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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace

Last year I installed an Aprilaire 600 humidifier on my 30 yr old
oil/hotair furnace. Smacked myself for not doing it 20 yrs ago- It
didn't cost much more than one of the dozen or so portable humidifiers
I futzed with over those years. It did a better job of humidifying-
and was no work at all.

Thanks to whoever asked about one on this group- or I probably never
would have woke up.

But then I saw a great deal on a new furnace on Craigs list- and just
got done installing it. I just ran it through one cycle to test for
noise & leaks. The HVAC guy comes Friday to check my work & tune it
up.

On the old furnace I wired a transformer to the fan so when it kicked
on, the solenoid kicked on the humidifier. For the life of me I
can't remember how I did that now. The schematic in the [furnace's]
installation booklet don't make sense to me.

Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg

Thanks,
Jim
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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace

You're friends with a heating tech, but you're posting the
question, here? What am I missing?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
...
Last year I installed an Aprilaire 600 humidifier on my 30
yr old
oil/hotair furnace. Smacked myself for not doing it 20 yrs
ago- It
didn't cost much more than one of the dozen or so portable
humidifiers
I futzed with over those years. It did a better job of
humidifying-
and was no work at all.

Thanks to whoever asked about one on this group- or I
probably never
would have woke up.

But then I saw a great deal on a new furnace on Craigs list-
and just
got done installing it. I just ran it through one cycle to
test for
noise & leaks. The HVAC guy comes Friday to check my work &
tune it
up.

On the old furnace I wired a transformer to the fan so when
it kicked
on, the solenoid kicked on the humidifier. For the life
of me I
can't remember how I did that now. The schematic in the
[furnace's]
installation booklet don't make sense to me.

Could someone look at these and try to put into words where
the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg

Thanks,
Jim


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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace

On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:18:14 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

You're friends with a heating tech, but you're posting the
question, here? What am I missing?


I *hired* a guy to come Friday. [actually he is the referral from a
friend of a friend--- but I didn't confuse the original post with that
bit of useless trivia]

I'm sure he'll be able to hook it up--- but it bugs me that I can't
figure out those diagrams and get it done.

I'm bound to learn something in the process of hooking it up myself.

Jim
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"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
...
Last year I installed an Aprilaire 600 humidifier on my 30 yr old
oil/hotair furnace. Smacked myself for not doing it 20 yrs ago- It
didn't cost much more than one of the dozen or so portable humidifiers
I futzed with over those years. It did a better job of humidifying-
and was no work at all.

Thanks to whoever asked about one on this group- or I probably never
would have woke up.

But then I saw a great deal on a new furnace on Craigs list- and just
got done installing it. I just ran it through one cycle to test for
noise & leaks. The HVAC guy comes Friday to check my work & tune it
up.

On the old furnace I wired a transformer to the fan so when it kicked
on, the solenoid kicked on the humidifier. For the life of me I
can't remember how I did that now. The schematic in the [furnace's]
installation booklet don't make sense to me.

Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg

Thanks,
Jim


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace

On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg



If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


Thanks-- I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim


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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace

On Oct 7, 7:00*pm, Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ifierwiring_sm....


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


Thanks-- * I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. * *I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. * *I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim



What determines if the furnace blower runs on high or med speed during
heating? The diagram shows that the blower can run at med or even
low if the nozzle size is small enough. I would guess that this must
be set via a dipswitch somewhere on the controls. Assuming you have
it set to always run at high speed, then as RBM said, the transformer
goes across the black and white wires going to the motor.

If the furnace can choose itself whether to run at high or med, then
you have a more difficult problem, because there is no easy way to
wire the transformer so that it will have AC power in either case.

I have an Aprilaire and mine is wired so that the transformer always
has 120V. There is a seperate trigger lead that is connected to the
furnace controls on the 24V side to then turn it on when the furnace
is running.
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wrote in message
...
On Oct 7, 7:00 pm, Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ifierwiring_sm...


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it
to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless
you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


Thanks-- I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim



What determines if the furnace blower runs on high or med speed during
heating? The diagram shows that the blower can run at med or even
low if the nozzle size is small enough. I would guess that this must
be set via a dipswitch somewhere on the controls. Assuming you have
it set to always run at high speed, then as RBM said, the transformer
goes across the black and white wires going to the motor.

If the furnace can choose itself whether to run at high or med, then
you have a more difficult problem, because there is no easy way to
wire the transformer so that it will have AC power in either case.

