"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 3 Oct 2014 10:38:52 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

The physical sciences are strictly deterministic (don't start with
me
about Schrodinger's cat, please g). Advances in those sciences
comes
primarily from finding out what the determinants are, and how they
relate. Once those are revealed, the relationships prove to be
mostly
extremely simple and consistent.

Economics may be deterministic but, at the fundamental level, it may
be impossible ever to uncover all of the determinants. Or there may
be
a randomness for which it is mathematically, scientifically,
improssible to uncover the determinants. In other words, there may
be
no intellectual distinction between randomness and the
finest-grained
determination. In the case of economics, that's largely because it
depends on the actions of people -- often hundreds of millions of
them
-- and neither biology nor psychology is anywhere near determining
the
causes of behavior behind any single one of those people. That is,
at
the level of weather prediction: predicting an individual, local
event.

The thermodynamics of chemical reactions deals with extensive (vs
intensive) and indeterminate complexity and randomness. Like economic
and social phenomena, every reaction that can possibly happen has some
probability that it will, in both directions, and they are influenced
by surrounding conditions on both micro and macro scales.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Activation_energy
"First, it is often unclear as to whether or not reaction does proceed
in one step; threshold barriers that are averaged out over all
elementary steps have little theoretical value. Second, even if the
reaction being studied is elementary, a spectrum of individual
collisions contributes to rate constants obtained from bulk ('bulb')
experiments involving billions of molecules, with many different
reactant collision geometries and angles, different translational and
(possibly) vibrational energies-all of which may lead to different
microscopic reaction rates."

It's not a subject that can be explained simply, without math which
quantifies the benefits both parties to a transaction receive, their
risk tolerance (activation energy, temperature) and their occasional
irrationally random behavior, or Entropy.

-jsw

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 3 Oct 2014 10:38:52 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:



The deviation between mainstream climate models run backwards is
around three times larger than the warming from observed data.
Projected hurricane tracks are called "spaghetti models" because our
understanding of energy flow in the atmosphere is inadequate to
accurately predict two days into the future.
http://stormfacts.net/models.htm

That's not climate models. That's weather models.

That effort to dismiss blatant failure is as dishonest as the
communists' claim that all their travesties of the past don't count.

-jsw

"F. George McDuffee" wrote in
message ...
On Sat, 4 Oct 2014 08:53:59 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:



What we really have is achievement inequality, but admitting that
won't get you elected.
Sounds good, but what specific quantifiable and measurable
achievements are we talking about? No matter how hard they
try, the vast majority of people will never be able to play
golf as well as Tiger Woods (and if golf were not currently
a popular sport, and integrated, Tiger would be on food
stamps too).

-jsw

--
Unka' George

Specifically for that example, the achievement is getting onto the
course in some beneficial capacity, perhaps caddy or groundskeeper,
rather than distancing yourself from those evil rich golfers who owe
you a living just 'cause.

On Sat, 4 Oct 2014 15:03:44 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 3 Oct 2014 10:38:52 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


You're talking about engineering more than science. No amount of
deductive theorizing or undirected observation would produce Special
Relativity. It depended, first, on a great insight; and then was
proven by highly-directed observation based on that insight.


You have it backwards.
This is the sequence that produced Special Relativity:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/r...1964_scrib.pdf
"The first stage in the evolution of the Special Theory of Relativity
is generally recognized as beginning with the failure to detect
experimentally the motion of the earth through the ether."

This is an old controversy which I will not get into. But one could
make the point that the failure of theories about the "ether," and the
failure to experimentally detect the motion of the earth through the
"ether,." required a new insight and a new formulation. That's what
Einstein did.

As that paper you linked to says, "For to appreciate the significance
of Einstein's 1905 paper it it important to see how he was able to
find a new point of view..."

Regardless, the point is that many of the great discoveries in science
were the result of great insights. In this case, the proof came after
the insight. Previous experiments produced questions, not directions.


Michelson - Poincare' / Fitzgerald / Lorentz - Einstein

Theory is "correct" only when it can explain all observations.

Unless the theory is that you can explain a statistical probability of
observations. Theories do not always depend upon strict reduction to
causation.

For example the theory about T-cells and the mechanism by which they
go awry, leading to juvenile diabetes. The theory is that the T-cells
in some small portion of the population have a genetic disposition to
misread the chemical signals of certain traumas as being the chemical
signals of the beta cells in one's pancreas. But it is not known why
or how that happens. There is no more than hypotheses about the path
of causation.

So an observation that one individual becomes diabetic, while his
identical twin does not, is not explained by the theory. Yet,
statistically, the theory that there is a genetic dispostion holds up
to a known degree of probability.

--
Ed Huntress

-jsw

On Sat, 4 Oct 2014 15:52:20 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 3 Oct 2014 10:38:52 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:



The deviation between mainstream climate models run backwards is
around three times larger than the warming from observed data.
Projected hurricane tracks are called "spaghetti models" because our
understanding of energy flow in the atmosphere is inadequate to
accurately predict two days into the future.
http://stormfacts.net/models.htm

That's not climate models. That's weather models.

