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#2
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Wiring a new light switch
Damn!
Given that many other posters gave the same opinion, I guess I'm toast unless I upgrade the wiring - and I'm not really keen on doing that.... So I will follow your suggestion and look for a motion detector switch. If that gets me some $$ refunded as well, then that would be a good thing too. As an aside - my ISP recently ditched their news server, and so I've had to find another means to access usenet. I signed up to Google Groups a few months back, but have ended up just lurking in my favourite groups. Until now. So this was my first ever post from my new account, as well as a first ever to al.home.repair. I have to say I am mightily impressed with the speed, usefulness and general civility of the posts I've received. Better than I had any hopes for. Thanks to all for your replies! Dave |
#3
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Wiring a new light switch
On Thu, 18 May 2006 19:05:34 -0400, John McGaw
wrote: wrote: Hi all, Sorry if this is really trivial, or has asked before, but I can't seem to find an answer. I just bought a new light switch for the laundry room in the basement. It is a Leviton brand which has a bunch of buttons to give you a painful details snipped What should I be doing? TIA, Dave As other posters indicted, you are probably screwed with that switch and your existing wiring. You _could_ always replace the 2-conductor romex between the switch and light with 3-conductor but that isn't trivial for a beginner and depending on how the walls and ceiling are finished can be a PITA for anyone. How about this: take the timer switch back and try to get your money back. Then buy a "warm moving body detector" switch for about half the price. The common ones, such a Eagle that some big-box stores carry, can be wired to work in your situation. I have one of those in my bathroom, which generally works well. It will not work properly wilt only compact fluorescent bulbs. And they work even better in my experience than a timer since you don't have to touch anything -- you walk into the room and the light comes on and after you leave it waits for a pre-determined time and then switches off. Just the thing if you have your hands full. Best of all, the Eagle probably costs half of what your Leviton timer cost ($20 vs. $40?) I've wired my garage bays and some entry switches with the Eagle brand units from the Borg and they work very well. -- Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin |
#4
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Wiring a new light switch
wrote in message ups.com... Damn! Given that many other posters gave the same opinion, I guess I'm toast unless I upgrade the wiring - and I'm not really keen on doing that.... So I will follow your suggestion and look for a motion detector switch. If that gets me some $$ refunded as well, then that would be a good thing too. The ones I have seen need a neutral for the same reason the timer does. Maybe some don't. |
#5
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Wiring a new light switch
wrote:
Damn! Given that many other posters gave the same opinion, I guess I'm toast unless I upgrade the wiring - and I'm not really keen on doing that.... So I will follow your suggestion and look for a motion detector switch. If that gets me some $$ refunded as well, then that would be a good thing too. As an aside - my ISP recently ditched their news server, and so I've had to find another means to access usenet. I signed up to Google Groups a few months back, but have ended up just lurking in my favourite groups. Until now. So this was my first ever post from my new account, as well as a first ever to al.home.repair. I have to say I am mightily impressed with the speed, usefulness and general civility of the posts I've received. Better than I had any hopes for. Thanks to all for your replies! Dave Dave - Don't despair - That switch sound pretty nice. You said this was a utility room, right? If so, can you see the wire from the switch to the light or does it run in a finished wall? Do you think you would be able to fish a different, or new, wire from your light to your switch? If you could get a different wire there then we could get that thing working for you. Inviato da X-Privat.Org - Registrazione gratuita http://www.x-privat.org/join.php |
#6
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Wiring a new light switch
Toller wrote:
wrote in message ups.com... Damn! Given that many other posters gave the same opinion, I guess I'm toast unless I upgrade the wiring - and I'm not really keen on doing that.... So I will follow your suggestion and look for a motion detector switch. If that gets me some $$ refunded as well, then that would be a good thing too. The ones I have seen need a neutral for the same reason the timer does. Maybe some don't. Well, the Eagle Electric brand for sure does not need the neutral -- I've installed several and none of them had both hot and neutral in the switch box. Their drawing calls for the black to go to the hot and the red & brown to be nutted and connected to the load and the green to go the ground. Works fine every time for me. Who knows, they might be using the ground lead to provide the little bit of "neutral" current needed -- probably wouldn't meet code but I've not checked it out. -- John McGaw [Knoxville, TN, USA] http://johnmcgaw.com |
#7
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Wiring a new light switch
Well, the Eagle Electric brand for sure does not need the neutral -- I've installed several and none of them had both hot and neutral in the switch box. Their drawing calls for the black to go to the hot and the red & brown to be nutted and connected to the load and the green to go the ground. Works fine every time for me. Who knows, they might be using the ground lead to provide the little bit of "neutral" current needed -- probably wouldn't meet code but I've not checked it out. If they've got any brains at all, they're just trickling the working current down through the light, and it's just not enough to light it. |
#8
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Wiring a new light switch
