[Mike P]

just moved to a "new" house.

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator.

So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
control rooms with TRV's .... right ?

So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
the water feed to the rads.

So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
want it that warm up there.

If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
.... methinks.

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Mike P

Mike P

[Dave Baker[_2_]]

"Mike P" mike@askme wrote in message
...
just moved to a "new" house.

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator.

So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
control rooms with TRV's .... right ?

So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
the water feed to the rads.

So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
want it that warm up there.

If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
... methinks.

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Clearly not. It should be in the main room whose temperature you want to
control, usually the lounge. You'd also want one rad in there without a TRV
to act as the master rad.
--
Dave Baker - Puma Race Engines

[Jim Alexander[_2_]]

"Mike P" mike@askme wrote in message
...
just moved to a "new" house.

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator.

So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
control rooms with TRV's .... right ?

So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
the water feed to the rads.

So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
want it that warm up there.

If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
... methinks.

No, because the hall is unheated. If you set the hall thermostat to 16deg
say the rooms would *probably* get to TRV temp because there will be
temperature gradient between the hall and each room. The hall stat is
really just a crude way of reducing boiler cycling.

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

There is not a straightforward answer to your question but its a common
arrangemnet. To control all rooms by TRV requires the boiler to be on
permanently which leads to wasteful cycling. Possibly you are suggesting
the stat should be the living room. That gives you good control of living
room temperature but unsatisfactory control of the heat to the other rooms.
On balance the hall is as good a place as any for a simple system. If its
not a programmeable stat consider upgrading to one.

Jim A

[John]

"Jim Alexander" wrote in message
o.uk...

"Mike P" mike@askme wrote in message
...
just moved to a "new" house.

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator.

So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
control rooms with TRV's .... right ?

So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
the water feed to the rads.

So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
want it that warm up there.

If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
... methinks.

No, because the hall is unheated. If you set the hall thermostat to 16deg
say the rooms would *probably* get to TRV temp because there will be
temperature gradient between the hall and each room. The hall stat is
really just a crude way of reducing boiler cycling.

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

There is not a straightforward answer to your question but its a common
arrangemnet. To control all rooms by TRV requires the boiler to be on
permanently which leads to wasteful cycling. Possibly you are
suggesting the stat should be the living room. That gives you good
control of living room temperature but unsatisfactory control of the heat
to the other rooms. On balance the hall is as good a place as any for a
simple system. If its not a programmeable stat consider upgrading to
one.

Jim A






I would have thought that a Wireless Stat would be the solution then it can
easily be put in the lounge without disturbing the wiring.

[Mike P]

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 15:22:26 +0100, "Dave Baker"
wrote:

...
... "Mike P" mike@askme wrote in message
... .. .
... just moved to a "new" house.
...
... Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
... of the stairs ... and NO radiator.
...
... So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
... other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
... control rooms with TRV's .... right ?
...
... So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
... the water feed to the rads.
...
... So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
... Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
... is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
... want it that warm up there.
...
... If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
... ... methinks.
...
... Is the thermostat in the right place ?
...
... Clearly not. It should be in the main room whose temperature you want to
... control, usually the lounge. You'd also want one rad in there without a TRV
... to act as the master rad.

Thanx .... master rad is in the bathroom

Mike P

[Vass[_2_]]

"John" wrote in message
...

"Jim Alexander" wrote in message


I would have thought that a Wireless Stat would be the solution then it
can easily be put in the lounge without disturbing the wiring.

seen the price of those things?
jeeez
--
Vass

[Andy Hall]

On 2007-09-30 16:31:31 +0100, "Vass" said:


"John" wrote in message
...

"Jim Alexander" wrote in message


I would have thought that a Wireless Stat would be the solution then it
can easily be put in the lounge without disturbing the wiring.

seen the price of those things?
jeeez

What about the cost of redecorating and of your time?

[Mike P]

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 15:26:00 GMT, "John"
wrote:

snip
...
...
...
... I would have thought that a Wireless Stat would be the solution then it can
... easily be put in the lounge without disturbing the wiring.
...
/snip

We had one of those for the Woecester boiler at my last place. It was
brilliant. Just carried it about where we were most at.

Mike P

[[email protected]]

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 15:22:26 +0100, "Dave Baker"
wrote:


"Mike P" mike@askme wrote in message
.. .
just moved to a "new" house.

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator.

So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
control rooms with TRV's .... right ?

So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
the water feed to the rads.

So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
want it that warm up there.