That effort to dismiss blatant failure is as dishonest as the
communists' claim that all their travesties of the past don't count.

I would not consider that a failure, blatant or not. Comparing climate
models to weather models is like comparing a model of tectonic plate
movement to the likelihood of a rockslide on Mount McKinley.

Weather models are about very short-term phenomena in specific places.
Climate models are not.

--
Ed Huntress


-jsw

On Sat, 4 Oct 2014 11:28:11 -0700 (PDT), jon_banquer
wrote:



slow eddy will never stop lying.

Show us an example, you slandering prick.

His entire life is based on lying, looking the other way, etc. He pretends to be a journalist but the reality is he writes ad copy that's only favorable to the advertiser he's writing about.

Tell that to my first publisher, who lost a $40,000 advertising
contract with Elox EDM because of an article I wrote -- and then he
accepted it when my editor (Andy Ashburn) stood behind my article.

You're full of crap, Jon. But then, nearly everyone knows that.

This problem is so bad in the CADCAM industry that you can never read the truth about a CADCAM program in any trade journal. I did something about this problem and started a LinkedIn group that now has over 2,300 members. The groups membership reads like a who's who of the CADCAM business.

And if you go to Jon's "group," a significant part of what you'll see
is people in the business trying to sell products and services to each
other. It's like watching them shine each other's shoes.

It's not advertising based.

That's because you can't. Outside of your "group," too many people in
the business know your reputation.

My LinkedIn group, CADCAM Technology Leaders, has changed the CADCAM business forever. For those who want proof here is just one example:

Right now you can read the former Director Of Software Engineering for CNC Software (Mastercam) talk about what's so wrong with the CADCAM business and what's holding back user productivity. You will never read anything like this is worthless, advertising based, machining rags that slow eddy is a puppet for.

"Former" director? Is he working off a grudge? If he has something
honest to say, he should have no trouble getting it published in, say,
_Manufacturing Engineering_ or _Cutting Tool Engineering_.


What I've done with my experience and my approach to not using any advertising is change the CADCAM business forever.

What you've done is slander half of the companies in the business.

What I've done scares the **** out of worthless, losers like slow eddy because it's so successful.

Oh, yeah, I'm terrified at the prospect that Jon's "success" is going
to impinge on the 25% - 30% or so of the 71,000 real shop people on
our mail list who click through a typical issue of Fab Shop. I'm also
terrified that all of the self-promoters who can't hold a job, and who
are on some kind of welfare, are going to undermine the real trade
journalism business by setting up no-pay "groups" as a kind of ersatz,
egomaniacal hobby.

Not.

None of slow eddy's approaches to trying to delegitimize my extensive knowledge of the CADCAM business...

Oh, mother...help us.

I think it's time for a review of one of the main Jon Banquer
entertainments. Whoever compiled this doesn't have the panache of
Whoyakidding, but it's fun, nevertheless:

======================================

"Without a doubt SaladWorks is a complete piece of ****" - Jon Banquer
- May 21, 2006

"SolidWorks is consuming every available minute of my learning time
right now." - Jon Banquer - Aug 12, 2007

"I've been away from SolidWorks for almost ten years. The program has
changed so much in ten years that I'm still way behind where I need to
be." - Jon Banquer - Aug. 26, 2007

----------------------------------------
"For the record I like SolidWorks" Jon Banquer April 10, 1998

"I'd hate to be using SolidWorks" -Jon Banquer - Jan 15, 2005

----------------------------------------
"OneCNC looks good." - Jon Banquer - Aug 31 2003

"OneCNC has a good product" - Jon Banquer - May 11 2005

"OneCNC is so bad that it can't be sold" - Jon Banquer - June 30,
2007
----------------------------------------------
"May I remind you that your an anonymous loser who is too chicken
**** to post with his own name." - Jon Banquer - Dec 24 2006

Franco Folini UPDATE -- July 8, 2007 -- "Jon didn't respect our
agreement, posting comments under fake names."
-------------------------------
SolidWorks 2007 Bible "the content is just superb!" - Jon Banquer-
Aug 8, 2007

To the author SolidWorks 2007 Bible "I should knock down 200 or so
pages this week. Which still won't get me to Multibodies! Just
****ing ridiculous, Matt." - Jon Banquer - Aug 19-2007
-----------------------------------
"John Carroll is probably the best thing that has ever happened to
U.S. Vero" - Jon Banquer- June 16, 2001

"the type of scumbag that John Carroll is... which is why he can't
sell jack ****" - Jon Banquer- Sept 13, 2012
------------------------------------
"You never chain geometry in Gibbs or SmartCAM. It's not necessary."
Jon Banquer - May 20, 2005

