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#121
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:18:35 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote: Boilers are typically left hot, so there isn't a bunch of humidity in the boiler, rusting it out. And, boiler systems often do take a LONG time to recover temp. Yeah, but do you have one? His first answer assumed you did. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "mm" wrote in message .. . Boiler installers never put daily "set back" thermostats on boilers, only forced air systems get those, and they tell you to set the thermostat once and leave it there. Why did you assume the Mormon had a boiler? The rules are completely different for radiant heated buidings vs air heated buildings. |
#122
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 07:50:56 -0700 (PDT), RickH
wrote: On Oct 29, 8:51*pm, DD_BobK wrote: On Oct 29, 11:05*am, RickH wrote: On Oct 29, 10:36*am, "SteveB" wrote: No, it takes too long to re-heat the boiler and all the water in the pipes, radiators, and floor tubing. *It is always best to set it once and leave it there all winter. *Too much energy is lost when all that water is asked to re-heat all the surfaces again. *For example when I feel the return manifold from the coils under my concrete slab after the slab was allowed to cool, the return water is ice cold, all that energy to reheat the slab. *No, bad asvice, best to keep it warm and leave it there, saves tons of energy. We use warm water here to shower. *I'd say that a higher % of people use heat pumps or gas to heat rather than water. *In your case, MAYBE it is cheaper to leave it on, but I think you are only quoting yourself, and no analytic studies by any testing agency. *Can you find any said studies? *I don't doubt that you believe what you say is true, I just think that it is not. Steve Boiler installers never put daily "set back" thermostats on boilers, only forced air systems get those, and they tell you to set the thermostat once and leave it there. The rules are completely different for radiant heated buidings vs air heated buildings. In an air heated building you heat the air, in a radiant heated building you heat the building materials and that in turn heats the people. *When you lose all that stored energy it costs a fortune to recover it back in boiler usage. *There is nothing quite like the warmth of a radiant-heated house. So the laws of themodynamics are different from system to system? Heat its lost to the environment based on the difference in temperature between the heated space & the unheated space. * As the temperature of the heated space falls, the heat loss also fails. *When the temperature of the heated space falls to that of the unheated space, heat loss stops. I believe you are confusing the "time" it takes to recover with "huge amounts of energy are required to re-heat everything". If you were correct in your thinking (& oyu are not) the whole concept of temperature setback would not work (& it does). cheers Bob- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - If left alone the boiler kicks on maybe once every 4-6 hours for only a short 5-10 minute period (maybe 4 or 5 recyclings of the entire water load). If you let the house cool for 10 hours while at work, the boiler will have to run several hours to get all the floors (and house contents) heated again. Are you sure. You just said that the boiler it runs 5-10 minutes every 4 to 6 hours. So if you are gone for 10 hours, the maximum that the boiler wouldn't run would be 20 minutes.) Yet now you say it would take several hours to get the house heated again. Plainly it would take 20 minutes or less to get the boiler heated to it's normal temp, instead of just pretty hot for lack of 20 minutes of heating. I don't have a boilerIs there more to the cycle that you think would delay heating the house? This run is more than the sum amount of time the boiler would have been fired if you had just left it alone. No, it's not. You just assume that it is. Or it seems like it. You've never lived with a boiler have you? Air is low mass, it heats up very quickly, radiant heating of the building mass itself takes longer from the same starting temp as the air entering a forced-air system. Of course it takes longer to heat up. It also takes longer to cool off, so it isn't as cold as the air is when you get home. Yes, the "rules" are different for forced-air vs under-floor radiant heat, in practice, but not the laws of thermodynamics are not. |
#123
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 07:50:56 -0700 (PDT), RickH
wrote: On Oct 29, 8:51*pm, DD_BobK wrote: On Oct 29, 11:05*am, RickH wrote: On Oct 29, 10:36*am, "SteveB" wrote: No, it takes too long to re-heat the boiler and all the water in the pipes, radiators, and floor tubing. *It is always best to set it once and leave it there all winter. *Too much energy is lost when all that water is asked to re-heat all the surfaces again. *For example when I feel the return manifold from the coils under my concrete slab after the slab was allowed to cool, the return water is ice cold, all that energy to reheat the slab. *No, bad asvice, best to keep it warm and leave it there, saves tons of energy. We use warm water here to shower. *I'd say that a higher % of people use heat pumps or gas to heat rather than water. *In your case, MAYBE it is cheaper to leave it on, but I think you are only quoting yourself, and no analytic studies by any testing agency. *Can you find any said studies? *I don't doubt that you believe what you say is true, I just think that it is not. Steve Boiler installers never put daily "set back" thermostats on boilers, only forced air systems get those, and they tell you to set the thermostat once and leave it there. The rules are completely different for radiant heated buidings vs air heated buildings. In an air heated building you heat the air, in a radiant heated building you heat the building materials and that in turn heats the people. *When you lose all that stored energy it costs a fortune to recover it back in boiler usage. *There is nothing quite like the warmth of a radiant-heated house. So the laws of themodynamics are different from system to system? Heat its lost to the environment