"Goedjn" wrote in message ... Well, the Eagle Electric brand for sure does not need the neutral -- I've installed several and none of them had both hot and neutral in the switch box. Their drawing calls for the black to go to the hot and the red & brown to be nutted and connected to the load and the green to go the ground. Works fine every time for me. Who knows, they might be using the ground lead to provide the little bit of "neutral" current needed -- probably wouldn't meet code but I've not checked it out. If they've got any brains at all, they're just trickling the working current down through the light, and it's just not enough to light it. Okay, why couldn't you do the same with the timer switch? |
#9
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Wiring a new light switch
According to Toller :
"Goedjn" wrote in message ... Well, the Eagle Electric brand for sure does not need the neutral -- I've installed several and none of them had both hot and neutral in the switch box. Their drawing calls for the black to go to the hot and the red & brown to be nutted and connected to the load and the green to go the ground. Works fine every time for me. Who knows, they might be using the ground lead to provide the little bit of "neutral" current needed -- probably wouldn't meet code but I've not checked it out. If they've got any brains at all, they're just trickling the working current down through the light, and it's just not enough to light it. Okay, why couldn't you do the same with the timer switch? No reason. Mind you, it may behave wierd with some loads that aren't necessarily (mostly) resistive. Eg: trying to trickle a bit of juice thru a CF bulb might not work at all. -- Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them. |
#10
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Wiring a new light switch
On Fri, 19 May 2006 18:56:46 GMT, "Toller" wrote:
"Goedjn" wrote in message .. . Well, the Eagle Electric brand for sure does not need the neutral -- I've installed several and none of them had both hot and neutral in the switch box. Their drawing calls for the black to go to the hot and the red & brown to be nutted and connected to the load and the green to go the ground. Works fine every time for me. Who knows, they might be using the ground lead to provide the little bit of "neutral" current needed -- probably wouldn't meet code but I've not checked it out. If they've got any brains at all, they're just trickling the working current down through the light, and it's just not enough to light it. Okay, why couldn't you do the same with the timer switch? Damned if I know. My theory is that the people who built the timer switch weren't smart enough to think of it. |
#11
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Wiring a new light switch
Goedjn wrote:
On Fri, 19 May 2006 18:56:46 GMT, "Toller" wrote: "Goedjn" wrote in message . .. Well, the Eagle Electric brand for sure does not need the neutral -- I've installed several and none of them had both hot and neutral in the switch box. Their drawing calls for the black to go to the hot and the red & brown to be nutted and connected to the load and the green to go the ground. Works fine every time for me. Who knows, they might be using the ground lead to provide the little bit of "neutral" current needed -- probably wouldn't meet code but I've not checked it out. If they've got any brains at all, they're just trickling the working current down through the light, and it's just not enough to light it. Okay, why couldn't you do the same with the timer switch? Damned if I know. My theory is that the people who built the timer switch weren't smart enough to think of it. Nah. Seems to me the "timers" working current has to be there when the light is ON, and that's when there should be NO voltage drop between those two wires to run the timer with. So you couldn't ask for a very large voltage drop there without having to put up with some significant power wastage and heating, depending on the size of the bulb load. Now I suppose you could put a current transformer over the current carrying lead to the light bulbs and use the voltage developed on its secondary, after regulation, to run the timer circuit. But that's a long run for a short slide and transformers ain't cheap parts to make. Then again, they do use current transformers in all GFCIs, so maybe it's not such a whacky idea, and if a rustbucket like me could think of it, then other engineers could easily do the same. Jeff -- Jeffry Wisnia (W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE) "Life is like a sewer -- what you get out of it depends on what you put into it." |
#12
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Wiring a new light switch
On Fri, 19 May 2006 02:07:29 GMT, "Toller" wrote:
wrote in message oups.com... Damn! Given that many other posters gave the same opinion, I guess I'm toast unless I upgrade the wiring - and I'm not really keen on doing that.... So I will follow your suggestion and look for a motion detector switch. If that gets me some $$ refunded as well, then that would be a good thing too. The ones I have seen need a neutral for the same reason the timer does. Maybe some don't. I have installed several motion-detector switches here, none of them need a neutral. They have 2 wires (or 3 if it has ground). I want one that uses a neutral. -- Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin |
#13
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Wiring a new light switch
In ,
Jeff Wisnia wrote: Nah. Seems to me the "timers" working current has to be there when the light is ON, and that's when there should be NO voltage drop between those two wires to run the timer with. So you couldn't ask for a very large voltage drop there without having to put up with some significant power wastage and heating, depending on the size of the bulb load. The OP's switch may be different, but I have two electronic timer switches to turn lights on and off automatically at evening and morning. They are powered by trickle current wither the load is on or off. I think they just use such a small amount of power that it doesn't cause a significant voltage drop. I know they use current from the light ckt because if and only if all connected bulbs burn out, the timer loses its programming. -- Jim "Remember, an amateur built the Ark; professionals built the Titanic." |
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