>From the SmartCAM Manual "Create the elements in any order, and
sequence them later, using modeling tools such as Chain."
--------------------------------------
"I would strongly suggest you buy The SolidWorks Bible. It will give
you many insights into how SolidWorks works" - Jon Banquer - Aug 19,
2007

"For all your talk about design intent it's amazing how few examples
you actually give in the SolidWorks Bible on design intent. Why is
that ****tard?" - Jon Banquer - July 14, 2007
----------------------------------------
"The program is a buggy, overpriced under performing, POS that is a
tribute to Bill Gibbs enormous ego" - Jon Banquer -

"Love those GibbsCAM Machining Markers! Great idea" - Jon Banquer -
---------------------------------------------------
"Need I remind you that it's you who is too much of a pussy to say a
word to Bill Gibbs on how you really feel about his claims of no
chaining." - Jon Banquer - July 15, 2007

"Last time I saw Bill Gibbs at a trade show he almost ****ed in his
pants... I went out of my way to be polite and not disturb his
presentation." - Jon Banquer - Aug 11, 2007
=====================================
LOL!
I think some of those dates are from cross-posted replies, but who
knows.

Yes, this is pretty cheesy entertainment, but there's something
satisfying about harpooning a complete phony -- like Jon the Phony
Banquer.
Which reminds me of a Banquer post that reminds me about just how
flakey this guy is:
===========================================
[Jon Banquer replying to Ed Huntress]:
Ed,
The newsgroup badly needs someone who is as articulate as you are.
Keep me on my toes and correct me where ever you think it's
appropriate,as I respect what you have to say based on what you have
already posted. I will certainly take the time to think about whatever
correction, advice, etc. you post. - Jon Banquer - Jun 23, 2002
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt....I/t2qa5vNd-rQJ
=============================================
You bettcha, Jon!

OMFG that was hilarious!

===================================
"Reading "whoyakidding" nail Gunner on a daily basis on all the lies
Gunner has told over many years on Usenet is easily the highlight of
this newsgroup for me." Jon Banquer, Jan 2, 2013
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.c...302126bc6be21d

"This is yet another one of KiddingNoOne's many lies." Jon Banquer,
Apr 3, 2013
http://groups.google.com/group/comp....a25a0cfef810a4

On Saturday, October 4, 2014 3:14:04 PM UTC-7, As per usual slow eddy was unable to counter any of the FACTS I wrote.

slow eddy lies and Bull**** snipped

Nothing to respond to.

On Tue, 30 Sep 2014 23:45:41 -0700 (PDT), jon_banquer
wrote:

This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

So how come I'm not laughing?

http://tinyurl.com/m7ur9l6
"Vlier belongs to a growing class of working poor in
Orlando, which has the lowest median pay among the 50
most-populous American metropolitan areas, according to U.S.
Labor Department data. Three of the city’s largest
employers, including Walt Disney Co. (DIS), increased
starting pay this year. Even after Disney raised its minimum
wage to $10 per hour, Vlier still lives below the federal
poverty line. "
--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

On Tue, 30 Sep 2014 23:45:41 -0700 (PDT), jon_banquer
wrote:

This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

That cloud no bigger than a man's hand just got bigger...

http://tinyurl.com/omcbpm6
"As well, Vladimir Putin’s provocations in Ukraine are
spurring interest in that oil from Europe and, strange as it
seems, Saint John provides among the fastest shipping times
to India of any oil port in North America. Indian companies,
having already sampled this crude, are interested in more.
That means oil-sands production for the first time would
trade in more than dribs and drabs on the international
markets. With the U.S. virtually its only buyer, the captive
Canadians are subject to price discounts of as much as $43 a
barrel that cost Canada $20 billion a year. "


--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

On Wednesday, October 8, 2014 12:37:22 PM UTC-7, F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Tue, 30 Sep 2014 23:45:41 -0700 (PDT), jon_banquer

wrote:



This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.



So how come I'm not laughing?



http://tinyurl.com/m7ur9l6

"Vlier belongs to a growing class of working poor in

Orlando, which has the lowest median pay among the 50

most-populous American metropolitan areas, according to U.S.

Labor Department data. Three of the city's largest

employers, including Walt Disney Co. (DIS), increased

starting pay this year. Even after Disney raised its minimum

wage to $10 per hour, Vlier still lives below the federal

poverty line. "

--

Unka' George



"Gold is the money of kings,

silver is the money of gentlemen,

barter is the money of peasants,

but debt is the money of slaves"



-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"


The Orlando market is totally controlled by Disney. Mickey isn't a mouse... he's a rat. This problem has existed forever. **** Disney.

Walt Disney was also antisemitic.

On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 18:12:46 -0500, Ignoramus19864
wrote:

There is many ways to be pro-Israel. They all involve wishing that
Israel is a prosperous and respected country, that is militarily safe
and economically developed. But being pro-Israel does not mean
supporting just one particular Israeli faction, hating all neighbors
of Israel, being pro-war, and so on. Some people who support Israeli
hardliners, tend to imply that anyone who does not support hardliners
are anti-Israel. I find that to be distateful.

