[benpost]

i am considering the above for my kitchen but cant decide, tiles i
think are better quality and feel more long term/solid. laminate
probably easier to lay but not as long lasting.

has anyone experience of both of these floorings for a kitchen? the
heating pipes run under the floor so it shouldnt get too cold. its
only a small kitchen and i have just taken up the old ceramic tiles,
leaving a pretty even surface of concrete, black tar like adhesive and
some old thin vinyl style tiles (probs there when the flat was
built-30-or so years ago)

i only found one small area where the concrete was loose and this is
where heating or water pipes had been installed and is right near a
wall where there will be units so i guess i could either leave it or
fill it in with some sort of cement(?).

once i've cleared the rubble and dustpan/brushed it all (im guessing i
dont need to worry too much about dust so not planing to hoover). then
what do i do next to prepare. ive heard self leveling isnt very good.
as i did with the walls should i use pva?

appreciate the help and advice guys, i'm finding you lot more helpful
than the diy manual!

[The Natural Philosopher]

benpost wrote:
i am considering the above for my kitchen but cant decide, tiles i
think are better quality and feel more long term/solid. laminate
probably easier to lay but not as long lasting.

has anyone experience of both of these floorings for a kitchen? the
heating pipes run under the floor so it shouldnt get too cold. its
only a small kitchen and i have just taken up the old ceramic tiles,
leaving a pretty even surface of concrete, black tar like adhesive and
some old thin vinyl style tiles (probs there when the flat was
built-30-or so years ago)

i only found one small area where the concrete was loose and this is
where heating or water pipes had been installed and is right near a
wall where there will be units so i guess i could either leave it or
fill it in with some sort of cement(?).

once i've cleared the rubble and dustpan/brushed it all (im guessing i
dont need to worry too much about dust so not planing to hoover). then
what do i do next to prepare. ive heard self leveling isnt very good.
as i did with the walls should i use pva?


Yes. I have found that PVA stabilises loose crumbly screed VERY well.
Use loads of it. It's cheap.

Don't bother self levelling for tiles. Get a GOOD quality RAPID set
adhesive - I swear by Ardex, and lay the tiles using a levelled string
as a guide, with a minimum of 4mm at the highest floor point. The cement
is very little more expensive than levelling compund, and this way it
comes out right. Mix stiff to avoid slump, in small quantities. They
really do mean rapid set.


appreciate the help and advice guys, i'm finding you lot more helpful
than the diy manual!

[benpost]

hi NP
the floor is now clear of rubble and got rid of most of the dust. most
of the floor is covered with the black adhesive stuff which was for
the original tiles when the flat was built. there are areas that
werent tiled that are a but uneven and crumbly.
what do you advise i do next. i'm thinking i might need some sort of
levelling stuff for the previously non tiled areas.
i know you said dont worry about self levelling but the concrete/sandy
areas are pretty uneven, but would be easy to level as they are
surrounding by the flat areas that were tiled.
your advice very welcomed. thanks

Yes. I have found that PVA stabilises loose crumbly screed VERY well.
Use loads of it. It's cheap.

Don't bother self levelling for tiles. Get a GOOD quality RAPID set
adhesive - I swear by Ardex, and lay the tiles using a levelled string
as a guide, with a minimum of 4mm at the highest floor point. The cement
is very little more expensive than levelling compund, and this way it
comes out right. Mix stiff to avoid slump, in small quantities. They
really do mean rapid set.



appreciate the help and advice guys, i'm finding you lot more helpful
than the diy manual!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

[The Natural Philosopher]

benpost wrote:
hi NP
the floor is now clear of rubble and got rid of most of the dust. most
of the floor is covered with the black adhesive stuff which was for
the original tiles when the flat was built. there are areas that
werent tiled that are a but uneven and crumbly.
what do you advise i do next. i'm thinking i might need some sort of
levelling stuff for the previously non tiled areas.
i know you said dont worry about self levelling but the concrete/sandy
areas are pretty uneven, but would be easy to level as they are
surrounding by the flat areas that were tiled.

Weigh up the cost of levelling compund versus GOOD tile cement and pick
the cheaper option.

Don't use sand/cement:it cracks in thin sheets.

your advice very welcomed. thanks

Yes. I have found that PVA stabilises loose crumbly screed VERY well.
Use loads of it. It's cheap.

