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#1
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Screwgun Recommendation
I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except
that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. |
#2
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Mike Dobony" wrote in message ... I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Good luck registering the Ridgid. Ridgid refused mine because the HD receipt wasn't adequate. Don't know what the hell they wanted as I chose not to fight this one. |
#3
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Screwgun Recommendation
I have one of the great Skil's too if we are talking the same model. It is
automatic locking so when you don't give it power it locks the front automatically and you can use it as manual screwdriver. Too bad the batteries are so expensive and don't last. "Mike Dobony" wrote in message ... I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. |
#4
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Screwgun Recommendation
Mike Dobony wrote: I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. Check out the Senco Duraspin line on Amazon.com. The box store types aren't in the same ballpark. A Senco will probably last you many times longer than the cheapoes and their service and parts are great. And they come with a no hassle warranty. HTH Joe |
#7
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Art" wrote in message ink.net... I have one of the great Skil's too if we are talking the same model. It is automatic locking so when you don't give it power it locks the front automatically and you can use it as manual screwdriver. Too bad the batteries are so expensive and don't last. No, we are not talking about the same model. Mine is a professional screwgun for screwing in drywall and decking. "Mike Dobony" wrote in message ... I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. |
#8
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Joe" wrote in message oups.com... Mike Dobony wrote: I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. Check out the Senco Duraspin line on Amazon.com. The box store types aren't in the same ballpark. A Senco will probably last you many times longer than the cheapoes and their service and parts are great. And they come with a no hassle warranty. HTH Joe I don't see any that use uncollated screws. The collated screws are VERY expensive compared to the loose screws and do not have the variety of styles and sizes available in loose boxed screws (trim screws for instance or pan head). |
#9
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Screwgun Recommendation
If you really like the Skil brand gun you have, try here for the
part: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/noframes.cgi/skil/6906_TYPE_2 -- ______________________________ Keep the whole world singing . . . . DanG (remove the sevens) "Mike Dobony" wrote in message ... I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. |
#10
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Screwgun Recommendation
"DanG" wrote in message ... If you really like the Skil brand gun you have, try here for the part: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/noframes.cgi/skil/6906_TYPE_2 That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. -- ______________________________ Keep the whole world singing . . . . DanG (remove the sevens) "Mike Dobony" wrote in message ... I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. |
#11
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Screwgun Recommendation
On Sun, 29 Apr 2007 14:03:47 GMT, "Mike Dobony"
wrote: "DanG" wrote in message ... If you really like the Skil brand gun you have, try here for the part: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/noframes.cgi/skil/6906_TYPE_2 That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? I think they have metal lathes! I bumped into a machine shop around here and auto parts stores have names, and the yellow pages. -- ______________________________ Keep the whole world singing . . . . DanG (remove the sevens) "Mike Dobony" wrote in message ... I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Unfortunately Skil no longer makes any screwgun and needless to say they do not have any parts available for this screwgun. I am therefore looking for a new gun. Harbor Freight's gun looks exactly like the DeWalt screwgun and at $39.99 is tempting to get with the 2 year extended warranty (I overheard some pros talking about buying the HF roofing guns and extended warranty and getting new ones all the time on HF). My other tempting option is a Ridgid R6000 from Home Depot because when I register it I can get a lifetime warranty (VERY tempting). Anybody have any experience with either of these? Thanks. Mike D. |
#12
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Screwgun Recommendation
"mm" wrote in message ... On Sun, 29 Apr 2007 14:03:47 GMT, "Mike Dobony" wrote: "DanG" wrote in message ... If you really like the Skil brand gun you have, try here for the part: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/noframes.cgi/skil/6906_TYPE_2 That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? I think they have metal lathes! I bumped into a machine shop around here and auto parts stores have names, and the yellow pages. Finding a reputable one who will do a small job like this and not charge half the price of a new gun is difficult. The charge for setup is more than the cost of the machining. What I need to find is more of a hobbist, not a business. |