Very good points, Ig. I've had Jewish and Israeli friends all my
life. The hardliners and extremists have always left a bad taste in
my mouth, too. War mongers, hate mongers, Reps, Dems, Zionists,
Muslims, Christians. All of 'em. Even eastern Indians are now saying
we hate them because we won't take their 50 cold calls a week, or send
money, or hire them, or become Hindi. Christ on a crutch...

I'm pro-Israel, but I'm also against sending them five to ten billion
a year of "foreign aid" so they can simply buy more weapons. I'm also
against their handling of their Arab neighbors, and against their
whining about anyone who isn't backing them 150% as being anti-Z or
anti-S. They're as bad as the blacks, with their race cards, damnit.
It's all bull****.

I'm against our president saying "As your ally, we'll back -anything-
you do." because I know they are far too likely to do something which
may force us into another world war, probably nuclear and probably
with Iran. Of course, I'm also against the prez saying that because
I'm certain that he wouldn't back them, anyway. sigh

--
Give me the luxuries of life.
I can live without the necessities.
--anon

On Fri, 03 Oct 2014 11:01:48 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 21:43:56 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller
wrote:

wrote in
:

[...]

Now Ed, I thought that if you were going to stoop to the level
of a few others in the efforts to defend the right (however
moderate or not), you'd at least be truthful.

And now you know why I killfiled Ed six or seven years ago.

Same here.

Ditto.

--
Give me the luxuries of life.
I can live without the necessities.
--anon

On Thursday, October 9, 2014 8:38:11 PM UTC-7, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 18:12:46 -0500, Ignoramus19864

wrote:



There is many ways to be pro-Israel. They all involve wishing that

Israel is a prosperous and respected country, that is militarily safe

and economically developed. But being pro-Israel does not mean

supporting just one particular Israeli faction, hating all neighbors

of Israel, being pro-war, and so on. Some people who support Israeli

hardliners, tend to imply that anyone who does not support hardliners

are anti-Israel. I find that to be distateful.



Very good points, Ig. I've had Jewish and Israeli friends all my

life. The hardliners and extremists have always left a bad taste in

my mouth, too. War mongers, hate mongers, Reps, Dems, Zionists,

Muslims, Christians. All of 'em. Even eastern Indians are now saying

we hate them because we won't take their 50 cold calls a week, or send

money, or hire them, or become Hindi. Christ on a crutch...



I'm pro-Israel, but I'm also against sending them five to ten billion

a year of "foreign aid" so they can simply buy more weapons. I'm also

against their handling of their Arab neighbors, and against their

whining about anyone who isn't backing them 150% as being anti-Z or

anti-S. They're as bad as the blacks, with their race cards, damnit.

It's all bull****.



I'm against our president saying "As your ally, we'll back -anything-

you do." because I know they are far too likely to do something which

may force us into another world war, probably nuclear and probably

with Iran. Of course, I'm also against the prez saying that because

I'm certain that he wouldn't back them, anyway. sigh



--

Give me the luxuries of life.

I can live without the necessities.

--anon

Larry Jackass says he hates Zionists.

A Zionists is someone who supports Israels right to exist.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/...andIsrael.html

"When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You're talking anti-Semitism," in response to a student who had attacked Zionism during a dinner event with Dr. King in 1968.

Larry Jackass is a Jew hater.

On Wed, 08 Oct 2014 14:44:24 -0500, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

On Tue, 30 Sep 2014 23:45:41 -0700 (PDT), jon_banquer
wrote:

This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

That cloud no bigger than a man's hand just got bigger...

http://tinyurl.com/omcbpm6
"As well, Vladimir Putin’s provocations in Ukraine are
spurring interest in that oil from Europe and, strange as it
seems, Saint John provides among the fastest shipping times
to India of any oil port in North America. Indian companies,
having already sampled this crude, are interested in more.
That means oil-sands production for the first time would
trade in more than dribs and drabs on the international
markets. With the U.S. virtually its only buyer, the captive
Canadians are subject to price discounts of as much as $43 a
barrel that cost Canada $20 billion a year. "

Why is our president allowing the export of U.S. oil? And everything
I've read says the Keystone pipeline full of Canadian oil will pass
through our land without us being able to buy it for ourselves. It
would have kept us from having to buy Arab oil. (A good thing, right?)
I don't understand any of this. Why haven't gas and oil become
nationalized for our safety and security? (I mean other than the fact
that all of our gov't workers are being bought off by Big Oil.)

--
Give me the luxuries of life.
I can live without the necessities.
--anon

On Thu, 9 Oct 2014 01:09:23 +0000 (UTC), (Edward A.
Falk) wrote:

In article ,
jon_banquer wrote:
On Saturday, October 4, 2014 2:54:54 AM UTC-7, RogerN wrote:

It's time to get big money out of politics. Both parties candidates are corrupted by it.