If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
... methinks.

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Clearly not. It should be in the main room whose temperature you want to
control, usually the lounge. You'd also want one rad in there without a TRV
to act as the master rad.

And if you dont have a main room the single thermostat will be a pain
if used "correctly". A bit of sun on one side of the house and a cold
wind blowing on the other can also play havoc with this type of
control. Not sure what the alternatives are if you are trying to
minimise boiler cycling ??
Robert

[jal]

Surely it doesn't matter _where_ the thermostat is?

Ours is set at 17 degrees (it happens to be in a corner of the dining
room). We have found - by experimentation - that at that temperature,
everywhere else is reasonably comfortable. If ever we find we're cold
in the lounge, we walk to the dining room and tweak the stat up a
degree. It's no big deal, and the whole arrangement costs us ...
nothing.

John

[Ed Sirett]

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 19:14:40 +0100, Mike P wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 15:26:00 GMT, "John"
wrote:

snip
..
..
..
.. I would have thought that a Wireless Stat would be the solution then it can
.. easily be put in the lounge without disturbing the wiring.
..
/snip

We had one of those for the Woecester boiler at my last place. It was
brilliant. Just carried it about where we were most at.


I'm using these regularly now as they are only £40 more than a wired unit.
It allows the user the possibility to experiment to find the best place
for the control. Then, later, if it's practical, a wired unit can be
substituted.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

[David Hansen]

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 15:01:21 +0100 someone who may be Mike P
mike@askme wrote this:-

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator. [snip]

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Almost certainly not.

Such a thermostat should be placed in a location which reflects the
external temperature, will not be influenced by internal heat gains
and will cool down most rapidly when heating is off.

An ideal place is a north facing bedroom. Living rooms are best
avoided as they may have supplementary heating, kitchens are best
avoided as they have cooking equipment in them which (one hopes)
will give off heat.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

[Roger Mills]

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
David Hansen wrote:


Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Almost certainly not.

Such a thermostat should be placed in a location which reflects the
external temperature, will not be influenced by internal heat gains
and will cool down most rapidly when heating is off.

An ideal place is a north facing bedroom. Living rooms are best
avoided as they may have supplementary heating, kitchens are best
avoided as they have cooking equipment in them which (one hopes)
will give off heat.

I think that this may have been asked already, but what is the legality and
practicality of putting the stat in a bathroom?

If it's switching mains, is it ok in some zones but not others? Will it be
adversely affected by steam?

If it's not switching mains - e.g. the sender part of a wireless stat -
presumably it's legally ok in a bathroom? But will the steam foul up its
electronics?
--
Cheers,
Roger
______
Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly
monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks.
PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP!

[Derek Geldard]

On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 17:08:02 +0100, David Hansen
wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 15:01:21 +0100 someone who may be Mike P
mike@askme wrote this:-

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator. [snip]

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Almost certainly not.


Yes but rather contentious amongst the older generation who had
central heating "put in" in the late '60s

Me : "Why did you have the thermostat placed just inside the front
door.

F.I.L. : It's the coldest place in the house.

Me : But the all the radiators in the house will come on when you open
the front door.

USW. USW.

Such a thermostat should be placed in a location which reflects the
external temperature,

Being quite serious, that's outside, Not that mine is outside, mine is
in the lounge but the only heat input apart from a couple of radiators
with lockshield valves. is the TV which is on constantly so gets
compensated for when the radiators are balanced, and the heat output
of human beings. if they affect the demand on the boiler at least
that's where they are.

The net result is not bad except when SWMBO starts steam ironing in
there whilst watching TV. Then the heating to the entire house shuts
down. :-((

DG

[David Hansen]

On Tue, 2 Oct 2007 17:54:20 +0100 someone who may be "Roger Mills"
wrote this:-

I think that this may have been asked already, but what is the legality and
practicality of putting the stat in a bathroom?

If it's switching mains, is it ok in some zones but not others?

It is just like any other electrical switch in a bathroom. In Ye
Olden Days such a switch could be installed, provided it was not
within reach of someone using a (fixed, in Ye Really Olden Days)
bath or shower. In new money much the same thing applies, though
this is now expressed in terms of zones.

Will it be adversely affected by steam?

Probably depends on design. My internal frost stat happens to be in
a bathroom, as it is the place which loses heat most rapidly and has
not been affected.

If the stat was controlling the heating then it will be affected by
heat gains in the bathroom, from baths and showers being taken in
particular.

