generator is honda gx390, 6600w / surge 8000, northerntool pro series 8000, unit has
total running hours under 30.

had it connected to load and suspect the ground post connection wire was not properly
connected to post at other end, ie. bad ground connection may have caused it to turn
off.

after running it on about 2000-2500w load for 30 minutes, lights flickered inside
couple times and then shut off, there were no motors running or starting at the time,
just couple inside lights, fridge, tv and radio, small a/c unit which uses only 1000w,
nothing else was running.

when I ran to the generator, could detect a faint electric burn odor and now suspect I
may have damaged the automatic voltage regulator.

it restarted fine (I did not reconnect to load) and I got 240/120 output voltage from
the connection plug but did not want to put it back on load for fear of making things
worse (?)

is the AVR easy to diagnose and replace? how sensitive are the hondas or generators in
having the proper ground post connection, if that was the cause of the shut down?

"Mark" wrote in message
m...
generator is honda gx390, 6600w / surge 8000, northerntool pro series
8000, unit has total running hours under 30.
First of all, it is apparently a Northerntool with a honda engine, not a
honda generator. Right?

On the three generators I have owned the ground is not connected to
anything, so the generator wouldn't much care about your ground connection.
I believe that is standard on consumer generator; OSHA requires industrial
generators to have the ground connected to the neutral. It should say what
you have on both the generator and the owners manual.
I can't see how a bad ground would affect you in either instance unless you
have a device that sends current to the ground rather then to the neutral;
which would be unusual.

And finally I read through the owner's manual. It doesn't say if the ground
is bonded, nor does it mention having AVR. Are you sure it even has it?
If the fridge and the A/C came on at the same time, that could easily have
caused it to stall.
Good luck.

On Jul 3, 6:03*pm, "Mark" wrote:
generator is honda gx390, 6600w / surge 8000, northerntool pro series 8000, unit has
total running hours under 30.

had it connected to load and suspect the ground post connection wire was not properly
connected to post at other end, ie. bad ground connection may have caused it to turn
off.

after running it on about 2000-2500w load for 30 minutes, lights flickered inside
couple times and then shut off, there were no motors running or starting at the time,
just couple inside lights, fridge, tv and radio, small a/c unit which uses only 1000w,
nothing else was running.

when I ran to the generator, could detect a faint electric burn odor and now suspect I
may have damaged the automatic voltage regulator.

it restarted fine (I did not reconnect to load) and I got 240/120 output voltage from
the connection plug but did not want to put it back on load for fear of making things
worse (?)

is the AVR easy to diagnose and replace? how sensitive are the hondas or generators in
having the proper ground post connection, if that was the cause of the shut down?

The Gen ground post , one on the unit you wire to a ground? is to
protect you incase its raining or it malfunctions and you go to shut
it off, I move mine while the unit runs, if it doesnt work it is
another issue, like defect.

Wade Lippman wrote:
First of all, it is apparently a Northerntool with a honda engine, not a
honda generator. Right?

right, northerntool pro 8000 with honda gx390

If the fridge and the A/C came on at the same time, that could easily have
caused it to stall.

you may be thinking of a conventional ac which this is not (inverter system with
variable speed everything, never exceeds 300 watts at startup, 3 amps)

oddly enough, when I've run it the 1st two weeks since new, ac and fridge have
repeatedly cycled and since ac is an inverter, it never causes a surge unlike
conventional systems, max amps well below 20 with all and generator rated above 30
amps

so everything that was running has stayed running previously (over 20 hours in one
continous run) and nothing of the sort occurred.

ransley wrote:
The Gen ground post , one on the unit you wire to a ground?

right, I mean the green covered "bolt" with the marking text "Grounding Post" and I've
understood reading the manual that I should always use a heavy gauge copper wire (ie.
14 gauge) and connect it to my 8-ft copper spike buried in the ground (2 ft above, 6
ft buried)

the other "end" of the wire had apparently come off the 2-ft top section and I suspect
could not discharge the powerhead properly while running (I am speculating as I don't
know what else may have caused it to shut down while running)

is to protect you incase its raining or it malfunctions and you go to shut
it off, I move mine while the unit runs, if it doesnt work it is
another issue, like defect.

sorry, don't quite understand what you write above. It was raining and the unit was
not moved while it was running.

On Jul 3, 7:31*pm, "Mark" wrote:
Wade Lippman wrote:
First of all, it is apparently a Northerntool with a honda engine, not a
honda *generator. *Right?

right, northerntool pro 8000 with honda gx390

If the fridge and the A/C came on at the same time, that could easily have
caused it to stall.

you may be thinking of a conventional ac which this is not (inverter system with
variable speed everything, never exceeds 300 watts at startup, 3 amps)

oddly enough, when I've run it the 1st two weeks since new, ac and fridge have
repeatedly cycled and since ac is an inverter, it never causes a surge unlike
conventional systems, max amps well below 20 with all and generator rated above 30
amps

so everything that was running has stayed running previously (over 20 hours in one
continous run) and nothing of the sort occurred.