Don't bother self levelling for tiles. Get a GOOD quality RAPID set
adhesive - I swear by Ardex, and lay the tiles using a levelled string
as a guide, with a minimum of 4mm at the highest floor point. The cement
is very little more expensive than levelling compund, and this way it
comes out right. Mix stiff to avoid slump, in small quantities. They
really do mean rapid set.



appreciate the help and advice guys, i'm finding you lot more helpful
than the diy manual!- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

[benpost]

thanks mate going to buy some tomorrow..... oh the pva, is it still
worth using that? i've got rid of most of the dust with a hoover, but
there is still some crumbly stuff here and there.

if i need pva should i do that first , then after that do the leveling/
adhesive?

cheers

[The Natural Philosopher]

benpost wrote:
thanks mate going to buy some tomorrow..... oh the pva, is it still
worth using that?

Yes.

If you only need a little get some white glue and water it down. Its
near enough.

i've got rid of most of the dust with a hoover, but
there is still some crumbly stuff here and there.

if i need pva should i do that first , then after that do the leveling/
adhesive?


You MUST seal with PVA ,with levelling compound. Otherwise the floor
'grabs' the water and the compound sets crumbly.


cheers

[benpost]

thanks NP, got the PVA (focus is a lot dearer than wickes??)

also got self levelling stuff from unibond.

will pva today. what sort of trowel do i need for the self
levelling? i saw pointing trowels but they didnt look right?

[benpost]

well just did the first coat of pva. amazing how many bits of grit the
roller picks up even after i'd hoovered it. well hopefully this first
coat (diluted 5 to 1) will seal most of it then i'll do another coat
maybe a bit thicker to finish off.

wait for that to dry then have a go with levelling compound. what type
of trowel do i need to do a basic levelling (after all its meant to
level itself?)?

[The Natural Philosopher]

benpost wrote:
thanks NP, got the PVA (focus is a lot dearer than wickes??)

also got self levelling stuff from unibond.

will pva today. what sort of trowel do i need for the self
levelling? i saw pointing trowels but they didnt look right?

don't ask me. I used a plaster float, and took hours, and it still
wasn't level :-)

I am the worlds worst plaaterer. My method is to slap it all on and then
treat like car body repair, and get the finish with a sander :-)


But you don't neeed accuracy here. The tile cement will do that last
couple of mm.

[The Natural Philosopher]

benpost wrote:
well just did the first coat of pva. amazing how many bits of grit the
roller picks up even after i'd hoovered it. well hopefully this first
coat (diluted 5 to 1) will seal most of it then i'll do another coat
maybe a bit thicker to finish off.

wait for that to dry then have a go with levelling compound. what type
of trowel do i need to do a basic levelling (after all its meant to
level itself?)?

It never does what it says on the tin. I am sure if you put it in
10-20mm deep, with a mechanical vibrator, it would eventually puddle
itself more or less flat..but in my case, it had 3mm lips where it
stopped flowoing, and was out by +-5mm everywhere..it simply did not flow.

I used a float at the edges to kill the lips, and guessed at the depth
in the 'puddles' I had to fill.

I would never use it for tiles. I had far more success in the kitchen
with no levelling compound, using tile cement from 5-40mm thick. That
was simply a question of covering the area in strings first (checked
with a level), and seeing where the highest point was..add 5mm + tile
thickness to that, and using it to set my my datum string, against
which the first course was laid. Each one checked with a small level to
make sure the tile itself wasn't slanted.

Where I knew I has problems and need extra cement depth, I used to
scrape out each old cement mix and plaster it on that bit of floor..to
build it up. Not perfectly, just smoothly. Then when the time came to do
the job finally, I need a smaller amount of fresh to fill the gap.


In one bathroom where I had an inch and a half of fallaway in one
corner..I screwed bits of scrap wood to the floor to save on
cement..that seems to have worked as well ;-)

[benpost]

thanks for your help.
i bought some self levelling as im still undecided on whether to tile
or put down laminate/vinyl. i think i'll end up renting the place out
so one part of me says do it quick and cheap but another likes the
solid tiles.
the middle area is pretty flat as it had tiles on before. i just have
a couple of rectangular areas (where units were) that are concrete and
a bit uneven.

[benpost]

i'm going to fill the deep holes with a 'cement based filler' are
there any well known brands of this?

[[email protected]]

On 23 Jan, 17:00, benpost wrote:
thanks for your help.
i bought some self levelling as im still undecided on whether to tile
or put down laminate/vinyl. i think i'll end up renting the place out
so one part of me says do it quick and cheap but another likes the
solid tiles.
the middle area is pretty flat as it had tiles on before. i just have
a couple of rectangular areas (where units were) that are concrete and
a bit uneven.

