Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are
going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Perce

On Mar 29, 10:19 am, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:
Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are
going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Perce


Why would you think this wouldn't work?

As long the posts go 24" or more deep and the post is driven in with a
'proper' post driving tool, you will be fine.

As regards being plumb, thats a function of how you drill the hole,
not how you drive the post in.

Lewis.

*****

On Thu, 29 Mar 2007 11:19:08 -0400, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:

Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are
going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.


So? Get the posts a little bit long, and trim the tops to height
after they're in place. It won't matter if they mushroom, because
you're cutting that part off.

And if the holes are drilled straight, the posts should go in
straight. Make minor adustments by pulling them just through vertical
away from the direction of lean, and pounding the ground on the
leanward side with a sledgehammer.

On Mar 29, 10:19 am, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:
Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are
going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Perce

Depends on lots of things including skill of "the guy", type of
equipment he's got and and ground and terrain...

It's possible, but with the caveats of the other responses, I'd be a
little concerned he can really set the digger point to such a close
tolerance to a straight line as you may want for a residential fence.
That's where the previous "depends" come in. I'd probably go look at
something he's done that way and see how it looks before committing.

Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole
digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are
going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Perce

In a perfect world, or with a high dollar drilling machine, drilling
undersized holes plumb and true would be a much easier thing than making
them oversized and backfilling.

I've used one of those post hole digging machines, and I don't believe that
I could get them that straight up and down.

I would say that it all depends on how nice you want the finished product to
be. I've seen barbed wire fences made of just limbs, but they seemed very
aesthetic because at least the holes were in straight lines. It's different
with straight posts, as any variation from straight and plumb is noticeable
by even an untrained person.

You might try it for a few holes and see how good you do, and go from there.
Maybe your soil is such that boring fairly plumb holes is relatively easy.
In most of the soils in my area, it is impossible to make straight holes, as
we always hit rocks. And by some sick trick of God and nature, EVERY SINGLE
hole is located right over the biggest rock within twenty feet!

As others said, leave your poles long, then use a string line to cut off the
mushroom and have a nice top line. Whichever way you choose to drill the
holes.

Steve

On Thu, 29 Mar 2007 11:19:08 -0400, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:

Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb?

Take a look at other posts the guy has put in.

You're paying him, or she is?

Haven't used one, but somehow I think it is fairly easy to hold the
tool vertical. Maybe because when it isn't vertical it will by trying
to fall over in one direction or the other. Same way, if you put a
straw broom on its handle, it's pretty easy to keep it exactly
vertical.

At least at the start of the hole

(b) the tops of the posts are
going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Perce

"Percival P. Cassidy" wrote in message
...
Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and throw
the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how do
you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are going
to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Perce

Hhmm - everybody else seems to assume you are refering to a power post hole
digger. Since I dig all mine with hand augers I assumed it was one of
those. You didn't mention what kind of posts you have - 4" dia cedar ? - 4"
square PT ? A 4" post in a 3" hole doesn't take much driving but I would
worry about getting them squared up with the line (not twisted 20 degrees in
one direction or the other if they are square posts.)

In a perfect world, or with a high dollar drilling machine, drilling
undersized holes plumb and true would be a much easier thing than making
them oversized and backfilling.

I've used one of those post hole digging machines, and I don't believe that
I could get them that straight up and down.

The augers I am looking at for sale and rent in my area have a hinge
at the top which allows you to drill a almost perfect plumb every
time. Link:

http://www.bobcat.com/attachments/auger

Interestingly, I read a book on fences which said that it is better to
drill the hole perpendicular to the ground rather than plumb. This
only applies to a high tension wire fence. That way it resists the
uplift of the tensioned wire more effectively. However, I don't
recall ever seeing such a post and it looks like it would be harder to
dig a post hole perpendicular than it would be to dig it plumb. Even
with a hand digger, my experience is that without any extra effort,
your hole will be close to plumb.

On Mar 29, 10:19 am, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:
Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and
throw the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how
do you ensure that the posts are plumb?

The augers I am looking at for sale and rent in my area have a hinge
at the top which allows you to drill a almost perfect plumb every
time. Even with a hand digger, my experience is that without any
extra effort,
your hole will be close to plumb. Some coaxing with big hammer can
bring the post into plumb before backfilling. Link:

http://www.bobcat.com/attachments/auger

(b) the tops of the posts are going to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Your average fence post is only a few inches thick. Typically holes
are dug plenty big and very little to no pounding should be
necessary.

However, pounded posts are supposed to be much, much stronger than a
similar backfilled one. Hydraulic post pounders are used by road
crews and fencing contractors. Little or no hole may be necessary at
all when a hydraulic pounder is used. They are also for sale and rent
in my area.

I doubt if this is what your guy has in mind but it's possible. If
he is pounding with a sledge and it mushrooms the post then it's no
problem since you can leave the posts long and cut after.

It sounds like you are planning a typical stockade fence. Very often
in good soils only soil is used to backfill. It needs to be well
tamped but will be plenty strong. In poor soil other measures may be
used. This means backfilling with good draining material or even
concrete.

On 03/29/07 04:39 pm Srgnt Billko wrote:

Hearing that I was planning to put up a fence, a friend who owns a small
farm (but does not work it herself) offered to lend me a post-hole digger.

She called to say that the guy who works for her is even willing to come
dig the holes and set the posts for me, but his standard method is:

for 4" posts, use a 3" post-hole digger, then drive the posts in and throw
the dirt back in. No concrete necessary.

Please tell me that, while this may work for chain-link or barbed-wire
fencing out on the farm, this isn't going to work for posts to support
fence panels in a residential environment. I see two problems: (a) how do
you ensure that the posts are plumb? (b) the tops of the posts are going
to get wrecked in the course of driving them in.

Hhmm - everybody else seems to assume you are refering to a power post hole
digger. Since I dig all mine with hand augers I assumed it was one of
those. You didn't mention what kind of posts you have - 4" dia cedar ? - 4"
square PT ? A 4" post in a 3" hole doesn't take much driving but I would
worry about getting them squared up with the line (not twisted 20 degrees in
one direction or the other if they are square posts.)

It's a hand auger that he uses. The posts will be 4" square PT. It's
getting them plumb and squared that concerns me too, as I'm planning to
install off-the-shelf 8ft-long fence sections between them.

Perce