How did you measure surge, with a digital meter that records the
peak?, ive seen new friges that use 100w pull 700w surge, and 300w
surge for AC sounds way to low. But its not honda so who knows who
made what as far as quality goes. Was the load balanced with a
transfer panel, how did you hook it up.

On Jul 3, 7:38*pm, "Mark" wrote:
ransley wrote:
The Gen ground post , one on the unit you wire to a ground?

right, I mean the green covered "bolt" with the marking text "Grounding Post" and I've
understood reading the manual that I should always use a heavy gauge copper wire (ie.
14 gauge) and connect it to my 8-ft copper spike buried in the ground (2 ft above, 6
ft buried)

the other "end" of the wire had apparently come off the 2-ft top section and I suspect
could not discharge the powerhead properly while running (I am speculating as I don't
know what else may have caused it to shut down while running)

is to protect you incase its raining or it malfunctions and you go to shut
it off, I move mine while the unit runs, if it doesnt work it is
another issue, like defect.

sorry, don't quite understand what you write above. *It was raining and the unit was
not moved while it was running.

You ran the unit in the rain! I hope it had a roof over it and did not
get wet. I mean that chassis ground is to protect you, not the gen,
units go bad or if its wet the operator can be killed if its not
grounded when the operator touches the generator. I just have my wire
attached to a piece of metal I throw on the ground, and i move it
while the unit runs.

ransley wrote:
You ran the unit in the rain! I hope it had a roof over it and did not
get wet. I mean that chassis ground is to protect you, not the gen,
units go bad or if its wet the operator can be killed

yes, the top of the unit has a kind of lid that protects all parts in such a way that
no water hits any electric parts and the powerhead is located under plastic fuel tank
so also protected from rain

ok, so the grounding wire is simply to protect me and unit would continue to run even
without proper ground wire, got it

not sure then why it decided to turn off this time as I had no new load starting when
this occurred, both fridge and ac were running steadily, not turning off and on when
it decided to flicker lights and shut off.

is there a simple way to diagnose what it will do under load to simulate the event
without actually connecting to house load?

ransley wrote:
How did you measure surge, with a digital meter that records the
peak?, ive seen new friges that use 100w pull 700w surge, and 300w
surge for AC sounds way to low.

the inverter ac definitely runs as I described and is rated 790w max and 7 amps as it
starts off (yes, compressor is inverter controlled also and fully variable speed, not
a two or three speed) very slowly and almost never draws more than 450w and 5 amps

fridge is fairly new but even granting that it may pull 700w, shouldn't a honda gx390
engine rated at 8000 watts, continuous 6600 watts easily handle this? it certainly has
in the first 20 hours of it's operation and it didn't even speed struggle when things
cycled on and off.

I also know the full load based on power company having connected a data logger when
running under utility power and we tested each circuit separately and multiple
circuits simultaneously. The logger recorded spikes just as they occurred within
thousands of a second fraction so am very confident of the total power draw of
everything that is running when I connect generator.

On Jul 3, 8:05*pm, "Mark" wrote:
ransley wrote:
You ran the unit in the rain! I hope it had a roof over it and did not
get wet. I mean that chassis ground is to protect you, not the gen,
units go bad or if its wet the operator can be killed

yes, the top of the unit has a kind of lid that protects all parts in such a way that
no water hits any electric parts and the powerhead is located under plastic fuel tank
so also protected from rain

ok, so the grounding wire is simply to protect me and unit would continue to run even
without proper ground wire, got it

not sure then why it decided to turn off this time as I had no new load starting when
this occurred, both fridge and ac were running steadily, not turning off and on when
it decided to flicker lights and shut off.

is there a simple way to diagnose what it will do under load to simulate the event
without actually connecting to house load?

I think you made a big mistake running it in the rain, read your
manual, its not rain-weather proof. Wet air is sucked through the gen
and motor to cool it and 100 humidity was in the panel. The ground rod
might have already have done its job and a direct short or malfunction
from rain might have actualy happened.

On Jul 3, 8:12*pm, "Mark" wrote:
ransley wrote:
How did you measure surge, with a digital meter that records the
peak?, ive seen new friges that use 100w pull 700w surge, and 300w
surge for AC sounds way to low.

the inverter ac definitely runs as I described and is rated 790w max and 7 amps as it
starts off (yes, compressor is inverter controlled also and fully variable speed, not
a two or three speed) very slowly and almost never draws more than 450w and 5 amps

fridge is fairly new but even granting that it may pull 700w, shouldn't a honda gx390
engine rated at 8000 watts, continuous 6600 watts easily handle this? it certainly has
in the first 20 hours of it's operation and it didn't even speed struggle when things
cycled on and off.

I also know the full load based on power company having connected a data logger when
running under utility power and we tested each circuit separately and multiple
circuits simultaneously. The logger recorded spikes just as they occurred within
thousands of a second fraction so am very confident of the total power draw of
everything that is running when I connect generator.

