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Re-roofing a barn



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 4th 09, 04:36 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 1,669
Default Re-roofing a barn


We've got an old arched-roof dairy barn (built in 1950) which obviously
hasn't been maintained or used in *many* years (we moved here last year).
The frame and three walls are good; the other wall's not so hot, it
needs new windows, and there are several holes in the roof - so it needs
some major surgery before re-shingling :-)

Fixing it up's a medium-term project though, as there aren't too many of
those types of barn left around here (northern MN), and it'd be a shame
for it to collapse (as I see so many have done).

I'm happy doing the wall work, and I'd be happy doing the roof too -
except that it's so darn high, making access tricky. Must be about 40' to
the very top. I'm curious as to what the best method is to work up there -
a series of ladders*, scaffold, climbing ropes etc. (I'm not sure that a
cherry picker would either go that high or be able to reach over the
20' or so needed to get to the center? Plus the rental costs for one are
quite insane up here anyway - and they presumably didn't use one back when
it was first built)

* shame I can't start at the top and work my way down when re-shingling,
or I could physically bolt ladders to the structure as I worked.

cheers

Jules

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  #2  
Old September 4th 09, 05:05 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 323
Default Re-roofing a barn

On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 09:36:36 -0500, Jules wrote:

We've got an old arched-roof dairy barn (built in 1950) which obviously
hasn't been maintained or used in *many* years (we moved here last year).
The frame and three walls are good; the other wall's not so hot, it
needs new windows, and there are several holes in the roof - so it needs
some major surgery before re-shingling :-)

Fixing it up's a medium-term project though, as there aren't too many of
those types of barn left around here (northern MN), and it'd be a shame
for it to collapse (as I see so many have done).

I'm happy doing the wall work, and I'd be happy doing the roof too -
except that it's so darn high, making access tricky. Must be about 40' to
the very top. I'm curious as to what the best method is to work up there -
a series of ladders*, scaffold, climbing ropes etc. (I'm not sure that a
cherry picker would either go that high or be able to reach over the
20' or so needed to get to the center? Plus the rental costs for one are
quite insane up here anyway - and they presumably didn't use one back when
it was first built)

* shame I can't start at the top and work my way down when re-shingling,
or I could physically bolt ladders to the structure as I worked.

cheers

Jules



http://www.diy-hq.net/outdoor/instal...oof-jacks.html

If working alone you need a minimum of 6 with 2x8 or 2x10's (you will have
to measure or read the directions). I would highly recommend a fall
prevention system with fall harness, etc. I helped out on such a roof in a
strong wind and fall chill up in Iowa. MN will be much worse I suspect.
  #3  
Old September 4th 09, 05:11 PM posted to alt.home.repair
dpb
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Posts: 10,458
Default Re-roofing a barn

Jules wrote:
....
I'm happy doing the wall work, and I'd be happy doing the roof too -
except that it's so darn high, making access tricky. Must be about 40' to
the very top. I'm curious as to what the best method is to work up there -
a series of ladders*, scaffold, climbing ropes etc. (I'm not sure that a
cherry picker would either go that high or be able to reach over the
20' or so needed to get to the center? Plus the rental costs for one are
quite insane up here anyway - and they presumably didn't use one back when
it was first built)

....

Well, what I did when we moved back to the home place was to find and
buy an inexpensive 40-ft boom lift(1) from eBay. Cost $5K+$600
trucking from Chicago area to far SW KS. Best $5K ever invested w/ the
intent of being short-term--had it 10 years now and use it around the
place a lot from trimming trees to then roof repair/painting house
(2-story old square farm house) to the TV antenna that was taken down by
wind/hail to...

It reached the nearly 40-ft ridge and the lower eave of the cupola. To
do the cupola roof I set up scaffolding a-straddle the ridge (2-high!)
and used a walkboard across.

The way we roofed was I bolted a 16-ft 2x10 "L" to the front of the
bucket and we "landed" that on the roof. Hired hand and I would work
from opposite ends til we met in the middle and could reach about 3-4
courses each stop. By the time we used up the number of bundles we
could put in the cage and get in ourselves we were ready for a break.