We need serious campaign finance reform that ends these PAC's once and for all.

Amen

Getting the money out of politics just might save the USA.

--
Give me the luxuries of life.
I can live without the necessities.
--anon

On Thursday, October 9, 2014 10:06:36 PM UTC-7, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 9 Oct 2014 01:09:23 +0000 (UTC), (Edward A.

Falk) wrote:



In article ,

jon_banquer wrote:

On Saturday, October 4, 2014 2:54:54 AM UTC-7, RogerN wrote:



It's time to get big money out of politics. Both parties candidates are corrupted by it.



We need serious campaign finance reform that ends these PAC's once and for all.



Amen



Getting the money out of politics just might save the USA.



--

Give me the luxuries of life.

I can live without the necessities.

--anon


No ****, Captain Obvious.

Does this mean the Great **** won't be swallowing you and Mark Wieber?

On Thu, 09 Oct 2014 20:40:01 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Oct 2014 11:01:48 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 21:43:56 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller
wrote:

wrote in
:

[...]

Now Ed, I thought that if you were going to stoop to the level
of a few others in the efforts to defend the right (however
moderate or not), you'd at least be truthful.

And now you know why I killfiled Ed six or seven years ago.

Same here.

Ditto.

You killfiled me because I was defending the "right" in an untruthful
way? In other words, I'm politically too far to the right for your
tastes?

Dingbat, do you ever really read what you're responding to?

And what you said is bull****, in any case. You got ****ed off after I
refused to talk to you for months, because you actually *advocated*
threatening elected officials with guns if they wouldn't toe your
dimwitted Tea Party line. I still think you're a complete jerk for
that. You'd do better in Russia, where they better appreciate the
means of undermining democratic representation.

--
Ed Huntress

On Thursday, October 9, 2014 11:40:01 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Fri, 03 Oct 2014 11:01:48 -0700, Gunner Asch

wrote:

On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 21:43:56 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller

wrote:

wrote in

:

Now Ed, I thought that if you were going to stoop to the level

of a few others in the efforts to defend the right (however

moderate or not), you'd at least be truthful.

And now you know why I killfiled Ed six or seven years ago.

Same here.

Ditto.

How does Ed strangely know you "don't drink" then?

On Saturday, October 4, 2014 4:24:03 PM UTC-4, Jim Wilkins wrote:
"F. George McDuffee" wrote in

message ...

On Sat, 4 Oct 2014 08:53:59 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"

wrote:

What we really have is achievement inequality, but admitting that

won't get you elected.

Sounds good, but what specific quantifiable and measurable

achievements are we talking about? No matter how hard they

try, the vast majority of people will never be able to play

golf as well as Tiger Woods (and if golf were not currently

a popular sport, and integrated, Tiger would be on food

stamps too).


Specifically for that example, the achievement is getting onto the

course in some beneficial capacity, perhaps caddy or groundskeeper,



rather than distancing yourself from those evil rich golfers who owe

you a living just 'cause.

I've never heard golfers described as "evil". Why use such rough talk?

On Wednesday, October 1, 2014 2:45:44 AM UTC-4, jon_banquer wrote:
This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to in a
longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

Jon, to get back to the point though:

To know more about Harold Gowdy (R-SC), you should read what his democratic opponent said about his record; business dealings, during his previous (and maybe current) campaign. Repubs usually don't shine anymore at that point.

On Thu, 09 Oct 2014 21:59:59 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

snip

Why is our president allowing the export of U.S. oil? And everything
I've read says the Keystone pipeline full of Canadian oil will pass
through our land without us being able to buy it for ourselves. It
would have kept us from having to buy Arab oil. (A good thing, right?)
I don't understand any of this. Why haven't gas and oil become
nationalized for our safety and security? (I mean other than the fact
that all of our gov't workers are being bought off by Big Oil.)

=============================

A short funny:
Many years ago I was peripherally involved in a union
dispute, and had to set in on the grievance hearing. One of
our smarmy management types asked the union reps to "try to
see the problem from our perspective." The reply, which
ended that session was "We've tried several times, but we
can't get our head up our *** that far."

To understand any of this will require one of the most
difficult mental activities, namely putting yourself in
their place and thinking like they do, i. e. a super "method
acting" http://tinyurl.com/4jumto exercise . This includes
considerable sociopathology, with no consideration given to
anyone else, e. g. Ted Bundy in the corner office.
http://tinyurl.com/od79drv These people live in a
completely different world than the huge majority of
humankind, which they regard as "Untermensch."
http://tinyurl.com/7ub4b

As to why several obvious things have not occurred, this
seems to me to be more a result of subliminal non-rational
cultural assumptions and beliefs, which *MAY* have had some
functionality in ages past, but should be consciously
examined and validated in the new socioeconomic era.
FWIW: The wild wild west died a century ago, and the
historical records show the "rugged individualists" (and
their families) of that era died like flies.