Unless you confirm the logger is designed for recording a spike you
might use a good handheld meter to verify it

Mark wrote:
ransley wrote:
How did you measure surge, with a digital meter that records the
peak?, ive seen new friges that use 100w pull 700w surge, and 300w
surge for AC sounds way to low.

the inverter ac definitely runs as I described and is rated 790w max and
7 amps as it starts off (yes, compressor is inverter controlled also and
fully variable speed, not a two or three speed) very slowly and almost
never draws more than 450w and 5 amps

fridge is fairly new but even granting that it may pull 700w, shouldn't
a honda gx390 engine rated at 8000 watts, continuous 6600 watts easily
handle this? it certainly has in the first 20 hours of it's operation
and it didn't even speed struggle when things cycled on and off.

I also know the full load based on power company having connected a data
logger when running under utility power and we tested each circuit
separately and multiple circuits simultaneously. The logger recorded
spikes just as they occurred within thousands of a second fraction so am
very confident of the total power draw of everything that is running
when I connect generator.
Hmmm,
Inverter running off AC? Conventionally inverter runs off DC for AC device.

Tony Hwang wrote:
Inverter running off AC? Conventionally inverter runs off DC for AC device.

the ac is a self-contained inverter system, built that way by japanese manufacturer.
when it starts, you can not hear any sound due to the superslow speed of compressor
which takes several minutes to reach running speed and it constantly varies it
according to sensors in the indoor blower computer board. even when running at full
speed it remains silent.

the inverter converts AC to DC and back to AC, thus apparently producing a best case
sine wave (what I've read from the manufacturer white papers)

is the AVR easy to diagnose and replace? how sensitive are the hondas or
generators in having the proper ground post connection, if that was the
cause of the shut down?

Most gensets have a low oil shutdown and is somewhat common to see this
activate several hours after initial startup.

On Jul 3, 8:23*pm, Abe wrote:
is there a simple way to diagnose what it will do under load to simulate the event
without actually connecting to house load?

I think you made a big mistake running it in the rain, read your
manual, its not rain-weather proof. *Wet air is sucked through the gen
and motor to cool it and 100 humidity was in the panel. The ground rod
might have already have done its job and a direct short or malfunction
from rain might have actualy happened.

Although you made some good commentary remarks, it seems that you
don't know of a way to diagnose this, which is the help the OP asked
for in the first place. In short, you should have just said, "no, I do
not know of a way to diagnose this, but here are some observations,
thoughts, etc...."

And...no, I do not know how to diagnose this problem either.

OP said it still runs and puts out voltage, actualy he doesnt know if
anything is wrong, I said he should try it, it could be simply low oil
or alot of other things IF it doesnt work right but he doesnt even
know, my 7500w unit says its not weatherproof, I would not want it
rained upon water goes most anywhere and this is air cooled with water
going anywhere it wants to. Its not weather sealed..

Mike Copeland wrote:
Most gensets have a low oil shutdown and is somewhat common to see this
activate several hours after initial startup.

the northstar 8000 PPG/ Honda 390GX had just been fully serviced 2 days prior, all new
oil, new battery etc.

it's this unit http://www.northerntool.com/download...als/165914.pdf

ransley wrote:
know, my 7500w unit says its not weatherproof, I would not want it
rained upon water goes most anywhere and this is air cooled with water
going anywhere it wants to. Its not weather sealed..

perhaps my mistake in describing it but it actually is totally weatherproof, that is,
there is not a drop of water possible to go anywhere on this unit, even in moderate
rain. in a hurricane, yes, but yesterdays rain was a mild one where one could easily
walk for short distance and get just one or two drops

so, don't think the shut down was due to weather

Wade Lippman wrote:
First of all, it is apparently a Northerntool with a honda engine, not a
honda generator. Right?

as previously replied, you are correct, northstar 8000 PPG with honda GX390, starter
motor and ignition key included.

am not familiar with how much of a distinguishing feature or how much it matters as to
who puts a label on the outside of the unit, so allow me to ask :

how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all have the
same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp

mine is this one http://www.northerntool.com/download...als/165914.pdf

"Mark" wrote in message
m...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp

GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator. Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.

That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.

Vaughn

"Mark" wrote in message
m...
ransley wrote:
You ran the unit in the rain! I hope it had a roof over it and did not
get wet. I mean that chassis ground is to protect you, not the gen,
units go bad or if its wet the operator can be killed

yes, the top of the unit has a kind of lid that protects all parts in such
a way that
no water hits any electric parts and the powerhead is located under
plastic fuel tank
so also protected from rain

ok, so the grounding wire is simply to protect me and unit would continue
to run even
without proper ground wire, got it

not sure then why it decided to turn off this time as I had no new load
starting when
this occurred, both fridge and ac were running steadily, not turning off
and on when
it decided to flicker lights and shut off.

is there a simple way to diagnose what it will do under load to simulate
the event
without actually connecting to house load?



