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Default Float Chargers

Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?

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Default Float Chargers

I had a marine battery, years ago. Kept on a Harbor Freight
float charger. when I next checked, it needed 1 1/2 quarts
of distilled, and never held a charge again. But, I saved
five bucks on the charger. Whoopee.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
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..


"Jack" wrote in message
...
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and
also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of
these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries
have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main
function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due
to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries
ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die
of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old
person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


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Default Float Chargers

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I had a marine battery, years ago. Kept on a Harbor Freight
float charger. when I next checked, it needed 1 1/2 quarts
of distilled, and never held a charge again. But, I saved
five bucks on the charger. Whoopee.


Now I've heard more than one such story. I'm sure it depends on the design of
the charger, so "float charger" may not be enough information.

I've got a 6 amp marine/deep cycle charger with an automatic mode. It cycles on
for a few seconds, then off for a minute or so. I don't know if that's a better
system.


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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:

Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if is low. Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.
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Default Float Chargers

On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy
wrote:

On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:

Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if is low. Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.

What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.


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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 12, 9:39*pm, wrote:
On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy



wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. *Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. *So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? *Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


* Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


* *Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if *is low. *Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... *I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


* *I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


* Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. * If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


*What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.


OP, you need an accurate voltmeter.
If the charger pushes and keeps a 12 Volt battery voltage above about
13.6 v then it is "overcharging" it and reducing it's life.

Too high or too low a voltage will both shorten the shelf life of a
lead acid battery.

13.5 to 13.6 is about optimum for room temperature.

A good battery charger will regulate the voltage to that range.

Mark


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Default Float Chargers

On 9/12/2011 9:16 PM, Mark wrote:
On Sep 12, 9:39 pm, wrote:
On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy



wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if is low. Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.


OP, you need an accurate voltmeter.
If the charger pushes and keeps a 12 Volt battery voltage above about
13.6 v then it is "overcharging" it and reducing it's life.

Too high or too low a voltage will both shorten the shelf life of a
lead acid battery.

13.5 to 13.6 is about optimum for room temperature.

A good battery charger will regulate the voltage to that range.

Mark



What about the vehicle itself then? They charge (if working properly)
at 14.2v



--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email
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Default Float Chargers

I considered using the HF float on a lamp timer, about two
hours a day. Well, I guess it's still over charge, two hours
a day instead of twenty four.

Yours is probably a much better quality device.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Bob F"
wrote in message ...

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I had a marine battery, years ago. Kept on a Harbor
Freight
float charger. when I next checked, it needed 1 1/2 quarts
of distilled, and never held a charge again. But, I saved
five bucks on the charger. Whoopee.


Now I've heard more than one such story. I'm sure it depends
on the design of
the charger, so "float charger" may not be enough
information.

I've got a 6 amp marine/deep cycle charger with an automatic
mode. It cycles on
for a few seconds, then off for a minute or so. I don't know
if that's a better
system.



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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 12, 7:16 pm, Mark wrote:

OP, you need an accurate voltmeter.
If the charger pushes and keeps a 12 Volt battery voltage above about
13.6 v then it is "overcharging" it and reducing it's life.

Too high or too low a voltage will both shorten the shelf life of a
lead acid battery.

13.5 to 13.6 is about optimum for room temperature.

A good battery charger will regulate the voltage to that range.

Mark


Andy comments:
I can't disagree , in principle. However, this month the
temperature
in my garage ranged from 70F in the morning to 110F at 7pm....
Battery chargers or maintainers simply don't compensate over that
range.....
and the battery chemistry over temp and the component tolerances
in the "charger" both vary , and don't necessarily track over a wide
temp range....


Under the hood of an automobile, the range is greater , probably
from around 0F in the winter to 160F or higher in the summer..
The voltage "regulator" in the alternator has temp compensation,
but not for that great a range.... I keep an accurate digital
voltmeter
plugged into my cigarette ligher outlet and see the "charging" voltage
range from 13.5 to about 14.5 volts as the battery chemistry terminal
voltage
argues with the alternator regulator temp compensation from summertime
to wintertime.... That's why
car batteries only last a few years....

By the way, my voltmeter has headed off being stranded by a
dead battery several times as it lets me know when an alternator
diode has gone out, long before the charging stops altogether.
Plenty of time to fix the problem before the alternator has failed
and possibly the battery has sulfated.....Just a suggestion.

Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.

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Default Float Chargers

On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 21:32:59 -0500, Steve Barker
wrote:

On 9/12/2011 9:16 PM, Mark wrote:
On Sep 12, 9:39 pm, wrote:
On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy



wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?

Andy comments:

Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if is low. Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.

What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.


OP, you need an accurate voltmeter.
If the charger pushes and keeps a 12 Volt battery voltage above about
13.6 v then it is "overcharging" it and reducing it's life.

Too high or too low a voltage will both shorten the shelf life of a
lead acid battery.

13.5 to 13.6 is about optimum for room temperature.

A good battery charger will regulate the voltage to that range.

Mark



What about the vehicle itself then? They charge (if working properly)
at 14.2v

But not 24 hours a day, seven days a week, for months.