based on the difference in temperature between the heated space & the unheated space. * As the temperature of the heated space falls, the heat loss also fails. *When the temperature of the heated space falls to that of the unheated space, heat loss stops. I believe you are confusing the "time" it takes to recover with "huge amounts of energy are required to re-heat everything". If you were correct in your thinking (& oyu are not) the whole concept of temperature setback would not work (& it does). cheers Bob- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - If left alone the boiler kicks on maybe once every 4-6 hours for only a short 5-10 minute period (maybe 4 or 5 recyclings of the entire water load). If you let the house cool for 10 hours while at work, the boiler will have to run several hours to get all the floors (and house contents) heated again. Are you sure. You just said that the boiler it runs 5-10 minutes every 4 to 6 hours. So if you are gone for 10 hours, the maximum that the boiler wouldn't run would be 20 minutes.) Yet now you say it would take several hours to get the house heated again. Plainly it would take 20 minutes or less to get the boiler heated to it's normal temp, instead of just pretty hot for lack of 20 minutes of heating. I don't have a boilerIs there more to the cycle that you think would delay heating the house? This run is more than the sum amount of time the boiler would have been fired if you had just left it alone. No, it's not. You just assume that it is. Or it seems like it. You've never lived with a boiler have you? Air is low mass, it heats up very quickly, radiant heating of the building mass itself takes longer from the same starting temp as the air entering a forced-air system. Of course it takes longer to heat up. It also takes longer to cool off, so it isn't as cold as the air is when you get home. Yes, the "rules" are different for forced-air vs under-floor radiant heat, in practice, but not the laws of thermodynamics are not. |
#124
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Oct 30, 6:53*am, Tony Hwang wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote: Well, sad to hear that you live in an over regulated part of the world. No, It is not regulation. Collective logical common sense. Collective logical common sense hmmmm cheers Bob |
#125
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Oct 30, 6:53*am, Tony Hwang wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote: Well, sad to hear that you live in an over regulated part of the world. No, It is not regulation. Collective logical common sense. Collective logical common sense hmmmm cheers Bob |
#126
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:26:52 -0500, Jules
wrote: On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 11:26:33 -0700, Smitty Two wrote: It's the same principle that makes elevators come faster if you hit the call button ten times I got into the habit of taking the stairs. Often it's quicker, and it's good exercise. Bonus points for being spotted by the same person at either end and claiming you have teleportation powers :-) One time I entered an old 4-floor building. Someone had just got on the elevator (there was just one) so I took the stairs. I got to the 4th floor and waited for the elevator to get there. BTW, that reminds me of the time I went to the hospital after a friend was taken away in an ambulance. I got there first. -- 56 days until the winter solstice celebration Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.us "How could you ask me to believe in God when there's absolutely no evidence that I can see?" -- Jodie Foster |
#127
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:26:52 -0500, Jules
wrote: On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 11:26:33 -0700, Smitty Two wrote: It's the same principle that makes elevators come faster if you hit the call button ten times I got into the habit of taking the stairs. Often it's quicker, and it's good exercise. Bonus points for being spotted by the same person at either end and claiming you have teleportation powers :-) One time I entered an old 4-floor building. Someone had just got on the elevator (there was just one) so I took the stairs. I got to the 4th floor and waited for the elevator to get there. BTW, that reminds me of the time I went to the hospital after a friend was taken away in an ambulance. I got there first. -- 56 days until the winter solstice celebration Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.us "How could you ask me to believe in God when there's absolutely no evidence that I can see?" -- Jodie Foster |
#128
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:47:33 -0500, Red Green
wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:hcem10 : Next week, I'll ask how to hang the roll of toilet paper. Or how to change a light bulb. BTW, which way does the ground go on a duplex outlet, up or down? :-) The ground is supposed to be pointed toward the grave of Nikola Tesla, or at least as close as you can get. |
#129
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:47:33 -0500, Red Green
wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:hcem10 : Next week, I'll ask how to hang the roll of toilet paper. Or how to change a light bulb. BTW, which way does the ground go on a duplex outlet, up or down? :-) The ground is supposed to be pointed toward the grave of Nikola Tesla, or at least as close as you can get. |
#130
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
The ground is always on the top. Cause if a piece of wire or
metal drops behind the plug, the ground keeps it from shorting the two flat prongs. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Red Green" wrote in message ... BTW, which way does the ground go on a duplex outlet, up or down? :-) |
#131
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
The ground is always on the top. Cause if a piece of wire or
metal drops behind the plug, the ground keeps it from shorting the two flat prongs. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Red Green" wrote in message ... BTW, which way does the ground go on a duplex outlet, up or down? :-) |
#132
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
My heat source is a 90% downflow hot air furnace.