I would gather up a bunch of blow dryers and electric heaters and add them
up until I got a resistive load about equal to the rated output of the
generator head being conscience of equaling distributing the load on both
legs of the output and see if it can produce the rated output. If you have
a Kill A Watt meter or something that to verify the loads that would be a
plus.

Check the oil level. Even if it was recently serviced that does not
necessarily mean the oil level is not low. If it is a slanted oil fill hole
fill it to where it is almost running out. You can temporarily disconnect
the low oil float switch to check for an intermittant problem. It is
usually a yellow wire.

Visually check for any wires (probably black) or connectors that might be
making contact with ground due to engine vibration.

Sometimes a bad On/Off switch can be intermittant. Most On/Off switches are
open while running and connected to ground to turn off the engine.
Disconnecting it temporarily (probably a black or brown wire) may help
locate an intermittant switch.

Remove the fuel line and check to see if it is flowing easily (use a
suitable container to catch the gas, of course). If not remove the fuel
filter (if it has one) at the tank shut-off valve and clean it. Honda
sometimes uses a filter screen inside the fuel line but probably not on the
GX engine.

Check the air filter.

Check the governor to make sure it is moving freely.

Check and regap the spark plug.

Sometimes a bad ingition module will start and run just fine and then
suddenly stop. Then it will start again.

If you do all this (what I call routine maintenance) and it stll has
problems remove the float bowl from the carburator and check to see if the
float is stuck. Sometimes there will be a little burr on the edges of the
float pivot that can be gently sanded off. There should be a screw near the
bottom of the float bowl for draining out the gas before taking if off.
Turn off the fuel supply first, of course.

Are you doing anything such as connecting this generator to an inverter such
as an OutBack or Xantrex SW?

Maybe the generator doesn't like your inverter AC. Does it work OK with
other comparable loads? None of my microwave ovens work well with any of my
generators. Neither do battery chargers.

Is this thing still under warranty?

Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
m...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp

GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator. Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.

That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.

Vaughn





I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda', but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some money.

--
aem sends...

On Jul 4, 3:21*pm, aemeijers wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
om...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp

* *GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator. *Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. *You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.

* *That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.

Vaughn

I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda', but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some money..

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

ransley wrote:
Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

the original poster referenced model northstar as sold by notherntool is selling for
around 1500 bucks, thought the homeowner grade models were less

Ulysses wrote:
I would gather up a bunch of blow dryers and electric heaters and add them
up until I got a resistive load about equal to the rated output of the
generator head being conscience of equaling distributing the load on both
legs of the output and see if it can produce the rated output. If you have
a Kill A Watt meter or something that to verify the loads that would be a
plus.

did what you suggest above.

noted my Kill a Watt has a max rated watts of 1850 (see reverse side) so it started
blinking the wattage display when it hit 2950, generator ran just fine

instead of plugging individual items into the 2-15amp-120v and 2-20amp-120v outlets, I
used a heavy duty cord with it's own trip breaker (it is also rated like the Kill A
Watt at 1850w) and once power went over 3000 watts, this cord's breaker (not
generator) tripped.

again, even at that, the generator was running just fine.

after running it on about 2000-2500w load for 30 minutes, lights flickered
inside couple times and then shut off, there were no motors running or
starting at the time, just couple inside lights, fridge, tv and radio,
small a/c unit which uses only 1000w, nothing else was running.

when I ran to the generator, could detect a faint electric burn odor and
now suspect I may have damaged the automatic voltage regulator.

I would most likely say that your generator just had a glob of water in the
gas tank. It got sucked into the carb and when the motor swallowed it, it
choked and died. Or a bit of dirt or varnish may have broke lose and
temporarily plugged a carb port. Or an ignition module may be flaky and it
quits when it get hot. Or it could be a valve that is sticking a bit because
of varnish buildup from disuse. Normally, when you have a direct short, it
will trip the breaker. A little bit of a burnt oil/electrical smell is
normal on a generator that new. It is just baking out the stuff from the
enamel on the coils.



If it puts out proper voltage, just run the dang thing. And run it hard.
That will get it cleaned out if it's a water or varnish problem. If it's a
ignition coil problem, or oil shut off problem it will become evident with a
little hard use.

If the varnish in the carb is really bad, the carb may have to be cleaned.

If it shuts off at a predictable point while warming up, then it's may be a
flaky ignition coil.

Also try disconnecting the low oil kill wire. Just because the oil is full,
doesn't mean that the switch isn't malfunctioning and killing the engine at
random.

And remember. Hard use, as in 5000W or more. Let the engine breath.

And above and beyond all, it could of just been a some water on the spark
plug. Yes, it has a plastic gas tank above it, but it is not water proof by
a long shot. That type of generator is not designed to be ran in the rain in
any way shape or form. In a good rain, that thing will be soaked.

