Yesterday I noticed that paint was peeling in my kitchen downstairs. I
took a good section of it off and noticed that the drywall was moist
and dark in color due to humidity. I decided to replace the drywall
but when I took it off ants were swarming underneath. There must have
been 1000's inside the wall because they loved the humidity. I removed
them and the insulation inside the wall. There are also three copper
pipes which run vertically behind the drywall I removed. I noticed that
the two hot water pipes which were insulated with foam were wet and
that's where the water was coming from. I removed the foam insulation
and one was completely wet on the inside while the other was only
partially wet. I checked the pipes for leaks but did not notice any
while it was uncovered. I bought new insulaiton for the pipes and
covered them both. Within a timespan of 2 minutes the one of the hot
water pipes once again contained condensaiton after it was covered. Is
it normal for copper pipes to sweat, however did this not occur while
the pipe was not covered with the foam insualtion. Can I patch up a
new piece of drywall without insulating the pipes or what is going on.
As far as I know, the insulation is only to keep the pipes insualted
for the hot water. I live in CA so I'm wondering if I should not
insulate them if years from now it will be humidity inside the wall
again. Thank you in advance for your help and advice.

"R8EDXXX" wrote in message

Within a timespan of 2 minutes the one of the hot
water pipes once again contained condensaiton after it was covered. Is
it normal for copper pipes to sweat, however did this not occur while
the pipe was not covered with the foam insualtion. Can I patch up a
new piece of drywall without insulating the pipes or what is going on.
As far as I know, the insulation is only to keep the pipes insualted
for the hot water. I live in CA so I'm wondering if I should not
insulate them if years from now it will be humidity inside the wall
again. Thank you in advance for your help and advice.


I've never seen condensation on a hot water pipe. Are you sure of this? If
the pipe is colder than the dewpoint of the ambient air, you get
condensation. That is virtually impossible with a pipe that has hot water
running it it. Don't seal up that wall until you figure out what the real
problem is.

"R8EDXXX" wrote in message
oups.com...
Yesterday I noticed that paint was peeling in my kitchen downstairs. I
took a good section of it off and noticed that the drywall was moist
and dark in color due to humidity. I decided to replace the drywall
but when I took it off ants were swarming underneath. There must have
been 1000's inside the wall because they loved the humidity. I removed
them and the insulation inside the wall. There are also three copper
pipes which run vertically behind the drywall I removed. I noticed that
the two hot water pipes which were insulated with foam were wet and
that's where the water was coming from. I removed the foam insulation
and one was completely wet on the inside while the other was only
partially wet. I checked the pipes for leaks but did not notice any
while it was uncovered. I bought new insulaiton for the pipes and
covered them both. Within a timespan of 2 minutes the one of the hot
water pipes once again contained condensaiton after it was covered. Is
it normal for copper pipes to sweat, however did this not occur while
the pipe was not covered with the foam insualtion. Can I patch up a
new piece of drywall without insulating the pipes or what is going on.
As far as I know, the insulation is only to keep the pipes insualted
for the hot water. I live in CA so I'm wondering if I should not
insulate them if years from now it will be humidity inside the wall
again. Thank you in advance for your help and advice.

You have pin hole leaks.

Find and stop the leak then repair the damage.

Might be Stress Corrosion Cracking. The insulation blowing agent used
in some rubber pipe insulations is corrosive to copper tubing when wet.
Usually just a problem with refrigeration piping, I never heard of it
on hot water lines. At any rate, your tubing in the wall needs
replaced.

Stretch

"Stretch" wrote in message
oups.com...
Might be Stress Corrosion Cracking. The insulation blowing agent used
in some rubber pipe insulations is corrosive to copper tubing when wet.
Usually just a problem with refrigeration piping, I never heard of it
on hot water lines. At any rate, your tubing in the wall needs
replaced.

Stretch


I didn't think of it until another poster brought up pinholes. In some
areas, the water is very corrosive to copper pipes. Perfect area to use PEX
if that is the case.