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "mm" wrote in message ... On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:18:35 -0400, "Stormin Mormon" wrote: Boilers are typically left hot, so there isn't a bunch of humidity in the boiler, rusting it out. And, boiler systems often do take a LONG time to recover temp. Yeah, but do you have one? His first answer assumed you did. |
#133
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
My heat source is a 90% downflow hot air furnace.
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "mm" wrote in message ... On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:18:35 -0400, "Stormin Mormon" wrote: Boilers are typically left hot, so there isn't a bunch of humidity in the boiler, rusting it out. And, boiler systems often do take a LONG time to recover temp. Yeah, but do you have one? His first answer assumed you did. |
#134
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Was the bambulance going all out, or just routine transport?
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Mark Lloyd" wrote in message ... BTW, that reminds me of the time I went to the hospital after a friend was taken away in an ambulance. I got there first. -- 56 days until the winter solstice celebration Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.us "How could you ask me to believe in God when there's absolutely no evidence that I can see?" -- Jodie Foster |
#135
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Was the bambulance going all out, or just routine transport?
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Mark Lloyd" wrote in message ... BTW, that reminds me of the time I went to the hospital after a friend was taken away in an ambulance. I got there first. -- 56 days until the winter solstice celebration Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.us "How could you ask me to believe in God when there's absolutely no evidence that I can see?" -- Jodie Foster |
#136
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Is that like Muslims praying toward Mecca? Need a big
pointer in every town square? -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Harry L" wrote in message ... BTW, which way does the ground go on a duplex outlet, up or down? :-) The ground is supposed to be pointed toward the grave of Nikola Tesla, or at least as close as you can get. |
#137
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Is that like Muslims praying toward Mecca? Need a big
pointer in every town square? -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Harry L" wrote in message ... BTW, which way does the ground go on a duplex outlet, up or down? :-) The ground is supposed to be pointed toward the grave of Nikola Tesla, or at least as close as you can get. |
#138
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
I've seen some very frightened red lights.
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Eric" wrote in message .. . "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I've met enough people who think slamming the thermostat makes it heat faster. Dunno. They must learn from driving a car where tromping the gas pedal throws it into four barrel? I think those are the same people who think that by creeping forward at a red light, they can intimidate it into changing to green faster. Eric Law |
#139
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
I've seen some very frightened red lights.