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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 12, 9:13*pm, Andy wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:

Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. *Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. *So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? *Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:

* *Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

* * Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if *is low. *Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... *I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

* * I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

* *Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. *


I beg to differ. I think if you look at the output of the float
chargers they do have sufficient capacity to charge the
battery. In fact, it would be impossible for them not to.
If they only could deliver exactly the amount of self-discharge
that occurs, they would have to be perfectly matched to
the battery. In reality, they have extra capacity so they
will make up for the slow self-discharge and have current
beyond that to slowly recharge the battery. It will however
take a long time compared to a regular battery charger.
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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 12, 9:39*pm, wrote:
On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy





wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. *Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. *So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? *Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


* Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


* *Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if *is low. *Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... *I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


* *I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


* Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. * If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


*What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Says who? In my world, the terms are interchangable.
Now a trickly charger, that will continue to deliver a slow
charge no matter if the battery is fully charged or not.
A float charger or "battery maintainer" will not.
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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 12, 10:16*pm, Mark wrote:
On Sep 12, 9:39*pm, wrote:





On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy


wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. *Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. *So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? *Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


* Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


* *Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if *is low. *Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... *I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


* *I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


* Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. * If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


*What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.


OP, you need an accurate voltmeter.
If the charger pushes and keeps a 12 Volt battery voltage above about
13.6 v then it is "overcharging" it and reducing it's life.

Too high or too low a voltage will both shorten the shelf life of a
lead acid battery.

13.5 to 13.6 is about optimum for room temperature.

A good battery charger will regulate the voltage to that range.

Mark- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


He has a float charger, which is exactly what he needs, not
a battery charger. With a battery charger, he'd need to monitor the
charging himself, which isn't going to work for
a battery that needs to be kept charged all the time.
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Default Float Chargers

Andy wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:

Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if is low. Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


I harbored my datsun last winter. It started ok. That's all I know about
that.
I know from floating NASA equipment, you have to be well under 100 ma to
keep bubbling down. 10 ma is good, if it enough to keep it above a certain
minimum voltage. Batteries are best overcharged occasionally to above 14
volts, to extend life. They might also need balanced, by discharging.

Greg
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Default Float Chargers

On Tue, 13 Sep 2011 17:08:07 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Sep 12, 9:13Â*pm, Andy wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:

Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Â*Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. Â*So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Â*Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:

Â* Â*Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

Â* Â* Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if Â*is low. Â*Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... Â*I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

Â* Â* I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

Â* Â*Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. Â*


I beg to differ. I think if you look at the output of the float
chargers they do have sufficient capacity to charge the
battery. In fact, it would be impossible for them not to.
If they only could deliver exactly the amount of self-discharge
that occurs, they would have to be perfectly matched to
the battery. In reality, they have extra capacity so they
will make up for the slow self-discharge and have current
beyond that to slowly recharge the battery. It will however
take a long time compared to a regular battery charger.

MOST will provide 2 amps - self dischrge is in the fractions of a
mili-amp


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Default Float Chargers

On Tue, 13 Sep 2011 17:10:21 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Sep 12, 9:39Â*pm, wrote:
On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy





wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Â*Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. Â*So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Â*Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


Â* Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


Â* Â*Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if Â*is low. Â*Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... Â*I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


Â* Â*I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


Â* Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. Â* If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


Â*What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Says who? In my world, the terms are interchangable.
Now a trickly charger, that will continue to deliver a slow
charge no matter if the battery is fully charged or not.
A float charger or "battery maintainer" will not.

You don't live in the real world.

A "battery maintainer" may be a trickle charger - but a trickle
charger is not necessarily a "battery maintainer"

MOST "trickle chargers" are nothing more than a small center-tapped
transformer with a half wave rectifier that will put out up to 16
volts (at 125 volts, input, for instance - less at lower line
voltages) and is resistance limited to 2 amps output. Some of the
better ones have a regulated output - and will put out a maximum of
something like 14.6 volts (might be a little less) regardless of
input voltage swings.

An intelligent battery maintainer usually runs in a pulsed mode -
checking the voltage of the battery between pulses, and adjusting the
voltage and duty cycle to keep the battery at full charge without the
possibility of over-charging. There are other types of "intelligence"
as well - some better than others.

The "battery tender" is one example of a smart battery maintainer.
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Default Float Chargers

On Tue, 13 Sep 2011 17:11:28 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Sep 12, 10:16Â*pm, Mark wrote:
On Sep 12, 9:39Â*pm, wrote:





On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy


wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Â*Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. Â*So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Â*Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


Â* Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


Â* Â*Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if Â*is low. Â*Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... Â*I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


Â* Â*I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


Â* Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. Â* If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


Â*What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.


OP, you need an accurate voltmeter.
If the charger pushes and keeps a 12 Volt battery voltage above about
13.6 v then it is "overcharging" it and reducing it's life.

Too high or too low a voltage will both shorten the shelf life of a
lead acid battery.

13.5 to 13.6 is about optimum for room temperature.

A good battery charger will regulate the voltage to that range.

