hope you like vanilla |
#29
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
George (dicegeorge) wrote in message ... what is 'close boarded' ? This is, looking up at my roof from the loft http://i32.tinypic.com/16kw9ds.jpg - |
#30
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
blue wrote:
On 28 Apr, 16:56, "George \(dicegeorge\)" wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. Its always in the builder's interest to recommend this, as they get 4 figures rather than 3. IMLE most of these recommendations have been inappropriate. Slate roofs shed slates over time, and the point at which its best to reslate is purely economic, ie when the cost of replacing a handful of slates every so many years works out to more than the cost of a reroof. One house had around 20 slates replaced several years ago after decades of neglect, and hasnt had any more work needed since. I havent seen or know the history of the roof, but more often than not just replacing missing slates is the more economic and satisfactory option. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? felt is a good backup, though not essential functionally. or is there an even better option? yes, fibre cement. But it costs, and the cost isnt normally warranted. I hope you stay well away from foam. There are more probems with it, such as the fact that it becomes impossible to inspect the roof structure, hence if structural rot occurs, you wont know until there is an eventual complete collapse. And it does significantly raise the chance of rot. NT |
#31
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
The message
from Hugo Nebula abuse@localhost contains these words: AFAIK it is a requirement for all new roofs in Scotland, not so in the rest of the UK. It may have been used on higher status buildings in the past where a higher standard of weatherproofing may have been needed (by the coast, for example), but it was by no means common, and it is virtually unknown these days (except when the roofer is Scottish). My first experience of building work was helping out on a house reconstruction in Argyll one summer holiday in 1961 or 62. Even then that roof was boarded first, and by a English Builder from Stoke-on-Trent of all places. -- Roger Chapman Sure as Hell My next Computer Won't be a Dell |
#32
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
One word of caution, be very careful with how your contractor intends to deal with the edges, abutments, verges, valleys, whatever. A number of GRP products, such as secret gutters for abutments are available which ensure you don't get leak problems, far too many try to bodge flashings without soakers or secret gutters. I had to re-timber a roof because of lack of attention to detail in this area. Roofing really seems to be a case of the devil being in the detail. I can heartily endorse this: I had some good people and some not so good people working on my tiled roof. The not so good did one side, and the rain came in, at which point the good pair lifted the tiles and showed me the crappy soakers that were totally useless. And made some new ones. The final demise of te old hose was in fact a valley that no one seemed able to fix. The new house that replaced it has two similar valleys, with lead going infeasible distances under the tiles and thatch (its where a tile section now abuts a thatch section: blame the council planners for wanting it that way). |
#33
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
Mark wrote:
George (dicegeorge) wrote in message ... what is 'close boarded' ? This is, looking up at my roof from the loft http://i32.tinypic.com/16kw9ds.jpg - The very best way to stop tiles being blown off. And limit arctic gales in the loft. And, in the context of a complete re-slate, not that expensive to do. |
#34
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
There are rotten roof rafters with woodworm because of decades of leaks,
so i think the whole lot of slates should come off and the wood be patched, replaced, and sprayed. It's quite a steep roof, half of a large victorian house. We're half way up a hill, wth trees behind the house, so i dont think that sarking/boarding will be necessary. The advantage of having no felting seems to me to be that when there is a small leak I can find it from underneath, damp patches in the attic and ceilings, whereas with felt the damp problem would be hidden, and may be rotting wood away secretly. But most of you recommend a modern felting material. There are a few roof spaces that could in future be converted to living spaces, that's a future project, this summer I just want to get the roof derotted and watertight. And maybe get the hot water working. -- [george] ~ [g] ~ ~ ~ ~ 07970 378 572 ~ ~ www.dicegeorge.com ~ ~ (c)2008 ~ ~ ~ wrote in message ... blue wrote: On 28 Apr, 16:56, "George \(dicegeorge\)" wrote: There are lots of slipped slates on my roof, with rusty nails, the local builder recommends reslating the whole roof rather than patching it again and again. Its always in the builder's interest to recommend this, as they get 4 figures rather than 3. IMLE most of these recommendations have been inappropriate. Slate roofs shed slates over time, and the point at which its best to reslate is purely economic, ie when the cost of replacing a handful of slates every so many years works out to more than the cost of a