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-   -   Connecting Timber Joists to Steel Beam (https://www.diybanter.com/uk-diy/112375-connecting-timber-joists-steel-beam.html)

TheScullster June 15th 05 12:16 PM

Connecting Timber Joists to Steel Beam
 
Does anyone have links, details, pictures or drawings showing methods for
attaching joists to steel beams please?

I am hoping to take out a wall which simply supports overlapping ceiling
joists in a single storey extension.
But, I don't want to install a beam below the ceiling and would rather it
fitted within the depth of the joists (projecting above into the loft space
depending on the beam depth).

So, how do I connect joist ends to the support beam?

TIA

Phil



Christian McArdle June 15th 05 12:18 PM

So, how do I connect joist ends to the support beam?

Joist hangers?

Don't forget that any steel framework has to be fireproofed.

Christian.



TheScullster June 15th 05 12:42 PM


Joist hangers?

Don't forget that any steel framework has to be fireproofed.



Thanks Christian, but I don't see how the joist hangers (usually nailed of
course) get fixed to the I section beam!
This is the sort of detail I am looking for guidance on.

Phil



BigWallop June 15th 05 12:59 PM


"TheScullster" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have links, details, pictures or drawings showing methods for
attaching joists to steel beams please?

I am hoping to take out a wall which simply supports overlapping ceiling
joists in a single storey extension.
But, I don't want to install a beam below the ceiling and would rather it
fitted within the depth of the joists (projecting above into the loft

space
depending on the beam depth).

So, how do I connect joist ends to the support beam?

TIA

Phil



Simple metal hook shaped things that screw to the timber joists, after being
placed over the far edge of the beam. Or flat metal straps that straddle
the beam and screw to the ends of the joists on either side, if they line up
together that is. With two sets of joist ends coming from either side of
the web on an " I " (eye) Beam, the straps help hold the beam, and beam
helps hold the joists. It might need BCO and Structural Engineer Calcs'
before you get insurance cover though.



Alan June 15th 05 01:27 PM

Hi,

I'm not sure if it is possible for your situation, but I have done this
with the ends of the joists shaped to fit into either side of the "I"
of the beam - and before anyone says anything - it was approved by the
structural engineer and BCO - worked a treat. Difficult do do unless
you are completely removing the ceilings in both rooms and the dwangs
between the joists but an option none the less.

Alan.


Christian McArdle June 15th 05 01:37 PM

Thanks Christian, but I don't see how the joist hangers (usually nailed of
course) get fixed to the I section beam!
This is the sort of detail I am looking for guidance on.


They can be bolted to the steel, or hung over the top.

Christian.



TheScullster June 16th 05 01:51 PM

Alan

Thanks - can you tell me the width of the section you used please?
I was under the understanding that 75mm of bearing length was required to
the end of each joist.
This would result in a larger than necessary section for the job in hand.

Also what is a dwang?

2nd Also - what did you do about fire proofing of beam in this instance?


Thanks in anticipation

Phil



TheScullster June 16th 05 02:56 PM

Were you given any recommendations for end support of the steel beam?
Is a concrete lintel/padstone needed?
Do the ends have to be secured in any way or do they just sit on the
supporting wall?
I believe it is usual to build the ends in?

TIA

Phil



TheScullster June 16th 05 03:59 PM

Thanks Mr B Thumbs

I believe I have enough information etc to size beam and submit proposals
now.

Phil



Alan June 16th 05 04:59 PM

Hi,

I don't have the exact size to hand but looking at standard size
information on the web, I think it was a 203x133. I guess that would
give you about 60mm bearing by the time you take the beam thickness
away. I've no idea if this is a larger than necessary section.

A dwang is the Scottish term for noggin. The short pieces of wood which
go between the beams to stop sideways movement.

Intumescent paint for fire proofing.

The end of the beam sits on a pad stone and is then concreted in.

Alan.


TheScullster June 16th 05 06:31 PM

Thanks Alan

I'll run the sums and check beam size, deflection etc.
As this is only taking ceiling materials, light storage loads I was looking
at 7 x 4 which affords slightly less bearing than your 133.

Phil



Nick Atty June 17th 05 07:16 PM

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:16:07 +0100, "TheScullster"
wrote:

Does anyone have links, details, pictures or drawings showing methods for
attaching joists to steel beams please?

I am hoping to take out a wall which simply supports overlapping ceiling
joists in a single storey extension.
But, I don't want to install a beam below the ceiling and would rather it
fitted within the depth of the joists (projecting above into the loft space
depending on the beam depth).

So, how do I connect joist ends to the support beam?


When they converted my house into a house, they bolted huge timbers
parallel to the beams, notched them, and put the joists in there.

I suspect you could do the same with smaller timbers and joist hangers.

We had all that exposed when reordering the rooms recently, and the BCO
was perfectly happy with it.
--
On-line canal route planner: http://www.canalplan.org.uk

(Waterways World site of the month, April 2001)

Nick Atty June 17th 05 07:16 PM

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:18:55 +0100, "Christian McArdle"
wrote:

So, how do I connect joist ends to the support beam?


Joist hangers?

Don't forget that any steel framework has to be fireproofed.


Surely that's only if it's exposed or goes through a fire break? My
steel[*] has still got the 1930s red oxide on, and nothing else and - as
I said - the BCO was happy with it.
[*] the house is a converted telephone exchange, the roof and upper
floor supports are two steel A frames.
--
On-line canal route planner: http://www.canalplan.org.uk

(Waterways World site of the month, April 2001)

Rick June 19th 05 06:13 PM

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:16:07 +0100, "TheScullster"
wrote:

Does anyone have links, details, pictures or drawings showing methods for
attaching joists to steel beams please?

I am hoping to take out a wall which simply supports overlapping ceiling
joists in a single storey extension.
But, I don't want to install a beam below the ceiling and would rather it
fitted within the depth of the joists (projecting above into the loft space
depending on the beam depth).

So, how do I connect joist ends to the support beam?

TIA

Phil


You put the ends of the joist into the web of the beam, or put another
way, into the middle of "I" shape.

Rick



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