It is correctly observed that statist solutions (such as oil
and gas nationalization*) are frequently expensive, slow and
even counterproductive, but such evaluation is meaningless
unless a comparable sample of private enterprise market
driven [what ever that means] solutions are also evaluated.
I would suggest the TVA as a counterexample.

*Although the hybrid solution of a domestically chartered
private joint stock company with 51% of the stock owned by
several levels of government (one of these a golden share
with veto power over relocation, inversions, M&A, governance
changes, etc) seems to be functioning well [compared to the
Repsol rendering] for YPF in Argentina.
http://tinyurl.com/l9jsakf

A small book is suggested to give some insight into this
problematique.

_23 Things They Don't Tell You About Capitalism_ – January
17, 2012 by Ha-Joon Chang (Author)
http://tinyurl.com/k7qvpyc

His book _Bad Samaritans: The Myth of Free Trade and the
Secret History of Capitalism_ is also highly recommended
http://tinyurl.com/l755qrv
This explains why we are being overrun by economic refugees
after we have done so much to help their countries. ;-(


--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 16:42:43 -0500, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

On Thu, 09 Oct 2014 21:59:59 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

snip

Why is our president allowing the export of U.S. oil? And everything
I've read says the Keystone pipeline full of Canadian oil will pass
through our land without us being able to buy it for ourselves. It
would have kept us from having to buy Arab oil. (A good thing, right?)
I don't understand any of this. Why haven't gas and oil become
nationalized for our safety and security? (I mean other than the fact
that all of our gov't workers are being bought off by Big Oil.)

=============================

A short funny:
Many years ago I was peripherally involved in a union
dispute, and had to set in on the grievance hearing. One of
our smarmy management types asked the union reps to "try to
see the problem from our perspective." The reply, which
ended that session was "We've tried several times, but we
can't get our head up our *** that far."

g


To understand any of this will require one of the most
difficult mental activities, namely putting yourself in
their place and thinking like they do, i. e. a super "method
acting" http://tinyurl.com/4jumto exercise . This includes
considerable sociopathology, with no consideration given to
anyone else, e. g. Ted Bundy in the corner office.
http://tinyurl.com/od79drv These people live in a
completely different world than the huge majority of
humankind, which they regard as "Untermensch."
http://tinyurl.com/7ub4b

Grok that, x3. sigh


As to why several obvious things have not occurred, this
seems to me to be more a result of subliminal non-rational
cultural assumptions and beliefs, which *MAY* have had some
functionality in ages past, but should be consciously
examined and validated in the new socioeconomic era.
FWIW: The wild wild west died a century ago, and the
historical records show the "rugged individualists" (and
their families) of that era died like flies.

True.


It is correctly observed that statist solutions (such as oil
and gas nationalization*) are frequently expensive, slow and
even counterproductive, but such evaluation is meaningless
unless a comparable sample of private enterprise market
driven [what ever that means] solutions are also evaluated.
I would suggest the TVA as a counterexample.

Right.


*Although the hybrid solution of a domestically chartered
private joint stock company with 51% of the stock owned by
several levels of government (one of these a golden share
with veto power over relocation, inversions, M&A, governance
changes, etc) seems to be functioning well [compared to the
Repsol rendering] for YPF in Argentina.
http://tinyurl.com/l9jsakf

(subscription only)

Like giving the USPS to UPS or FEDEX, with strings? Surely they
wouldn't screw it up like the pseudo-gov't has.


A small book is suggested to give some insight into this
problematique.

_23 Things They Don't Tell You About Capitalism_ – January
17, 2012 by Ha-Joon Chang (Author)
http://tinyurl.com/k7qvpyc

fee


His book _Bad Samaritans: The Myth of Free Trade and the
Secret History of Capitalism_ is also highly recommended
http://tinyurl.com/l755qrv

target no got.


This explains why we are being overrun by economic refugees
after we have done so much to help their countries. ;-(

sigh2

--
Give me the luxuries of life.
I can live without the necessities.
--anon

On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 20:08:55 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

*Although the hybrid solution of a domestically chartered
private joint stock company with 51% of the stock owned by
several levels of government (one of these a golden share
with veto power over relocation, inversions, M&A, governance
changes, etc) seems to be functioning well [compared to the
Repsol rendering] for YPF in Argentina.
http://tinyurl.com/l9jsakf

(subscription only)

try this one http://tinyurl.com/mxxmp4h
google translation of pagana12 article, a populist/peronesta
paper.


--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

F. George McDuffee wrote:

On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 20:08:55 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

*Although the hybrid solution of a domestically chartered
private joint stock company with 51% of the stock owned by
several levels of government (one of these a golden share
with veto power over relocation, inversions, M&A, governance
changes, etc) seems to be functioning well [compared to the
Repsol rendering] for YPF in Argentina.
http://tinyurl.com/l9jsakf

(subscription only)

F. George McDuffee
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 20:08:55 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

*Although the hybrid solution of a domestically chartered
private joint stock company with 51% of the stock owned by
several levels of government (one of these a golden share
with veto power over relocation, inversions, M&A, governance
changes, etc) seems to be functioning well [compared to the
Repsol rendering] for YPF in Argentina.
http://tinyurl.com/l9jsakf

(subscription only)

try this one http://tinyurl.com/mxxmp4h
google translation of pagana12 article, a populist/peronesta
paper. try this one http://tinyurl.com/mxxmp4h
google translation of pagana12 article, a populist/peronesta
paper.