#13
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Screwgun Recommendation
Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? Not if they can get away with out If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? I have a 1/4 million in capital equipment, how much should I charge? Seriously, unless you have a friend....... I think they have metal lathes! I bumped into a machine shop around here and auto parts stores have names, and the yellow pages. -- ______________________________ |
#14
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Screwgun Recommendation
According to Mike Dobony :
"DanG" wrote in message ... If you really like the Skil brand gun you have, try here for the part: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/noframes.cgi/skil/6906_TYPE_2 That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Something like that you can probably do while holding the bit in a drill against a grinding wheel and go slowly, dip the end in water frequently. In other cases, you might be able to drive the shank out of the body far enough to work using a flat end punch and a decent hammer. If it falls out, glue it back in with epoxy. Aha - look half way down http://www.wihatools.com/700_BitHolders.htm there you go. -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#15
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Screwgun Recommendation
On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 13:53:41 GMT, yourname wrote:
Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? Not if they can get away with out So, the OP should go there and only be willing to pay a reasonable price, and see if they'll do it. You don't get anywhere if you don't ask. He had sense enough to ask this ng for ideas. He should ask a mahcine shop guy. If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? This was partly rhetorical. A guy who isn't busy or wants to be a nice guy will charge what he thinks it is worth to the customer if he won't feel put upon doing so. I have a 1/4 million in capital equipment, how much should I charge? Welll you shouldn't charge 10,000 dollars. You can't expect to make a year's interest in 10 or 20 minutes. Seriously, unless you have a friend....... If you have all this machinery, you don't go to other machine shops and you only know how much you would charge. I've always assumed that things I never bought before cost a lot of money, and I'm often wrong. This included foam rubber, lucite, and welding. The welding guys have thousands of dollars of equipement and a whole shop they own or rent and both of them wanted very little to do a welding job that took at least 20 minutes when one did it. (I priced the welding at one shop next to the place I expected to order the part, but when the time came had it done near where I live.) I think they have metal lathes! I bumped into a machine shop around here and auto parts stores have names, and the yellow pages. -- ______________________________ |
#16
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Chris Lewis" wrote in message ... According to Mike Dobony : "DanG" wrote in message ... If you really like the Skil brand gun you have, try here for the part: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/noframes.cgi/skil/6906_TYPE_2 That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Something like that you can probably do while holding the bit in a drill against a grinding wheel and go slowly, dip the end in water frequently. If you can get a piece of hardened rod down .070+-.005 on the full length of 0.650" on such a setup AND keep it round you are a master machinist! And NOT water, but cutting oil or coolant, NEVER water! You are NOT a master machinist! In other cases, you might be able to drive the shank out of the body far enough to work using a flat end punch and a decent hammer. If it falls out, glue it back in with epoxy. The wall is too thin on that type of bit holder. It must be a single piece of metal to be able to machine it to those dimensions and still last. Aha - look half way down http://www.wihatools.com/700_BitHolders.htm There I am with the same thing as the DeWalt, PLUS shipping and handling! From the picture I can tell that the diameter is too large! there you go. -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#17
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Screwgun Recommendation
"mm" wrote in message ... On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 13:53:41 GMT, yourname wrote: Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? Not if they can get away with out So, the OP should go there and only be willing to pay a reasonable price, and see if they'll do it. You don't get anywhere if you don't ask. He had sense enough to ask this ng for ideas. He should ask a mahcine shop guy. I WORKED in a machine shop. A friend is the only option until I have the space and extra money to set up my own hobby machine shop. The lathe in question for the smallest size that would do this job, but not other wished-for projects is about $700 unless I can find one in an estate sale. If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? This was partly rhetorical. A guy who isn't busy or wants to be a nice guy will charge what he thinks it is worth to the customer if he won't feel put upon doing so. I have a 1/4 million in capital