[Arthur2]

Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large piece
of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 15:33:33 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large piece
of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur

The MIL looked at it and froze the pipes?

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47712cd9@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 15:33:33 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large
piece
of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur

The MIL looked at it and froze the pipes?




When the wife revealed to all the absence of cold water the MIl gave me a
look that froze my nadgers.

Arthur

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 17:27:20 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47712cd9@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 15:33:33 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large
piece
of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur

The MIL looked at it and froze the pipes?




When the wife revealed to all the absence of cold water the MIl gave me a
look that froze my nadgers.

Arthur

Oh dear.

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could
well suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47714187@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 17:27:20 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47712cd9@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 15:33:33 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned
on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large
piece
of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires
off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur

The MIL looked at it and froze the pipes?




When the wife revealed to all the absence of cold water the MIl gave me a
look that froze my nadgers.

Arthur

Oh dear.

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could well
suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.


Might condensation be a cause?

Arthur

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 17:58:29 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47714187@qaanaaq...

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could well
suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.


Might condensation be a cause?


Possibly if it were to get onto the electronics, but that would be
obvious from looking. You could try the other obvious thing of
making sure that all connectors are pushed firmly home.

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:477147d1@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 17:58:29 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47714187@qaanaaq...

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could
well
suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.


Might condensation be a cause?


Possibly if it were to get onto the electronics, but that would be obvious
from looking. You could try the other obvious thing of making sure
that all connectors are pushed firmly home.



Although as I said the boiler 'fires up' when the hot tap is run. So it
seems that searching for an
electrical fault caused by condensation seems a long shot.

Arthur

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 18:31:37 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:477147d1@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 17:58:29 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47714187@qaanaaq...

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could
well
suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.


Might condensation be a cause?


Possibly if it were to get onto the electronics, but that would be obvious
from looking. You could try the other obvious thing of making sure
that all connectors are pushed firmly home.



Although as I said the boiler 'fires up' when the hot tap is run. So it
seems that searching for an
electrical fault caused by condensation seems a long shot.

Arthur

What do you mean by "fires up"? Fan runs and burner lights?

Does it run at full power or low power? Presumably if it is firing
up as in the burner lighting, after a short while the burner goes off
because heat is not being transferred to the hot water?

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47716036@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 18:31:37 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:477147d1@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 17:58:29 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
news:47714187@qaanaaq...

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could
well
suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.


Might condensation be a cause?


Possibly if it were to get onto the electronics, but that would be
obvious
from looking. You could try the other obvious thing of making sure
that all connectors are pushed firmly home.



Although as I said the boiler 'fires up' when the hot tap is run. So it
seems that searching for an
electrical fault caused by condensation seems a long shot.

Arthur

What do you mean by "fires up"? Fan runs and burner lights?

Does it run at full power or low power? Presumably if it is firing up
as in the burner lighting, after a short while the burner goes off because
heat is not being transferred to the hot water?




When a hot tap is turned on the boiler fires up as in makes the usual
noises..then
remains like this until the tap is turned off, as though its running fine
except the water
remains stone cold.
I don't know anything about low or high power.

Should it be easy to see if the burner lights up?

Arthur

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47716036@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 18:31:37 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:477147d1@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 17:58:29 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
news:47714187@qaanaaq...

If the boiler is apparently "starting" - i.e. fan runs; then it could
well
suggest an issue with the gas valve or the electronics driving it.


Might condensation be a cause?


Possibly if it were to get onto the electronics, but that would be
obvious
from looking. You could try the other obvious thing of making sure
that all connectors are pushed firmly home.



Although as I said the boiler 'fires up' when the hot tap is run. So it
seems that searching for an
electrical fault caused by condensation seems a long shot.

Arthur

What do you mean by "fires up"? Fan runs and burner lights?

Does it run at full power or low power? Presumably if it is firing up
as in the burner lighting, after a short while the burner goes off because
heat is not being transferred to the hot water?




I took the front cover off and there is a tiny port hole window. If there
is supposed to be a
pilot flame/ignition spark visible thriough this, I can't see anything
happen.
And the noises I am hearing may be just the fan.

