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#1
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is
Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walter www.rationality.net |
#2
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
In article , "Walter R." wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I've been using Windex on my eyeglasses for, oh, thirty or forty years, and it doesn't seem to have done any harm. |
#3
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walter www.rationality.net The original Windex has ammonia in it. I wouldn't be too fast to put it on a coated lens. |
#4
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Walter R. wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Definitely a no-no for mine, anyway--depends on what the coating is. I use a little mild liquid soap (not detergent). -- |
#5
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"dpb" wrote in message ...
Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Definitely a no-no for mine, anyway--depends on what the coating is. I use a little mild liquid soap (not detergent). I use plain water, and soft dishtowel. |
#6
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Walter R." wrote in message
... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- I just lather up my hands with bathroom soap, wet the glasses and gently rub both sides of the lenses and the frame, rinse, wipe gently with clean soft cotton towel, done... |
#7
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
On Apr 10, 8:09*pm, dpb wrote:
Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Definitely a no-no for mine, anyway--depends on what the coating is. I use a little mild liquid soap (not detergent). -- I just use running tap water and then dry with a soft towel. If I were using a cleaner, I'd use a gentle one, like liquid soap, Simple Green, etc. |
#8
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I usually clean mine while waiting in line at a department store. Just use saliva to wet, and the person's coat in front of you to dry. |
#9
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walter www.rationality.net This on the advice of our optician . Liquid dishwashing soap. It cleans the oil from fingerprints, doesn't leave a residue and is very mild. Charlie |
#10
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "Walter R." wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I've been using Windex on my eyeglasses for, oh, thirty or forty years, and it doesn't seem to have done any harm. 'Bout 30 years ago, I asked the grad student at the optometry school who was doing the final fitting on my new glasses, exactly what they did with them after they vanish in back room for five minutes, before handing them to me all shiny in their case. 'Cleaning them', he said. 'With what?', I asked, envisioning some exotic ultrasonic cleaner. His sheepish admission- plain old Joy dish soap and warm water, and dry with a lint-free lab wipe. Ever since then, I always ask the McEyedoctor people, after I turn down the five-dollar chamois towel and special drops they try to sell me, what they actually use in the back room. Most of them admit is it just dish soap. Think about it- most of the grunge on your glasses comes off your face, unless you are spraypainting or something. What do you clean your face with? Gentle soap. Don't need any abrasives or solvents (and some of the fancy coatings are easy to damage)- you just need something that will dissolve body oils into solution so they can be rinsed away. Free hint- NEVER lean over a campfire or backyard cleanup fire wearing coated glasses. Those fancy coatings are NOT heat resistant, and they will alligator in seconds. C'mon, ask me how I know that. -- aem sends.... |
#11
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
aemeijers wrote:
Doug Miller wrote: In article , "Walter R." wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I've been using Windex on my eyeglasses for, oh, thirty or forty years, and it doesn't seem to have done any harm. 'Bout 30 years ago, I asked the grad student at the optometry school who was doing the final fitting on my new glasses, exactly what they did with them after they vanish in back room for five minutes, before handing them to me all shiny in their case. 'Cleaning them', he said. 'With what?', I asked, envisioning some exotic ultrasonic cleaner. His sheepish admission- plain old Joy dish soap and warm water, and dry with a lint-free lab wipe. Ever since then, I always ask the McEyedoctor people, after I turn down the five-dollar chamois towel and special drops they try to sell me, what they actually use in the back room. Most of them admit is it just dish soap. Think about it- most of the grunge on your glasses comes off your face, unless you are spraypainting or something. What do you clean your face with? Gentle soap. Don't need any abrasives or solvents (and some of the fancy coatings are easy to damage)- you just need something that will dissolve body oils into solution so they can be rinsed away. Free hint- NEVER lean over a campfire or backyard cleanup fire wearing coated glasses. Those fancy coatings are NOT heat resistant, and they will alligator in seconds. C'mon, ask me how I know that. -- aem sends.... I think most of those fancy cleaning sprays are a really weak ammonia solution anyway. And the little special cloths (which really do kick ass) are small pieces of fine microfiber cloth. But yes, dish soap is the stuff. The more important thing is only using soft clean cloths to polish them with afterward. Fortunately the newer coatings shed water a lot better than the old ones so not much polishing is required. Hopefully this makes them last longer. nate -- replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel |
#12
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Walter R. wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Having had a set of COATED lenses about a year now, I understand what you are up against. Any of the "old" ways of cleaning non-COATED glasses just do not get the job done. Body oil just does not come off. I don't know a DIY formula, what works best for me is Walgreen's or CVS's little spray bottle of cleaner made for COATED glasses, and a MICROFIBER cloth. That's why the doc's office gave me 2 cloths when I got the glasses. Again, anything else just does not work on COATED lenses. My mgr at work had same problem with his new lenses a few months ago. YMMV --Reed |
#13
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 16:45:48 -0700, "Walter R."
wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks What? You can't just use a rag? |
#14
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Reed wrote:
Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Having had a set of COATED lenses about a year now, I understand what you are up against. Any of the "old" ways of cleaning non-COATED glasses just do not get the job done. Body oil just does not come off. I don't know a DIY formula, what works best for me is Walgreen's or CVS's little spray bottle of cleaner made for COATED glasses, and a MICROFIBER cloth. That's why the doc's office gave me 2 cloths when I got the glasses. Again, anything else just does not work on COATED lenses. My mgr at work had same problem with his new lenses a few months ago. YMMV --Reed But how do you clean the microfiber cloth? And yes, this is a serious question- whenever I run one through the washer, it self-destructs. -- aem sends... |
#15
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Reed wrote:
Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Having had a set of COATED lenses about a year now, I understand what you are up against. Any of the "old" ways of cleaning non-COATED glasses just do not get the job done. Body oil just does not come off. I don't know a DIY formula, what works best for me is Walgreen's or CVS's little spray bottle of cleaner made for COATED glasses, and a MICROFIBER cloth. That's why the doc's office gave me 2 cloths when I got the glasses. Again, anything else just does not work on COATED lenses. My mgr at work had same problem with his new lenses a few months ago. YMMV --Reed What are coated lenses supposed to do anyway? I've had the same pair of plastic progressive lenses for about 7 years - I clean them in the sink when I do dishes, wipe with a soft cotton towel. Not a scratch on them. |
#16
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
aemeijers wrote:
Reed wrote: Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Having had a set of COATED lenses about a year now, I understand what you are up against. Any of the "old" ways of cleaning non-COATED glasses just do not get the job done. Body oil just does not come off. I don't know a DIY formula, what works best for me is Walgreen's or CVS's little spray bottle of cleaner made for COATED glasses, and a MICROFIBER cloth. That's why the doc's office gave me 2 cloths when I got the glasses. Again, anything else just does not work on COATED lenses. My mgr at work had same problem with his new lenses a few months ago. YMMV --Reed But how do you clean the microfiber cloth? And yes, this is a serious question- whenever I run one through the washer, it self-destructs. -- aem sends... I marvel at all the microfiber crap in the cleaning products section at the store - wondering how I get along without it. Buying them seems to me much like burning a stack of dollar bills. |
#17
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Nate Nagel" wrote in message But yes, dish soap is the stuff. The more important thing is only using soft clean cloths to polish them with afterward. Fortunately the newer coatings shed water a lot better than the old ones so not much polishing is required. Hopefully this makes them last longer. I use the soap and then hold the glasses vertical and run them under the water. Under a light stream, not the bubbling from the aerator, the soap rinses and nothing is left but maybe a drop or two and I blot that away with a towel or T shirt. Perfectly clean and no contact that can scratch.. |
#18
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Walter R. wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks I came across something called Cat Crap at an eye doctor's office. It worked for me. http://tinyurl.com/c37t5y TDD |
#20
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
wrote in message What are coated lenses supposed to do anyway? I've had the same pair of plastic progressive lenses for about 7 years - I clean them in the sink when I do dishes, wipe with a soft cotton towel. Not a scratch on them. Coatings reduce glare. Makes for better night driving, especially in the rain. Makes your eyes more visible to others also. When you look in the mirror with a standard lens you see light reflecting. With coated, you see a perfectly clear lens. Yes, it is overpriced, but it does help. |
#21
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Ed Pawlowski wrote:
wrote in message What are coated lenses supposed to do anyway? I've had the same pair of plastic progressive lenses for about 7 years - I clean them in the sink when I do dishes, wipe with a soft cotton towel. Not a scratch on them. Coatings reduce glare. Makes for better night driving, especially in the rain. Makes your eyes more visible to others also. When you look in the mirror with a standard lens you see light reflecting. With coated, you see a perfectly clear lens. Yes, it is overpriced, but it does help. The anti-glare is nice, but the main coating I try to get is the stuff that makes it not scratch. Having coke bottle lenses, I can't get glass, so scratches are a problem. -- aem sends... |
