On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 12:31:19 -0500, mm
wrote:

On 5 Dec 2006 09:01:34 -0800, "professorpaul"
wrote:


Terry wrote:
On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:15:21 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:



You're likely to have multiple wall-warts.


What is a wall-wart?

Just last night on Jay Leno's "Headlines" was a headline from a local
paper, "Plans for new Wal-Wart under discussion."

Those little power supplies that you plug into the electrical
outlets... PITA

I had one that came with a fax machine. It was 10 inches high and had
a polarized plug. It wouldn't do very well in an upside-down
receptacle.

Some catalogs sell a thing that' supposed to help. It's a 1-foot
1-outlet extension cord that costs too much. Use a regular extension
cord and you can use 2 or 3 wall-warts.
--
20 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 12:04:08 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 12:27:55 -0500, mm
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 06:07:00 -0600, Don Fearn
wrote:

Is there a "right" way for wall outlets to face?

Definitely. The holes should face inward. *Into* the room.



So you'd put the ground hole right in from of the others, so it
becomes impossible to plug anything in without creating a short. Hope
your breakers aren't the kind that don't trip.

If the prong holes face the wall, you can't plug anything in at all.
On all my receptacles, the ground hole faces the same direction as the
power prong holes.

Terry wrote:
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:07:39 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

Let's see...... when was the last time a METAL TRAY slid down my
wall....


I understand your comments now. You think this about you.

I am guessing you are not a surgeon. They use metal trays daily.

MY surgeon doesn't drop things.

Mark wrote:
I don't believe that the NEC addresses this issue at all.
nate



All commercial buildings seem to be wired with the ground pin UP. Why
is that?

Most workers in building construction come from the southern hemisphere
where things are reversed.

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 18:24:32 GMT, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

"Terry" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Most places that use stainless steel outlet covers often have
construction going on all the time.

Vibration.


If you're going to think of office buildings as if they were cars, boats &
aircraft, then the law should forbid using screws to attach wires to outlets
and switches.

Or they should have wires through the screws so they can't unscrew.
Finally a way to use those wire twisting pliers I keep posting about.
I'm going to start on it tonight.

"mm" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 18:24:32 GMT, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

"Terry" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Most places that use stainless steel outlet covers often have
construction going on all the time.

Vibration.


If you're going to think of office buildings as if they were cars, boats &
aircraft, then the law should forbid using screws to attach wires to
outlets
and switches.

Or they should have wires through the screws so they can't unscrew.
Finally a way to use those wire twisting pliers I keep posting about.
I'm going to start on it tonight.


I'm a big fan of crimp connectors, but I'm lucky to have a tool that does
them correctly. The ones I see in stores nowadays are no better than putting
the connector on the floor and stomping on it.

"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Screws do come loose.
--

All of my replacement faceplates come with a small cardboard washer behind
the screw, so that even if it did come loose from the outlet it would remain
attached to the faceplate. Regards --

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 06:07:00 -0600, Don Fearn
wrote:

Is there a "right" way for wall outlets to face?

Should they be

| |
O

| |
O


or


O
| |

O
| |



and why?



The top way makes little faces and the ground pin is closer to the
ground, but it seems like the bottom way might be safer (something
metal would hit the ground pin first if it fell). Any other reasons to
prefer one way over the other? How about sideways (I won't attempt
ASCII art for sideways).

-Don


IMHO:

I think it's a personal preference for home's. In commercial places,
there is some belief if the screw becomes loose, pops out, and the
'metal' face plate falls, on a partially inserted plug, you can get a
spark that causes a fire. This sounds like a lot of "what if's", but
you need to do what you are instructed.

Personally I like grounds down, since the index finger has a habit of
migrating to one of the prongs, so best if it's the grounding prong.

hth,

tom @ www.mesothelioma-poll.com

JimR wrote:

"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Screws do come loose.
--

All of my replacement faceplates come with a small cardboard washer behind
the screw, so that even if it did come loose from the outlet it would remain
attached to the faceplate. Regards --

Loosing the screw on the floor isn't the issue, the issue is having the
metal cover plate land balanced on the exposed conductors of the plug in
the outlet. It's not a pretty thing, especially when you can't turn off
the circuit right away to fix it due to the equipment plugged in. With a
plastic or nylon cover plate it would of course be a non issue.