I had the same decision to make a few weeks ago - and went with tile
effect laminate to save time on levelling out the floor.
Laid it in under an hour, and it looks great - no-one has guessed that
it is laminate so far.

Mark.

[adder1969]

On Jan 24, 10:32*am, wrote:
On 23 Jan, 17:00, benpost wrote:

thanks for your help.
i bought some self levelling as im still undecided on whether to tile
or put down laminate/vinyl. i think i'll end up renting the place out
so one part of me says do it quick and cheap but another likes the
solid tiles.
the middle area is pretty flat as it had tiles on before. i just have
a couple of rectangular areas (where units were) that are concrete and
a bit uneven.

I had the same decision to make a few weeks ago - and went with tile
effect laminate to save time on levelling out the floor.
Laid it in under an hour, and it looks great - no-one has guessed that
it is laminate so far.

Mark.

If I were tiling I would use the tile adhesive to level the floor
whilst tiling, unless it was way out of course in which case I'd fill
with whatver I had around - screed or plaster. I find for floating
plank style flooring like laminate that getting the floor level is
more critical otherwise it bounces. A water leak onto/under a
laminate floor will also ruin it very quickly and you'll have to do
the job over again. Laminate isn't a permanent as tiling unless you
tile over a membrane.

[benpost]

hey guys. i know laminate would be easier to lay, i'm just not sure i
like the tile effect, compared to real tiles. plus if i lay this one
room with ceramic tiles then i've had the experience of laying tiles.
in some of my other rooms i will definitely lay laminate.

today i've bought some polyfilla cement mix, comes in a box with 2
seperate packets of powder. to be honest it did not make a lot of
cement for the size of the box. but i've filled in the worse parts so
they are close to the level i need.

also pva'd (3 to 1) around the edges again just to stabilise the
surface further. back to the flooring, in homebase its pretty
expensive for that laminate tile stuff, i'm sure it said about £28 a
square metre?

[Man at B&Q]

On Jan 24, 11:06*am, adder1969 wrote:
On Jan 24, 10:32*am, wrote:





On 23 Jan, 17:00, benpost wrote:

thanks for your help.
i bought some self levelling as im still undecided on whether to tile
or put down laminate/vinyl. i think i'll end up renting the place out
so one part of me says do it quick and cheap but another likes the
solid tiles.
the middle area is pretty flat as it had tiles on before. i just have
a couple of rectangular areas (where units were) that are concrete and
a bit uneven.

I had the same decision to make a few weeks ago - and went with tile
effect laminate to save time on levelling out the floor.
Laid it in under an hour, and it looks great - no-one has guessed that
it is laminate so far.

Mark.

If I were tiling I would use the tile adhesive to level the floor
whilst tiling, unless it was way out of course in which case I'd fill
with whatver I had around - screed or plaster. *I find for floating
plank style flooring like laminate that getting the floor level is
more critical otherwise it bounces. *A water leak onto/under a
laminate floor will also ruin it very quickly and you'll have to do
the job over again. *

Has this actually happened to you?

We had quite serious leak from the W/M outflow. The laminate suffered
no real damage and dried out well (It is designed for kitchens, after
all). I admit, I was pleasantly surprised. The real damage was to the
worktop above. The humidity (we didn't realise there was a leak for a
while as most of the water found its way under the laminate at the
edge of the room. seems to have caused it to swell and the covering to
start coming away where it rolls down over the front.

MBQ

[adder1969]

On Jan 24, 3:27*pm, benpost wrote:
in homebase its pretty
expensive for that laminate tile stuff, i'm sure it said about £28 a
square metre?

You were there.

[adder1969]

On Jan 24, 3:37*pm, "Man at B&Q" wrote:
*

Has this actually happened to you?

We had quite serious leak from the W/M outflow. The laminate suffered
no real damage and dried out well (It is designed for kitchens, after
all). I admit, I was pleasantly surprised. The real damage was to the
worktop above. The humidity (we didn't realise there was a leak for a
while as most of the water found its way under the laminate at the
edge of the room. seems to have caused it to swell and the covering to
start coming away where it rolls down over the front.


Yep the leak was small and went unnoticed and the laminate lifted
along a join. My worktop was fine though :-)

[benpost]

I'm gonna go with laminate, with a tile effect, for ease of laying and
practicality.

If anyone else here as laid a laminate floor with tile-effect lately
then let me know where you bought it ?