I have an Aprilaire and mine is wired so that the transformer always
has 120V. There is a seperate trigger lead that is connected to the
furnace controls on the 24V side to then turn it on when the furnace
is running.

I've only seen an Aprilaire once, and it too was wired as you describe.


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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace

I like the Can-Do attitude. Typically the humidifier water
valve is wired to come on with the fan blower. And, if the
humidistat is calling.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
news
I *hired* a guy to come Friday. [actually he is the
referral from a
friend of a friend--- but I didn't confuse the original post
with that
bit of useless trivia]

I'm sure he'll be able to hook it up--- but it bugs me that
I can't
figure out those diagrams and get it done.

I'm bound to learn something in the process of hooking it up
myself.

Jim


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Default Wiring Humidifier to furnace


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg



If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it
to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless
you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


Thanks-- I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim


You *are* using the medium speed (the blue wire). The black wire is from
the air conditioning relay. The blue wire is from the fan/limit control,
which is connected to the heating speed tap at (or near) the blower motor. I
don't see where this furnace can choose it's own speed, based on the
provided diagram. The tech who sets this furnace up will measure the
temperature rise (heating) and drop across the evaporator (cooling) and
physically plug in the black and blue wires into the speed tap accordingly.
Anyway, the huimidifier is automatically interlocked to only run on a
heating fan call, not during a cooling nor fan on (at thermostat subbase)
call.


Alternately, you could use the model #50 current sensing relay for
interlock.

HTH, Lefty


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On Oct 8, 2:47*am, "Lefty" wrote:
"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

...





On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:


"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ifierwiring_sm....


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it
to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless
you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


Thanks-- * I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. * *I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. * *I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.


Thanks-
Jim


You *are* using the medium speed (the blue wire). *The black wire is from
the air conditioning relay. *The blue wire is from the fan/limit control,
which is connected to the heating speed tap at (or near) the blower motor.. I
don't see where this furnace can choose it's own speed, based on the
provided diagram. *The tech who sets this furnace up will measure the
temperature rise (heating) and drop across the evaporator (cooling) and
physically plug in the black and blue wires into the speed tap accordingly.


On looking at this again, I agree with your analysis. It appears the
blue wire is used to power the fan for heating and the relay selects
black when in AC mode. So, he would have 120V between the blue and
white fan wires during heating.


Anyway, the huimidifier is automatically interlocked to only run on a
heating fan call, not during a cooling nor fan on (at thermostat subbase)
call.


Assuming of course that he has it wired up that way. That is how my
Aprilaire is hooked up. It has 120V all the time and has a 24V
trigger lead connected to the furnace controls.




Alternately, you could use the model #50 current sensing relay for
interlock.

HTH, Lefty




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Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on, connect it to
the white and black wires where the diagram shows the blower, unless you're
using the medium speed, then use the white and blue


Thanks-- I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim


Relay "relay" is connected to thermostat G-C and is energized when the
stat calls for cooling or the stat is set for "fan on". The fan runs at
high speed.

Control "fan & limit switch" is a plenum switch that is operated by
heat. The fan (NO contacts) comes on when the switch gets hot and the
fan is held on while the plenum is hot. The normally closed contacts
only open if the control gets too hot. If the NC contacts open nothing
operates except the fan. "Aux limit" is a redundant safety control.

(Not obvious what the low voltage connection to the "fan & limit switch"
is - "if used". It is connected thermostat W-C and would be energized
when the stat calls for heat. "Relay" has common symbol for a coil. "Fan
& limit switch" is different - probably heat activated.)

The "blue" wire from the "fan and limit switch" terminal "F" to the
"relay" terminal "4" is only on when you are heating. _It is the wire to
tap_.

This is similar to what Lefty said, but you don't want to connect to the
blue wire at the motor.

It is desirable to only power the dehumidifier during heating (not
cooling). The wire above will do that. The other thing to avoid is
connecting (directly or indirectly) to a motor wire that can feed the
wrong voltage to the humidifier solenoid. The wire above also avoids that.

It is much easier to figure out what is happening with a control diagram
with wiring on horizontal rungs, rather than a connection diagram provided.

--
bud--
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bud-- wrote:
Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message

-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on,
connect it to the white and black wires where the diagram shows the
blower, unless you're using the medium speed, then use the white and
blue


Thanks-- I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim


Relay "relay" is connected to thermostat G-C and is energized when the
stat calls for cooling or the stat is set for "fan on". The fan runs at
high speed.

