Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob

"Guv Bob" wrote in message m...
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob

===

PS -- I overlooked something important.... CB #9, receptacle near the door has a lamp plugged into it and it also flickers when the ceiling lights do. So that probably eliminates CB 1&3 as the problem. Also, it might be good to say that no appliances or heavy power users are running at the time of the flickering. I have looked for a common activity, but they flicker night or day, and whether anything else is running or not.

Thanks again.

On 2014-04-20, Guv Bob wrote:
"Guv Bob" wrote in message m...
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?


Perhaps a loose screw in one of the holes of the neutral bus bar.



--
umop apisdn

On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 07:53:55 -0800, "Guv Bob"
wrote:

"Jasen Betts" wrote in message ...
Perhaps a loose screw in one of the holes of the neutral bus bar.

Thanks Jason. I just now checked and all are snug. I'm thinking about moving
the 2 ceiling light CB's over to the other hot bar and try to isolate it that way.

I would also check for an intermittent circuit breaker.

If nothing obvious appears (like a circuit breaker on fire, smoking,
or cracked housing), put a clamp on ammeter on the wire to the
flickering circuit and see if you can detect the flickering. Testing
will take two people. Station one at the breaker box and have them
watch the ammeter. Follow the wiring around the house until you find
the bad connection by wiggling the wiring and wall jacks. My
guess(tm) is a junction box in the ceiling or under the floor, where
the wires are connected with electrical tape instead of wire nuts or
screw terminals.

If you do find tape, I strongly suggest you hire an electrician to
inspect your wiring as other such abominations may be lurking in the
wiring.

This is what you do NOT want to see:
http://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/2032/is-this-electrical-junction-up-to-code


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

"Jasen Betts" wrote in message ...
On 2014-04-20, Guv Bob wrote:
"Guv Bob" wrote in message m...
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?


Perhaps a loose screw in one of the holes of the neutral bus bar.

Thanks Jason. I just now checked and all are snug. I'm thinking about moving the 2 ceiling light CB's over to the other hot bar and try to isolate it that way.

On 4/20/2014 8:25 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:


If you do find tape, I strongly suggest you hire an electrician to
inspect your wiring as other such abominations may be lurking in the
wiring.

This is what you do NOT want to see:
http://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/2032/is-this-electrical-junction-up-to-code

I'll see that and raise this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKZU...layer_embedded

On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 08:25:32 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:



This is what you do NOT want to see:
http://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/2032/is-this-electrical-junction-up-to-code

I like the way the yellow and orange picks up the copper color. It's
very attractive.

On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 14:14:41 -0400, micky
wrote:

On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 08:25:32 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:



This is what you do NOT want to see:
http://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/2032/is-this-electrical-junction-up-to-code

I like the way the yellow and orange picks up the copper color. It's
very attractive.

Most of those "for-hire" home inspectors, that _buyers_ (fortunately
:-) pay for, can't even find the right end of a flashlight.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 11:05:28 -0700, RosemontCrest
wrote:

On 4/20/2014 8:25 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
If you do find tape, I strongly suggest you hire an electrician to
inspect your wiring as other such abominations may be lurking in the
wiring.

This is what you do NOT want to see:
http://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/2032/is-this-electrical-junction-up-to-code

I should mention that you can also do it wrong without the electrical
tape:
http://inspectapedia.com/electric/LowVoltageGERelayBox020DFs.jpg
http://inspectapedia.com/electric/Electrical_Inspector_Safety.htm

Hint: If you have an IR thermometer, use it to measure the
temperature of your circuit breakers. I had a problem at a rental
that I found that way. The breaker looked ok, but it wasn't. I've
also used an IR thermometer to test the integrity of low voltage high
current solar panel wiring and battery banks:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBAZ2UPheGQ

I'll see that and raise this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKZU...layer_embedded

That's pretty bad. The #16awg(?) extension cord at the end is the
best part. Looking at the garage, I would guess that it's new
construction, probably added without the benefit of a building permit.

Many more of the same:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=bad+electrical+wiring
Perhaps we have an epidemic of bad wiring?

Why the OP expected to find advice on electrical wiring in two
electronics newsgroups will remain a mystery.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.

