I was wondering if anyone has any experience with the 410cc Generac
single cylinder engine.

We will be running a unit on propane for 7 hours per day, 3 days per
week (Wednesday, Saturday and Sunday).

What kind of life can we expect?

What problems have you seen?

Thanks
Phil

"philkryder" wrote in message
oups.com...
I was wondering if anyone has any experience with the 410cc Generac
single cylinder engine.

We will be running a unit on propane for 7 hours per day, 3 days per
week (Wednesday, Saturday and Sunday).

How many weeks?


What kind of life can we expect?

Unless they are a commercial grade item with a good engine, don't expect too
much if you are running them week in and out.


What problems have you seen?

Thanks
Phil

"How many weeks? "

We run 3 days EVERY week.

That is my question - Do you have experience or other data on the life
expectancy of the Generac 410cc running LP?

The small air-cooled engines in generators are only going to last between
1500-2500 hours. The one you are talking about is not one of the "premium"
engines so you'll probably be on the lower end of that scale. So at 1500
hours, you're talking 71 weeks. Remember, this is a very rough estimate.
Of course, you can rebuild the engine or even replace it every year or two
and keep a well-running generator. Just build that into your cost.

The main thing in getting the most hours is in doing regular oil changes,
and be sure to use synthetic.


"philkryder" wrote in message
oups.com...
I was wondering if anyone has any experience with the 410cc Generac
single cylinder engine.

We will be running a unit on propane for 7 hours per day, 3 days per
week (Wednesday, Saturday and Sunday).

What kind of life can we expect?

What problems have you seen?

Thanks
Phil

Well that is Generacs premium engine , pressure oiled with oil filter,
many hondas have no oil filter. Manufacturers have different lines of
quality. But use-how heavy the load, and oil are key, They do run to
3500+hrs but I dont know what loads were used. At heavy load maybe
1000-1500. Ive heard of many people getting 10000-14000 on little Honda
2000w EU run conservativly, those are load dependant RPM, and run from
900 - 3600 rpm producing power. Use is key, load dependant-controling
rpm and conservativly run are best. in regular 3600 rpm units. Take a
3000 EU and use 1-500 watts running it at 900- 1200 rpm and it will
outlast anything, theoreticly 20000 - 40000+

How does Honda get a clean sine wave (per their site) from an inverter?

Steve Kraus wrote:

How does Honda get a clean sine wave (per their site) from an inverter?

I have an EU3000 and its a wonderful machine. I do think the claim that
it is a sine wave is BS though. If it were it wouldn't generate crap
that completely wipes out AM radio reception on even battery radios
within 20ft of the gen. AM/Shortwave radio running from the gen is
almost impossible except for very strong local stations.

Actually it really doesn't make sense to generate a sine in a unit such
as this. A clean and well regulated modified square is more efficient
and less costly. And this Honda produces excellent power... it's just
not a true sine in my opinion.

OK, next time I run mine I'll put the Oscope on it and see what it looks
like.

Fred

Steve Kraus wrote:

How does Honda get a clean sine wave (per their site) from an inverter?

With more sophisticated electronics.

--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form .

A clean and well regulated modified square is more efficient
and less costly. And this Honda produces excellent power... it's just
not a true sine in my opinion.

Yes, maybe their modified sine has more steps than is typical of inverters
but unless Ohm's Law is repealed the voltage drop across partially on /
partially off transistors necessary to do a real sine wave makes it
unlikely.

According to Fred Wesner :
Actually it really doesn't make sense to generate a sine in a unit such
as this. A clean and well regulated modified square is more efficient
and less costly. And this Honda produces excellent power... it's just
not a true sine in my opinion.

Rotational gensets generate sinusoidal waveforms by definition. Power
stations are just bigger gensets.

The issue about square wave is with DC - AC inverters (ie: UPSes), car lighter
plug in inverters etc. Trying to produce true sine wave in those is quite
expensive, and seldom worthwhile. So, they simulate it to a degree determined
by how much they're willing to pay to have it do that.

The issue with consumer-grade gensets is _not_ that it's square wave (it isn't),
it's that the frequency and voltage isn't very well regulated. Sensitive
electronics may get upset with things being far enough out of whack (ie: power
demand spike from water pump downrevs and browns out the PC also hooked in
before the generator has chance to throttle up in response to demand).
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

Chris Lewis wrote:

According to Fred Wesner :

Actually it really doesn't make sense to generate a sine in a unit such
as this. A clean and well regulated modified square is more efficient
and less costly. And this Honda produces excellent power... it's just
not a true sine in my opinion.


Rotational gensets generate sinusoidal waveforms by definition. Power
stations are just bigger gensets.

The Honda in question is not a standard genset. The flywheel of the
engine generates three phase power into a potted "black box".
I assume the black box rectifies it and uses the DC to drive the
modified square wave inverter. The advantage here being the output
frequency is independent of engine RPM.

The issue about square wave is with DC - AC inverters (ie: UPSes), car lighter
plug in inverters etc. Trying to produce true sine wave in those is quite
expensive, and seldom worthwhile. So, they simulate it to a degree determined
by how much they're willing to pay to have it do that.

Exactly. The Honda uses an inverter of this design.

The issue with consumer-grade gensets is _not_ that it's square wave (it isn't),
it's that the frequency and voltage isn't very well regulated. Sensitive
electronics may get upset with things being far enough out of whack (ie: power
demand spike from water pump downrevs and browns out the PC also hooked in
before the generator has chance to throttle up in response to demand).

The Honda is not a "conventional" consumer-grade genset. The inverter,
being crystal controlled, can generate a consistent AC waveform
regardless of engine RPM and load. As you noted, many standard gensets,
and especially the cheaper ones, have poor regulation and significant
waveform distortion.

Fred

CJT wrote:
With more sophisticated electronics.

I can't wait to see the oscilloscope pictures posted.