Spent most of the first 18-months in that puppy almost continuously by
time did all the prep work and roofing followed by paint prep and paint...

(1) What I found was JLG 40H ca '88 vintage. It passed OSHA
requirements prior to shipment and my minimum was the only bid. I did
replace a head gasket on the Wisconsin 4-cyl engine but that was minimal
effort and expense. In 10 yrs only other maintenance has been replaced
one control lever electronics for the boom swing other than change oil,
normal lube, etc.

If you're at all interested I'll look up and see which broker it was I
dealt with--he's straight up; I just don't recall the business name
otomh any longer. The broker was in FL, the machine in IL, I in KS...

--

  #4  
Old September 4th 09, 05:32 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 1,669
Default Re-roofing a barn

On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 10:05:28 -0500, Michael Dobony wrote:
http://www.diy-hq.net/outdoor/instal...oof-jacks.html


Interesting - thanks! As the roof is curved, I suspect I'm going to have
to get some made up to match the curvature of the roof.

The description on that site implies that the jacks stay where they are
nailed until the whole project's done ("Once the project has been
completed, all you have to do is remove the board and the jacks along with
it.") - yet in the photo it appears as though there's just a nail-hole in
the jack, rather than a slot; I assume the hole must be larger than the
nail-head so that the jack can be removed and the nail left behind (and
hammered home)?

If working alone you need a minimum of 6 with 2x8 or 2x10's (you will
have to measure or read the directions).


I suppose the 'trick' is to space them apart (vertically) at slightly less
than my own height, so maybe every 5' or so. Right now I don't have an
estimate really for the 'length' top-bottom of each side of the roof,
though.

I would highly recommend a fall
prevention system with fall harness, etc. I helped out on such a roof in
a strong wind and fall chill up in Iowa. MN will be much worse I
suspect.


I think I'd recommend that to myself, too ;-) I don't particularly like
heights, but when the need arises... I wouldn't want to wander around up
there without knowing something will stop me falling if I did slip (I
suspect it gets pretty windy up top, too)

It's not something I want to get stuck into this year - just looking for
ideas and options right now. Maybe next Spring after it's warmed up a
little, and if time and money allow (that amount of shingles plus all the
lumber I'll need won't come cheap, I suspect)

cheers

Jules

  #5  
Old September 4th 09, 06:14 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 1,334
Default Re-roofing a barn

dpb wrote:

Well, what I did when we moved back to the home place was to find and
buy an inexpensive 40-ft boom lift(1) from eBay. Cost $5K+$600
trucking from Chicago area to far SW KS. Best $5K ever invested w/ the
intent of being short-term--had it 10 years now and use it around the
place a lot from trimming trees to then roof repair/painting house
(2-story old square farm house) to the TV antenna that was taken down by
wind/hail to...


Can I borrow it? Damn I'd like to have one of those around here! I
have a habit of doing oil changes on equipment I borrow as a little way
of saying "thanks".
  #6  
Old September 4th 09, 07:39 PM posted to alt.home.repair
dpb
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Posts: 10,458
Default Re-roofing a barn

Jules wrote:
....
It's not something I want to get stuck into this year - just looking for
ideas and options right now. Maybe next Spring after it's warmed up a
little, and if time and money allow (that amount of shingles plus all the
lumber I'll need won't come cheap, I suspect)

....

Given the overall cost and effort, I'll reiterate don't sell short the
"find a cheap lift for the duration" option. If you have a place of any
size at all the number of uses you'll find for it will amaze you once
you have it. I intended to sell it as soon as got done w/ the barn but
now it's become a staple around the place I'd hate to do without.

This old barn was still in solid shape (it's much drier here than MN so
that helps a lot) but w/ what siding that did need replacement and some
sill plate plus the roof material itself (got a year-end deal on 1/2"
shakes at $95/square as was this time of year after two _horrendous_
hail storms in town that spring left the building supply w/ more on hand
than wanted to store over winter) ended up into the $20K neighborhood.