Arthur

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 20:05:25 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47716036@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 18:31:37 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

What do you mean by "fires up"? Fan runs and burner lights?

Does it run at full power or low power? Presumably if it is firing up
as in the burner lighting, after a short while the burner goes off because
heat is not being transferred to the hot water?




When a hot tap is turned on the boiler fires up as in makes the usual
noises..then
remains like this until the tap is turned off, as though its running fine
except the water
remains stone cold.

So the heat has to be going somewhere. What happens if you turn
down the room thermostat and then run the HW? My guess would be
that the radiators will get warm.

If so, it suggests the diverter valve inside the boiler that directs
the primary (heating) circuit water to the heat exchanger instead of
the radiators. A common fault is that they stick.

I don't know anything about low or high power.

Many boilers have variable output power. On high output the boiler is
usually making more noise because of the fan running faster.



Should it be easy to see if the burner lights up?

If there isn't a sight glass then check the meter.



Arthur

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47717409@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 20:05:25 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47716036@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 18:31:37 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

What do you mean by "fires up"? Fan runs and burner lights?

Does it run at full power or low power? Presumably if it is firing
up
as in the burner lighting, after a short while the burner goes off
because
heat is not being transferred to the hot water?




When a hot tap is turned on the boiler fires up as in makes the usual
noises..then
remains like this until the tap is turned off, as though its running fine
except the water
remains stone cold.

So the heat has to be going somewhere. What happens if you turn down
the room thermostat and then run the HW? My guess would be that the
radiators will get warm.

If so, it suggests the diverter valve inside the boiler that directs the
primary (heating) circuit water to the heat exchanger instead of the
radiators. A common fault is that they stick.

I don't know anything about low or high power.

Many boilers have variable output power. On high output the boiler is
usually making more noise because of the fan running faster.



Should it be easy to see if the burner lights up?

If there isn't a sight glass then check the meter.



Just checked the manual and it points out the cut-off button. There seems
nothing to lose by trying it but it
seems to be stuck unless we're supposed to apply a heavy action to it.

Arthur

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47717409@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 20:05:25 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47716036@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 18:31:37 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

What do you mean by "fires up"? Fan runs and burner lights?

Does it run at full power or low power? Presumably if it is firing
up
as in the burner lighting, after a short while the burner goes off
because
heat is not being transferred to the hot water?




When a hot tap is turned on the boiler fires up as in makes the usual
noises..then
remains like this until the tap is turned off, as though its running fine
except the water
remains stone cold.

So the heat has to be going somewhere. What happens if you turn down
the room thermostat and then run the HW? My guess would be that the
radiators will get warm.

If so, it suggests the diverter valve inside the boiler that directs the
primary (heating) circuit water to the heat exchanger instead of the
radiators. A common fault is that they stick.

I don't know anything about low or high power.

Many boilers have variable output power. On high output the boiler is
usually making more noise because of the fan running faster.



Should it be easy to see if the burner lights up?

If there isn't a sight glass then check the meter.



I have the check valves closed to the rads since discovering the leak
mentioned a fews ago on here.
And the c/h is now switched off.
The hot water was working earlier today but then just quit. As said, the
fan/pump turns on when using the hot taps.
There is a viewing hole but nothing happening there. Re; this viewing hole,
should something be happening
when just the hot water is on?

Arthur

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 22:16:40 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


I have the check valves closed to the rads since discovering the leak
mentioned a fews ago on here.
And the c/h is now switched off.

So the burner can't be lighting at all or running for any length of
time. The water would boil and the burner would turn off.


The hot water was working earlier today but then just quit. As said, the
fan/pump turns on when using the hot taps.
There is a viewing hole but nothing happening there.

Can you normally see the blue flames through there when it's running the CH?



Re; this viewing hole,
should something be happening
when just the hot water is on?

If you can normally see flames then yes it should be the same.

If other gas appliances are working, then this fault is probably the
gas valve, a sensor or the control electronics in the boiler.

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:47718c28@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 22:16:40 +0000, "Arthur2" said:


I have the check valves closed to the rads since discovering the leak
mentioned a fews ago on here.
And the c/h is now switched off.

So the burner can't be lighting at all or running for any length of time.
The water would boil and the burner would turn off.



