On 24 Aug 2003 04:19:06 -0700, (chris) wrote:

a message for Andy!

I am fed up with people who think they know all about everything.

So am I, which is why I frequently make it clear that I am using
anecdotal material from personal experience.

I refer in particular to your references rubbishing power-flushing in
google groups.

I have not rubbished power flushing. I have presented an alternative
solution on a number of occasions, which is effective and has a much
lower cost.

Have you got a power flushing machine?

I have used one.

If so, do you know how to use it?

Yes thank you.



Telling people that genuine heating engineers like me are ripping
people off really annoys me.

I have not said that genuine heating engineers are ripping people off,
but have certainly singled out BG on occasions because I do not
consider that the typical £800 that they charge is good value for
money.

I would also point out that this is a DIY news group and that it is
perfectly reasonable to present a DIY approach to an issue that has a
lower cost than commercial power flushing and is perfectly effective.

You advocate to this girl flushing with cold water! Egh? It doesn't
take a scientist to work out that an acid will do a better job than
water does it.

If you searched back through Google Groups, you would find a
completely detailed set of information on my approach.
It includes hot flushing with a flushing agent for a period of time as
part of the procedure.

Are you advocating that she flushes with water in both
directions, as is possible with a power flush.

Again, if you bothered to read the procedure, you would realise that
it involves flushing both ways at each radiator.



In short, I power flush for a living.

I wondered when we would get to that.

So in short you are making a posting from the perspective of having a
commercial vested interest

This is a DIY group, not a referral service for commercial operators.
If you want to do that, I suggest that you advertise in Yellow Pages.


I have solved hundreds…literally
hundreds of circulation issues in heating systems using my power
flushing kit. Yes it costs money, as any service does, and I will
allow for the fact that the world is full of idiots who cant be
bothered or don't know how the job is done properly, don't add your
name the list.

I wouldn't dream of it, but I wasn't born yesterday or the day before
and wouldn't add my name to the list of mugs who are ripped off by
cowboy operators offering power flushing when it is completely
unnecessary.




Get yourself a power flush machine and stop misinforming people.


I have used one of these machines, according to the manufacturer's
instructions. I was then able to remove more material from the
system using my method. Not that that was any great surprise.

I should add that this was in a system which had been maintained with
corrosion inhibitor religiously according to the manufacturer's
instructions.

I have not said that power flushing is necessarily bad as a technique,
but that it is not good value for money (certainly at BG prices), and
there are equally effective if not better DIY approaches.




..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On 24 Aug 2003 04:19:06 -0700, chris wrote:

a message for Andy!

*snip*

So Chris, why didn't you email it to him?

If you had ever bothered to read any of Andy's posts properly in the
first place you would realise that the advice he gives is sound,
balanced and unbiased.

This community is about "Do It Yourself", not "Put the Plumbers Kids
through College".

Admittedly there are many jobs where it is sensible to call in the
professionals, but bunging in a load of X400 and leaving it for a
week* just isn't one of them.

Just as an aside, by any chance do you live under a bridge?

Steve


*Summarised for those with a short attention span

chris wrote:

a message for Andy!

I am fed up with people who think they know all about everything.

I refer in particular to your references rubbishing power-flushing in
google groups.

Have you got a power flushing machine?

If so, do you know how to use it?



Telling people that genuine heating engineers like me are ripping
people off really annoys me.

You advocate to this girl flushing with cold water! Egh? It doesn't
take a scientist to work out that an acid will do a better job than
water does it. Are you advocating that she flushes with water in both
directions, as is possible with a power flush.



In short, I power flush for a living. I have solved hundreds?literally
hundreds of circulation issues in heating systems using my power
flushing kit. Yes it costs money, as any service does, and I will
allow for the fact that the world is full of idiots who cant be
bothered or don't know how the job is done properly, don't add your
name the list.



Get yourself a power flush machine and stop misinforming people.

As a professional (i.e. someone who is paid for doing the job) I would
take issue with a number of these statements.

In particular whilst flushing is important (indeed the manufacturers
tell you so), there are two problems with its widespread use.

1) Use when it is not necessary because it is not the cause of the
heating system failure(s). In particular there are many companies (yours
and mine excepted - of course) that advocate this either as a cure-all
or as a remedy of last resort (having failed to diagnose the real
fault).

2) Using it to treat the symptoms rather than the cause of the problems
(for instance chronic over-pumping).

As you know limescale is rarely a problem for primary circuits and thus
acid is rarely needed if on circuits. It is needed to on secondary
pipework especially combis.

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

I have not said that power flushing is necessarily bad as a technique,
but that it is not good value for money (certainly at BG prices), and
there are equally effective if not better DIY approaches.

.andy

I was working at a house today where a white van with a magnetic sticker on
the side showed it was a BG installer/contractor. The two plumbers inside
were doing a power flush that had been arranged by BG and the owner of the
house had paid £750 plus VAT for the job. The plumbers informed me they got
£120 off BG for the job. Do your own maths and you will never use BG again.

Adam

In article ,
ARWadsworth writes
I have not said that power flushing is necessarily bad as a technique,
but that it is not good value for money (certainly at BG prices), and
there are equally effective if not better DIY approaches.

.andy

I was working at a house today where a white van with a magnetic sticker on
the side showed it was a BG installer/contractor. The two plumbers inside
were doing a power flush that had been arranged by BG and the owner of the
house had paid £750 plus VAT for the job. The plumbers informed me they got
£120 off BG for the job. Do your own maths and you will never use BG again.

Adam


How did the plumbing world manage before power flushing machines were
invented ?. What is wrong with just removing the radiators and blasting
them with a hose pipe down the end of the garden ?.
--
Andrew