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All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?



 
 
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  #1  
Old March 31st 12, 01:47 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 597
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

I have spoken with several HVAC contractors regarding replacement of my
old Lennox central air conditioning system. All of them are Lennox
dealers except one who also carries Trane products.

The dealer who also carries Trane was trying to switch me from my
original Lennox preference, stating that the Trane coils, which are 100%
aluminum, rather than the Lennox coils, which use aluminum fins and
copper tubing, provide a better, longer lasting design.

He felt that Trane was superior in other ways also, since they used
"composite plastics" in the outdoor condensing unit case rather than
steel to ensure that no corrosion or rusting would occur.

The basic claim was that Trane, using aluminum for all of the
refrigeration loop, had a longer life expectancy that Lennox, given the
newer Puron refrigerant.

Does anyone have any experience with Trane, and is there any science to
support this type of claim or any other prior experience to say that
Trane is somehow better?

Thanks for any advice.
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  #2  
Old March 31st 12, 03:04 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 6,413
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

On Mar 31, 8:47*am, Smarty wrote:
I have spoken with several HVAC contractors regarding replacement of my
old Lennox central air conditioning system. All of them are Lennox
dealers except one who also carries Trane products.

The dealer who also carries Trane was trying to switch me from my
original Lennox preference, stating that the Trane coils, which are 100%
aluminum, rather than the Lennox coils, which use aluminum fins and
copper tubing, provide a better, longer lasting design.

He felt that Trane was superior in other ways also, since they used
"composite plastics" in the outdoor condensing unit case rather than
steel to ensure that no corrosion or rusting would occur.

The basic claim was that Trane, using aluminum for all of the
refrigeration loop, had a longer life expectancy that Lennox, given the
newer Puron refrigerant.

Does anyone have any experience with Trane, and is there any science to
support this type of claim or any other prior experience to say that
Trane is somehow better?

Thanks for any advice.


When I was replacing mine a year ago I looked at Consumer Reports and
other sources. My conclusion was there wasn't any significant
difference
in the trouble history among the common brands. I think Goodman had
more
problems some years back. Some folks still don't like them.
It looked to me like you're paying a lot more for the name in a Trane
versus say a Rheem. When I looked at the data, Rheem had less
repair problems than the top name brands, but it wasn't enough to
be statistically significant,

As to the reliability of copper, two points. The system I replaced
was
a 27 year old Ruud. It was still running and never had a service
issue
other than needing to put in a hard start kit about 12 years into it's
service. So copper obviously lasts.

Second, if copper is the source of problems, ask the installer what
they are going to use for a line set. The line sets are all copper,
so you're going to have a lot more copper in the system from that
than from the coils. I would suspect that Trane's decision to use
all aluminum is based on something else. Look up the current
price of raw copper versus aluminum.

One thing that everyone should agree on is that you are far better
off getting what is perceived as a lesser brand that is installed
correctly than a Trane that is installed incorrectly. A simple
exampe is do they flow nitrogen when doing the brazing? A
half-assed installer can save and skip that. The result is you
have crud form inside the lines that leads to failure down the
road. Another
thing to find out, are they replacing your line set or re-using
the old one? IMO, for the couple hundred bucks, it's worth
going with new, but again, installers can cut corners. If
you do re-use them, they have to be properly flushed. Those
are examples of where you can get screwed and the typical
homeowner would never know.
  #3  
Old March 31st 12, 04:06 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 4,724
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

It's been my experience that copper is a harder metal, and much easier to
work with, in terms of soldering or brazing. I've not tried aluminum, I'd
just expect it to melt out from under.

With no data except my gut hunch, I'd not put aluminum unit in my own home.
Until it had been on the market for several years.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Smarty" wrote in message
...
I have spoken with several HVAC contractors regarding replacement of my
old Lennox central air conditioning system. All of them are Lennox
dealers except one who also carries Trane products.

The dealer who also carries Trane was trying to switch me from my
original Lennox preference, stating that the Trane coils, which are 100%
aluminum, rather than the Lennox coils, which use aluminum fins and
copper tubing, provide a better, longer lasting design.