equipment, how much should I charge? Welll you shouldn't charge 10,000 dollars. You can't expect to make a year's interest in 10 or 20 minutes. Seriously, unless you have a friend....... If you have all this machinery, you don't go to other machine shops and you only know how much you would charge. I've always assumed that things I never bought before cost a lot of money, and I'm often wrong. This included foam rubber, lucite, and welding. The welding guys have thousands of dollars of equipement and a whole shop they own or rent and both of them wanted very little to do a welding job that took at least 20 minutes when one did it. (I priced the welding at one shop next to the place I expected to order the part, but when the time came had it done near where I live.) I think they have metal lathes! I bumped into a machine shop around here and auto parts stores have names, and the yellow pages. -- ______________________________ |
#18
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Screwgun Recommendation
Mike Dobony wrote:
I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Do you want torque adjustment or depth adjustment? Milwaukee makes both. Chris |
#19
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Chris Friesen" wrote in message ... Mike Dobony wrote: I have an old, but great condition Skil Screwgun model 6906. Great except that the bit holder no longer holds the bit in place. Do you want torque adjustment or depth adjustment? Milwaukee makes both. Chris Depth adjust. I didn't have time to mess with this and needed it right away so I went ahead and bought the Ridgid. |
#20
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Mike Dobony" wrote in message t... "mm" wrote in message ... On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 13:53:41 GMT, yourname wrote: Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? Not if they can get away with out So, the OP should go there and only be willing to pay a reasonable price, and see if they'll do it. You don't get anywhere if you don't ask. He had sense enough to ask this ng for ideas. He should ask a mahcine shop guy. I WORKED in a machine shop. A friend is the only option until I have the space and extra money to set up my own hobby machine shop. The lathe in question for the smallest size that would do this job, but not other wished-for projects is about $700 unless I can find one in an estate sale. Also, when should I ask the machine shop guy? When I loose the price of the gun anyway by taking off work to locate a machine shop that would do this for a reasonable price? I DON'T have any vacation time. I also need it by today, by this morning! Therefore I bought the Ridgid yesterday because of the low torque of the Harbor Freight gun. Mike D. |
#21
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Screwgun Recommendation
According to Mike Dobony :
"Chris Lewis" wrote in message Something like that you can probably do while holding the bit in a drill against a grinding wheel and go slowly, dip the end in water frequently. If you can get a piece of hardened rod down .070+-.005 on the full length of 0.650" on such a setup AND keep it round you are a master machinist! And NOT water, but cutting oil or coolant, NEVER water! You are NOT a master machinist! If you're using a grinder, water is just fine. The idea is to keep it cool. Aha - look half way down http://www.wihatools.com/700_BitHolders.htm There I am with the same thing as the DeWalt, PLUS shipping and handling! From the picture I can tell that the diameter is too large! Uh, no, take a look at the shank lengths. It's 1/4" hex stock, _not_ the outer diameter. #71433 would have probably done you, #71435 definately would. -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#22
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Screwgun Recommendation
On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 12:09:01 GMT, "Mike Dobony"
wrote: That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? If all you need is a bit like the Harbor Freight one referenced, I will do that for you. How many do you want done? NO charge. You pay freight. Email me off line and we will work it out. camperkn at yahoo dot com |
#23
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Camperken" wrote in message . .. On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 12:09:01 GMT, "Mike Dobony" wrote: That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? If all you need is a bit like the Harbor Freight one referenced, I will do that for you. How many do you want done? ???????????????? Harbor Freight does NOT have the bit I need. I was asking about the screwgun they have. NO charge. You pay freight. Email me off line and we will work it out. camperkn at yahoo dot com |
#24
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Screwgun Recommendation
