Hey all - I've been doing some research on this problem for almost a
year now. I've kind of got a good idea of what I need but let me
describe the problem.

I've successfully converted a 3 horsepower Briggs and Stratton vertical
engine to horizontal use. I did 26.08 hours of test running and it
just kept right on going. The tests were held outdoors in the dead
cold of winter so since part of my conversion involved extending the
intake tube by using a rubber tube, I soon had carb ice issues because
no longer would the warmth of the engine make it to the carb (isolated
by the rubber tube.)

What I need to do is take a piece of tubing which has a 3/4" O.D. and
expand it to 3/4" I.D. to a depth of one inch. Then all I have to do
is hammer the tube over the existing one and presto - I'll have an
extended intake tube. My goal is produce a very simple kit which lets
you take a vertical shaft mower, convert it to horizontal, so that it
can be used in horizontal applications. I'm currently checking ebay
for a minibike frame so I can mount the engine (via a bracket) to it
and test it out further.

Is a boiler or condensor tube roller what I need here? What I need
essentially is a miniature version of a tail-pipe expander.

Thanks for the help and please - if you can assist me here, please
contact me at

Pictures of the conversion are found at http://www.nqvw.com/verthoriz/

Just ignore all the other pictures - the ones you wanna see are
engine1.jpg - engine9.jpg

Thanks!

Erin

Two things:

Ya, a tube roller would do it, but a prosser (like an exhaust pipe
expander) would also. The best way is the proper socket expander.

The icing issue is best handled with air preheat. Preheat duct to the
carb intake to draw air over the cooling fins on the cylinder.


wrote:
Hey all - I've been doing some research on this problem for almost a
year now. I've kind of got a good idea of what I need but let me
describe the problem.

I've successfully converted a 3 horsepower Briggs and Stratton
vertical
engine to horizontal use. I did 26.08 hours of test running and it
just kept right on going. The tests were held outdoors in the dead
cold of winter so since part of my conversion involved extending the
intake tube by using a rubber tube, I soon had carb ice issues
because
no longer would the warmth of the engine make it to the carb
(isolated
by the rubber tube.)

What I need to do is take a piece of tubing which has a 3/4" O.D. and
expand it to 3/4" I.D. to a depth of one inch. Then all I have to do
is hammer the tube over the existing one and presto - I'll have an
extended intake tube. My goal is produce a very simple kit which
lets
you take a vertical shaft mower, convert it to horizontal, so that it
can be used in horizontal applications. I'm currently checking ebay
for a minibike frame so I can mount the engine (via a bracket) to it
and test it out further.

Is a boiler or condensor tube roller what I need here? What I need
essentially is a miniature version of a tail-pipe expander.

Thanks for the help and please - if you can assist me here, please
contact me at

Pictures of the conversion are found at
http://www.nqvw.com/verthoriz/

Just ignore all the other pictures - the ones you wanna see are
engine1.jpg - engine9.jpg

Thanks!

Erin

On 10 Dec 2004 18:00:49 -0800, wrote:

===Hey all - I've been doing some research on this problem for almost a
===year now. I've kind of got a good idea of what I need but let me
===describe the problem.
===
===I've successfully converted a 3 horsepower Briggs and Stratton vertical
===engine to horizontal use. I did 26.08 hours of test running and it
===just kept right on going. The tests were held outdoors in the dead
===cold of winter so since part of my conversion involved extending the
===intake tube by using a rubber tube, I soon had carb ice issues because
===no longer would the warmth of the engine make it to the carb (isolated
===by the rubber tube.)
===
===What I need to do is take a piece of tubing which has a 3/4" O.D. and
===expand it to 3/4" I.D. to a depth of one inch. Then all I have to do
===is hammer the tube over the existing one and presto - I'll have an
===extended intake tube. My goal is produce a very simple kit which lets
===you take a vertical shaft mower, convert it to horizontal, so that it
===can be used in horizontal applications. I'm currently checking ebay
===for a minibike frame so I can mount the engine (via a bracket) to it
===and test it out further.
===
===Is a boiler or condensor tube roller what I need here? What I need
===essentially is a miniature version of a tail-pipe expander.
===
===Thanks for the help and please - if you can assist me here, please
===contact me at
===
===Pictures of the conversion are found at http://www.nqvw.com/verthoriz/
===
===Just ignore all the other pictures - the ones you wanna see are
===engine1.jpg - engine9.jpg
===
===Thanks!
===
===Erin