He felt that Trane was superior in other ways also, since they used
"composite plastics" in the outdoor condensing unit case rather than
steel to ensure that no corrosion or rusting would occur.

The basic claim was that Trane, using aluminum for all of the
refrigeration loop, had a longer life expectancy that Lennox, given the
newer Puron refrigerant.

Does anyone have any experience with Trane, and is there any science to
support this type of claim or any other prior experience to say that
Trane is somehow better?

Thanks for any advice.


  #4  
Old March 31st 12, 06:47 PM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 798
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

On Mar 31, 5:47*am, Smarty wrote:
I have spoken with several HVAC contractors regarding replacement of my
old Lennox central air conditioning system. All of them are Lennox
dealers except one who also carries Trane products.

The dealer who also carries Trane was trying to switch me from my
original Lennox preference, stating that the Trane coils, which are 100%
aluminum, rather than the Lennox coils, which use aluminum fins and
copper tubing, provide a better, longer lasting design.

He felt that Trane was superior in other ways also, since they used
"composite plastics" in the outdoor condensing unit case rather than
steel to ensure that no corrosion or rusting would occur.

The basic claim was that Trane, using aluminum for all of the
refrigeration loop, had a longer life expectancy that Lennox, given the
newer Puron refrigerant.

Does anyone have any experience with Trane, and is there any science to
support this type of claim or any other prior experience to say that
Trane is somehow better?

Thanks for any advice.


GOOD QUESTION!

How about doing what a friend of mine did when he went to purchase
something he didn't know anything about - insurance. He set up
appointments with several of the sales people ALL FOR THE SAME EXACT
TIME got them into one room and asked the question, "Why should I buy
yours and not theirs?" and turned them loose on each other to watch
and listen. He said that within 20 minutes he learned ptifalls NEVER
mentioned by any insurance agent/company what to buy and what NOT to
buy, He said best education he ever went through.
  #5  
Old March 31st 12, 08:09 PM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,324
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

On Sat, 31 Mar 2012 11:06:48 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

It's been my experience that copper is a harder metal, and much easier to
work with, in terms of soldering or brazing. I've not tried aluminum, I'd
just expect it to melt out from under.

With no data except my gut hunch, I'd not put aluminum unit in my own home.
Until it had been on the market for several years.


It has been on the market for years. It is cheaper to build, more
difficult to field repair.

All aluminum coils were starting to come into play in the late 1960's.
I worked for a company that made HVAC units until 1970 and we made our
own copper tubed coils and they started to buy aluminum coils.
  #6  
Old April 1st 12, 06:27 PM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 597
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

On 3/31/2012 8:47 AM, Smarty wrote:
I have spoken with several HVAC contractors regarding replacement of
my old Lennox central air conditioning system. All of them are Lennox
dealers except one who also carries Trane products.

The dealer who also carries Trane was trying to switch me from my
original Lennox preference, stating that the Trane coils, which are
100% aluminum, rather than the Lennox coils, which use aluminum fins
and copper tubing, provide a better, longer lasting design.

He felt that Trane was superior in other ways also, since they used
"composite plastics" in the outdoor condensing unit case rather than
steel to ensure that no corrosion or rusting would occur.

The basic claim was that Trane, using aluminum for all of the
refrigeration loop, had a longer life expectancy that Lennox, given
the newer Puron refrigerant.

Does anyone have any experience with Trane, and is there any science
to support this type of claim or any other prior experience to say
that Trane is somehow better?

Thanks for any advice.




As the original poster of this question, I am very sorry to see not a
single reply............

This newsgroup really has become quite pathetic over the years, thanks
to the combined efforts of those who think it deserves to be a place to
discuss everything BUT home repair topics.

To the trolls who like to post about getting their cock caught in a
carpet stretcher, to harry who insists on rambling about all things
political to all the other folks who seem to think this is the right
place to show their skills in endless threads about nonsense, I say a
big **** YOU as you have effectively weakened the value of a very useful
forum and made it into a garbage pile.

Maybe some new forum will arise where people with home repair issues
won't be surrounded by these huge message turds which offer nothing of
value to the average home repair person.