"Chris Lewis" wrote in message ... According to Mike Dobony : "Chris Lewis" wrote in message Something like that you can probably do while holding the bit in a drill against a grinding wheel and go slowly, dip the end in water frequently. If you can get a piece of hardened rod down .070+-.005 on the full length of 0.650" on such a setup AND keep it round you are a master machinist! And NOT water, but cutting oil or coolant, NEVER water! You are NOT a master machinist! If you're using a grinder, water is just fine. The idea is to keep it cool. You are no machinist. The water does more than keep it cool. It needs a lubricant and the water does not do a very good job of lubrication. Oil or coolant keeps the part from becoming brittle. Aha - look half way down http://www.wihatools.com/700_BitHolders.htm There I am with the same thing as the DeWalt, PLUS shipping and handling! From the picture I can tell that the diameter is too large! Uh, no, take a look at the shank lengths. It's 1/4" hex stock, _not_ the outer diameter. #71433 would have probably done you, #71435 definately would. -- I am not talking about the hex part, but the cylindrical part that the bit sits in. The diameter is too large. The OUTER diameter is why I can't use the DeWalt bit holder. The OUTER diameter needs to be turned down ABOVE the hex. |
#25
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Screwgun Recommendation
On Tue, 1 May 2007 16:37:37 -0500, "Mike Dobony"
wrote: "Camperken" wrote in message ... On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 12:09:01 GMT, "Mike Dobony" wrote: That has every part of the gun EXCEPT the specialized tool holder. If I had a metal lathe and carbide cutting tip I could turn down the shaft of a DeWalt bit holder (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h4639) and make it work. The problem is that the seal at the end of the drill portion is smaller than a standard tool holder. Just above the hex shank I need the holder turned down from about 0.450" to 0.370" for about 0.650", a simple operation IF I had a metal lathe. I can find lots of bit holders that are the right length, but they are too thick to fit in the gun. Don't machine shops do that sort of thing for people who hire them? If it is really just one setup and one operation, how much would they charge? If all you need is a bit like the Harbor Freight one referenced, I will do that for you. How many do you want done? ???????????????? Harbor Freight does NOT have the bit I need. I was asking about the screwgun they have. My mistake. The machining offer stands. Email me off line and we will work it out. camperkn at yahoo dot com |
#26
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Screwgun Recommendation
According to Mike Dobony :
"Chris Lewis" wrote in message ... According to Mike Dobony : "Chris Lewis" wrote in message Something like that you can probably do while holding the bit in a drill against a grinding wheel and go slowly, dip the end in water frequently. If you can get a piece of hardened rod down .070+-.005 on the full length of 0.650" on such a setup AND keep it round you are a master machinist! And NOT water, but cutting oil or coolant, NEVER water! You are NOT a master machinist! If you're using a grinder, water is just fine. The idea is to keep it cool. You are no machinist. The water does more than keep it cool. It needs a lubricant and the water does not do a very good job of lubrication. Oil or coolant keeps the part from becoming brittle. Aha - look half way down http://www.wihatools.com/700_BitHolders.htm There I am with the same thing as the DeWalt, PLUS shipping and handling! From the picture I can tell that the diameter is too large! Uh, no, take a look at the shank lengths. It's 1/4" hex stock, _not_ the outer diameter. #71433 would have probably done you, #71435 definately would. -- I am not talking about the hex part, but the cylindrical part that the bit sits in. The diameter is too large. The OUTER diameter is why I can't use the DeWalt bit holder. The OUTER diameter needs to be turned down ABOVE the hex. Maybe I'm missing something, but if the hex is long enough to clear the housing entirely, why do you care how big the outer diameter is? -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#27
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Screwgun Recommendation
Mike Dobony wrote:
"Chris Lewis" wrote... If you're using a grinder, water is just fine. The idea is to keep it cool. You are no machinist. The water does more than keep it cool. It needs a lubricant and the water does not do a very good job of lubrication. Oil or coolant keeps the part from becoming brittle. I can picture how cooling would prevent brittleness. I can't imagine how lubrication could prevent brittleness. -- Postulate a God who's so smart He designed things we won't discover for the next ten years, but who's so incredibly stupid He couldn't think up the theory of evolution. Duhhhhhhhh. "Damn, Darwin, what a great idea!" |
#28
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Screwgun Recommendation
According to clifto :
Mike Dobony wrote: "Chris Lewis" wrote... If you're using a grinder, water is just fine. The idea is to keep it cool. You are no machinist. The water does more than keep it cool. It needs a lubricant and the water does not do a very good job of lubrication. Oil or coolant keeps the part from becoming brittle. I can picture how cooling would prevent brittleness. I can't imagine how lubrication could prevent brittleness. Mike's gotten confused. You don't use lubricants with grinding wheels. Grinding wheels should be used on dry metal, they rely on both the abrasion and instantaneous melting (the sparks) to cut. With hardened steel or carbide, the melting does more of the cutting than the abrasion does. If you're sharpening a chisel on a grinder, you'll often need to keep a cup of water around. The idea being that you need to keep the edge of the blade from getting too hot ("burning") by periodically dipping the chisel in the water. If it gets too hot, the hardened steel of the blade detempers and gets