Is this an open (not solid sheathed) wood shingle roof I presume? If
so, while I used the shakes as noted because they made me a deal and
didn't have sufficient of the sawn shingles in stock I would _not_
recommend them and would not choose them again for the purpose. Or, if
do, instead of the straight installation as was common, you will
definitely need a paper layer to stop the blowing snow infiltrating
between when the wind blows. They're water tight just fine but let a
lot of snow thru when the wind blows (and out here it never blows just a
little--it's 30+ or more; last spring had "the real deal" blizzard again
of 2 days of 50-60 mph and 2-ft snow (altho how they could make any
guess as to the actual snowfall is hard to fathom given the drifting).
Anyway, the upshot was the haymow as pretty full as well--didn't help
that the wind blew so hard and long it managed to work the haymow door
open along its sliding track either, of course. All in all, looks good,
has a definite shortcoming that the flat shingles didn't.

--
  #7  
Old September 4th 09, 07:44 PM posted to alt.home.repair
dpb
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Posts: 10,458
Default Re-roofing a barn

Tony wrote:
dpb wrote:

Well, what I did when we moved back to the home place was to find and
buy an inexpensive 40-ft boom lift(1) from eBay. Cost $5K+$600
trucking from Chicago area to far SW KS. Best $5K ever invested w/
the intent of being short-term--had it 10 years now and use it around
the place a lot from trimming trees to then roof repair/painting house
(2-story old square farm house) to the TV antenna that was taken down
by wind/hail to...


Can I borrow it? Damn I'd like to have one of those around here! I
have a habit of doing oil changes on equipment I borrow as a little way
of saying "thanks".


Where you located??? It doesn't road well top speed being less than a
walking pace....

So far I've not done that for the potential liability issue. I do/have
used it for many other purposes at church, County historical museum
where board member, etc., etc., but I've always operated it myself
rather than let it go to somebody else. I've never even asked what Mr
Farm Bureau insurance man would say...

--
  #8  
Old September 4th 09, 11:02 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 1,669
Default Re-roofing a barn

On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 12:39:54 -0500, dpb wrote:

Jules wrote:
...
It's not something I want to get stuck into this year - just looking for
ideas and options right now. Maybe next Spring after it's warmed up a
little, and if time and money allow (that amount of shingles plus all the
lumber I'll need won't come cheap, I suspect)

...

Given the overall cost and effort, I'll reiterate don't sell short the
"find a cheap lift for the duration" option.


Yeah, that may well be the way to go. I still think a standard cherry
picker won't reach, but something a bit more heavy-duty might. Due to the
curve of the roof, it's the middle section each side that's probably the
harder bit; the bottom I can reach with ladders, the top's reasonably
'flat' if I can find a way up there - but the middle third's at quite
an angle.

Given that I know I'll have wood that needs replacing up there it's not a
quick job; I can see myself needing something for a week, and rental
for cherry pickers seems to be about $300/day around here. Buying then
selling (or talking myself into keeping is probably a good plan.

This old barn was still in solid shape (it's much drier here than MN so
that helps a lot) but w/ what siding that did need replacement and some
sill plate plus the roof material itself (got a year-end deal on 1/2"
shakes at $95/square as was this time of year after two _horrendous_
hail storms in town that spring left the building supply w/ more on hand
than wanted to store over winter) ended up into the $20K neighborhood.


Youch. I don't think it'll be that bad for me - I was guesstimating at
$10k for shingles but I've seen a few good deals on lately and it'll
probably be about a third of that for something that'll last (supposedly)
for 20-30 years.

I do have the end-wall which needs completely re-siding (and insulating -
basically strip back to frame and start again) so that'll be a couple of
thousand I expect. The frame needs fixing there, too - they built this
barn with a 3' tall concrete wall around 3-1/2 sides, but one half of one
end wall has the framing extending right to the ground. 60 years later,
it's all rotted out there, so I need to jack the hayloft floor and replace
the framework (I'm looking forward to doing that aspect, because it
doesn't involve falling off a roof :-)

It's an expensive project, and I don't even know what the heck I'll use
the barn for when it's done - just seems a shame to let it all collapse!