If it's not switching mains - e.g. the sender part of a wireless stat -
presumably it's legally ok in a bathroom? But will the steam foul up its
electronics?

I suppose condensation might bridge some bits of a PCB. Suitable
conditions are usually stated in the instruction booklet.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

[David Hansen]

On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 18:22:22 +0100 someone who may be Derek Geldard
wrote this:-

Such a thermostat should be placed in a location which reflects the
external temperature,

Being quite serious, that's outside,

It is indeed. If one has a system where weather compensation makes
sense then that is a good place for one of the sensors.

The net result is not bad except when SWMBO starts steam ironing in
there whilst watching TV. Then the heating to the entire house shuts
down. :-((

She does too much ironing:-) Tell her to relax.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

[Pete C]

On Oct 3, 11:52 am, David Hansen
wrote:
On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 18:22:22 +0100 someone who may be Derek Geldard
wrote this:-

Such a thermostat should be placed in a location which reflects the
external temperature,

Being quite serious, that's outside,

I'd also look at a differential bypass valve, and put a thermostat on
that too.

Or have it across the TMV in the room the thermostat is in.

cheers,
Pete.

[RobertL]

On Sep 30, 4:06 pm, "Jim Alexander" wrote:
"Mike P" mike@askme wrote in message

...



just moved to a "new" house.

Rads have TRV's ..... There is a wall thermostat in the hall at bottom
of the stairs ... and NO radiator.

So ......... if I set the hall thermostat to 20deg and I wish the
other rooms to be the same temperature (20 deg) with doors shut, I can
control rooms with TRV's .... right ?

So what happens when the rooms reach 20deg? I assume the TRV's shut
the water feed to the rads.

So what is happening in the hall and the upstairs landing space etc ?
Hot air rises so will the boiler keep grinding away until it is 20deg
is reached at the bottom of the stairs from the top ? I do not really
want it that warm up there.

If I set the thermostat lower .... then the rooms will not reach 20deg
... methinks.

No, because the hall is unheated. If you set the hall thermostat to 16deg
say the rooms would *probably* get to TRV temp because there will be
temperature gradient between the hall and each room. The hall stat is
really just a crude way of reducing boiler cycling.

Is the thermostat in the right place ?

There is not a straightforward answer to your question but its a common
arrangemnet. To control all rooms by TRV requires the boiler to be on
permanently which leads to wasteful cycling. Possibly you are suggesting
the stat should be the living room. That gives you good control of living
room temperature but unsatisfactory control of the heat to the other rooms.
On balance the hall is as good a place as any for a simple system. If its
not a programmeable stat consider upgrading to one.

One could wire several thermostats in parallel, located in different
partsof the house. The boiler is on if any of the thermostats is
demanding heat but the TRVs actually control the temperatures.

The thermostats could each be the clever ones with electronic timers
included.

Robert

[Roger Mills]

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
RobertL wrote:


One could wire several thermostats in parallel, located in different
partsof the house. The boiler is on if any of the thermostats is
demanding heat but the TRVs actually control the temperatures.

The thermostats could each be the clever ones with electronic timers
included.


Yes, I'd already wondered about doing that, and I don't see why it shouldn't
work. What I have in mind is a fixed (programmable) stat in parallel with a
wireless programmable stat. The wireless stat could be moved from room to
room depending on priorities at any one time.
--
Cheers,
Roger
______
Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly
monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks.
PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP!

[Ed Sirett]

On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 17:54:20 +0100, Roger Mills wrote:

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
David Hansen wrote:


Is the thermostat in the right place ?

Almost certainly not.

Such a thermostat should be placed in a location which reflects the
external temperature, will not be influenced by internal heat gains
and will cool down most rapidly when heating is off.

An ideal place is a north facing bedroom. Living rooms are best
avoided as they may have supplementary heating, kitchens are best
avoided as they have cooking equipment in them which (one hopes)
will give off heat.

I think that this may have been asked already, but what is the legality and
practicality of putting the stat in a bathroom?

If it's switching mains, is it ok in some zones but not others? Will it be
adversely affected by steam?

If it's not switching mains - e.g. the sender part of a wireless stat -
presumably it's legally ok in a bathroom? But will the steam foul up its
electronics?


Most likely a normal mains wired themrostat/programmer is rated at IP22 so
not suitable for a bathroom (maybe zone 3?).
It is however a highly impractical suggestion even if using a wireless
unit as the bathroom temperature is volatile and unrepresentative of the
house as a whole.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html