So just run the dang thing and don't worry about it! :-)

"Mark" wrote in message
m...
Ulysses wrote:
I would gather up a bunch of blow dryers and electric heaters and add
them
up until I got a resistive load about equal to the rated output of the
generator head being conscience of equaling distributing the load on
both
legs of the output and see if it can produce the rated output. If you
have
a Kill A Watt meter or something that to verify the loads that would be
a
plus.

did what you suggest above.

noted my Kill a Watt has a max rated watts of 1850 (see reverse side) so
it started
blinking the wattage display when it hit 2950, generator ran just fine

instead of plugging individual items into the 2-15amp-120v and
2-20amp-120v outlets, I
used a heavy duty cord with it's own trip breaker (it is also rated like
the Kill A
Watt at 1850w) and once power went over 3000 watts, this cord's breaker
(not
generator) tripped.

again, even at that, the generator was running just fine.



Just so you realize that you have two seperate "legs" and each leg can
produce 3300 watts but neither can produce (much) more than that. It is
better to balance the loads on both legs.

Since you have a Kill A Watt I'd also check the output voltage and frequency
under a moderate load. I tend to adjust my 5000 watt generator to about 120
volts at about 1/2 load which gives me about 63 Hz. I find many appliances
run better at the slightly higher frequency mainly because the voltage is
higher (I think). Of course there may be some appliances that won't like
the frequency being that high and with no load it could run a bit too high
so you kinda have to check it a couple of times to make sure you aren't
going too far over. If your voltage is a bit low your AC might not like it.

"ransley" wrote in message
...
On Jul 4, 3:21 pm, aemeijers wrote:

Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

I've seen some GX engines used commercially with a lot of hours on them. My
understanding is that they were rated for about 3500 hours. There are at
least three oversize pistons available for the GX and once you bore it out
too much you can get a new cylinder or cylinder head and start over. There
is also at least one undersized piston rod available.

OTOH the GC series by Honda is an overhead cam affair and is pretty much
designed to be thrown away when it wears out. They do, however, seem to
last a long time.

I too have a piece of equipment (generator) with a Honda engine. Honda
engines are good and all but they have their problems too. In any case the
generator head ought to outlast several engines.

Ulysses wrote:
Just so you realize that you have two seperate "legs" and each leg can
produce 3300 watts but neither can produce (much) more than that. It is
better to balance the loads on both legs.

so connect two separate items to two separate 20amp outlets and try running 3000w on
both?

does the fact that I managed to run off one extension cord 2950w dispel my concern
that the voltage regulator may have damage or does it mean nothing since I produced it
from just one outlet connection?

the max output is rated at 8000w and running is rated at 6600w

Since you have a Kill A Watt I'd also check the output voltage and frequency
under a moderate load. I tend to adjust my 5000 watt generator to about 120
volts at about 1/2 load which gives me about 63 Hz. I find many appliances

not sure how this is done, please do post some details, if possible specific to the
honda gx390

going too far over. If your voltage is a bit low your AC might not like it.

if you read the original details, you will find the ac is an inverter system,
converting AC to DC to AC so it does not care what's being input as it conditions the
line internally to suit it's own needs - thus, it also has almost no jump in locked
rotor amps but starts off with just 1.5amps and very slowly ramps it up from there
over several minutes. it also uses max watts of about 700 but I have never seen it go
above 350w

"Mark" wrote in message
m...
not sure how this is done, please do post some details, if possible specific
to the honda gx390

I already explained to you, a Honda GX390 is a common industrial engine, not
a generator.
http://www.honda-engines.com/engines/gx390.htm

In other words: your off-brand generator just happens to have a pretty nice
Honda GX390 engine.

Vaughn

On Jul 7, 8:22*am, "Mark" wrote:
Ulysses wrote:
Just so you realize that you have two seperate "legs" and each leg can
produce 3300 watts but neither can produce (much) more than that. *It is
better to balance the loads on both legs.

so connect two separate items to two separate 20amp outlets and try running 3000w on
both?

does the fact that I managed to run off one extension cord 2950w dispel my concern
that the voltage regulator may have damage or does it mean nothing since I produced it
from just one outlet connection?

the max output is rated at 8000w and running is rated at 6600w

Since you have a Kill A Watt I'd also check the output voltage and frequency
under a moderate load. *I tend to adjust my 5000 watt generator to about 120
volts at about 1/2 load which gives me about 63 Hz. *I find many appliances

not sure how this is done, please do post some details, if possible specific to the
honda gx390

going too far over. *If your voltage is a bit low your AC might not like it.

if you read the original details, you will find the ac is an inverter system,
converting AC to DC to AC so it does not care what's being input as it conditions the
line internally to suit it's own needs - thus, it also has almost no jump in locked
rotor amps but starts off with just 1.5amps and very slowly ramps it up from there
over several minutes. it also uses max watts of about 700 but I have never seen it go
above 350w

You now measure 120v that is no load? if so its at 3600 rpm. at the
3000w produced check voltage, even with avr its still likely 115v,
your AC may be fine at 115 but it does have an input range, I set my
unit above 120 to allow for load drawdown. How good yours controls
voltage only you cant test it from no load to full load. Whether 3000w
you use is off one leg or split from 220 call Northern. I would run it
and test it, having a low oil level sensor shut you down is common.