Mark- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


He has a float charger, which is exactly what he needs, not
a battery charger. With a battery charger, he'd need to monitor the
charging himself, which isn't going to work for
a battery that needs to be kept charged all the time.

And nore will a cheap float charger.
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Default Float Chargers

On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 01:48:53 +0000 (UTC), gregz
wrote:

Andy wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.

But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:

Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....

Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if is low. Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....

I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......

Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....

Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


I harbored my datsun last winter. It started ok. That's all I know about
that.
I know from floating NASA equipment, you have to be well under 100 ma to
keep bubbling down. 10 ma is good, if it enough to keep it above a certain
minimum voltage. Batteries are best overcharged occasionally to above 14
volts, to extend life. They might also need balanced, by discharging.

Greg

You are talking about an "equalization charge" - which bubbles the
battery just enough to mix the acid to prevent stratification. This
generally also achieves the "balancing"
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Default Float Chargers

On Sep 13, 10:58*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 13 Sep 2011 17:10:21 -0700 (PDT), "





wrote:
On Sep 12, 9:39*pm, wrote:
On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 18:13:30 -0700 (PDT), Andy


wrote:
On Sep 12, 5:39 pm, Jack wrote:
Float chargers are attached to the 12v in the generator, and also to
two 12v that provide back-up for the sump-pump. *Neither of these
units is used every day; in fact, the sump-pump batteries have never
been used in seven yrs. *So, presumably, the chargers main function in
these applications is to keep the 12v from discharging due to lack of
use.


But beyond that, do chargers, theoretically, keep batteries ready and
able to run indefinitely? *Or will the cells eventually die of old age
despite the chargers, much like a well-preserved, fit old person: Bob
Hope, Geo. Burns, Jack LaLanne?


Andy comments:


* Float chargers, such as the one from Harbor Freight, do a pretty
good job of maintaining the charge, but that doesn't mean that
it can keep things going for long periods of time without checking.
Much like planting flowers --- they need to be weeded...
When working with chemical reactions over a wide temperature
range, there is no such thing as "hook it up and forget it "....


* *Every month, check the water level in each cell. Top them up with
distilled water if *is low. *Depending on the temperature variations,
the float charger can't compensate for every single variable, and
occasionally will feed in a little bit too much and boil off a little
water..... *I'm not aware of ANY device which will compensate
exactly for the changes that occur with the electrolyte which
require minor changes in the float voltage.....


* *I've used the Harbor Freight float charger for years, and easily
double
the battery life in my lawn tractor.... but it won't give the battery
immortality, and you have to check up on it......


* Remember, it is a FLOAT charger, not a BATTERY CHARGER....
A real charger, with a hydrometer, should be used to charge the
battery... Then the float charger is attached to compensate for
internal leakage..... A FLOAT CHARGER will not "charge up"
the battery by itself.... That is a mistake that many people
make. * If you use the Harbor Freight float charger, read the
manual.....


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Andy in Eureka, Texas , P.E.


*What you guye REALLY want is a "battery maintainer" - not a float
charger. A float charger is NOT an intelligent device. A "battery
maintainer" is.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Says who? *In my world, the terms are interchangable.
Now a trickly charger, that will continue to deliver a slow
charge no matter if the battery is fully charged or not.
A float charger or "battery maintainer" will not.


* You don't live in the real world.

A "battery maintainer" may be a trickle charger - but a trickle
charger is not necessarily a "battery maintainer"



I never said a trickle charger is a battery maintainer. I said
the terms float charger and battery maintainer are one and
the same. A float charger senses when a battery reaches
full charge, then backs off and allows the voltage to lower.
It will start charging again when it senses that the battery
voltage has dropped below a certain point.

Here's an example:

Black & Decker Bm2b Smart Battery Charger 2 Amp Automatic Float Mode
$17 online

1 review The Black & Decker Smart 12-Volt Float Mode Maintainer
Battery Charger is a hand-held engine starter that can be run on
either alternating or direct current. It has reverse polarity
protection.



MOST "trickle chargers" are nothing more than a small center-tapped
transformer with a half wave rectifier that will put out up to 16
volts (at 125 volts, input, for instance - less at lower line
voltages) and is resistance limited to 2 amps output. Some of the
better ones have a regulated output - and will put out a maximum of
something like 14.6 *volts (might be a little less) regardless of
input voltage swings.

An intelligent battery maintainer usually runs in a pulsed mode -
checking the voltage of the battery between pulses, and adjusting the
voltage and duty cycle to keep the battery at full charge without the
possibility of over-charging. *There are other types of "intelligence"
as well - some better than others.

The "battery tender" is one example of a smart battery maintainer.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


It's also an example of what the rest of the world
calls a float charger, just like the Black and Decker.

Here, from Wikipedia:

"Float charger
A float charger differs from a trickle charger in having circuitry to
prevent overcharging. It senses when the battery voltage is at the
appropriate float level and temporarily ceases charging; it maintains
the charge current at zero or a very minimal level until it senses
that the battery output voltage has fallen, and then resumes charging.
"

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