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Eric" wrote in message .. . "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... I've met enough people who think slamming the thermostat makes it heat faster. Dunno. They must learn from driving a car where tromping the gas pedal throws it into four barrel? I think those are the same people who think that by creeping forward at a red light, they can intimidate it into changing to green faster. Eric Law |
#140
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
A very few furnaces (furnai?) are two stages. And some heat
pumps have second stage "emergency heat". -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "DD_BobK" wrote in message ... the question about wives turning the stat all the way up/down so the heat/a/c runs faster. I doubt there are 1% who DON'T think that. My ex certainly did, and it was a total waste of time trying to explain it to her. Unfortunately, women don't have a monopoly on that kind of thinking-- I know a lot of guys who think the same thing. Larry Try telling them that the thermostat is just a switch (on-off) not a "gas pedal" like in their car. cheers Bob |
#141
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
A very few furnaces (furnai?) are two stages. And some heat
pumps have second stage "emergency heat". -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "DD_BobK" wrote in message ... the question about wives turning the stat all the way up/down so the heat/a/c runs faster. I doubt there are 1% who DON'T think that. My ex certainly did, and it was a total waste of time trying to explain it to her. Unfortunately, women don't have a monopoly on that kind of thinking-- I know a lot of guys who think the same thing. Larry Try telling them that the thermostat is just a switch (on-off) not a "gas pedal" like in their car. cheers Bob |
#142
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:hcg462
: The ground is always on the top. Cause if a piece of wire or metal drops behind the plug, the ground keeps it from shorting the two flat prongs. Yea but if the ground is on top and orange juice spills in it, the ground will divide the water left and right just beyond the prongs (regardless of liquid volume, velocity, viscosity, wind, gravity, sunspots, etc) and effectively nothing happens. Ask MacGruber. |
#143
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:hcg462
: The ground is always on the top. Cause if a piece of wire or metal drops behind the plug, the ground keeps it from shorting the two flat prongs. Yea but if the ground is on top and orange juice spills in it, the ground will divide the water left and right just beyond the prongs (regardless of liquid volume, velocity, viscosity, wind, gravity, sunspots, etc) and effectively nothing happens. Ask MacGruber. |
#144
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
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#145
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
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#146
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Tony Hwang wrote in :
Stormin Mormon wrote: Well, sad to hear that you live in an over regulated part of the world. No, It is not regulation. Collective logical common sense. Collective logical common sense. Assimilated Vulcans? |
#147
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Tony Hwang wrote in :
Stormin Mormon wrote: Well, sad to hear that you live in an over regulated part of the world. No, It is not regulation. Collective logical common sense. Collective logical common sense. Assimilated Vulcans? |
#148
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Van Chocstraw wrote:
Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Stormin Mormon wrote: Please forgive me while I troll for a moment..... Is it energy saving to turn the thermostat down, when leaving the house? I mean, the furnace has to run to catch up when I get home. I have a way of looking at the matter. I'll explain my point of view after the argument is underway. Six of one, half dozen of the other. Depends on how long you are gone. Leaving the thermostat at a steady temperature saves energy. On the other hand, a lower difference between the inside wall and the outside wall means lower heat loss. So lowering the thermostat does save energy in the long run. Now, constantly raising and lowering the temperature for short periods wastes energy. When you raise it you have to reheat not only the heating system but the entire inside wall, floor and ceiling not to mention all the furniture and appliances. When you lower the thermostat, all those items lose all their heat again the heat is drawn out into the room and the room loses it through the walls to the outside. So....use your little noggin. Wow, Where are you coming from? The lower the setting the longer the setting. You save energy. I am talking about how much saving. Just it saves. Our 'stat is set to 17C from midnight. Back up to 20C at 7 in the morning. It does make a difference. Now our NG price is 3.80 per GigaJoule. Electricity is 7 cents/KWh I like my house 80 degrees all the time. I burn pellets and wood. Screw saving energy. I'm not gonna pay for fuel and freeze my ****ing ass off. Hmm, So you are a polluter. Where I live wood burning is no, no. Fire places are all NG burning. Even my cabin in the woods have NG FP. One who lives in past century! 80 degrees? You must have some kind of medical condition. Or are running around naked in the house? FACT: NG is a C02 polluter, wood and wood pellets are not. WOod is carbon neutr So how many trees have you planted in your life time? Even spent a time in forestry camp in your younger days planting seedlings? Very hard work. You don't need to plant ****. If you stop using a field for farming it soon turns into forest. I have see this all through my life. Fields I use to play in and slide on in the winter are all woods now with trees 50 years old. People like you are called part of problem. |
#149
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Van Chocstraw wrote:
Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Stormin Mormon wrote: Please forgive me while I troll for a moment..... Is it energy saving to turn the thermostat down, when leaving the house? I mean, the furnace has to run to catch up when I get home. I have a way of looking at the matter. I'll explain my point of view after the argument is underway. Six of one, half dozen of the other. Depends on how long you are gone. Leaving the thermostat at a steady temperature saves energy. On the other hand, a lower difference between the inside wall and the outside wall means lower heat loss. So lowering the thermostat does save energy in the long run. Now, constantly raising and lowering the temperature for short periods wastes energy. When you raise it you have to reheat not only the heating system but the entire inside wall, floor and ceiling not to mention all the furniture and appliances. When you lower the thermostat, all those items lose all their heat again the heat is drawn out into the room and the room loses it through the walls to the outside. So....use your little noggin. Wow, Where are you coming from? The lower the setting the longer the setting. You save energy. I am talking about how much saving. Just it saves. Our 'stat is set to 17C from midnight. Back up to 20C at 7 in the morning. It does make a difference. Now our NG price is 3.80 per GigaJoule. Electricity is 7 cents/KWh I like my house 80 degrees all the time. I burn pellets and wood. Screw saving energy. I'm not gonna pay for fuel and freeze my ****ing ass off. Hmm, So you are a polluter. Where I live wood burning is no, no. Fire places are all NG burning. Even my cabin in the woods have NG FP. One who lives in past century! 80 degrees? You must have some kind of medical condition. Or are running around naked in the house? FACT: NG is a C02 polluter, wood and wood pellets are not. WOod is carbon neutr So how many trees have you planted in your life time? Even spent a time in forestry camp in your younger days planting seedlings? Very hard work. You don't need to plant ****. If you stop using a field for farming it soon turns into forest. I have see this all through my life. Fields I use to play in and slide on in the winter are all woods now with trees 50 years old. People like you are called part of problem. |
#150
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Red Green wrote:
Kurt Ullman wrote in news:kurtullman- : In article , "Stormin Mormon" wrote: I've met enough people who think slamming the thermostat makes it heat faster. Dunno. They must learn from driving a car where tromping the gas pedal throws it into four barrel? I think it just an extension of the well known fact that if you press the button repeatedly the elevator will arrive faster. The just don't know that holding the button makes it skip floor stops. Pressing the "Door Close" and desired floor simultaneously put the elevator in "express mode" http://www.realtechnews.com/posts/1604 Of course many computer games have "secret" buttons for the elevators. Some contain spiders. |
#151
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
There's a factor you haven't considered.
If you have a programmable thermostat it doesn't apply. But if you have a manual one, changing the setting frequently will make it wear out faster. Never having worn one out myself, I don't have a guess at how much faster that would be. |
#152
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 21:33:37 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote: Was the bambulance going all out, or just routine transport? It was an emergency. Someone had a stroke. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Mark Lloyd" wrote in message .. . BTW, that reminds me of the time I went to the hospital after a friend was taken away in an ambulance. I got there first. -- 55 days until the winter solstice celebration Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.us "How could you ask me to believe in God when there's absolutely no evidence that I can see?" -- Jodie Foster |
#153
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Tony Hwang wrote: Van Chocstraw wrote: Stormin Mormon wrote: [Christmas presents] [Christmas presents] |
#154
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
Bother! What, did you take the subway or something?
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Mark Lloyd" wrote in message ... On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 21:33:37 -0400, "Stormin Mormon" wrote: Was the bambulance going all out, or just routine transport? It was an emergency. Someone had a stroke. |
#155
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 11:05:16 -0700 (PDT), RickH
wrote: On Oct 29, 10:36*am, "SteveB" wrote: No, it takes too long to re-heat the boiler and all the water in the pipes, radiators, and floor tubing. *It is always best to set it once and leave it there all winter. *Too much energy is lost when all that water is asked to re-heat all the surfaces again. *For example when I feel the return manifold from the coils under my concrete slab after the slab was allowed to cool, the return water is ice cold, all that energy to reheat the slab. *No, bad asvice, best to keep it warm and leave it there, saves tons of energy. We use warm water here to shower. *I'd say that a higher % of people use heat pumps or gas to heat rather than water. *In your case, MAYBE it is cheaper to leave it on, but I think you are only quoting yourself, and no analytic studies by any testing agency. *Can you find any said studies? *I don't doubt that you believe what you say is true, I just think that it is not. Steve Boiler installers never put daily "set back" thermostats on boilers, only forced air systems get those, and they tell you to set the thermostat once and leave it there. The rules are completely different for radiant heated buidings vs air heated buildings. In an air heated building you heat the air, in a radiant heated building you heat the building materials and that in turn heats the people. When you lose all that stored energy it costs a fortune to recover it back in boiler usage. There is nothing quite like the warmth of a radiant-heated house. Sorry, but no matter what you do, if you lower the AVERAGE temperature over a long period, you save energy. That's the beginning, middle, and end of the facts. Your average temp over the entire heating season is what counts. Lowering the temp for a period each day results in a lower average temp over the course of a heating season. |