Pete C.

Don Fearn wrote:
Is there a "right" way for wall outlets to face?
snip
and why?
snip

FWIW:
The manufacturer's catalogs, like Pass & Seymour/LeGrand, have
illustrations uniformly showing duplex outlets with grounds at the top.


Joe

Yes, I see that now. there are several loose in this group. G I
personally have NEVER seen an outlet cover plate unscrew itself in a home,
in a shop, in an aircraft plant, in a school, in a garage, where there was
loud music, OR in a hospital.

--
Steve Barker



"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Screws do come loose.
--
20 days until CHRISTmas
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

"Steve Barker LT" wrote in message
...
WHAT industry? Hospitals? Not homes though.

--
Steve Barker

Take a look. Many new homes are being done that way.

Don Fearn wrote in
:

Is there a "right" way for wall outlets to face?

Should they be

| |
O

| |
O


or


O
| |

O
| |



and why?



The top way makes little faces and the ground pin is closer to the
ground, but it seems like the bottom way might be safer (something
metal would hit the ground pin first if it fell). Any other reasons to
prefer one way over the other? How about sideways (I won't attempt
ASCII art for sideways).

-Don


I wonder if this subject will set a new record for most replies in a
thread previously held by this same subject.

On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 20:49:15 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

Yes, I see that now. there are several loose in this group. G I
personally have NEVER seen an outlet cover plate unscrew itself in a home,
in a shop, in an aircraft plant, in a school, in a garage, where there was
loud music, OR in a hospital.

I haven't either, but I have seen door locks (on wooden doors) unscrew
themselves. Also water faucets (loosening from the sink, not causing a
water leak).
--
20 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

In article om,
Mark wrote:


I don't believe that the NEC addresses this issue at all.
nate



All commercial buildings seem to be wired with the ground pin UP. Why
is that?

Mark


Too bad they didnt design the outlet to look like | 0 | instead of
| |
0




--
For every complicated, difficult problem, there is a simple, easy
solution that does not work.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland -

Has anyone surveyed the common electrical appliances to see how they feel?
Are there certain appliances that prefer doggy style over the missionary
position?

On Wed, 06 Dec 2006 02:44:30 GMT, "Pete C."
wrote:

JimR wrote:

"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Screws do come loose.
--

All of my replacement faceplates come with a small cardboard washer behind
the screw, so that even if it did come loose from the outlet it would remain
attached to the faceplate. Regards --

Loosing the screw on the floor isn't the issue, the issue is having the
metal cover plate land balanced on the exposed conductors of the plug in
the outlet. It's not a pretty thing, especially when you can't turn off
the circuit right away to fix it due to the equipment plugged in. With a
plastic or nylon cover plate it would of course be a non issue.

If you land a metal cover plate balanced across the
plugs, the circut is likely to be turning itself off,
anyway. If you got something that
mission-critical plugged in, why isn't it on a UPS?

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:35:28 -0600, ()
wrote:

In article om,
Mark wrote:


I don't believe that the NEC addresses this issue at all.
nate



All commercial buildings seem to be wired with the ground pin UP. Why
is that?

Mark


Too bad they didnt design the outlet to look like | 0 | instead of
| |
0

Goedjn wrote:

Too bad they didnt design the outlet to look like | 0 | instead of
| |
0

Ever looked at a Neutrik PowerCon connector?

Twist and lock, no exposed conductors, ground contacts touch first,
rated for 20A. Unfortunately its not rated as an in-wall mains connector.

http://www.neutrik.com/content/produ...=CatMSDE_audio


Chris

On Wed, 06 Dec 2006 06:34:11 -0500, newsreader
wrote:

Has anyone surveyed the common electrical appliances to see how they feel?
Are there certain appliances that prefer doggy style over the missionary
position?


I've checked with the toaster, it appears to not care, as long as it
gets some.