"Jeff Liebermann" wrote in message

Why the OP expected to find advice on electrical wiring in two
electronics newsgroups will remain a mystery.

I know what you're saying. If there is a more appropriate usenet group please let me know. The only other one I could find was "alt.trades.electrician" which has not been active since 2012.

It's hard to tell from the names which groups people hang around. I recently had some questions about an automobile computer/electrical issue. These 3 groups had a lot of good advice. Hardly anything from the auto and computer groups.

On Mon, 21 Apr 2014 16:46:48 -0800, "Guv Bob"
wrote:

"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.

Might be on the pole. We had that problem years ago, 1 phase with a
bad connection. Took a few tries before they cleaned and tightend the
connection.

Cheers

On Mon, 21 Apr 2014 22:48:43 -0400, Martin Riddle
wrote:

On Mon, 21 Apr 2014 16:46:48 -0800, "Guv Bob"
wrote:

"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.

Might be on the pole. We had that problem years ago, 1 phase with a
bad connection. Took a few tries before they cleaned and tightend the
connection.

Cheers

I had a bad neutral coming to the house. Furnace blower would fire
up, half of the house lights would dim, half would brighten.

Called SRP, got lip from the receptionist, read her the riot act,
serviceman there in 20 minutes :-}

Installed temporary, above ground, neutral, came back and trenched and
replace the whole feed.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On 4/21/2014 8:46 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.


Bob,

With the flickering happening only on lights connected to
phase A it is less likely to be a loose neutral connection.

Ed

On 4/21/2014 8:46 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.


Bob,

With the flickering happening only on lights connected to
phase A it is less likely to be a loose neutral connection.

Ed

"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/21/2014 8:46 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.


Bob,

With the flickering happening only on lights connected to
phase A it is less likely to be a loose neutral connection.

Ed

Hi Ed, you are absolutely right! Take a bow! LOL!!! The power company tech checked out the field connection and the connector on the phase connected to the left side, with the flickering circuits, was the problem. He replaced all three of them.

I'll post a couple of photos to the 2 binary groups.

"Guv Bob" wrote in message ...
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/21/2014 8:46 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.


Bob,

With the flickering happening only on lights connected to
phase A it is less likely to be a loose neutral connection.

Ed

Hi Ed, you are absolutely right! Take a bow! LOL!!! The power company tech checked out the field connection and the connector on the phase connected to the left side, with the flickering circuits, was the problem. He replaced all three of them.

I'll post a couple of photos to the 2 binary groups.

"Guv Bob" wrote in message ...
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/21/2014 8:46 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
"ehsjr" wrote in message ...
On 4/19/2014 11:12 PM, Guv Bob wrote:
Well, the lights started flickering again. In attached, CB 1 & 3 are a signal unit - tandem I think is the term. I removed them, cleaned all the contacts and checked all the wiring connections and all are fine. After that, no flickering for a few weeks. Now it started again this week. Connections are still tight.

No other devices are flickering. Wind doesn't make any difference, so it sounds to me like it's in the CB 1& 3 circuit. The ceiling light/fan in slot #8 doesn't flicker, nor do any lamps plugged into receptacles.

Any other ideas what might be the problem before I go out and buy a new CB?

Thanks fellers!

Bob


You have this:

Phase A hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL CL CL
| | |
Neutral -------------+---+--}}}---+
| | |
CL Cl Cl
| | |
Phase B hot ---CB----+---+--}}}---+

(CL = Ceiling Light, CB = circuit breaker. Switches omitted
for clarity.)

It's a shared neutral circuit, and is allowed by the USA
National electrical code.

Your symptom strongly suggests a loose connection in
the neutral path.

Ed

Thanks, Ed. That sounds reasonable to me. I'll check it out. All the flickering is on Phase A lights & receptacles. They all flicker at the same time. I called the power company today and they will send someone out this week to check the line up to the CP panel.


Bob,

With the flickering happening only on lights connected to
phase A it is less likely to be a loose neutral connection.

Ed

Hi Ed, you are absolutely right! Take a bow! LOL!!! The power company tech checked out the field connection and the connector on the phase connected to the left side, with the flickering circuits, was the problem. He replaced all three of them.

I'll post a couple of photos to the 2 binary groups.