Control "fan & limit switch" is a plenum switch that is operated by
heat. The fan (NO contacts) comes on when the switch gets hot and the
fan is held on while the plenum is hot. The normally closed contacts
only open if the control gets too hot. If the NC contacts open nothing
operates except the fan. "Aux limit" is a redundant safety control.

(Not obvious what the low voltage connection to the "fan & limit switch"
is - "if used". It is connected thermostat W-C and would be energized
when the stat calls for heat. "Relay" has common symbol for a coil. "Fan
& limit switch" is different - probably heat activated.)

The "blue" wire from the "fan and limit switch" terminal "F" to the
"relay" terminal "4" is only on when you are heating. _It is the wire to
tap_.

This is similar to what Lefty said, but you don't want to connect to the
blue wire at the motor.

It is desirable to only power the dehumidifier during heating (not
cooling). The wire above will do that. The other thing to avoid is
connecting (directly or indirectly) to a motor wire that can feed the
wrong voltage to the humidifier solenoid. The wire above also avoids that.

It is much easier to figure out what is happening with a control diagram
with wiring on horizontal rungs, rather than a connection diagram provided.

In my old house I used a special gadget
where you clamp it around the
neutral wire for the blower. It has 2
leads which you wire in series with
the 24 volt circuit to the humidifier.
Here's a link:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001TXE0G2
Worked perfectly. As for not wanting
the humidifier to turn on in the
summer, the humidistat will usually take
care of that .... you can just turn
is as low as possible and it'll be ok.
Also, you really don't want to connect
the 110 volt side of a 24 volt
transformer to a multi-speed blower, where
speeds are determined by heating or
cooling because strange voltages
appear on the unused lead, i.e. blower
running on medium, high lead may
have 160 volts on it depending on the
motor.
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Art Todesco wrote:
bud-- wrote:
Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 18:13:36 -0400, "RBM" wrote:

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
-snip-
Could someone look at these and try to put into words where the
transformer wires-- 2 black & a green-- go?
Schematic
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ng_diagram.jpg
Humidifier hook-up
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...rwiring_sm.jpg


If you want the transformer to power up when the blower is on,
connect it to the white and black wires where the diagram shows the
blower, unless you're using the medium speed, then use the white and
blue

Thanks-- I didn't think that was a choice *I* made. I thought the
furnace chose the speed & I was looking for something to connect to
before it made that choice. I'll have another read through the
literature to see what it says about the two speeds.

Thanks-
Jim


Relay "relay" is connected to thermostat G-C and is energized when the
stat calls for cooling or the stat is set for "fan on". The fan runs
at high speed.

Control "fan & limit switch" is a plenum switch that is operated by
heat. The fan (NO contacts) comes on when the switch gets hot and the
fan is held on while the plenum is hot. The normally closed contacts
only open if the control gets too hot. If the NC contacts open nothing
operates except the fan. "Aux limit" is a redundant safety control.

(Not obvious what the low voltage connection to the "fan & limit
switch" is - "if used". It is connected thermostat W-C and would be
energized when the stat calls for heat. "Relay" has common symbol for
a coil. "Fan & limit switch" is different - probably heat activated.)

The "blue" wire from the "fan and limit switch" terminal "F" to the
"relay" terminal "4" is only on when you are heating. _It is the wire
to tap_.

This is similar to what Lefty said, but you don't want to connect to
the blue wire at the motor.

It is desirable to only power the dehumidifier during heating (not
cooling). The wire above will do that. The other thing to avoid is
connecting (directly or indirectly) to a motor wire that can feed the
wrong voltage to the humidifier solenoid. The wire above also avoids
that.

It is much easier to figure out what is happening with a control
diagram with wiring on horizontal rungs, rather than a connection
diagram provided.

In my old house I used a special gadget where you clamp it around the
neutral wire for the blower. It has 2 leads which you wire in series with
the 24 volt circuit to the humidifier. Here's a link:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001TXE0G2


Probably what Lefty described.

Worked perfectly. As for not wanting the humidifier to turn on in the
summer, the humidistat will usually take care of that .... you can just
turn
is as low as possible and it'll be ok.



Also, you really don't want to
connect
the 110 volt side of a 24 volt transformer to a multi-speed blower, where
speeds are determined by heating or cooling because strange voltages
appear on the unused lead, i.e. blower running on medium, high lead may
have 160 volts on it depending on the motor.


That was one of my points, and it doesn't happen if connection is made
where I said.

--
bud--
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