#22
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
aemeijers wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote: wrote in message What are coated lenses supposed to do anyway? I've had the same pair of plastic progressive lenses for about 7 years - I clean them in the sink when I do dishes, wipe with a soft cotton towel. Not a scratch on them. Coatings reduce glare. Makes for better night driving, especially in the rain. Makes your eyes more visible to others also. When you look in the mirror with a standard lens you see light reflecting. With coated, you see a perfectly clear lens. Yes, it is overpriced, but it does help. The anti-glare is nice, but the main coating I try to get is the stuff that makes it not scratch. Having coke bottle lenses, I can't get glass, so scratches are a problem. -- aem sends... Hi, It's called scratch resistant, not scratch proof. |
#23
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
On Fri 10 Apr 2009 06:17:11p, Nate Nagel told us...
aemeijers wrote: Doug Miller wrote: In article , "Walter R." wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I've been using Windex on my eyeglasses for, oh, thirty or forty years, and it doesn't seem to have done any harm. 'Bout 30 years ago, I asked the grad student at the optometry school who was doing the final fitting on my new glasses, exactly what they did with them after they vanish in back room for five minutes, before handing them to me all shiny in their case. 'Cleaning them', he said. 'With what?', I asked, envisioning some exotic ultrasonic cleaner. His sheepish admission- plain old Joy dish soap and warm water, and dry with a lint-free lab wipe. Ever since then, I always ask the McEyedoctor people, after I turn down the five-dollar chamois towel and special drops they try to sell me, what they actually use in the back room. Most of them admit is it just dish soap. Think about it- most of the grunge on your glasses comes off your face, unless you are spraypainting or something. What do you clean your face with? Gentle soap. Don't need any abrasives or solvents (and some of the fancy coatings are easy to damage)- you just need something that will dissolve body oils into solution so they can be rinsed away. Free hint- NEVER lean over a campfire or backyard cleanup fire wearing coated glasses. Those fancy coatings are NOT heat resistant, and they will alligator in seconds. C'mon, ask me how I know that. -- aem sends.... I think most of those fancy cleaning sprays are a really weak ammonia solution anyway. And the little special cloths (which really do kick ass) are small pieces of fine microfiber cloth. But yes, dish soap is the stuff. The more important thing is only using soft clean cloths to polish them with afterward. Fortunately the newer coatings shed water a lot better than the old ones so not much polishing is required. Hopefully this makes them last longer. nate A lot of the eyeglass sprays are about 2/3 distilled water, 1/3 alcohol (rubbing alcohol is fine), and a few drops of detergent. -- Wayne Boatwright ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I take a vitamin every day. It's called a steak. ~Leo Benvenuti and Steve Rudnick, Kicking & Screaming, 2005, spoken by the character Buck Weston |
#24
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
aemeijers wrote:
Reed wrote: Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Having had a set of COATED lenses about a year now, I understand what you are up against. Any of the "old" ways of cleaning non-COATED glasses just do not get the job done. Body oil just does not come off. I don't know a DIY formula, what works best for me is Walgreen's or CVS's little spray bottle of cleaner made for COATED glasses, and a MICROFIBER cloth. That's why the doc's office gave me 2 cloths when I got the glasses. Again, anything else just does not work on COATED lenses. My mgr at work had same problem with his new lenses a few months ago. YMMV --Reed But how do you clean the microfiber cloth? And yes, this is a serious question- whenever I run one through the washer, it self-destructs. -- aem sends... I have been hand-washing mine with just a drop of Dawn dish detergent. Rinse real good, then let it air dry. --Reed |
#25
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walter www.rationality.net *** 1 drop dish detergent 1/2 oz (15 ml or 3 tsp) isopropyl alcohol 4 oz (125 ml or 1/2 cup) water Note: water - alcohol ratio is 8 water to 1 alcohol. Adjust detergent as required for amount of the previous ingredients. Spray on lenses and dry with a microfibre cloth from Optometrist. We have used this recipe for several years and it works great. About once a week, you need to wash the microfibre cloth as follows: Soak cloth in water and a drop of dish detergent for a few minutes. Agitate in the solution and then rinse thoroughly under the tap. Keep the cloth clean or tiny specks of dirt could scratch the lenses. Larry |