reroof. One house had around 20 slates replaced several years ago after decades of neglect, and hasnt had any more work needed since. I havent seen or know the history of the roof, but more often than not just replacing missing slates is the more economic and satisfactory option. At the moment there is no felt, he advises felt, is there any reason not to use felt? felt is a good backup, though not essential functionally. or is there an even better option? yes, fibre cement. But it costs, and the cost isnt normally warranted. I hope you stay well away from foam. There are more probems with it, such as the fact that it becomes impossible to inspect the roof structure, hence if structural rot occurs, you wont know until there is an eventual complete collapse. And it does significantly raise the chance of rot. NT |
#35
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
George (dicegeorge) wrote:
There are rotten roof rafters with woodworm because of decades of leaks, so i think the whole lot of slates should come off and the wood be patched, replaced, and sprayed. It's quite a steep roof, half of a large victorian house. We're half way up a hill, wth trees behind the house, so i dont think that sarking/boarding will be necessary. The advantage of having no felting seems to me to be that when there is a small leak I can find it from underneath, damp patches in the attic and ceilings, whereas with felt the damp problem would be hidden, and may be rotting wood away secretly. But most of you recommend a modern felting material. There are a few roof spaces that could in future be converted to living spaces, that's a future project, this summer I just want to get the roof derotted and watertight. And maybe get the hot water working. Do the job properly then. Strip it. New timbers or treat the old, and FELT it with at least a breathable membrane. Proper eves vents with insect mesh, and maybe a ridge vent or two. At this level it s probably a Building Notification matter, and I suspect they wont let you do any less actually. I would even consider boarding it frankly - exterior grade ply ..adds a lot of strength and windproofing. If you have the budget, and its sensible given the construction, I would also insulate between the rafters and board it out inside. Make a nice room out of a crabby old loft. |
#36
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
stuart's reminder of it raining halfway through is the strongest argument
for felting... i guess the roofer will take the slates off first, cover it with plastic, then the wood people will replace the rotten rafters and spray them then recover with plastic, then the roofer will put in battens and felt then slowly fit slates over the top... it's a complicated roof, and last summer it rained and rained, and i have computers and books etcetera in the rooms below, and very fancy plaster in some of the rooms below what do roofing contractors do in rainy weather? "Stuart Noble" wrote in message ... Without felt you'd be in trouble if it rained halfway through the job. Certainly easier than lugging tarpaulins over the roof |
#37
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
wrote :
also insulate between the rafters and board it out inside. That's something I can DIY in the winter after they're gone isnt it? Whether or not it's boarded on the top? And even maybe give it a year or two first to see if there are any leaks where they forgot a few nails. -- [george] |
#38
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
ive just uploaded a picture of the roof
http://www.dicegeorge.com/psb/psimg/...-sharpened.jpg there's a lot to do! -- [george] |
#39
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
On Apr 29, 2:03*pm, "George \(dicegeorge\)"
wrote: wrote : also insulate between the rafters and board it out inside. That's something I can DIY in the winter after they're gone isnt it? Whether or not it's boarded on the top? Do yourself a favour and get all the wood you're likely to need into the roof space while they're redoing the roof. The access is much bigger than your loft hatch, meaning you can get nice big sheets up, which will save you an arm and a leg, and a LOT of time! Jon. |
#40
Posted to uk.d-i-y
|
|||
|
|||
slate roof - felt or not?
In article , George (dicegeorge)
writes ive just uploaded a picture of the roof http://www.dicegeorge.com/psb/psimg/...-sharpened.jpg there's a lot to do! Oooh, that is a lot. The benefit of boarding and the use of breathable membrane is that it leaves your options open to do absolutely anything underneath in the future. You've clearly got some dormer and used attic space so the option of a warm roof is useful and the small additional cost over a basic job should be worth it. I'm used to seeing roofs in relatively exposed situations so would automatically tend towards boarding, felting/membraning, battening, counter battening and finishing. Although possibly with variations depending on the final roof finishing. I wouldn't like to see membrane flapping loose over rafters. -- fred Plusnet - I hope you like vanilla |
Reply |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Shed roof felt blown off, timber roof wet, should I... | UK diy | |||
cost for slate or synthetic slate roof? | Home Ownership | |||
New felt on a flat roof | UK diy | |||
No roof felt...is this normal? | UK diy | |||
garage roof felt | UK diy |