  #7  
Old April 1st 12, 06:31 PM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 597
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

On 3/31/2012 3:09 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Sat, 31 Mar 2012 11:06:48 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

It's been my experience that copper is a harder metal, and much easier to
work with, in terms of soldering or brazing. I've not tried aluminum, I'd
just expect it to melt out from under.

With no data except my gut hunch, I'd not put aluminum unit in my own home.
Until it had been on the market for several years.

It has been on the market for years. It is cheaper to build, more
difficult to field repair.

All aluminum coils were starting to come into play in the late 1960's.
I worked for a company that made HVAC units until 1970 and we made our
own copper tubed coils and they started to buy aluminum coils.


Thanks Ed for your reply and information. I just noticed that you have
taken the time to provide useful and helpful information which I
appreciate very much, and I am going to go with the copper / Lennox
approach. My very limited experience working with aluminum leads me to
the same conclusion you state and copper seems like the better choice. I
am guessing that aluminum is becoming popular more as a result of rising
copper costs than other, technical reasons.

Thanks again.



  #8  
Old April 1st 12, 11:57 PM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,724
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

You didn't see my post?

Thinking about it some more, well, I have read a bit about repairing
aluminum, and it's a lot harder than repairing copper tubing. For that
reason (as well as what I mentioned earlier), I'd avoid the aluminum unit.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Smarty" wrote in message
...

As the original poster of this question, I am very sorry to see not a
single reply............



  #9  
Old April 1st 12, 11:58 PM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,724
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

I didn't think you saw what I wrote.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Smarty" wrote in message
...
On 3/31/2012 3:09 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Sat, 31 Mar 2012 11:06:48 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

It's been my experience that copper is a harder metal, and much easier
to
work with, in terms of soldering or brazing. I've not tried aluminum, I'd
just expect it to melt out from under.

With no data except my gut hunch, I'd not put aluminum unit in my own
home.
Until it had been on the market for several years.

It has been on the market for years. It is cheaper to build, more
difficult to field repair.

All aluminum coils were starting to come into play in the late 1960's.
I worked for a company that made HVAC units until 1970 and we made our
own copper tubed coils and they started to buy aluminum coils.


Thanks Ed for your reply and information. I just noticed that you have
taken the time to provide useful and helpful information which I
appreciate very much, and I am going to go with the copper / Lennox
approach. My very limited experience working with aluminum leads me to
the same conclusion you state and copper seems like the better choice. I
am guessing that aluminum is becoming popular more as a result of rising
copper costs than other, technical reasons.

Thanks again.





  #10  
Old April 2nd 12, 12:04 AM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,019
Default All aluminum versus copper/aluminum coils for air conditioner?

Smarty wrote:
On 3/31/2012 8:47 AM, Smarty wrote:
I have spoken with several HVAC contractors regarding replacement of
my old Lennox central air conditioning system. All of them are Lennox
dealers except one who also carries Trane products.

The dealer who also carries Trane was trying to switch me from my
original Lennox preference, stating that the Trane coils, which are
100% aluminum, rather than the Lennox coils, which use aluminum fins
and copper tubing, provide a better, longer lasting design.

He felt that Trane was superior in other ways also, since they used
"composite plastics" in the outdoor condensing unit case rather than
steel to ensure that no corrosion or rusting would occur.

The basic claim was that Trane, using aluminum for all of the
refrigeration loop, had a longer life expectancy that Lennox, given
the newer Puron refrigerant.

Does anyone have any experience with Trane, and is there any science
to support this type of claim or any other prior experience to say
that Trane is somehow better?

Thanks for any advice.




As the original poster of this question, I am very sorry to see not a
single reply............

This newsgroup really has become quite pathetic over the years, thanks
to the combined efforts of those who think it deserves to be a place
to discuss everything BUT home repair topics.

To the trolls who like to post about getting their cock caught in a
carpet stretcher, to harry who insists on rambling about all things
political to all the other folks who seem to think this is the right
place to show their skills in endless threads about nonsense, I say a
big **** YOU as you have effectively weakened the value of a very
useful forum and made it into a garbage pile.

Maybe some new forum will arise where people with home repair issues
won't be surrounded by these huge message turds which offer nothing of
value to the average home repair person.


I see several replies. Don't let the door hit you......


 




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