"The Great Depression was 80 years ago, and people are still debating the causes and response. Perhaps the 2008 crisis is destined to be the same. To the question we began with -- were the financial leaders [principally the Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke, Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson and the New York Fed chief, Timothy Geithner] heroes, benefactors of Wall Street or vindictive decision-makers, the answer that is coming into focus is this: all three."

"The Fed bailout of A.I.G. [headquartered in Houston, TX] was in no small part about ensuring that those banks would get the money they were owed: $12 billion each for Deutsche Bank and Société Générale, for example"

"Six Years Later, We're Still Litigating The Bailouts" by By NEIL IRWIN. New York Times, Sunday Business, SUNDAY, OCTOBER 3, 2014
-- http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/10/05..._r=0&referrer=

On Thursday, October 2, 2014 6:07:57 PM UTC-4, jon_banquer wrote:
On Thursday, October 2, 2014 1:51:30 PM UTC-7, F. George McDuffee wrote:

You have very little understanding of the growing hatred for
Israel/Jews and it often shows in what you post. I would not
want to be a Jew and live in many parts of Europe right now. Safest
place for a Jew is Israel.

In America, the number 3 republican in congress (Steve Scalise) took $1000 dollar campaign contribution from Kenny Knight, campaign chair for David Duke.

He said his views are similar to David Duke.

I'd be more scared of the right, not the left

On 1/2/2015 8:55 AM, wrote:

In America, the number 3 republican in congress (Steve Scalise) took
$1000 dollar campaign contribution from Kenny Knight, campaign chair
for David Duke.

He said his views are similar to David Duke.

I'd be more scared of the right, not the left


Which Democrat members of Congress were members of the KKK again? Which
Party founded the KKK? How long ago did Scalise take the donation?
What corroborating evidence is there that Scalise is aligned with
Kenny Knight? If a bit of conclusion jumping is good cardio exercise,
you must be in great shape! But, anything to further the cause; the end
ALWAYS justifies the means!

On Friday, January 2, 2015 5:55:39 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Thursday, October 2, 2014 6:07:57 PM UTC-4, jon_banquer wrote:
On Thursday, October 2, 2014 1:51:30 PM UTC-7, F. George McDuffee wrote:

You have very little understanding of the growing hatred for
Israel/Jews and it often shows in what you post. I would not
want to be a Jew and live in many parts of Europe right now. Safest
place for a Jew is Israel.

In America, the number 3 republican in congress (Steve Scalise) took $1000 dollar campaign contribution from Kenny Knight, campaign chair for David Duke.

He said his views are similar to David Duke.

I'd be more scared of the right, not the left

The key to a better GOP is to make racist ****tards and morons not welcome in the GOP. What's needed are smarter and better conservatives rather than world class losers like slow eddy, Mark Wieber, Larry Jackass, etc:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9_7Elc1e3E

On Friday, January 2, 2015 5:55:39 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Thursday, October 2, 2014 6:07:57 PM UTC-4, jon_banquer wrote:
On Thursday, October 2, 2014 1:51:30 PM UTC-7, F. George McDuffee wrote:

You have very little understanding of the growing hatred for
Israel/Jews and it often shows in what you post. I would not
want to be a Jew and live in many parts of Europe right now. Safest
place for a Jew is Israel.

In America, the number 3 republican in congress (Steve Scalise) took $1000 dollar campaign contribution from Kenny Knight, campaign chair for David Duke.

He said his views are similar to David Duke.

I'd be more scared of the right, not the left


The radical left is worse because it's growing much faster.

Tom Gardner wrote:

Which Democrat members of Congress were members of the KKK again? Which
Party founded the KKK? How long ago did Scalise take the donation?
What corroborating evidence is there that Scalise is aligned with
Kenny Knight? If a bit of conclusion jumping is good cardio exercise,
you must be in great shape! But, anything
to further the cause; the end
ALWAYS justifies the means!


Fox News "Fox Nation" report on Facebook says it: https://www.facebook.com/TheFOXNatio...53019368747446
http://nation.foxnews.com/2014/12/31...scalise-story- ... Fox affiliate fires reporter and cameraman who deceptively edited video of police. ... Report: Scalise's Pitch 20 Years Ago: I'm 'David Duke Without The Baggage' -

When someone says that he's a Klux Klansman like Duke was, why would you - a democrat argue with him, huh Tom.
d

On 1/2/2015 4:31 PM, wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:

Which Democrat members of Congress were members of the KKK again?
Which Party founded the KKK? How long ago did Scalise take the
donation?
What corroborating evidence is there that Scalise is aligned with
Kenny Knight? If a bit of conclusion jumping is good cardio
exercise, you must be in great shape! But, anything
to further the cause; the end
ALWAYS justifies the means!