The funny thing about this is that the leaking or sweating of the pipes
only occurs when the foam insulaiton is on the pipe. The foam has been
all day today and no humidity is on the pipe. It is strange. Should I
patch up without the foam and why is this occuring.

I meant to say that the foam has been OFF all day today and there is no
humidity on the pipe. Thanks again guys!

I suspect the hot water pipe is leaking. Water vapor will seek out
cooler surfaces to condense.

On 5 Jun 2005 11:45:27 -0700, "R8EDXXX" wrote:

Yesterday I noticed that paint was peeling in my kitchen downstairs. I
took a good section of it off and noticed that the drywall was moist
and dark in color due to humidity. I decided to replace the drywall
but when I took it off ants were swarming underneath. There must have
been 1000's inside the wall because they loved the humidity. I removed
them and the insulation inside the wall. There are also three copper
pipes which run vertically behind the drywall I removed. I noticed that
the two hot water pipes which were insulated with foam were wet and
that's where the water was coming from. I removed the foam insulation
and one was completely wet on the inside while the other was only
partially wet. I checked the pipes for leaks but did not notice any
while it was uncovered. I bought new insulaiton for the pipes and
covered them both. Within a timespan of 2 minutes the one of the hot
water pipes once again contained condensaiton after it was covered. Is
it normal for copper pipes to sweat, however did this not occur while
the pipe was not covered with the foam insualtion. Can I patch up a
new piece of drywall without insulating the pipes or what is going on.
As far as I know, the insulation is only to keep the pipes insualted
for the hot water. I live in CA so I'm wondering if I should not
insulate them if years from now it will be humidity inside the wall
again. Thank you in advance for your help and advice.

Thanks guys, tomorrow I am calling a plumber to look into this. Like I
have been saying, the humidity only occurs when the insulation foam is
on the pipe. This is really strange!

Might be evaporating when the foam is off?

Foam, like diapers, tends to trap moisture.

--

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
www.mormons.com


"R8EDXXX" wrote in message
ups.com...
Thanks guys, tomorrow I am calling a plumber to look into this. Like I
have been saying, the humidity only occurs when the insulation foam is
on the pipe. This is really strange!

On 6 Jun 2005 21:26:01 -0700, "R8EDXXX" wrote:

Thanks guys, tomorrow I am calling a plumber to look into this. Like I
have been saying, the humidity only occurs when the insulation foam is
on the pipe. This is really strange!

What is strange is that you keep calling it "humidity", when
it's clearly not.

In article . com,
says...
Thanks guys, tomorrow I am calling a plumber to look into this. Like I
have been saying, the humidity only occurs when the insulation foam is
on the pipe. This is really strange!

It's a very small leak, spreading water onto a hot pipe. When the
surface of the pipe is exposed, the heat makes the water evaporate
quickly. When the pipe is covered, the water can't evaporate so the
pipe appears wet.

I expect if you took a very close look at the pipe while it was un-
wrapped you would find one small area that stays damp, right at the
leak. (Of course, the way things work, the leak is on the back side
of a soldered joint so you can't see it without sticking a mirror in
behind the pipe....)

--
is Joshua Putnam
http://www.phred.org/~josh/
Braze your own bicycle frames. See
http://www.phred.org/~josh/build/build.html

Personnally I'd try and solve the wet hot pipe problem first.

Sorry to be ageuementative but this is illogcal - condesation forms on cold surfaces not the hot (living in the UK we know this, we have a lot of cold and wet)

Question are the pipes hoter or colder than the surrounding air?

You say the pipes/joints aren't leaking but bear in mind the water pressure increases at night when all you CA's stop taking showers and filling your pools.

Its not ant pee is it? Does it smell?

The hot water pipes should dry any moisture intouch or imediatley around?

A wild guess - is the insulations open cell foam possably with a non porus outer skin (Like a sponge in a plastic bag) - when the pipes are hot moisture on the pipes evaporates into the insulation, when the pipes cool moisture is sucked out of the insulation and condensess on the pipes.

You could always introduce air flow - dont no what it will do to your thermal properties though.

Good luck

Cameron