Not going near the blender, or microwave.

later,

tom @ www.ringtone-makers.com

On Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:10:39 -0500, Goedjn wrote:

On Wed, 06 Dec 2006 02:44:30 GMT, "Pete C."
wrote:

JimR wrote:

"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 11:05:20 -0600, "Steve Barker LT"
wrote:

why would the screw fall out? This is a ridiculous scenario.

Screws do come loose.
--

All of my replacement faceplates come with a small cardboard washer behind
the screw, so that even if it did come loose from the outlet it would remain
attached to the faceplate. Regards --

Loosing the screw on the floor isn't the issue, the issue is having the
metal cover plate land balanced on the exposed conductors of the plug in
the outlet. It's not a pretty thing, especially when you can't turn off
the circuit right away to fix it due to the equipment plugged in. With a
plastic or nylon cover plate it would of course be a non issue.

If you land a metal cover plate balanced across the
plugs, the circut is likely to be turning itself off,
anyway.

The circuit would turn itself off, after a spark between the metal
cover plate and the hot wire caused an explosion.

If you got something that
mission-critical plugged in, why isn't it on a UPS?

Maybe it was, but it was the UPS plug that had been knocked partly out
of the outlet.

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 11:21:46 -0500, Terry
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:15:21 -0600, Mark Lloyd
wrote:



You're likely to have multiple wall-warts.


What is a wall-wart?

It's when the wall seems to have a growth on it, because of some
oversized thing on a cord instead of a plug. Often a power supply for
something.

Oh pshaw, on Tue 05 Dec 2006 10:07:39a, Steve Barker LT meant to say...

Let's see...... when was the last time a METAL TRAY slid down my wall....


Probably this morning when you weren't looking.

--
Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________

(...a short musical interlude...)

On 12/05/06 09:46 pm Joe wrote:

Is there a "right" way for wall outlets to face?
snip
and why?

The manufacturer's catalogs, like Pass & Seymour/LeGrand, have
illustrations uniformly showing duplex outlets with grounds at the top.

And I just noticed that some of the spare outlets I have -- possibly
Pass & Seymour/Legrand -- are marked so that the writing is the right
way up only when the ground pin is uppermost.


Perce

"Percival P. Cassidy" wrote in message
...
On 12/05/06 09:46 pm Joe wrote:

Is there a "right" way for wall outlets to face?
snip
and why?

The manufacturer's catalogs, like Pass & Seymour/LeGrand, have
illustrations uniformly showing duplex outlets with grounds at the top.

And I just noticed that some of the spare outlets I have -- possibly Pass
& Seymour/Legrand -- are marked so that the writing is the right way up
only when the ground pin is uppermost.


Perce

Yeah, but a lot of things you need to plug in will not work correctly when
upside down. Install outlets so they work, not so they satisfy some geek's
idea of what's normal.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"Steve Barker LT" wrote in message
...
WHAT industry? Hospitals? Not homes though.

--
Steve Barker

Take a look. Many new homes are being done that way.

More fuel on the fire! While not confirming the above, Friday I visited
a brand new Mazda dealership building about 90% complete, and
throughout the entire service, parts and public area were duplex
outlets with...are you ready for this?...the grounds at the top. It
would appear that in our Central Illinois area at least, our tradesmen
are following the grounds-up practice in commercial buildings. I think
I'll do a little investigation of our newest McMansions under
construction and see what the hoi polloi prefer.

Joe

In article . com,
says...

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"Steve Barker LT" wrote in message
...
WHAT industry? Hospitals? Not homes though.

--
Steve Barker

Take a look. Many new homes are being done that way.

More fuel on the fire! While not confirming the above, Friday I visited
a brand new Mazda dealership building about 90% complete, and
throughout the entire service, parts and public area were duplex
outlets with...are you ready for this?...the grounds at the top. It
would appear that in our Central Illinois area at least, our tradesmen
are following the grounds-up practice in commercial buildings.

Every building I worked in at my PPoE (dozens over 30+ years) was
ground-up. I was told that it was because of the metal studs,
covers, and partitions. Any falling object would contact the
ground pin first.

I think
I'll do a little investigation of our newest McMansions under
construction and see what the hoi polloi prefer.

I'v never seen it in residential construction, since metal is kinda
rare. There may be a lesson here...

--
Keith