In alt.energy.homepower ransley wrote:
On Jul 4, 3:21?pm, aemeijers wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
om...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp

? ?GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator. ?Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. ?You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.

? ?That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.

Vaughn

I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda', but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some money.

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

GX IS the commercial grade. There is a more junior series of engines, but
they're called something other than GX.

ransley wrote:
You now measure 120v that is no load?

mark did not write anything about 120v but it was in reply to something
ulysses "see the " wrote

the northstar (as sold by notherntool) pro series have no voltage regulator
and have no low oil shutdown.

the voltage and Hz is controlled by capacitors and engine speed. idle
voltage is around 125 and decreases at full load/full engine speed to just
about 108-112v

"Mark" wrote in message
m...
Ulysses wrote:
Just so you realize that you have two seperate "legs" and each leg can
produce 3300 watts but neither can produce (much) more than that. It is
better to balance the loads on both legs.

so connect two separate items to two separate 20amp outlets and try
running 3000w on
both?

does the fact that I managed to run off one extension cord 2950w dispel my
concern
that the voltage regulator may have damage or does it mean nothing since I
produced it
from just one outlet connection?

Well, if you can get that much power from each leg individually then you are
probably in good shape.


the max output is rated at 8000w and running is rated at 6600w

Since you have a Kill A Watt I'd also check the output voltage and
frequency
under a moderate load. I tend to adjust my 5000 watt generator to about
120
volts at about 1/2 load which gives me about 63 Hz. I find many
appliances

not sure how this is done, please do post some details, if possible
specific to the
honda gx390

I'm not sure how it's done either. Since you have some kind of electronic
voltage regulator it's different from having an alternator (generator head)
that is designed to run at 60 Hz at 3600 rpm and can output higher voltage
by increasing the engine speed. Increasing the engine speed also increases
the frequency. Perhaps yours cannot be adjusted. I am so used to using the
speed control type that I overlooked your voltage regulator. In any case
you can still check the output voltage and frequency and see if it looks OK.
Generally, from what I've read, most appliances will accept frequency
variations within about 2% so that would be about 58.8 Hz to 61.2 Hz.
However, I have found 63 Hz to be OK with most things. That is my personal
experience so your gadgets may differ. If you find that your voltage is
lower than, say, about 117 VAC and your frequency less than 58.8 Hz then I
would have the voltage regualtor checked.


going too far over. If your voltage is a bit low your AC might not like
it.

if you read the original details, you will find the ac is an inverter
system,
converting AC to DC to AC so it does not care what's being input as it
conditions the
line internally to suit it's own needs - thus, it also has almost no jump
in locked
rotor amps but starts off with just 1.5amps and very slowly ramps it up
from there
over several minutes. it also uses max watts of about 700 but I have never
seen it go
above 350w


Most likely the inverter will be either on or off. If the DC input is too
low it probably will not come on at all. But inverters can be tricky. I
have a Honda eu2000 inverter generator with a worn-out engine. It will
start up and come on and output AC but it does not have full power because
the engine cannot deliver the full power. If your output voltage from your
generator is low then the air conditioner's inverter might not be able to
draw enough power to run properly. This all seems very unlikely because of
the size of your generator if you are only running the Air Conditioner. If
you have all of your appliances running from one leg of your generator then
you could simply be overloading it. You seem to have determined that the
generator has adequate output. How is it wired to your house or whatever?
Do you have each seperate leg of the generator connected to a seperate leg
on the house wiring? Are you balancing your loads by having the
refrigerator on one leg and the air conditioner on another?

On Jul 7, 11:40*am, "Ulysses" / wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message

m...

Ulysses wrote:
Just so you realize that you have two seperate "legs" and each leg can
produce 3300 watts but neither can produce (much) more than that. *It is
better to balance the loads on both legs.

so connect two separate items to two separate 20amp outlets and try
running 3000w on
both?

does the fact that I managed to run off one extension cord 2950w dispel my
concern
that the voltage regulator may have damage or does it mean nothing since I
produced it
from just one outlet connection?

Well, if you can get that much power from each leg individually then you are
probably in good shape.





the max output is rated at 8000w and running is rated at 6600w

Since you have a Kill A Watt I'd also check the output voltage and
frequency
under a moderate load. *I tend to adjust my 5000 watt generator to about
120
volts at about 1/2 load which gives me about 63 Hz. *I find many
appliances

not sure how this is done, please do post some details, if possible
specific to the
honda gx390

I'm not sure how it's done either. *Since you have some kind of electronic
voltage regulator it's different from having an alternator (generator head)
that is designed to run at 60 Hz at 3600 rpm and can output higher voltage
by increasing the engine speed. *Increasing the engine speed also increases
the frequency. *Perhaps yours cannot be adjusted. *I am so used to using the
speed control type that I overlooked your voltage regulator. *In any case
you can still check the output voltage and frequency and see if it looks OK.
Generally, from what I've read, most appliances will accept frequency
variations within about 2% so that would be about 58.8 Hz to 61.2 Hz.
However, I have found 63 Hz to be OK with most things. *That is my personal
experience so your gadgets may differ. *If you find that your voltage is
lower than, say, about 117 VAC and your frequency less than 58.8 Hz then I
would have the voltage regualtor checked.