Fox News "Fox Nation" report on Facebook says it:
https://www.facebook.com/TheFOXNatio...53019368747446
http://nation.foxnews.com/2014/12/31...scalise-story-
... Fox affiliate fires reporter and cameraman who deceptively edited
video of police. ... Report: Scalise's Pitch 20 Years Ago: I'm 'David
Duke Without The Baggage' -

When someone says that he's a Klux Klansman like Duke was, why would
you - a democrat argue with him, huh Tom. d



Page not found.

Why would I argue? Because, unlike some people I don't believe most of
what I see or read...even if told to do so by the master.

On 1/2/2015 10:51 AM, Tom Gardner wrote:
On 1/2/2015 8:55 AM, wrote:

In America, the number 3 republican in congress (Steve Scalise) took
$1000 dollar campaign contribution from Kenny Knight, campaign chair
for David Duke.

He said his views are similar to David Duke.

I'd be more scared of the right, not the left


Which Democrat members of Congress were members of the KKK again? Which
Party founded the KKK? How long ago did Scalise take the donation?
What corroborating evidence is there that Scalise is aligned with
Kenny Knight? If a bit of conclusion jumping is good cardio exercise,
you must be in great shape! But, anything to further the cause; the end
ALWAYS justifies the means!
Demo from S. Carolina - long time member of the Senate as I recall -
maybe N. Carolina. But South rings a bell.

No Party founded the KKK. They did it themselves.
It was around for a very long time - like since the Civil War or before.
It was in the northern states and last heard from up there.

Martin

On 1/3/2015 12:49 AM, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Fri, 02 Jan 2015 20:11:20 -0600, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

ALWAYS justifies the means!
Demo from S. Carolina - long time member of the Senate as I recall -
maybe N. Carolina. But South rings a bell.

No Party founded the KKK. They did it themselves.
It was around for a very long time - like since the Civil War or before.
It was in the northern states and last heard from up there.

Martin

But the Founders of the KKK were indeed solely Democrat and had the
full blessing of the Democratic Party.

The Democratic Party had a full Klanbake in 1928 when they took over
Washington DC

snip

Thew leftists will NEVER admit that the complicity of their high priests
and prophets in anything politically inconvenient. Notice how they try
to deflect and reverse the charges? But they find SOMETHING on the
internet to bolster their position...so it must be true.

Thue Democrats just acknowledge their sordid past and move on. But, not
so leftists! That's why I'm a Democrat and NOT a Leftist...THANK GOD!

On Wednesday, October 1, 2014 at 2:45:44 AM UTC-4, jon_banquer wrote:
This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to
in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

Having second thoughts? "... Just yesterday, several Democratic members of the committee wrote to ... [Committee Chairman Trey Gowdy R-S.C.] to remind him of his own Benghazi-related schedule, which Republicans are now ignoring. From the letter:

"At the beginning of this year, Select Committee Republicans provided Democrats with detailed information about their plans to hold 11 hearings between January and October on a wide range of topics relating to the Benghazi attacks. Since then, however, Republicans have completely abandoned this plan - holding no hearings at all since January ..."

Rachel Maddow report from MSNBC
-- http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-s...goes-the-rails

On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 1:47:15 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Wednesday, October 1, 2014 at 2:45:44 AM UTC-4, jon_banquer wrote:
This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to
in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

Having second thoughts? "... Just yesterday, several Democratic members of the committee wrote to ... [Committee Chairman Trey Gowdy R-S.C.] to remind him of his own Benghazi-related schedule, which Republicans are now ignoring. From the letter:

"At the beginning of this year, Select Committee Republicans provided Democrats with detailed information about their plans to hold 11 hearings between January and October on a wide range of topics relating to the Benghazi attacks. Since then, however, Republicans have completely abandoned this plan - holding no hearings at all since January ..."

Rachel Maddow report from MSNBC
-- http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-s...goes-the-rails


None whatsoever.

On Tuesday, September 30, 2014 at 11:45:44 PM UTC-7, jon_banquer wrote:
This is the first member of the GOP I've listened to in a longtime that doesn't seem like a total joke.

??? Such smarmy arrogance has no place in public office...the guy's an extreme JACKASS!!

Rep. Trey Gowdy To Leave Congress, Becoming Latest High-Profile Committee Chairman To Retire
Fox News - January 31, 2018

-- http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018...-november.html

On 2/3/2018 12:52 PM, wrote:
Rep. Trey Gowdy To Leave Congress, Becoming Latest High-Profile Committee Chairman To Retire
Fox News - January 31, 2018

-- http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018...-november.html


He is about to be accused of homosexual assault and rape.