soft - you end up softening the chisel so it won't keep an edge. You either have to regrind the chisel to remove the softened spot, retemper it, toss it out, or retire it to opening paint cans and chopping thru nails. Note with high speed grinders (eg: dremels, bench grinders) you _don't_ put the coolant on the wheel. You periodically cool the work by dipping it. My idea was to use a grinder to turn down part of the body of a hex bit holder because he didn't have access to a metal lathe. Yes, it's quite tricky, but it can be done - eg: by placing the hex bit holder into a drill, starting the drill, and holding it against a bench grinder wheel. The grinder will heat up the bit holder. Periodic dipping in water will prevent it getting too hot. Softening it isn't likely a big problem, but causing it to get too hot might loosen it on the hex shank. If you use a lubricant on a grinding wheel, at best you'll slow its cutting down. More likely, you'll foul the wheel, spray gooey gunk all over the place, and perhaps start a fire (depending on what the lubricant is). When you're cutting metal with edged tools (eg: lathe or milling machine), the metal is being cut, not melted. The cutting tool is going _much_ slower. Depending on the material, depth of cut, etc, sometimes you need a lubricant to prevent the metal or tool bit from overheating and detempering/burning. Lubricants do dual function - by lubricating the cutting action, they reduce heat production. They also provide a direct cooling function by transferring what heat is produced away from the work. You may not be able to turn down the body of a hex bit holder on a lathe using regular tool bits. The body is hardened at least somewhat (otherwise it'd simply break in use), and many will simply be too hard to cut with regular lathe bits (perhaps only with carbide bits). If a hacksaw or file won't cut it, you'll have a real problem with a lathe. Generally speaking, once metal is hard enough that a hacksaw or file won't cut it, only a grinding wheel will touch it. And BTW: different materials use different lubricant/coolants. IIRC, cast iron works well with straight water. Steel is most often done with Dromus, which is bought as a concentrate and diluted 10:1 with water before use. [I'd have to pull my machinist references out to find out what's in Dromus]. Lard (yes, lard) is good with some materials. "Sulfurous oil" with others. Etc. There are a few lubricants that work with almost everything - these are usually commercially-made mixtures. -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#29
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Screwgun Recommendation
According to Chris Lewis :
According to clifto : I can picture how cooling would prevent brittleness. I can't imagine how lubrication could prevent brittleness. Mike's gotten confused. You don't use lubricants with grinding wheels. Grinding wheels should be used on dry metal, they rely on both the abrasion and instantaneous melting (the sparks) to cut. With hardened steel or carbide, the melting does more of the cutting than the abrasion does. The picky may notice that there are _some_ grinding setups designed to be cooled with a continuous stream of water. These are low speed grinders (up to 200RPM or so) _mostly_ used for sharpening woodworking tools - allows you to fine grind for long periods of time without overheating and detempering the metal - in contrast with a standard bench grinder that's usually running at 3600RPM with silicon dioxide (hard!) wheels that will burn a chisel quite fast if you're not careful. Wet grinders are not suitable for general metal shaping. -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#30
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Screwgun Recommendation
Chris Lcan picture how cooling would prevent brittleness. I can't
imagine how lubrication could prevent brittleness. Mike's gotten confused. You don't use lubricants with grinding wheels. Grinding wheels should be used on dry metal, they rely on both the abrasion and instantaneous melting (the sparks) to cut. With hardened steel or carbide, the melting does more of the cutting than the abrasion does. nope While you don't see it in the average shop, there are plenty of wet high speed grinding processes. Full flood coolant on a surface grinder or cylindrical grinder. Taking a part out to dip it in water is not a production oriented process |
#31
Posted to alt.home.repair
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Screwgun Recommendation
According to yourname :
Chris Lcan picture how cooling would prevent brittleness. I can't imagine how lubrication could prevent brittleness. Mike's gotten confused. You don't use lubricants with grinding wheels. Grinding wheels should be used on dry metal, they rely on both the abrasion and instantaneous melting (the sparks) to cut. With hardened steel or carbide, the melting does more of the cutting than the abrasion does. While you don't see it in the average shop, there are plenty of wet high speed grinding processes. Full flood coolant on a surface grinder or cylindrical grinder. Taking a part out to dip it in water is not a production oriented process I think it's save to omit high speed production grinding systems from what a guy who can't afford to have a metal lathe - the context of the original thread. -- Chris Lewis, Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
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