going too far over. *If your voltage is a bit low your AC might not like
it.

if you read the original details, you will find the ac is an inverter
system,
converting AC to DC to AC so it does not care what's being input as it
conditions the
line internally to suit it's own needs - thus, it also has almost no jump
in locked
rotor amps but starts off with just 1.5amps and very slowly ramps it up
from there
over several minutes. it also uses max watts of about 700 but I have never
seen it go
above 350w

Most likely the inverter will be either on or off. *If the DC input is too
low it probably will not come on at all. *But inverters can be tricky. *I
have a Honda eu2000 inverter generator with a worn-out engine. *It will
start up and come on and output AC but it does not have full power because
the engine cannot deliver the full power. *If your output voltage from your
generator is low then the air conditioner's inverter might not be able to
draw enough power to run properly. *This all seems very unlikely because of
the size of your generator if you are only running the Air Conditioner. *If
you have all of your appliances running from one leg of your generator then
you could simply be overloading it. *You seem to have determined that the
generator has adequate output. *How is it wired to your house or whatever?
Do you have each seperate leg of the generator connected to a seperate leg
on the house wiring? *Are you balancing your loads by having the
refrigerator on one leg and the air conditioner on another?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

At that price of his unit I dought his unit has anything special in
voltage regulation that will do any better than keeping it at less
than 5-6v swing, my 7500 Generac with avr is that way. He still needs
to manualy make a set point based on load used. 3600 rpm is still
60hz, and varies with rpm. Im sure an adjustment to rpm is easy to
do.

Cydrome Leader wrote:
In alt.energy.homepower ransley wrote:
On Jul 4, 3:21?pm, aemeijers wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
m...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp
? ?GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator. ?Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. ?You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.
? ?That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.
Vaughn
I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda', but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some money.

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

GX IS the commercial grade. There is a more junior series of engines, but
they're called something other than GX.

Y'all got me curious enough to dig out the manuals for my 'power by
Honda' MTD push mower. The engine is a GCV190.

GoogleGoogleGoogle

It does appear to be their 'residential' grade, not the commercial one.
But it is shown as being the same one used as in their own expen$ive
Honda-branded mowers. At 3 hours per mowing cycle, and 20? mowings per
year, it already has at least 180 hours on it. It damn well better last
more than 300 hours without a major rebuild. No signs of smoking or hard
starting so far, knock on sheet metal.

--
aem sends...

In alt.energy.homepower aemeijers wrote:
Cydrome Leader wrote:
In alt.energy.homepower ransley wrote:
On Jul 4, 3:21?pm, aemeijers wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
m...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp
? ?GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator. ?Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. ?You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.
? ?That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.
Vaughn
I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda', but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some money.

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

GX IS the commercial grade. There is a more junior series of engines, but
they're called something other than GX.

Y'all got me curious enough to dig out the manuals for my 'power by
Honda' MTD push mower. The engine is a GCV190.

GoogleGoogleGoogle

It does appear to be their 'residential' grade, not the commercial one.
But it is shown as being the same one used as in their own expen$ive
Honda-branded mowers. At 3 hours per mowing cycle, and 20? mowings per
year, it already has at least 180 hours on it. It damn well better last
more than 300 hours without a major rebuild. No signs of smoking or hard
starting so far, knock on sheet metal.

This is the "best" description of the two series of engines I can find

http://www.perr.com/honda.html

One's tougher, one's quieter? who knows.

"aemeijers" wrote in message
...
Cydrome Leader wrote:
In alt.energy.homepower ransley wrote:
On Jul 4, 3:21?pm, aemeijers wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
m...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear
to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp
? ?GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator.
?Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's
generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. ?You
do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens
to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.
? ?That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought
at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.
Vaughn
I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda',
but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some
money.

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

GX IS the commercial grade. There is a more junior series of engines,
but
they're called something other than GX.

Y'all got me curious enough to dig out the manuals for my 'power by
Honda' MTD push mower. The engine is a GCV190.

GoogleGoogleGoogle

It does appear to be their 'residential' grade, not the commercial one.
But it is shown as being the same one used as in their own expen$ive
Honda-branded mowers. At 3 hours per mowing cycle, and 20? mowings per
year, it already has at least 180 hours on it. It damn well better last
more than 300 hours without a major rebuild. No signs of smoking or hard
starting so far, knock on sheet metal.

That's not even broken in yet ;-) I've had a Honda GC engine last for
about 12,000 hours with regular oil changes and a few valve adjustments etc.
Another one lasted about 7200 hours. These were both on eu2000 generators
with Eco Throttle so they were seldom running at full RPM.

3 hours per mowing cycle? That's a LOT of grass. I think most people
probably run their mowers only 15-20 minutes per week and maybe 25 weeks a
year. At that rate the cheapest B&S rated for only 300 hours could last
well over 30 years.