#156
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
FACT: NG is a C02 polluter, wood and wood pellets are not. WOod is carbon neutral.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - CO2 is NOT a pollutant any more then H2O is... Oh Oh, the black helicopters are coming... Mark |
#157
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
All things in moderation, of course. The folks in New
Orleans might consider water a pollutant. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Mark" wrote in message ... CO2 is NOT a pollutant any more then H2O is... Oh Oh, the black helicopters are coming... Mark |
#158
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Oct 30, 7:50*am, RickH wrote:
On Oct 29, 8:51*pm, DD_BobK wrote: On Oct 29, 11:05*am, RickH wrote: On Oct 29, 10:36*am, "SteveB" wrote: No, it takes too long to re-heat the boiler and all the water in the pipes, radiators, and floor tubing. *It is always best to set it once and leave it there all winter. *Too much energy is lost when all that water is asked to re-heat all the surfaces again. *For example when I feel the return manifold from the coils under my concrete slab after the slab was allowed to cool, the return water is ice cold, all that energy to reheat the slab. *No, bad asvice, best to keep it warm and leave it there, saves tons of energy. We use warm water here to shower. *I'd say that a higher % of people use heat pumps or gas to heat rather than water. *In your case, MAYBE it is cheaper to leave it on, but I think you are only quoting yourself, and no analytic studies by any testing agency. *Can you find any said studies? *I don't doubt that you believe what you say is true, I just think that it is not. Steve Boiler installers never put daily "set back" thermostats on boilers, only forced air systems get those, and they tell you to set the thermostat once and leave it there. The rules are completely different for radiant heated buidings vs air heated buildings. In an air heated building you heat the air, in a radiant heated building you heat the building materials and that in turn heats the people. *When you lose all that stored energy it costs a fortune to recover it back in boiler usage. *There is nothing quite like the warmth of a radiant-heated house. So the laws of themodynamics are different from system to system? Heat its lost to the environment based on the difference in temperature between the heated space & the unheated space. * As the temperature of the heated space falls, the heat loss also fails. *When the temperature of the heated space falls to that of the unheated space, heat loss stops. I believe you are confusing the "time" it takes to recover with "huge amounts of energy are required to re-heat everything". If you were correct in your thinking (& oyu are not) the whole concept of temperature setback would not work (& it does). cheers Bob- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - If left alone the boiler kicks on maybe once every 4-6 hours for only a short 5-10 minute period (maybe 4 or 5 recyclings of the entire water load). If you let the house cool for 10 hours while at work, the boiler will have to run several hours to get all the floors (and house contents) heated again. *This run is more than the sum amount of time the boiler would have been fired if you had just left it alone. *You've never lived with a boiler have you? *Air is low mass, it heats up very quickly, radiant heating of the building mass itself takes longer from the same starting temp as the air entering a forced-air system. Yes, the "rules" are different for forced-air vs under-floor radiant heat, in practice, but not the laws of thermodynamics are not. If left alone the boiler kicks on maybe once every 4-6 hours for only a short 5-10 minute period (maybe 4 or 5 recyclings of the entire water load). If you let the house cool for 10 hours while at work, the boiler will have to run several hours to get all the floors (and house contents) heated again. Your numbers cannot be correct..... "left alone" it runs 10 minutes in 5 hours but "setback" for 10 hours ("let the house cool") and "the boiler will have to run several hours" nonsense cheers Bob btw did you do those thermal mass / heat capacity calcs? |
#159
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 08:32:19 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote: I've met enough people who think slamming the thermostat makes it heat faster. Dunno. They must learn from driving a car where tromping the gas pedal throws it into four barrel? I've noticed with my computer that if the key doesn't work, I hit the key harder and then it does. |
#160
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Turn thermostat down or leave steady?
In article ,
Mark Lloyd wrote: On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:26:52 -0500, Jules wrote: On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 11:26:33 -0700, Smitty Two wrote: It's the same principle that makes elevators come faster if you hit the call button ten times I got into the habit of taking the stairs. Often it's quicker, and it's good exercise. Bonus points for being spotted by the same person at either end and claiming you have teleportation powers :-) One time I entered an old 4-floor building. Someone had just got on the elevator (there was just one) so I took the stairs. I got to the 4th floor and waited for the elevator to get there. A little faster and you'll be ready for Chris Angel's trick: throwing something off the roof of a multi-story building, then running out the front door to catch it. |
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