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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
Situation:
Beech hedge some 12' high and about 6' deep has the remains of a 3' closeboarded fence about a foot away from its centre line, i.e. the fence was built along my boundary and the beech hedge planted close to the fence on my side of the boundary. Fence has now come to the end of its life and I wish to replace it - the collapsing fence is revealing the bald base of the hedge and allowing easy access for animals, particularly dogs. The hedge has also suffered from poor maintenance and has grown out quite a bit - hence its depth. I do not wish to cause tremendous damage to the hedge or do any radical pruning. Can I use metal post anchors such as Metpost to fix 6' fence posts along the line of the previous fence at maybe 4' intervals, perhaps with a top rail between each post to prevent swaying and a stay through the hedge at say 45 deg down from each post to stake under the hedge on my side of the boundary. Then build the fence up with horizontal boards as far as I can and wherever I can. Is this a crazy solution? Can anyone suggest anything better? BTW the far side of the hedge faces open woodland - not another garden. TIA Richard |
#2
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
Richard wrote:
Situation: Beech hedge some 12' high and about 6' deep has the remains of a 3' closeboarded fence about a foot away from its centre line, i.e. the fence was built along my boundary and the beech hedge planted close to the fence on my side of the boundary. Fence has now come to the end of its life and I wish to replace it - the collapsing fence is revealing the bald base of the hedge and allowing easy access for animals, particularly dogs. The hedge has also suffered from poor maintenance and has grown out quite a bit - hence its depth. I do not wish to cause tremendous damage to the hedge or do any radical pruning. Can I use metal post anchors such as Metpost to fix 6' fence posts along the line of the previous fence at maybe 4' intervals, Why 4'? Standard spacing for 6' fence posts & panels is 6' - more with feather edge & arris rail. Bear in mind that you are bound to encounter tree roots so the fewer posts the better. Metposts are probably the best fixing in this case, but bear in mind they can twist & go in off level if they hit a root. With a 3' fence you could probably go for 10' between posts using 2 arris rails & galv brackets. -- Dave The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk 01634 717930 07850 597257 |
#3
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Why 4'? Because I cannot fit standard panels (both in terms of width and height) - because I am not going to cut the hedge back to allow a clear run of fencing. I will be inserting the fence posts _within_ the existing hedge that has grown out and over the remains of the original fence. Standard spacing for 6' fence posts & panels is 6' - more with feather edge & arris rail. Bear in mind that you are bound to encounter tree roots so the fewer posts the better. Metposts are probably the best fixing in this case, but bear in mind they can twist & go in off level if they hit a root. With a 3' fence you could probably go for 10' between posts using 2 arris rails & galv brackets. I'm only going to be able to panel sporadically, hence my query regarding the use of horizontal boards. I may not have said that I expect to fix the boards to the posts, i.e. not using arris rails. I can't do an ASCII drawing but . . . Now (top view) -------------------------hedge edge ---------------------------------- -- ---- - - - - - - - - old fence -- --- -- -- --- -- -- --- -- -------------------------hedge centre line ----------------------------- -------------------------hedge edge ---------------------------------- Idea: (again from above and omiting braces through the hedge) -------------------------hedge edge ---------------------------------- __________ _________ __________ ___________ __________ ________ _______ x x x x x x x -------------------------hedge centre line ----------------------------- -------------------------hedge edge ---------------------------------- x = line of posts _ = horizontal planking fixed to post |
#4
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
"Richard" wrote in message ... Situation: Beech hedge some 12' high and about 6' deep has the remains of a 3' closeboarded fence about a foot away from its centre line, i.e. the fence was built along my boundary and the beech hedge planted close to the fence on my side of the boundary. Fence has now come to the end of its life and I wish to replace it - the collapsing fence is revealing the bald base of the hedge and allowing easy access for animals, particularly dogs. The hedge has also suffered from poor maintenance and has grown out quite a bit - hence its depth. I do not wish to cause tremendous damage to the hedge or do any radical pruning. Can I use metal post anchors such as Metpost to fix 6' fence posts along the line of the previous fence at maybe 4' intervals, perhaps with a top rail between each post to prevent swaying and a stay through the hedge at say 45 deg down from each post to stake under the hedge on my side of the boundary. Then build the fence up with horizontal boards as far as I can and wherever I can. Is this a crazy solution? Can anyone suggest anything better? BTW the far side of the hedge faces open woodland - not another garden. If it's in the middle of the hedge and the main reason for it is to keep dogs in/out why use panels? Why not use wire, pig mesh maybe, and let the hedge grow back through it? You say you don't want to prune but beech really thickens up after a good hacking. H |
#5
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
In message , Richard