Theres definitely nothing happening behind the viewing hole.
This hole is normally hidden behind the fascia panel so I don't know whats
visible during normal operation.


The hot water was working earlier today but then just quit. As said, the
fan/pump turns on when using the hot taps.
There is a viewing hole but nothing happening there.

Can you normally see the blue flames through there when it's running the
CH?



Re; this viewing hole,
should something be happening
when just the hot water is on?

If you can normally see flames then yes it should be the same.

If other gas appliances are working, then this fault is probably the gas
valve, a sensor or the control electronics in the boiler.



Looks like I'm calling a corgi guy in the morning.
Do they charge heavy on boxing day; assuming they have the time.?

In the meantime I will switch the thing off and hope something magic
happens.

Thanks for your help.

Arthur.

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-12-25 23:28:02 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

Looks like I'm calling a corgi guy in the morning.
Do they charge heavy on boxing day; assuming they have the time.?

If you were a CORGI guy receiving a call on Boxing Day for a distress
purchase, what would you do?




In the meantime I will switch the thing off and hope something magic
happens.

Thanks for your help.


Hopefully it's nothing too major. There are many sensors for
measuring and safety and these can easily prevent operation.

[Arthur2]

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:477199e5@qaanaaq...
On 2007-12-25 23:28:02 +0000, "Arthur2" said:

Looks like I'm calling a corgi guy in the morning.
Do they charge heavy on boxing day; assuming they have the time.?

If you were a CORGI guy receiving a call on Boxing Day for a distress
purchase, what would you do?




He could take a fancy to the MIL.

Arthur.

[Derek Geldard]

On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 23:03:04 +0000, Andy Hall
wrote:

Re; this viewing hole,
should something be happening
when just the hot water is on?

If you can normally see flames then yes it should be the same.

If other gas appliances are working, then this fault is probably the
gas valve, a sensor or the control electronics in the boiler.

If it cuts a long story any shorter at this time on Boxing day ...

I had a similar problem last Friday.

21 year old daughter bursts in my bedroom at 05-45 am yelling (She's a
senna-pod tea drinker on the run) "THERE'S NO HOT WATER".

She was not wrong, there was however central heating as normal.

Boiler is a Worcester Bosch Siemens Greenstar, 4 Years old. Initially
suspecting a stuck diverter valve, I looked on the W.B.S. website but
what I saw intimated the boiler was not made of standard UK plumbing
bits - it was very "Geeairman", as were the electrics.

Preferring to avoid a similar rude awakening anytime soon (or ever in
fact) I called W.B.S. in, it turned out to be it was the diverter
valve (siezed solid). This was replaced, the annual service done and
an old water leak *from the flue* traced and remedied in 40 minutes.

The point is the particular details of what you observe will depend on
how the whole set-up is interlocked. The boiler electronics may wait
for feedback from the diverter valve that it has successfully opened
for hot water before it fires the boiler. OTOH it might not ...

HTH.

DG

[Arthur2]

"Arthur2" wrote in message
...
Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large
piece of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur



I left the combi switched off last night then tried it again first thing
this morning.
It was just the same..no hot. Then 5 minutes ago..the MIL must have given
it a 'look'
and it the hot water came back.

Is this a woman thing..beyond our understanding?

Arthur

[The Natural Philosopher]

Arthur2 wrote:
"Arthur2" wrote in message
...
Hi all.
Hoping you can help with this one as I have the mother in law here
for a few days.
I have had the central heating turned off since the problems mentioned on
here recently.
So today with 2 gas fires and the gas cooker doing overtime on a large
piece of brisket.
The W-B 28i combi produces no hot water. It behaves in the usual
way...'firing up' when
attempting to run hot water taps. I've tried switching the gas fires off
but still no change.

Any suggestions for remedies please?

Arthur



I left the combi switched off last night then tried it again first thing
this morning.
It was just the same..no hot. Then 5 minutes ago..the MIL must have given
it a 'look'
and it the hot water came back.

Is this a woman thing..beyond our understanding?

Arthur



PROBABLY a stick valve, and with low voltage yesterday with all those
turkeys frying, not enough power to move it..

Get it seen to ASAP - it will happen again.