Is this an open (not solid sheathed) wood shingle roof I presume?


Yes (if I understand you) - the curved framing for the roof's made up from
a 3x6" laminate of 1x6" boards, 1x6" boards then nailed across that,
then boring ol' asphalt shingles on top.

There seems to be a tarpaper layer lower down; I don't know if that's
failed at the top of the roof (hence being able to see daylight in places)
or if it simply doesn't run the whole way up. Possibly the latter - the
way the barn's built it's as though they threw money at it when they had
it, and just worked with whatever material they could find when they
didn't.

Anyway, the upshot was the haymow as pretty full as well--didn't help
that the wind blew so hard and long it managed to work the haymow door
open along its sliding track either, of course.


Yuck. Ours has one of those huge hayloft doors with the hinges along
the bottom (and a smaller door with vertical hinges set within it).
There's a rail at roofline height with a rope/pulley system that's
supposed to allow the larger door to safely lower, but I doubt it's worked
in years (I know they had cows in there in '68, but I suspect it wasn't
much long after that when the previous owners stopped using and
maintaining it, judging by how bad the roof is)

cheers

Jules

  #9  
Old September 5th 09, 02:21 AM posted to alt.home.repair
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Posts: 196
Default Re-roofing a barn


"Jules" wrote in message
news

We've got an old arched-roof dairy barn (built in 1950) which obviously
hasn't been maintained or used in *many* years (we moved here last year).
The frame and three walls are good; the other wall's not so hot, it
needs new windows, and there are several holes in the roof - so it needs
some major surgery before re-shingling :-)

Fixing it up's a medium-term project though, as there aren't too many of
those types of barn left around here (northern MN), and it'd be a shame
for it to collapse (as I see so many have done).

I'm happy doing the wall work, and I'd be happy doing the roof too -
except that it's so darn high, making access tricky. Must be about 40' to
the very top. I'm curious as to what the best method is to work up there -
a series of ladders*, scaffold, climbing ropes etc. (I'm not sure that a
cherry picker would either go that high or be able to reach over the
20' or so needed to get to the center? Plus the rental costs for one are
quite insane up here anyway - and they presumably didn't use one back when
it was first built)

* shame I can't start at the top and work my way down when re-shingling,
or I could physically bolt ladders to the structure as I worked.

cheers

Jules


I watched a contractor do one just down the road. He used standing seam
metal roofing a foot wide and the length of the barn. He also had a reach
forklift. He started at the peak and worked his way down.


  #10  
Old September 5th 09, 03:57 AM posted to alt.home.repair
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,334
Default Re-roofing a barn

dpb wrote:
Tony wrote:
dpb wrote:

Well, what I did when we moved back to the home place was to find and
buy an inexpensive 40-ft boom lift(1) from eBay. Cost $5K+$600
trucking from Chicago area to far SW KS. Best $5K ever invested w/
the intent of being short-term--had it 10 years now and use it around
the place a lot from trimming trees to then roof repair/painting
house (2-story old square farm house) to the TV antenna that was
taken down by wind/hail to...


Can I borrow it? Damn I'd like to have one of those around here! I
have a habit of doing oil changes on equipment I borrow as a little
way of saying "thanks".


Where you located??? It doesn't road well top speed being less than a
walking pace....


I was just joking, I'm in eastern Tennessee. My son in law bought one
for their electrical business, mostly for changing lamps in parking
lots. Changing lamps isn't paying for it but the extra work it
generates does. I keep telling him to bring it down next visit, it's
only 600+ miles.

So far I've not done that for the potential liability issue. I do/have
used it for many other purposes at church, County historical museum
where board member, etc., etc., but I've always operated it myself
rather than let it go to somebody else. I've never even asked what Mr
Farm Bureau insurance man would say...


He would tell you to make friends with that Gecko.
 




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