Question:
I the images you have is that a board taped and bolted to what was/ is
a lawn mower blade? I assume you n eeded to have "something" on the
crank so it wold work right, but I really question the safety of
swinging a piece of wood like this.......you know the old saying $hit
happens.........I would look for a cast iron flywheel as odds are it
has an aluminum flywheel, and also get rid of that blade / board setup
and use a disk or perhaps a flywheel from a treadmill if its inertia
that this motor needs for your test purpose.

Other than that, its a pretty neat idea, but a kit is gonna have to be
pretty cheap as you can buy a consumer grade 3 to 3.5 hp B & S ort
Tech engine pretty darn cheap anymore........that is already a
horizontal style.

You may have problems finding a small tube expander, but I think they
are made but they as well as the larger ones are pretty pricey.
Perhaps making a tool to swedge the steel tube outwards to expand its
inside diameter would work better, but its still going to need a good
seal so perhaps a boot made of hose or such over the joint will be
needed. Just a tiny air leak and they don't really work all that
well.... I stilldoubt you will get sufficient heat transfer in really
cold conditions to elimiate your icing conditions, but you never know.
Neat idea anyhow........I give it a 8.5 on the ingenuity scale!
Visit my website: http://www.frugalmachinist.com
Opinions expressed are those of my wife,
I had no input whatsoever.
Remove "nospam" from email addy.

wrote:

Hey all - I've been doing some research on this problem for almost a
year now. I've kind of got a good idea of what I need but let me
describe the problem.

I've successfully converted a 3 horsepower Briggs and Stratton vertical
engine to horizontal use. I did 26.08 hours of test running and it
just kept right on going. The tests were held outdoors in the dead
cold of winter so since part of my conversion involved extending the
intake tube by using a rubber tube, I soon had carb ice issues because
no longer would the warmth of the engine make it to the carb (isolated
by the rubber tube.)

What I need to do is take a piece of tubing which has a 3/4" O.D. and
expand it to 3/4" I.D. to a depth of one inch. Then all I have to do
is hammer the tube over the existing one and presto - I'll have an
extended intake tube. My goal is produce a very simple kit which lets
you take a vertical shaft mower, convert it to horizontal, so that it
can be used in horizontal applications. I'm currently checking ebay
for a minibike frame so I can mount the engine (via a bracket) to it
and test it out further.

Is a boiler or condensor tube roller what I need here? What I need
essentially is a miniature version of a tail-pipe expander.

Thanks for the help and please - if you can assist me here, please
contact me at

Pictures of the conversion are found at http://www.nqvw.com/verthoriz/

Just ignore all the other pictures - the ones you wanna see are
engine1.jpg - engine9.jpg

Thanks!

Erin

Go to a heavy truck/equipment overhaul place & see if you can find some
large ball bearings in their trash box ---some electric motors go this big
too--Press a 3/4" ball down into your tube,then knock it out---If I
remember right you get a few thou oversize!!

I'm swinging a piece of pallet wood and it's duct-taped to keep it from
exploding. My first one did. Noticed I didn't stand in the path of
the swinging piece of wood due to the angle of the photos. This was
outside behind where I work and situated "just-so" so that if it blow
again, the pieces would fly elsewhere. I didn't have to have a load on
it but wanted at least a little something to make the engine work. My
test with the wood is over anyway. I'm looking for a minibike project
to mount this engine too. It's surprising how few parts are involved
in the conversion. I can easily beat the price of a new B&S horizontal
shaft engine which let's face it - in the used market, is harder to
come by than old vertical shaft engines.