writes Situation: Beech hedge some 12' high and about 6' deep has the remains of a 3' closeboarded fence about a foot away from its centre line, i.e. the fence was built along my boundary and the beech hedge planted close to the fence on my side of the boundary. Fence has now come to the end of its life and I wish to replace it - the collapsing fence is revealing the bald base of the hedge and allowing easy access for animals, particularly dogs. The hedge has also suffered from poor maintenance and has grown out quite a bit - hence its depth. I do not wish to cause tremendous damage to the hedge or do any radical pruning. Can I use metal post anchors such as Metpost to fix 6' fence posts along the line of the previous fence at maybe 4' intervals, perhaps with a top rail between each post to prevent swaying and a stay through the hedge at say 45 deg down from each post to stake under the hedge on my side of the boundary. Then build the fence up with horizontal boards as far as I can and wherever I can. Is this a crazy solution? Yes. Although, as a farmer with domestic neighbours, I have to admire your honesty:-) Can anyone suggest anything better? Why are you determined not to prune? Is there an access/disposal issue? Beech is boys stuff compared with Blackthorn. BTW the far side of the hedge faces open woodland - not another garden. Rabbits? You mention dogs so possibly public open space? Privacy issues? Cost has not been mentioned but the cheapest dog proof barrier is agricultural stock fence or, if Rabbits are a problem, 48" 18 gauge netting. Burying the bottom 6" will be difficult with your roots. Benefits. Cheap, good life (20 years) hedge can fill out because light is not obstructed. Post spacing is not critical. No maintenance required. Downside. Strainer posts required at corners/50m. Loss of privacy, temporary. Using a sledge hammer below branches is not practical so you need Metposts or a tubular post rammer. ISTR there is some advice on rural fencing on the Forestry Commission website. regards -- Tim Lamb |
#6
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
Tim Lamb wrote:
Yes. Although, as a farmer with domestic neighbours, I have to admire your honesty:-) Why are you determined not to prune? Is there an access/disposal issue? Beech is boys stuff compared with Blackthorn. Thanks to all. Yes there are privacy issues - the woodland is public access - AKA used for dog emptying and while I don't mind the ocasional fox and smaller visitors I object strongly to dogs coming into my garden to frighten the cats and to crap! I did not want to complicate my OP by discussing pruning. You may have guessed that the hedge has grown out as a result of neglect and is now rather open and woody rather than bushy. I have been advised that it will recover, i.e. become denser and with more fine branches if I cut one side back beyond the growth point by, say 6", and feed the base of the hedge with e.g. Growmore. I'm to do this before the new growth starts, but when than is with the current crazy seasons is anyone's guess. I can then do the same to the unpruned side on the following year. I suspect that I will then leave both sides for another year before hard pruning the first side again. I have similarly hard pruned another Beech hedge which seems to have coped, despite erecting a 5' fence against the pruned face - that one adjoins a neighbour who wanted a 6' CB fence. We compromised with 5' CB + 1' trellis. So, although I ultimately need only a dog proof barrier, for a number of years I will need a dog and sight proof barrier. Disposal and access are no problem and having done hedgelaying with the odd Blackthorn present for purely entertainment value I give thanks for it's absence here! TIA Richard |
#7
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
In message , Richard
writes Tim Lamb wrote: Why are you determined not to prune? Is there an access/disposal issue? Beech is boys stuff compared with Blackthorn. Thanks to all. Yes there are privacy issues - the woodland is public access - AKA used for dog emptying and while I don't mind the ocasional fox and smaller visitors I object strongly to dogs coming into my garden to frighten the cats and to crap! OK. Fox crap has a pointy end. I did not want to complicate my OP by discussing pruning. You may have guessed that the hedge has grown out as a result of neglect and is now rather open and woody rather than bushy. I have been advised that it will recover, i.e. become denser and with more fine branches if I cut one side back beyond the growth point by, say 6", and feed the base of the hedge with e.g. Growmore. I'm to do this before the new growth starts, but when than is with the current crazy seasons is anyone's guess. I can then do the same to the unpruned side on the following year. I suspect that I will then leave both sides for another year before hard pruning the first side again. I have similarly hard pruned another Beech hedge which seems to have coped, despite erecting a 5' fence against the pruned face - that one adjoins a neighbour who wanted a 6' CB fence. We compromised with 5' CB + 1' trellis. Could you not prune to just above the height of any replacement fence with a bit spare for working room. Any serious trimming needs to be done over the next few weeks. Post holes are likely to be tricky: roots and hard dry soil. Fencing contractors use a motorised auger which might be available from the hire shops. I use a tractor mounted borer and clean out with a *shoveholer* sort of double shovel. regards -- Tim Lamb |
#8
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
Tim Lamb wrote:
Could you not prune to just above the height of any replacement fence with a bit spare for working room. That was/is my idea. Installing tall posts was a way of future proofing. Any serious trimming needs to be done over the next few weeks. Just how hard can I prune the hedge. the side to be trimmed is south facing. Post holes are likely to be tricky: roots and hard dry soil. Fencing contractors use a motorised auger which might be available from the hire shops. I use a tractor mounted borer and clean out with a *shoveholer* sort of double shovel. regards Sorry for tardy reply - New Year away intervened. Richard |
#9
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
In message , Richard
writes Tim Lamb wrote: Could you not prune to just above the height of any replacement fence with a bit spare for working room. That was/is my idea. Installing tall posts was a way of future proofing. Any serious trimming needs to be done over the next few weeks. Just how hard can I prune the hedge. the side to be trimmed is south facing. I don't see any problem with trimming all the obstructing branches in the work area back to 200mm or so. There will still be plenty of untrimmed growth to keep the bushes growing. Sorry for tardy reply - New Year away intervened. You haven't missed much:-) regards -- Tim Lamb |
#10
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Building or repairing a fence within a hedge
Tim Lamb wrote:
Just how hard can I prune the hedge. the side to be trimmed is south facing. I don't see any problem with trimming all the obstructing branches in the work area back to 200mm or so. There will still be plenty of untrimmed growth to keep the bushes growing. Thanks Tim Slash and burn will commence at the end of next week! Rgds Richard |
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