For the record, Honda told me that the engine for the eu2000 is a GX100.
The GX engines are usually overhead valve types with pushrods. The GC
engines are overhead cam types with a timing belt and cam. The eu2000
engine has "GCxxxxxxx" stamped on the side and has a drive belt and cam so I
don't see how they can say it's a GX.


--
aem sends...

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...

It does appear to be their 'residential' grade, not the commercial one.
But it is shown as being the same one used as in their own expen$ive
Honda-branded mowers. At 3 hours per mowing cycle, and 20? mowings per
year, it already has at least 180 hours on it. It damn well better last
more than 300 hours without a major rebuild. No signs of smoking or hard
starting so far, knock on sheet metal.

This is the "best" description of the two series of engines I can find

http://www.perr.com/honda.html

One's tougher, one's quieter? who knows.

That's a good description but it still leaves me wondering how an engine
gets to be called GX instead of GC. They are also saying that there is a 3
HP GX100 that is included in the GX series and that it has an overhead cam
and uniblock construction which fits into the GC definition but not the GX..

On Jul 7, 6:08*pm, aemeijers wrote:
Cydrome Leader wrote:
In alt.energy.homepower ransley wrote:
On Jul 4, 3:21?pm, aemeijers wrote:
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Mark" wrote in message
news:H7Cdnb8fuN0oifPVnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@earthlin k.com...
how does a honda GX390 differ from one label to another? they appear to all
have the same 13hp, 6600w-8000w (max) power, 30amp
? ?GX390 is the model number of the engine, not the entire generator.. ?Sombody
(probably somebody in China) mated that Honda engine to a sombody's generator
and added the frame and other parts to make the entire package. ?You do not have
a Honda generator unit, you have an off-brand generator that happens to sport a
common Honda industrial engine.
? ?That is not necessarily a bad thing, my pressure cleaner (bought at HD) is
the same deal and seems to be just fine.
Vaughn
I'll second that- my lawn mower is an off-brand 'Powered by Honda', but
it is not a Honda lawnmower. A genuine Honda lawnmower would have cost
$700, this one cost $325 or so. Engine has held up great with spotty
maintenance and regular abuse. Since there isn't a whole lot else to
break on a lawnmower, I figured I would take the risk and save some money.

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
Honda is a good motor, but until recently they only made a commercial
unit good for 2-4000 hrs. The GX might be the new homeowner grade,
good for maybe 300-800 hours.

GX IS the commercial grade. There is a more junior series of engines, but
they're called something other than GX.

Y'all got me curious enough to dig out the manuals for my 'power by
Honda' MTD push mower. The engine is a GCV190.

GoogleGoogleGoogle

It does appear to be their 'residential' grade, not the commercial one.
But it is shown as being the same one used as in their own expen$ive
Honda-branded mowers. At 3 hours per mowing cycle, and 20? mowings per
year, it already has at least 180 hours on it. It damn well better last
more than 300 hours without a major rebuild. No signs of smoking or hard
starting so far, knock on sheet metal.

--
aem sends...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I read about it, its a different design with internal belt, knowing
Honda its good for a long long time.

On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:08:56 GMT, aemeijers wrote:


GX IS the commercial grade. There is a more junior series of engines, but
they're called something other than GX.

Y'all got me curious enough to dig out the manuals for my 'power by
Honda' MTD push mower. The engine is a GCV190.

GoogleGoogleGoogle

It does appear to be their 'residential' grade, not the commercial one.
But it is shown as being the same one used as in their own expen$ive
Honda-branded mowers. At 3 hours per mowing cycle, and 20? mowings per
year, it already has at least 180 hours on it. It damn well better last
more than 300 hours without a major rebuild. No signs of smoking or hard
starting so far, knock on sheet metal.

Their GX line is indeed their commercial grade engine. The GC is the
dispose-a-motor. That is not to say that it is a low quality engine. I have
well in excess of 1000 hours on my CBC

http://www.neon-john.com/Generator/CBC/CBC_home.htm

And it still doesn't use a drop of Mobil-1 oil. I used to know the life specs
for both lines but I'd be afraid to quote anything from memory now.

From a maintenance perspective, the major difference is, once the GC wears
out, you throw it away. Since the whole engine is probably cheaper than a
rebuild kit for a GX of the same HP, no big deal.

The GC has several features of its own. Major among them are weight and
noise. The engine is very light weight compared to the GX counterpart. The
overhead cam with the timing belt drive is very quiet compared to the
cam-in-case design of the GX that uses pushrods. Noise, or lack thereof, was
a major consideration, as I originally designed this CBC for use in charging
my RV's batteries. Noise in a camp ground isn't very welcome.

The GC is good enough for anything a homeowner, small farmer or even casual
businessman (second job, that kind of stuff) will do. It'll probably out-last
whatever it's driving.

John
--
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.johndearmond.com -- best little blog on the net!
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
WARNING: Do not use this hair dryer in the shower!