The kit would have to be cheap yes - at the very least, I can sell
plans on ebay. I've heard so many people down-play the idea of
converting an engine but it's funny - people will buy a kit thinking it
will save them money over buying a new engine. In some cases it will
and other cases it won't. The fact that I've proven it can be done
answered tons of questions I had. Just tell me I can't do it and then
watch me go to work. :-)

You may have problems finding a small tube expander, but I think they

I've found plenty of them - just didn't know if they would work or not.

Just a tiny air leak and they don't really work all that

RTV and a hammer. Worse comes to worse - a couple slits and a hose
clamp. :-)

well.... I stilldoubt you will get sufficient heat transfer in really
cold conditions to elimiate your icing conditions, but you never
know.

I agree but better than nothing. If the engine was being used hard and
throttled up and down, it would probably produce the heat needed to
prevent icing. The stock setup though just uses an o-ring in the carb
that the intake tube presses into - probably not much thermal transfer
there anyway.

Thanks for the comments!

Erin

Hey that's a pretty cool idea! I'll give that serious consideration -
definiltey cheaper than a boiler roller. Although, if I make a ton of
kits, I'll need something a bit faster than that. :-) It takes a good
amount of expansion to do 3/4" O.D. to 3/4" I.D. - generally the
thickness of the tube determins the difficulty level.

Erin

On 10 Dec 2004 18:00:49 -0800, wrote:

Hey all - I've been doing some research on this problem for almost a
year now. I've kind of got a good idea of what I need but let me
describe the problem.

I've successfully converted a 3 horsepower Briggs and Stratton vertical
engine to horizontal use. I did 26.08 hours of test running and it
just kept right on going. The tests were held outdoors in the dead
cold of winter so since part of my conversion involved extending the
intake tube by using a rubber tube, I soon had carb ice issues because
no longer would the warmth of the engine make it to the carb (isolated
by the rubber tube.)

What I need to do is take a piece of tubing which has a 3/4" O.D. and
expand it to 3/4" I.D. to a depth of one inch. Then all I have to do
is hammer the tube over the existing one and presto - I'll have an
extended intake tube. My goal is produce a very simple kit which lets
you take a vertical shaft mower, convert it to horizontal, so that it
can be used in horizontal applications. I'm currently checking ebay
for a minibike frame so I can mount the engine (via a bracket) to it
and test it out further.

Is a boiler or condensor tube roller what I need here? What I need
essentially is a miniature version of a tail-pipe expander.

Thanks for the help and please - if you can assist me here, please
contact me at

Pictures of the conversion are found at http://www.nqvw.com/verthoriz/

Just ignore all the other pictures - the ones you wanna see are
engine1.jpg - engine9.jpg

Thanks!

Erin
Greetings Erin,
If you have a lathe this will work. Probably. It works on brass.
Anyway, mount a bearing that's 1/2" to 5/8" O.D. on the end of a 1/2
square steel rod. Put the tube in the collet in your lathe and mount
the bearing assembly in the tool post. Spin the tube and touch the
bearing to the inside so that it starts spinning. Pull it out of the
tube and use the cross slide to move the bearing out. Then just force
it into the tube and it will expand. The radius on the outer race of
the bearing will make a nice transition from the new dia. to the old.
I've done this on 1" O.D. 1/16" wall brass tube. It moved surprisingly
easy. I imagine that steel or aluminum tube will work also. If using
6061-T6 aluminum tube it might need to be annealed.
ERS

wrote in message
oups.com...
Hey all - I've been doing some research on this problem for almost a
year now. I've kind of got a good idea of what I need but let me
describe the problem.

I've successfully converted a 3 horsepower Briggs and Stratton
vertical
engine to horizontal use. I did 26.08 hours of test running and it
just kept right on going.

Will the splash oiling work properly in the horz. position and how do
you plan on changing the oil when the engine is mounted to something
permanently that can't be tipped over to get the oil out.?

Bernd

If it is metal tubing you might be able to expand a one of item by
freezing water inside or using a mandrel and a hammer like a snarling
iron on the inside. A bolt with the head filed round would be the tool
to make. Pound on the shaft of the bolt to transfer the force to the
head inside the tube working around the inside. Might involve a bit of
annealing too.
If the tubing is some kind of rubber or plastic try dipping in in
boiling water and opening a pair of needlenose pliers inside.