#26
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Larry wrote:
"Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Hi, When glasses get dirty with sweat/dirt/skin oil, I dunk it in the ultra sound cleaning tub. |
#27
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Sanity" wrote in message ... "Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walter www.rationality.net The original Windex has ammonia in it. I wouldn't be too fast to put it on a coated lens. I stay away from ammonia also. It may not hurt them, but why take a chance if you don't need to. |
#28
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Use a microwashingmachine?
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. But how do you clean the microfiber cloth? And yes, this is a serious question- whenever I run one through the washer, it self-destructs. -- aem sends... |
#29
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Ah, but isn't "ammonia D" the new stuff? Might be different
than the old ordinary ammonia. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Rick Samuel" wrote in message ... "Sanity" wrote in message ... The original Windex has ammonia in it. I wouldn't be too fast to put it on a coated lens. I stay away from ammonia also. It may not hurt them, but why take a chance if you don't need to. |
#30
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 20:55:11 -0400, "Charlie"
wrote: "Walter R." wrote in message ... Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walter www.rationality.net This on the advice of our optician . Liquid dishwashing soap. It cleans the oil from fingerprints, doesn't leave a residue and is very mild. Charlie Does anyone remember visiclean? (I'm not sure of the spelling). I assume it is no longer avaialble because it harms the new expensive coatings, but it sure did clean well. Anyone know what is was made of? |
#31
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
Walter R. wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks I don't have coated glasses but I have always cleaned mine by holding under tap water to remove grit, moistening my fingers with soap (either hand soap or dish soap), rubbing on lenses, rinsing off and drying with tissue. Using solvents on plastic lenses is looking for trouble and even with glass lenses, coatings are plastic based. |
#32
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 16:45:48 -0700, "Walter R."
wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Island girl has a product called "Clear Horizons" that is superior to anything I have ever used. You will think you have just gotten new lenses. Amazing stuff. islandgirlproducts.com In a salt environment, always rinse lenses with plain water first to avoid rubbing residual salt on and into the lens surface. |
#33
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
In article , "Walter R." wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I would not use Windex on optical glass with coatings. You can purchase specialized lens cleaning solutions; most are a combination of distilled water, alcohol and a small amount of soap/detergent. I normally use the liquid soap that we have at out washbasin. If the nose clips are really dirty, I'll use an old (soft) toothbrush to clean them. Then dry with a lint free cloth -- a CLEAN cotton handkerchief is fine and a CLEAN microfiber cloth is better. NEVER use paper-based products (like a regular tissue) on optical glass or plastic. ALWAYS use tissues that are specifically made/rated for optical glass or a clean lint-free cloth. Trees and other plants produce phytolyths (micro crystals of quartz, silica and other abrasives). These are carried into the pulps and paper products and they will, over time, scratch up a plastic or glass lens and any coatings on it. -- |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| | Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". | | Gary Player. | | http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. | ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
#34
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
"Walter R." wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Mix up some rubbing alcohol and water, then add a few drops of Dawn diswashing detergent. Spray it on lenses, make sure they are well coated, rinse off thoroughly, then dry with a clean, soft cloth. Jon |
#35
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
aemeijers wrote:
Doug Miller wrote: In article , "Walter R." wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? I've been using Windex on my eyeglasses for, oh, thirty or forty years, and it doesn't seem to have done any harm. 'Bout 30 years ago, I asked the grad student at the optometry school who was doing the final fitting on my new glasses, exactly what they did with them after they vanish in back room for five minutes, before handing them to me all shiny in their case. 'Cleaning them', he said. 'With what?', I asked, envisioning some exotic ultrasonic cleaner. His sheepish admission- plain old Joy dish soap and warm water, and dry with a lint-free lab wipe. Ever since then, I always ask the McEyedoctor people, after I turn down the five-dollar chamois towel and special drops they try to sell me, what they actually use in the back room. Most of them admit is it just dish soap. Think about it- most of the grunge on your glasses comes off your face, unless you are spraypainting or something. What do you clean your face with? Gentle soap. Don't need any abrasives or solvents (and some of the fancy coatings are easy to damage)- you just need something that will dissolve body oils into solution so they can be rinsed away. Free hint- NEVER lean over a campfire or backyard cleanup fire wearing coated glasses. Those fancy coatings are NOT heat resistant, and they will alligator in seconds. C'mon, ask me how I know that. -- aem sends.... Just a FWIW but there are most definitely different quality coatings. The big box version will behave as you described. |
#36
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
aemeijers wrote:
Reed wrote: Walter R. wrote: Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks Having had a set of COATED lenses about a year now, I understand what you are up against. Any of the "old" ways of cleaning non-COATED glasses just do not get the job done. Body oil just does not come off. I don't know a DIY formula, what works best for me is Walgreen's or CVS's little spray bottle of cleaner made for COATED glasses, and a MICROFIBER cloth. That's why the doc's office gave me 2 cloths when I got the glasses. Again, anything else just does not work on COATED lenses. My mgr at work had same problem with his new lenses a few months ago. YMMV --Reed But how do you clean the microfiber cloth? And yes, this is a serious question- whenever I run one through the washer, it self-destructs. -- aem sends... If it is doing that likely it isn't even microfiber. Also just like any other fabric type product there is a huge difference in quality of microfiber cloth depending on the type pf plastics used and the method used to make it. |
#37
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
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#38
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
I marvel at all the microfiber crap in the cleaning products section at the store - wondering how I get along without it. Buying them seems to me much like burning a stack of dollar bills. Marvel all you want, but have you tried it? I too, was skeptical. Cleaning the inside of a windshield was the worst job possible for cleaning. No matter what I did, it would streak and glare in the low sun. I've been tempted to buy a new car just for the clean windshield it comes with. Enter the microfiber cloth. Wet it with plain water. Wipe windshield, rinse and wipe again. Perfect. No streaks. $25000 for new car saved. Two people at work have tried mine and bought their own. Get back to us after you try one. |
#39
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
On Apr 10, 7:45*pm, "Walter R." wrote:
Does anyone have a DIY formula for cleaning coated eyeglass lenses? Is Windex spray OK? Thanks -- Walterwww.rationality.net Distilled water and isopropyl alcohol does the trick for me. That what they told me when I got my glasses. I mix it 75% water. My fried got me a baggie full of clean room wipes that is super for cleaning them. I put the solutin in a spray perfume bottle because it gives a very fine mist. One pump one the cloth and then wipe my glasses with it. Jimmie |
#40
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Eyeglass lens cleaner
In article , aemeijers wrote:
But how do you clean the microfiber cloth? And yes, this is a serious question- whenever I run one through the washer, it self-destructs. Buy a better microfiber cloth. I like the 3M electronics cloths. They cost about $5 each for a good size cloth -- I use them for delicates like cameras, LCD screens and a piano. I have 3 or 4 and the oldest one must have been through the washing machine several dozens of times and is still perfectly servicable. It's not torn, shredded, or frayed even a tiny bit. -- |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| | Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". | | Gary Player. | | http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. | ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
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